Off the bat Halo 5 should have a seperate playlist section for Normal/Classic modes and Infinity modes. Giving classic and old school fans some love and fun without having to wait 10 + weeks/months for something.
Also adding variety NEVER harms a game. 343 isn’t getting rid of Halo 4 elements as much as it is just adding layers and more things for people to play. Which may gain attention and SALES.
Classic Modes
Big Team
Team Slayer
FFA
SWAT
Multi Team
No loadouts
No sprint
No AA’s/equipment
No ordnance
Weapons on map
No HUD layouts or markers
110% speed
Infinity modes
Infinity Big
Infinity Slayer
Infinity FFA
Infinity SWAT
Loadouts (mix of personal and pre set)
Sprint always on
AA’s active
Ordnance on
Weapons are dropped off
HUD layouts/markers
90-100% speed (due to sprint)
Of course things like action sack, griffball and so would be a mix of both.
So. Would you guys like this idea. It’s simple, wouldn’t take much work at all, and would and could possible get Halo1/2/3 fans back into Halo. Something that’s simple but would have a HUGE positive effect on Halo 5’s sales and grades.
Wouldn’t prefer it personally.
I’d be stuck between choosing an old gamemode and a heavily flawed gamemode.
I doubt Infinity as you described it will return in Halo 5. Ordnance is pretty unanimously hated as one example, therefore no reason to keep it. Along with new concepts inevitably being created to replace old ones. Point is Infinity will most likely evolve drastically from what it is now if 343I has learned anything, and that is what we will see in Halo 5.
Halo 5 should be Halo 5 with classic gametypes on the side. Halo 2 wasn’t strictly a copy paste version of Halo CE, I don’t see why Halo 5 should be of Halo 2.
Creating variety does not. Adding variety does and inconsistency does even more and an inconsistent multiplayer experience is what you are basically suggesting.
I can’t follow and understand why segregating the community by splitting your game into two different games would be a good idea.
I thought history (gaming history as well as human history) showed us that segregation has never been well received or led to great outcomes in general, to put it politely.
> So. Would you guys like this idea. It’s simple, wouldn’t take much work at all, and would and could possible get Halo1/2/3 fans back into Halo. Something that’s simple but would have a HUGE positive effect on Halo 5’s sales and grades.
Actually, it would take an enormous amount of unnecessary work to pull that of properly. It isn’t as simple as just enabling or disabling stuff here and there and call it a day.
Maps, sandboxes, etc. all would have to be designed specifically for each of the two modes. So basically you would have to develop two multiplayers.
And in the end, because resources are limited, we would likely end up with a half-baked “classic” experience and a half-baked “infinity” experience, what would mean eventually no one is really pleased and satisfied with the game.
And aside that your multiplayer won’t even have a clear identity.
I would say create one consistent and full-fledged multiplayer experience and create gameplay variety primarily through maps and gametypes that are developed upon that experience.
Reunite the community or rather create a united community with your game but don’t segregate it.
I do like separated Infinity and “Old” playlists.
Whenever votes go to Big Team Slayer I flee, I like using my loadouts.
My #1 wish for Xbox One-Halo multiplayer is increased speed (of course, let the sprint in). Even faster than the temporary Speed Slayer playlist they put on “343i day”.
If they could increase 20% more speed than Speed Slayer it would be my dream come true.
Or, even better. How about they just scrap the idea of imbalance in the game and opt for compromises between the two:
Fast, crisp movement without Sprint
Loadout options heavily limited to Utility weapons ONLY for primary, and Magnum/Automatics ONLY for secondary. 1x Grenade with minor tweaks to Plasmas to rebalance. No AA’s, no Perks.
AA’s remain in the game but are used as map pickups as opposed to spawning powers. This way they can be tweaked and balanced separately instead of alongside one another, and can be controlled and predicted by players. You do not spawn with a Default AA making every AA on the map a power up as opposed to a trade off. This makes them a middle man between Equipment and AA’s in that they are actually useful for the player using them personally like AA’s, but can still be controlled and fought over like Equipment or a Powerup/Power Weapon. Picking up an AA should require a player to hold X/RB/B as opposed to simply walking over.
Personal Ordinance replaced by allowing players the ability to select a resupply of their loadout Primary, Secondary, and Grenade choices. Good for getting rid of empty power weapons, refuelling your primary weapon, or adding a couple of grenades to your arsenal. As opposed to Personal Ordinance being deployed based on a score, instead personal Ordinance is granted to every player ever 3-5 minutes after the game starts based on what balances best.
HUD Markers should be toggled in Custom Options but should remain ON by default as some players simply aren’t capable of keeping track of weapon spawns as well as others, and they don’t have any direct unfair impact on gameplay.
The problem with this approach is it’s binary nature… you’re picking Halo 4 and one of Halo 2 or 3.
I don’t think either of those options should return because A) the definition of classic/normal varies greatly, and B) Infinity was a grand experiment, but it taught us more about how not to do things rather than how to do them.
Halo 5 needs to be it’s own creature, informed by the past iterations but not a rehash of the way things behaved 2 years, 6 years, or 10 years ago. Keep it fresh, keep it current, don’t let it stagnate. You can be deferential to the past while still evolving the gameplay; just don’t look at Halo 4 as the best example of that.
> What’s wrong with continuing exactly what we have now, a main course of modern infinity with a side of classic legendary?
Because the great majority of players very much dislike Infinity.
Because Legendary is far from being a good classic experience. Sprint, having no weapon on map asides from a couple of power weapons, weapon indicators, oversized maps… It’s not traditional Halo. It’s better than Halo 4, but does not live up to expectations.
Those who prefer the classic experience don’t just want Halo 2.5 or Halo 3.5, we want a game that take the core of Halo and then builds onto it in ways that stick to the traditional experience. Halo 2 evolved from Halo 1, yet still stuck to the core principles of Halo. Same goes for Halo 3. Traditional Halo is not Infinity Slayer - Personal Ordnance and Loadouts, it’s a whole game design mentality.
Having one small playlist dedicated to the vast majority of fans is a stupid idea. We would not get to play the majority of gametypes in the style we like, which is terrible.
Come on Sammy, you know for a fact that the majority of players do not like Infinity. Why do you always seem to be so oblivious to that fact? We know that you know this, so please, stop acting like Halo 4 is factually the best thing since sliced bread.
If you want Halo 5 to have a population of 10k players and sell very poorly then sure, we can continue down the path of Halo 4. But nobody wants that, right? If we are to have a split like this, I vote that we have a highly majority of playlists in both ranked and social be traditional Halo, and then have one Infinity Slayer playlist.
> > What’s wrong with continuing exactly what we have now, a main course of modern infinity with a side of classic legendary?
>
> 4. Having one small playlist dedicated to the vast majority of fans is a stupid idea. We would not get to play the majority of gametypes in the style we like, which is terrible.
Exactly.
This is what I keep trying to point out. Both Social and Ranked should exist, but the game should naturally and normally play like its Ranked lists. Social lists should be the variant.
Casuals wouldn’t even notice the game wasn’t primarily built with all these crap perks and Sprint in mind anyway.
Even if they did, by that time, they’d have moved onto the next shooter anyway.
Casuals buy every big game, play them for a month, and then move on.
It will change nothing in terms of units sold to Casuals if the game is aimed toward Competitives.
What it does change is that more Competitives will buy it and keep playing it. We’ll even buy the DLC, too.
I actually do think that the OP’s suggestion would divide the community. Why include Infinity settings in the first place, though? They’re broken beyond belief and most of the community wants to move on to what made Halo great.
I don’t want a copy-and-paste of Halo 3, but rather an improved version of the Arena shooter known as Halo. How can we improve Halo? For starters, remove random spread, decrease bullet magnetism, speed up kill-times, make an increased non-slugish movement speed and a responsive strafe.
> I actually do think that the OP’s suggestion would divide the community. Why include Infinity settings in the first place, though? They’re broken beyond belief and most of the community wants to move on to what made Halo great.
>
> I don’t want a copy-and-paste of Halo 3, but rather an improved version of the Arena shooter known as Halo. How can we improve Halo? For starters, remove random spread, decrease bullet magnetism, <mark>speed up kill-times</mark>, make an increased non-slugish movement speed and a responsive strafe.
Nope nope nope nope nope nope The high kill time is what makes Halo so great. It’s more about strategy than who shoots first.
> > I actually do think that the OP’s suggestion would divide the community. Why include Infinity settings in the first place, though? They’re broken beyond belief and most of the community wants to move on to what made Halo great.
> >
> > I don’t want a copy-and-paste of Halo 3, but rather an improved version of the Arena shooter known as Halo. How can we improve Halo? For starters, remove random spread, decrease bullet magnetism, <mark>speed up kill-times</mark>, make an increased non-slugish movement speed and a responsive strafe.
>
> Nope nope nope nope nope nope The high kill time is what makes Halo so great. It’s more about strategy than who shoots first.
With reduced magnetism, and I should have added difficulty of aiming, faster kill times balance it and improves the skill it takes to play the game.
I’m not advocating for kill-times as fast as CoD-- they’ll still be slow. What’s ironic (and i mean this in the most respectful manner) about what you said is that what I and the competitive community suggests will make the better player win more often and will promote strategy.
The fastest possible kill-time should be fast, but the average kill time should be decently higher so only the most skillful can kill fast (think 3 shot pistol CE-- the most balanced Halo multiplayer). The problem with Halo 4 is the fastest kill-time and average kill time are way too close.
The idea sounds good in theory, and I once thought this was the best way for Halo Matchmaking to proceed. Give both groups what they want.
But this will only split the community even more. You need a system that is a hybrid of them both, but at its core is an Arena Shooter.So I guess the game would be more like Classic Halo than the later. But the items from REACH and Halo 4 that have improved the game would continue.
> > > What’s wrong with continuing exactly what we have now, a main course of modern infinity with a side of classic legendary?
> >
> > 4. Having one small playlist dedicated to the vast majority of fans is a stupid idea. We would not get to play the majority of gametypes in the style we like, which is terrible.
>
> Exactly.
> This is what I keep trying to point out. Both Social and Ranked should exist, but the game should naturally and normally play like its Ranked lists. Social lists should be the variant.
>
> Casuals wouldn’t even notice the game wasn’t primarily built with all these crap perks and Sprint in mind anyway.
> Even if they did, by that time, they’d have moved onto the next shooter anyway.
> Casuals buy every big game, play them for a month, and then move on.
> It will change nothing in terms of units sold to Casuals if the game is aimed toward Competitives.
> What it does change is that more Competitives will buy it and keep playing it. We’ll even buy the DLC, too.
There were no difference between H2/H3 Ranked and Social playlist. They were both the same. The difference was the people who played.
Ranked was much more serious and was about winning. So was Social, but you would find people messing around, trying to get splatters in H3 using the Mongoose, but you rarely saw this in Ranked.
And the players who played social enjoyed Halo as much as the people who played RANKED. They just didn’t take as serious but some did. This what was so great about these two games. I played more social than ranked, but that because the netcode was not the best. And especially when you live in Australia and always playing games with American Host, IMO, it was not worth playing RANKED because of the massive disadvantage you had against American Host.
Then REACH came along, with great netcode, and no RANKED playlist (Arena was a fail).
H5 needs to be a hybrid of the two, but needs to be an Arena Shooter.
I believe it is possible that custom loadouts can work, but require massive change. However the following H4 features need to be removed, they are unbalanced and can not be improved. They create randomness and do not belong in an Arena Shooter. They are PERKS and POD.
> Exactly.
> This is what I keep trying to point out. Both Social and Ranked should exist, but the game should naturally and normally play like its Ranked lists. Social lists should be the variant.
>
> Casuals wouldn’t even notice the game wasn’t primarily built with all these crap perks and Sprint in mind anyway.
> Even if they did, by that time, they’d have moved onto the next shooter anyway.
> Casuals buy every big game, play them for a month, and then move on.
> It will change nothing in terms of units sold to Casuals if the game is aimed toward Competitives.
> What it does change is that more Competitives will buy it and keep playing it. We’ll even buy the DLC, too.
Not to be offensive but your post is full of close-minded stereotypes and wrong assumptions.
First of all define what makes a player competitive and what makes a player casual.
Because in your post it seems as if the competitives are all professional players with a “phd in gaming” while casuals are just brainless people with too much money.
And that reflects the entire gaming community?
Then, like Thomsy already mentioned, Ranked and Social in Halo 3 was one and the same game. They only differed in their atmosphere. Ranked was more serious Halo 3, social was more relaxed Halo 3.
And now comes the shocking twist: Halo 3’s population primarily existed of so called casuals in its prime time because so called competitives have always been a minority.
In my opinion there are no such things as truly competitive or truly casual games, heck, I even find it absurd to relate games and especially people to such stereotypes.
I think there is only a game that in itself is entertaining to play, no matter if you play it competitively or socially.
Something what a game like Halo 3 managed quite well and where Halo 4 apparently failed.
How about no because it would split an already polarized community even more and we should have the same mechanics for the entire game and all its playlists except infection and action sack, but they’re supposed to be like that.
As much as I disliked Halo 4’s multiplayer, I prefer it all be one experience.