It wouldn’t take long for the average players to realise they get better quality / even games in the “competitive” playlist.
And all the good players would be left sweating in the “social” list.
Sounds perfect to me.
But really. We just need some match making toggles. So each player can pick their level of SBMM (from none to moderate to strict) and a maximum ping they will tolerate.
Toggle sounds like a good idea
Just needs to be fine tuned is all more or less. Try to pair up parties with similar set ups when possible, other wise allow them to still be pitted with anyone if that cannot be acquired.
In all honestly, they could do so much more if they allowed people to create their own servers and have a community created custom server browser though. If you want a true genuine casual experience, this is how you get it.
Prioritize regional lists though for people too, so that people can find servers near them so they can experience better lists. Then it can toss out SBMM settings amongst the people in that area to try and pair people for the best results.
The problem is this isn’t what happens to the very good players.
They get close to 9 out of 10 games against opposition ranked completely below them. And remember that teams average out to Gold 6.
They very rarely get a game vs an opponent ranked higher them. And it would be as rare as hen’s teeth to get enough quality on the opposition to be “rocked”. Only just over 1% of random teams would have two Onyx players.
And you can imagine the damage you could cause if 2 or more Onyx buddies teamed up.
I get that people are frustrated with connection quality. But purely random skill match making is not a good thing.
Player’s will be much happier if they have a sense of control.
And then change up the social playlist to make it less sweaty.
I’m a big fan of multi-team games. 3v3v3 is fun and chaotic. It’s hard to get too sweaty when you are always outnumbered 2:1.
Make games shorter. It would reduce blowouts on the scoreboard.
Look at less sweaty game types. Infection for one. VIP and Juggernaut etc mix it up.
Take out the focus on power weapons and equipment. Either have more of them. Or none. Try and take the focus of the game away from map control (sweaty) and more into running around and killing people (chill).
Look at ways of getting Onyx players into the mix without stuffing up the game balance. Make them worth more points for the kill (put a waypoint on their head). Make it so they get less points for a kill. Take equipment off the table (eg. camo) - it just doesn’t show up for them to pick up. Put less ammo in their power weapons. Pop their shields if they get a multikill. etc.
If you put in other mechanisms to “even out the skill” you can stretch out the teams and focus a bit more on better connection.
I will say during the lifetime of MW2 I started off bad. Then as time went on i could call in more and more kill streaks as i got better. The connection first system of matchmaking allowed me to see progress where had i of had to deal with SBMM i never would have been able to do this. Sure over time i got to where i was better than most players as i could call in AC130s 9/10 games but at the start no chance i was doing that.
The reason killing bots isn’t fun is because they are so bad even the lowest skill players can do it. But if you started off bad and worked and worked until you are dominating most casual games that is what is fun. It only becomes not fun if the other team just gives up so i think massive penalties should be given to quitters, especially in ranked to deter that behavior. Quitting just because you aren’t winning is a loser mentality and needs to be corrected. Perseverance is a great virtue to have and i cant tell you how many matches in countless games i have won just because i didn’t give up, come backs are possible.
I do agree a slider or toggle is probably better than a whole new playlist.
Ageee with almost everything but I don’t like the nerfs to Onyx players (not just because i am one of them) because on principal (and maybe its just because of how i was raised) you should never give up no matter the odds. Go down fighting and you never know if a comeback is possible unless you try. And spoiler alert for Rocky but similar to the first Rocky movie sometimes there is a feeling of achievement just making someone better than you go all out to beat you and take them all 12 rounds to do so.
The good old fashioned “get gud”.
I think there are plenty of studies that show skills are better learnt gradually as opposed to being thrown in the deep end.
As long as match making gives you a chance to breathe (a range of games from a bit softer to a bit harder) you will have the chance to learn and progress.
In our Halo customs group we had a couple of Forged H5 maps that had a bunch of OS placed around that only the “damage sponges” were allowed to pick up. This meant that instead of being killed instantly by the Onyx level players (and not having the faintest idea what just happened) - they got the chance to fight back.
They still died, or course, but now they got to practice their aiming, strafe patterns, movement, etc.
They improved heaps. And had way much more fun doing it.
And the Onyx level guys didn’t mind at all.
I would be down for a system like that if they could make it to where only low skill players could see them/pick them up. MW2 handled this with death streaks which i would be for. Also made for easy jokes when a friend who shouldn’t have gone on a death streak did. Man it seems like we could just solve all of Halos problems right now.
Our weekly custom group is desperately waiting for Forge.
Priority 1 is a copy of Beaver Creek (shotguns!).
Priority 2 is a script that provides dynamic handicapping in game. Scoring will be based on the K/D of the player you killed (eg. K/D of 0.5 = 5 points). And then players with K/D less than one will spawn with an OS (from 1 to 60 seconds depending on how bad).
Players on a kill streak may have a penalty applied. We are toying with a gradual drop off in damage output. But we want to see how the OS mixes things up first.
We want to put 8 players on the field. Ranging from low Gold to Onyx. Have the script randomly assign two teams and just let them rip - knowing that the game will balance itself out.
Yes, it’s a somewhat artificial construct. But as long as the games are close - and everyone feels involved in the combat loop - it’s all good.
And I can’t emphasise how much the OS helps the lower ranked players. They have so much more fun knowing they can’t be spawn killed. That they can go toe to toe with the enemy and not be shredded in less than a second. That they have a chance to run if they need to.
And the better players seemed to enjoy the challenge.
Yeah i can get on board with helping low skill players but anything that actively de-incentivises players from doing well i am against.
Ex i am for: player dies 5 times in a row they spawn with a 75% overshield. Maybe even increase their motion tracker range (which for casual should be done anyways but i am saying more than base at whatever that is)
Ex i am against: player goes on 15 kill streak and now deals less damage/has less health/is marked for all to see
I would stop playing any FPS that nerfed me for doing good, that just makes me not want to try at all and honestly why would anyone if they get punished for doing well.
All in all i agree with helping bad players though, great idea. Always wondered why death streaks never came back in COD but ugly SBMM has reared its ugly head in recent entrees so i guess that is what replaced them.
In MW2 you could choose your death streak too so if Halo did the same and losened up SBMM (or added a toggle) i think that would be a great comprise.
And this is the disconnect between skilled / competitive players and social playlists.
You are at least ahead of most of your colleagues. There will be heaps who are completely against buffing the lower ranked players as well.
The key is to think about it as a different way of nerfing you. SBMM uses similarly skilled players to nerf your output. Here we are giving you a faster match / better connection, but nerfing you in other ways.
Our group baulked a bit at the lower damage output. I don’t think it’s necessarily good to have invisible mechanics. At least with the OS you can see clearly what you are up against.
We didn’t mind the waypoint idea. Other game types use those.
And popping shields. eg. on five kills in a row. At least you know exactly where you stand. And it makes continuing the streak a challenge - which is a good thing. What I would really like to look at is a gradual increase in the delay in shields regenerating (eg. add 3 seconds to each kill in the streak).
Hopefully scripting will allow us to nerf players in terms of power weapon pick ups, changing ammo counts, and/or equipment use.
I simply cannot take a game seriously if it is not 4vs4 …and I mean every player contributing equally to the team… Be it killstreaks, or holding the objective or being the meat shield, (vanguard) or whatever. But I’ve played enough games to know if I’m on a losing team in about 2-3 minutes. At that point I have no interest in doing too much. So I go for my medals which I enjoy, but sometimes pisses off my teammates who may not realize our fate as early as I.
Yeah i think we are just going to be at a disagreement there. Im all for actively buffing a bad player to help them after certain criteria are met but i am not for passively helping them by nerfing good players.
If you nerf a good player because they are doing good you not only hurt them but you are helping more than just the bad players. Any other good players could take advantage of this to help themselves. Thats why i think just singularly helping bad players is the best option.
They could flat out remake the MW2 death streaks:
Stim = overshields
Martyrdom = frag drops on death
Last stand = your spartan spawns a bubble where you could be revived and the death not be counted on your record (this is pretty different but as good as we are going to get in Infinite)
Copycat = spawn with the weapon that killed you although maybe we just make this be a weapon thats not a power weapon ex. Spawn with a heatwave and not be able to spawn with a rocket or sniper
@Darwi its nice to have a cordial conversation even though we disagree, can’t say this is the norm
every decision they make to change things for the worse makes me want to delete the game, and honest to God I don’t know what’s keeping me here at this point
It’s like they’re fun vampires, they want to suck every ounce of fun out of everything
Take a little break if possible… I’m at the beach this week. I’m fine not playing, but I miss playing a little and it’s actually a decent game if I get the right squad. Maybe when I get back we can see if we work well together. Peace
On leaving a match, I don’t agree that this is a loser mindset. It is not always so. Yes, there are players who feel a little pressure from the enemy and run away from the match. I agree here. And it happens that you are thrown into a meat grinder, and there is simply no chance of winning. You play at the limit for half the match - the opponent’s score grows exponentially, and your team’s score does not grow. What is the point of such a game? To be cannon fodder? Run as a live target? What is my interest in just taking damage with no chance of winning? I am not a masochist. Matchmaking is sometimes done in such a way that your team has no chance. And whoever told me anything - I saw it myself, I felt it myself. And at first I waited for the end of the match. And then not just tired of it. I don’t want to waste my time playing cannon fodder and I won’t. Am I a loser now? 
I have a different opinion. I would write here about who are really losers. But the moderators will ban me The game is broken. The rules and logic themselves are broken, why then do the players adhere to some rules?
I would say yes this is a loser mentality. Growing up my parents had a rule, i didn’t have to start any activity i didn’t want to but if i started you have to finish and do the best you can. Also growing up my dad never went easy on me, never let me win anything unless i beat him fair and square. This tought me perseverance and that if you want to win you need to practice and most importantly that winning is never guaranteed but you should still do your best because winning and losing doesn’t affect your worth. Everyone should live by this rule.
You can learn so much from your losses and not only that there is no guarantee that a comback isn’t possible. I have had my team clutch team slayer games where the enemy only needed 3 or so kills and we need 10+. Should we have just given up because the odds are stacked against us? No because even in losing you can learn how to fight opponents that have better gun play and team dynamic. You can also see what they do better than you and mimic that to improve yourself.
Sure you won’t always win these and a comback is highly unlikely but you owe it to yourself and your opponents to try your hardest the entire time. If you aren’t willing to play until the end of a match no matter the outcomes then just don’t play. It makes it no fun for anyone.
Sometimes a match just sucks. I don’t leave because I don’t want to leave others hanging, but were I able to leave with utter impunity, I may more often.
Listen, some folks know when they’re beat and don’t want to suffer through a guaranteed loss - not because they won’t win, but because there’s not a lot of point in sticking around for a 1v4 and wasting literally everyone’s time.
Daddy was hard on you, okay, cool, so was mine. My dad was very hard on me, even kicked me out of his house when he ended up having issue with having a daughter instead of a son.
Don’t stick it out for a guaranteed loss if you don’t have to lose that valuable time. You are not virtuous or great for suffering.
In my Custom Modes In H.I. I set the radar for 25 meters. For me I turn off the bloom.
My starting Wepons are THE BR with 120 Rounds and The Hydra comes with 6 clips for a total of 36 rounds.
Peace! 
