Seriously…this rank system needs to change

I loose two 3v4s back to back and loose 5% of my D4 level…then I go 25:12 in a 12 minute Stongholds game and gain the 5% back…

I literally feel like I’m running on a treadmill with my rank over here because of this broken system.


That sucks. I really wish 343 would do something different here.

So not a lot really. A handful of points.

And chances are your MMR didn’t budge. So your CSR is now probably a bit lower than your MMR and will be keen as mustard to jump back up with your next win.

And there we are. A win and your CSR is back with your MMR.

Frustrating for sure. But no harm. No foul.

And your 25:12 won’t mean much for that game (your CSR doesn’t care). But if you have improved your KPM vs higher ranked opponents it may nudge your MMR and you can look at ranking up in your next game or two.

There is not a lot the system can do with quitters.

343 just need to work out how to deal with it.

As for the tread mill. That’s up to you. If you improve your level of play then the rank will come. Just not off the back of a game or two. People plateau with their skill ceiling and your MMR settles in. The CSR oscillates a bit with token wins or losses (eg in 3v4 matches) - but always comes back if you play consistently.


The MMR/CSR system is bs. If you perform well in a game, you should be rewarded regardless of what your arbitrary MMR is. There is no argument against this. It’s only in place to make it more difficult to rank up.


You are.

Both the win and your personal performance (mainly KPM) act on your MMR.

And the win is reflected in your CSR change.

It’s anything but arbitrary.

Again, personal performance affects your MMR. And this is eventually reflected in your CSR (which is chasing your MMR).

The CSR is designed to smooth the trajectory of your ranking. It’s limited to a max of 15 points per game. But your MMR is free to reflect your skill. And the CSR will catch up eventually.


No, if you perform well in your game, you should see that reflected in the points you earn and not some number that’s there to be there, hence it being arbitrary. It shouldn’t take several games of doing well for a player to finally see their hard work paying off by having the CSR system finally kicking in and gifting you a bunch of points. It’s a ton of hoops to go through for no reason other than “This is how our system works, and it’s working correctly.” It’s a crock.


yeah, the system only brings stress and disappointment. It should motivate us to keep playing better and more… but no :frowning:


The best way to destress the system is to stop counting every CSR point you gain or lose.

There just isn’t enough precision in the system.

Your CSR is chasing a moving target. And that target isn’t even an actual number - it a range of probable numbers.

Just be happy you are P4 or whatever.

Work hard and keep improving. Don’t get hung up on becoming P5 in a day. That’s not how skill improvement works.

Let it all unfold over days to weeks.

The system doesn’t put any real importance on a single MMR point - so you shouldn’t either.


I agree with this some people think aim training and what ever is going to magically make them platinum overnight. Have fun with it, if you get there and improve thats great. If not don’t give up keep trying. but make sure to have fun. Too many competitive matches with people screaming and it spoils the whole experience.

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You can see why they kept it simple and just left the personal performance out of the CSR.

I guess they could factor it in. But on the same token they would have to also take CSR away if you perform badly. And that “disappointment” would probably outweigh the benefit.

Much simpler to have CSR go up with a win and down with a loss.

Could you imagine the Waypoint threads when people started losing CSR on a win?

That at least keeps people’s eyes on the real prize - working as a team and actually winning the game.

If people thought they could manipulate CSR even more through personal performance we would just end up with even more toxic plays.

The system is actually set up to reward consistent play.

Not instant gratification on the basis of a good game.

It’s not a “crock”. That’s how ranking systems are supposed to work.

What we desperately need is an XP rank, weighted to performance. That way you can get your pat on the head right after the game.

And if people really do want a volatile ranking system that puts you up on a whim (ie. a couple of good games) - you need to make sure they are OK with the opposite. A couple of bad losses should see you drop straight away as well.

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I hope to be P5 one day. Hopefully, that day will come pretty soon. That´s the dream

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Waypoint actually provides a useful tool now to help you work out the direction you are heading.

If you look up your last 20 games you can see your kills and deaths vs expected.

This will reflect your KPM and DPM at your current level.

Keep winning and get your acual > expected and I’m sure your MMR will get moving.

Good luck Spartan.


Yeah, i’m feeling you.

They should make it so that your rank doesn’t decrease as much if you lose a 3v4.

Assuming they havent done that already

I’m finally starting to get in the mindset of stop getting worked up looking at the amount of bar lost on the screen and just starting to focus on my own stats for the match. Even losing can get your MMR to raise so the bar will fill quicker when you finally do win.
Evidentially to some degree, screw the objective.
Have heard this on many youtube videos as well on how to rank up faster, without any explanation of MMR and CSR.
When I notice the my rank going up minimal amounts or taking big losses, I take it to social matches for a while to get my MMR up higher that way I’m not losing CSR in the process.

It’s so much better. And by not micromanaging the stress of each game you probably do better in the long run.

Um. Yes. I guess.

It can happen. But not often. And probably only during placement. When your curve is wide and you can be matched in a game that is below your pay grade. ie. you perform well AND your MMR is volatile.

I doubt it happens very often when your curve is narrow and you are playing relatively balanced opposition (and whom it would be very hard to actually generate a high KPM anyway).

No! The key is still to beat teams ranked above you.

You are not going to generate KPM high enough in these games to move a stable MMR. Not a lot anyway. You have to focus on the win. Play the objective.

But you can, and should, play the objective as a Slayer. The good teams push the objective when they have the number advantage. 4v3 or better.

Danger Will Robinson. Danger.

Also probably doesn’t help.

Each game mode has an offset MMR. These do go up and down with your global MMR (match history / form). That’s how offsets work.

Your “form” in another playlist may push your MMR’s behaviour to one side of the curve or the other - but as your curve narrows it becomes much less of an effect.

I guess it could “buffer” your CSR shifts for a game or two. But it’s not going to do a lot to your MMR.

Bottom line;

  • Win. Especially the games vs better opponents.
  • Do play the objective. That’s how you win.
  • Maintain a solid KPM. Check Waypoint stats to see that you are at least matching the expected KPM and DPM for each game.

It takes me 5 wins to make up for one loss. I’ll play my absolute heart out and gain nothing. I have lost twice as much rank as I’ve gained by losing a 3 v 4 match before. I don’t get this system. I hate it to its core. Halo Infinite is brilliant! It is undone by its systems. These guys are too clever and its why they’ve yet to produce a Halo game that people are satisfied with.

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It’s frustrating - but it’s more that it takes one loss to correct five wins.

You’ve been winning. Pushing your CSR up but not your MMR. You CSR wants to get back to your MMR. So it jumps at the next loss.

The personal solution is to stop counting every single CSR point. The system just isn’t that precise. Go with the trend over time.

The 343 solution is to;

  1. Stop giving CSR for wins that don’t matter.
  2. Reduce the scale of the CSR eg. 1 to 100.

This hurts. But it’s just the system stealing back those “borrowed” CSR points.

I agree that 343 should wait until you lose a game fair and square before taking them back.

But at least you know where you stand in terms of MMR vs CSR.

Clearly not (and yes, I know the full sentence was intoned with sarcasm).

The decision to go 1-1800+ just doesn’t hold any precision. People are getting upset over literally “nothing”.

Keeping it open ended is just encouraging a toxic grind. Put a max value on it already.

Awarding token CSR for the win has backfired - any brief moment of joy for getting the win is soon outstripped by it being taken away with the next loss.

Not adding in an XP rank to grind alongside.


It would be nice to not loose points upon game crashes and disconnects. I had that happen to me back to back and watched the bar go way down.

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It amazes me how many people don’t know how the system works…

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It’s impossible to know what was accidental and what was a quit.

It has to err on the side of a quit.


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I am aware of this.
I want to grind out competitive but lately it’s been laggy and full of bad desynchs :frowning_face:
I think thats the biggest issue with ranked is that games can feel so inconsistent in terms of play.

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