I do have a reason. Two, in fact. One is that this data is had to be pulled manually and took a few hours just to put together data on 40 players. The second is that by using only the top player data we can eliminate skill variables. Using the top players allows us to see the max potential of each input. The max potential for controller is higher than the max potential for KBM. If you are trying to measure the difference in raw input type, the best way to see that is by comparing where the cap is for each input. If the cap is higher for one than the other, we can see that one has an advantage over the other. We also see that the cap for controller players goes even higher when faced with KBM players while the cap for KBM is lower when they face controller players. That part alone is more telling than the higher top end for controller players.
No, they donât. They have LESS variables. We know they are the best of their respective inputs so we can use that data to see the difference. Picking a bunch of average players can vary wildly in skill and the data is useless. It gives us no insight into the mechanical difference if we canât settle on a base expectation of skill. What you are trying to claim is actually the opposite of what it would display. Your âaverage playerâ data would be effectively useless for this type of comparison. You fundamentally do not understand what you are arguing about.
No, your âquestionâ ended with a period. I attempted to understand what you were saying and thought it was a statement with bad grammar since it ended with a period, not a question mark. Proofread your comments instead of assuming bias. This miscommunication is on you, not me.
To answer your question. I donât know. As I said, wins are not a good metric. The MMR system is designed to push you to a 50% win rate. It would be near impossible to find valuable data from win rate in this system.
Again, the average player will fill the data with variables regarding their skill. I get that you donât understand this and that is ok. Data analytics is hard to understand when you use it everyday, let alone to the average person. Your lack of understanding does not invalidate the data.
I wonât accept that. I will tell you as directly as I can so you get it this time. My data is the exact data set you would use to measure the difference in input types on a system. You arguing from ignorance will not change that. How about you accept that you donât understand data analytics and go share your unsubstantiated opinion about how things work somewhere else?
This doesnt eliminate it skill will fluctuate between the two groups. As you keep wanting to shy away from external factors. What has every pro tournament that has run in halo been on. Controller. So the skill gap at the top end is going to be skewed towards controller. It is an external variable.
But the data holds very little input to the average player. Do you hold the standards of a rookie sports league to that of a pro or do you conpare them within their owne league.
Average player data holds a lot for this kind of comparison. If you balance to the pro the effect it has is on the wider population. Balancing to the top 0.01% could potentially take the balance from the median. But we dont have a full set of data to essentially show what is happening.
So what your saying is a game should always be balanced for the 0.01% of both inputs even though the exp between the two could be wildly different.
The data set you have provided is a small fraction of what would be used. To be honest the easiest way to end the debate is to call for crossinput and crossplay to be aced or optioned.
However you arent looking at the variables in ur own data. Now if you did and happiky admit the flaws then i would believe your looking for the best comparison not just to be right.
You are going to have to try and explain this better because it makes no sense. Or are you trying to say that Controller players are just better at the game than KBM players and that is the difference?
What? We arenât comparing skills. You keep going on about the average player but again, again, again, that is not how data analytics works. You are trying to make it sound like if we took average player data we would see different results. Given that you could somehow get an average player set with a consistent tight skill range, you would see the same results. Or are you trying to say the gap between the average and best controller players is somehow different than the gap between the average and best KBM players?
YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND DATA ANALYTICS. What you are saying is not valid in any way. YOU FUNDAMENTALLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE TOPIC YOU ARE ARGUING ABOUT!!!
If we were talking about balancing a map, effectiveness of a weapon, spawn points, etc, we would want to balance around the average player. We arenât and you donât know what you are talking about.
I dont know how else to put it the trchnical capability is going to be stronger on a game sense in controller. How the game is played the mechanics including aiming movement, using the weapons positioning in Halo as the game has built a following for two decades in the pro scene around controller. So the general game sense and play is going to lead the more capable pros there. I know your not good at recognising factors into you conclusions but that will have an effect.
I thought we werent bringing opinions into this. There has been no data from 343 just people like yourself looking at the top 40 from halo tracker. Like myself you have no clue what is going on in the mean. I could be wrong im happy to say that but i could be right.
If we are talking about balancing the inputs if you balance to the pro you run the risk of alienating the average player. Its not that hard to understand. Ok lets put it this way if the average mnk sits beside or close to the average controller (which looking at the csr as the only easy but unreliable comparrison they are) reducing aim assist would lower the mean for controller but keep the mnk in place. You cant take 20 of the best of each side and nerf controller to match mnk.
Mnk has no real way to nerf so all you can do is bring on side down.
Too be honest the two can NEVER be truly balanced so doesnt it make sense to just give them the option of seperate lobbies.
This is not in any way accurate or data conclusive. This is 100% conjecture based on your opinion that is based on what I can only guess is what you want the truth to be to avoid the truth the data presents.
We arenât. Iâm sharing how data works. Again, the only way your incessant need to use average player data instead of top player data makes sense is if you believe that the gap between average to pro is larger for controller players than KBM players or vice versa. The difference between a top player and an average player should be statistically the same for both inputs.
Do you believe the average controller player is closer/further away from the top controller players than the difference for the average to top KBM player?
You are again just proving you are floundering in the deep end of the pool. There are plenty of buffs that can be applied to KBM to balance the inputs without negatively affecting your precious aimbot. And yes I can call it an aimbot because I have been playing on controller and it is stupid OP. Strafe and pull the trigger and the game does the rest. Buff bullet magnetism for KBM. That alone could provide enough help to balance the inputs.
Just because you canât fathom a solution to a problem, doesnât mean a solution doesnât exist.
Please just stop commenting. All you have done is to bring attention that you donât understand data analytics, you donât understand how game balancing works, you donât understand the mechanics that can be adjusted, and despite all of it you still feel the need to argue from ignorance about it.
I donât know why this needs to be said but aim assist on Mouse is not a popular feature. People would perma uninstall the game on principle if you buffed bullet magnetism or added any other aim assist mechanics on Mouse. The bullet magnetism the game already has was cause enough for a lot of players to bounce off the game entirely.
Beyond that the game is already effectively ded on Mouse. Itâs not worth discussing solutions until 343 acknowledges that.
Wow⌠thatâs not even accurate lmfao!!! People, do your own experiment, xbox player⌠go ahead play each ranked games, collect all the k/d & platforms BUT MAKE SURE that you can verify itâs an PC player by checking theaters not just the profile because PC logos can be easily hidden making you think its the xbox when reality⌠PC can literally just use an xbox app to be hidden AND has an ability to modify/use adapter to trick halo infinite thinking youre using a controller giving aim assist onto mouse and keyboard very easily lmfaoo.
Thereâs a reason why itâs all high in PC players disguised as xbox & xbox controller⌠funny⌠thinking thqt the controllers just went superior when m&k are the powerful ones especially with aim assist on check those profiles throughly to see for yourself qnd check collecting data YOURSELF in ever matches you play, youll always see xbox players are the worst players, PC are the best
lmao what does that even mean? Just because halo was primarily a console game you need to treat your mnk community like trash by making controller overpowered? What kind of logic is that?
My mouse accuracy is 44% and my headshot accuracy is 47% yet my controller accuracy is 45% with a staggering 60% headshot accuracy. Thatâs too much of a difference. Yesterday in crossplay I increase my headshot accuracy from 47% to 47.4% simply by using a controller.
Stop telling me mouse has an advantage in any scenario. Nobody should use mouse in this game unless you like getting melted by onyx ranked players in 1v1 every time.
I play a lot of SWAT and I can tell you, any advantages KBM have over controller does not hold any weight with the advantages controller gets in Halo Infinite, whatsoever. KBM may have bullet mag but, it is no where near as close to what controller receives. Try playing Behemoth in SWAT on KBM. This is a dead giveaway of how strong bullet mag is with controller. Most controller players think a KBM user has the advantage at long range but this is totally untrue, controller still has the advantage at long range with the very strong bullet mag.
Are you trying to say that controller stats are higher because PC players are somehow cheating by appearing as controller users and using aim assist on KBM?
If you honestly think this you have no idea how aiming works on a mouse. Aim assist would fight against the userâs movements and make aiming worse, not better.
Youâve said similar things on multiple posts but never shared any of this âdataâ youâve collected. Always the claim of PC being better, never any proof provided.
Thank you ZeroSine2760 for putting these controller players in their place lmao. I am actually confused on how controller kids actually think mnk is better. You can literally FEEL the difference in game.
The key piece of this âdataâ that is missing is that these Onyx controller players are playing with decades of Halo controller muscle memory built in. Kbm players just donât have that for Halo.
My question to those who claim controller is god tier over kbm is if controller is so damn good, why are you still playing kbm?
These will never, ever be 1:1 no matter how much fine tuning goes in so the crossplay toggle is the only real viable option to resolve this.
Laughed really hard at this. That is not data, that is your opinion and is completely irrelevant to reality. You all like to act like we are some incompetent new players because we play on KBM. Those at the top of the KBM leaderboard are not performing worse than Controller players because of your nonsense about game history, they are performing at the top of the potential for KBM and that is not enough to overcome the advantage Controller players have against them.
I switched. Still dialing in my Controller play and already dramatically outperforming my KBM play. The difference is night and day.
Always the laziest option. Iâll say the same to you as every other person that has offered the laziest solution. Just because you canât comprehend a solution, doesnât mean there is not a solution.
You say that yet your solutions donât really seem all that great either.
You keep implying thereâs some sort of big brain solution out there waiting to be found yet nobody has found it yet.
I mean are you sitting on a something that will resonate with majority of the playerbase? Because thatâs what 343 is ultimately going to shoot for. As they should.
FIxing balance will make all the Controller players unhappy because the game will get harder for them. Fixing an imbalance isnât about keeping the advantaged players happy, it is about fixing the problem.
Letâs clarify the points here. I donât know the ultimate fix to successfully balance crossplay but just making separate game modes does literally nothing to solve the problem. It just allows us to play separately to avoid fixing the problem. For those that want to give up and just play separately, great! You can go play separately. For those that want Crossplay, there still needs to be a REAL solution to improve the balancing issues. Separating the inputs is not a solution to fix Crossplay, it is a lazy workaround to avoid fixing the actual problem. Hope that clarifies it.
Controller players make up majority of the playerbase. Now, Iâm all for balance but trying to bully your way into a game that has been a traditional console shooter would draw ire.
Fixing imbalance is about maintaining a fun sandbox environment for everyone.
The thing is, crossplay isnât a competitive feature. Itâs largely meant for casual play.
Competitive Halo is built around the even starts rule and its been this way for 20 years. If the starts arenât even, the entire foundation falls apart.
Mice and controller arenât even, in any regard. So why would you match them together and expect things to play the same as it always has? One uses a sensor and one uses a joystick. Just look at how chaotically unbalanced fiesta is.
Regardless of how balanced you make the two, the input thatâs easier to use will still manage to shine. It simply because of how each input differs mechanically. Mice have the pixel precise control that controllers donât have. And controllers have aim assist so mice are at a disadvantage by definition.
This has largely been my stance on the crossplay and the mkb vs controller debate. Just couldnât really find the right words to really string my thoughts together coherently.
The way shyway explains the competitive foundation for halo really shows why crossplay doesnât work.
@ZeroSine2760 You keep shooting down legitimate workarounds (ie crossplay toggle), call the workarounds lazy and offer nothing in return. You seem to know of a magic fix for this so why are you holding it back? Can you just post the code please so that 343i can just fix this once and for all? Be our savior.
check those profiles throughly to see for yourself 
qnd check collecting data YOURSELF in ever matches you play, youll always see xbox players are the worst players, PC are the best