Sangheili (Elites) In New Trilogy Matchmaking (Part 1)

> 2533274856871452;10760:
> Let’s break down this counter-argument:
> [ODSTs were playable at a time (and still are, but that should be a given) in Halo 3: ODST.] - Halo 3 ODST was a filler game with no multiplayer besides firefighter so obviously they wouldn’t be playable-
> [Doesn’t mean that they should be in Halo 5, same with Elites.]- This is a tread design to argue on why they should be. So you’re going to obviously encounter opinions you odislike.-
> [Of course the Forerunners weren’t playable.] - Yes because they have power and strength that is far superior to both so why would a overpowered god like being be playable?!-
> [ It isn’t essential to play as the natives/creators of the Halo Array because the story takes place on a Halo.] - yes but quite a few missions take place on their home world. It almost seems like they are teasing the Elite fan base.-
> That was my original point.
> [Likewise, it isn’t essential to play as Elites when the story takes place on Sangheilios. The Elites can still be present and impactful to the story.] - yes but not including them kills off a large fan base from the game and takes away player diversity. It seems like I said before that they are teasing us. I do agree that they don’t have to be in it but the Elites not being playable is a good reason for me to not get this game.-
>
> (

Those are some pretty good points.

> 2535414395721320;10721:
> Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.

Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.

> 2533274829675476;10763:
> > 2535414395721320;10721:
> > Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.
>
>
> Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.

But fan feedback comes above all else.

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> > > 2533274858572140;10748:
> > > 1. A Good Name
> > > How about the “Halo 5: Noble Blood” add-on? Simple, not much else to say.
> > >
> > > 2. Have a Good Story
> > > Not much to say here, just make the situation just right as the Arbiter is usually too busy to go out and do missions himself. Escalation was a special case that needed his attention, so give us a reason for the Arbiter to go do something important. Now this could take place before or after Halo 5, I don’t know, but if done right, this add-on (if real) would be Halo 5’s version of Halo 3: ODST. And that would be fantastic.
> > >
> > > 3. Each Character must have their own loadout
> > > The Arbiter could start with the Covenant Carbine (with its own skin perhaps) and the Prophets’ Bane. Rtas 'Vadum would probably have the Plasma Rifle and Energy Sword. N’tho 'Sraom would probably have the Covenant Carbine and Plasma Rifle and Usze 'Taham would have the Storm Rifle and Plasma Pistol.
> > >
> > > 4. Co-op gameplay must remain the same
> > > Nothing else to say here, just let us revive, join in and out of missions and let us command our fireteam just like Halo 5’s campaign. Amagine you as the Arbiter giving out orders to your team, its just awesome!
> > >
> > > 5. Goodbye Spartan Abilities, Hello Elite Abilities
> > > a. Sprint
> > > b. Clamber
> > > c. Smart Scope
> > > d. Evade
> > > e. Active Camo
> > >
> > > If we’re going to play as Elites, we need some abilities for them Now to make Evade and Active Camo coexist I think would be tricky. How can we make it work, I don’t know. But if Evade and Active Camo can’t coexist, than just have Active Camouflage.
> > >
> > > 6. Make Elites playable in Halo 5’s multiplayer (Only Warzone at the very least)
> > > The whole topic of bringing back Elites into multiplayer has been brought up numerous Times, so much that I won’t discuss it too much here. Just give us playable Elites with unique armor (some of Halo 3’s and H2A’s multiplayer would be nice) the same about of armor customization as Spartans and give them Spartan Abilities. I know that doesn’t make sense because of Thruster Pack, but if Elites can have Jet Packs and Jump Packs, why not Thruster Packs? To talk more on that, just look up “Sangheili (Elites) in New Trilogy Matchmaking” for that.
> > >
> > > 7. Introduce 3 to 4 new Sangheili or Covenant styled maps
> > > This is just an idea that I’ve had for a while, but what if we had a Covenant styled version of Lockout? We’ve had a Forerunner version in Halo 2 and H2A and a human styled version in Halo 3, so why not a Covenant styled version for it? I can imagine it floating Inside a cave with the cave being all dark with the map itself being bright and purple, with covenant terminals in multiple locations and a waterfall behind the sniper tower. It’s beautiful isn’t it? I can amagine another taking place in a Sangheili garden, one taking place high in the mountains on Sangheilos with beautiful sights to see and one taking place in a Sangheili Keep on Sanghelios, maybe Vadam Keep? So many options here, so many options…
> > >
> > > 8. Have it at a reasonable price
> > > A price range between $20 and $40 doesn’t sound bad, at least to me it doesn’t.These are the eight things that I feel a Swords of Sanghelios DLC should have. I don’t have anything else to say, but please make this happen 343.
>
>
> Sorry man I meant to credit you but I didn’t remember who it was that posted it.

Very well, just be sure you find put who originally did it and credit them next time. Someone took my work and got a 100 for it back when I was in High School and I got a zero for the assignment. So I find it very frustrating when someone takes my idea or work, I hope you understand.

Now to be sure I stay on topic, “please bring back Elites 343”

> 2533274858572140;10764:
> > 2533274829675476;10763:
> > > 2535414395721320;10721:
> > > Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.
> >
> >
> > Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.
>
>
> But fan feedback comes above all else.

Isn’t the fans more important than other random players?

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> > 2533274858572140;10764:
> > > 2533274829675476;10763:
> > > > 2535414395721320;10721:
> > > > Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.
> > >
> > >
> > > Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.
> >
> >
> > But fan feedback comes above all else.
>
>
> Isn’t the fans more important than other random players?

How do you determine who is a “fan” and who is a “random player”? What’s your criteria?

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> > > 2533274858572140;10764:
> > > > 2533274829675476;10763:
> > > > > 2535414395721320;10721:
> > > > > Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.
> > >
> > >
> > > But fan feedback comes above all else.
> >
> >
> > Isn’t the fans more important than other random players?
>
>
> How do you determine who is a “fan” and who is a “random player”? What’s your criteria?

I have to agree with him on that one.

The halo 5 beta had magnetized bullets even with less or no aim assist this basically makes it to where if you miss you still hit the person so why would they care about the competitive game play if they want to add that in? Just seems like a mistake from halo 4 and people are gonna still be ignored.

> 2533274856871452;10769:
> The halo 5 beta had magnetized bullets even with less or no aim assist this basically makes it to where if you miss you still hit the person so why would they care about the competitive game play if they want to add that in? Just seems like a mistake from halo 4 and people are gonna still be ignored.

Im not sure if that was done on purpose or not.

LOL

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> LOL

What?

> 2533274829675476;10763:
> > 2535414395721320;10721:
> > Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.
>
>
> Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.

Halo 2, halo 3, halo reach. All competitive all featuring elites. Stop defending their laziness

I honestly wish they’d bring back elites, theres no reason not to. They can easily change hitbox aswell as the elites body to make it work. Halo 5 looks so much better than halo 4, but I just don’t want to play as a spartan in MP. Before anyone goes “omg its just a player model wats the big deal” It’s my preference, you wouldn’t understand since you prefer playing as a spartan.

> 2533274851412396;10773:
> > 2533274829675476;10763:
> > > 2535414395721320;10721:
> > > Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.
> >
> >
> > Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.
>
>
> Halo 2, halo 3, halo reach. All competitive all featuring elites. Stop defending their laziness
>
> I honestly wish they’d bring back elites, theres no reason not to. They can easily change hitbox aswell as the elites body to make it work. Halo 5 looks so much better than halo 4, but I just don’t want to play as a spartan in MP. Before anyone goes “omg its just a player model wats the big deal” It’s my preference, you wouldn’t understand since you prefer playing as a spartan.

It totally makes sense. They have the models and the lore so why not do it.

> 2533274855689370;10766:
> > 2533274858572140;10764:
> > > 2533274829675476;10763:
> > > > 2535414395721320;10721:
> > > > Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.
> > >
> > >
> > > Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.
> >
> >
> > But fan feedback comes above all else.
>
>
> Isn’t the fans more important than other random players?

What defines ‘fans’? Pretty much every ‘random player’ is going to be a ‘fan’, as they are someone who enjoys playing the game. But you are missing the point.

This game is BUILT for competitive play. 343i made the mistake of making Halo 4 much too casual-player oriented, and it did not work out for anyone. Let me put it this way: Neither ‘fans’ nor ‘random players’ are more important than the vision of the developers/studio actually creating the game. I’m sure they take fan feedback very seriously, and are open to ideas that intersect with their own. But they will not ask fans to help shape the entire game, that would result in a mess, because everyone has different tastes.

> 2533274856871452;10769:
> The halo 5 beta had magnetized bullets even with less or no aim assist this basically makes it to where if you miss you still hit the person so why would they care about the competitive game play if they want to add that in? Just seems like a mistake from halo 4 and people are gonna still be ignored.

This game has no more bullet magnetism than any other Halo. Both BM and aim assist are scaled down drastically, almost to zero. And they’ve avoided pretty much every gameplay mechanic error from Halo 4. This was evident even in the beta, which was almost a year ago.

> 2533274829675476;10776:
> > 2533274856871452;10769:
> > The halo 5 beta had magnetized bullets even with less or no aim assist this basically makes it to where if you miss you still hit the person so why would they care about the competitive game play if they want to add that in? Just seems like a mistake from halo 4 and people are gonna still be ignored.
>
>
> This game has no more bullet magnetism than any other Halo. Both BM and aim assist are scaled down drastically, almost to zero. And they’ve avoided pretty much every gameplay mechanic error from Halo 4. This was evident even in the beta, which was almost a year ago.

Thats right.

> 2533274858572140;10774:
> > 2533274851412396;10773:
> > > 2533274829675476;10763:
> > > > 2535414395721320;10721:
> > > > Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.
> > >
> > >
> > > Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.
> >
> >
> > Halo 2, halo 3, halo reach. All competitive all featuring elites. Stop defending their laziness
> >
> > I honestly wish they’d bring back elites, theres no reason not to. They can easily change hitbox aswell as the elites body to make it work. Halo 5 looks so much better than halo 4, but I just don’t want to play as a spartan in MP. Before anyone goes “omg its just a player model wats the big deal” It’s my preference, you wouldn’t understand since you prefer playing as a spartan.
>
>
> It totally makes sense. They have the models and the lore so why not do it.

Because they dont want to take a few hours out of their schedule to please the minority elite fan base.

Personally, I like elites, but don’t consider it a game changer whether they’re in or not. I use a Spartan for every game except Halo 2 on the Xbox. In MCC I even changed that back to a Spartan.

The way I see it, they can just say the Swords of Sangheilos are, due to their alliance with the UNSC, sending their adolescent (read: not massive, hulking character models) elites to train with the S4s. These smaller elites train with the Spartans as part of a gesture of goodwill.

Elites have a different hitbox for their head, but that’s a neutral tradeoff, as they are vulnerable in different ways than Spartans. However, they would be sized about the same, as they are younger. They use thrusters, not evade, because they are training for use of the thruster packs standard to Elite rangers and jet troops.

Boom, done. Canonically explained, doesn’t cause a massive balance problem, and pleases a bunch of players. Let’s all move along, shall we?

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> > > 2533274851412396;10773:
> > > > 2533274829675476;10763:
> > > > > 2535414395721320;10721:
> > > > > Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.
> > >
> > >
> > > Halo 2, halo 3, halo reach. All competitive all featuring elites. Stop defending their laziness
> > >
> > > I honestly wish they’d bring back elites, theres no reason not to. They can easily change hitbox aswell as the elites body to make it work. Halo 5 looks so much better than halo 4, but I just don’t want to play as a spartan in MP. Before anyone goes “omg its just a player model wats the big deal” It’s my preference, you wouldn’t understand since you prefer playing as a spartan.
> >
> >
> > It totally makes sense. They have the models and the lore so why not do it.
>
>
> Because they dont want to take a few hours out of their schedule to please the minority elite fan base.

Please stop being such armchair developers.

To add playable Elites, the following would need to happen:

  • Arrange a first-person POV on the existing Elite model.
  • Create first-person models & animations for all base actions (sprinting, thrusting, clambering, sliding, throwing grenades, etc.).
  • Create animations for equipping, zooming (first-person only), firing, and reloading each and every weapon available in the MP sandbox. Third-person equipping and firing animations would already exist for some weapons, but AI-controlled Elites don’t need to reload. All would require first-person animations.
  • Create a HUD for the Sangheili perspective, not to mention creating/tweaking existing overlays for when zooming with various weapons.
  • Code all models, animations, HUD, and overlays to work without issue.
  • Assuming you want these Elite models to be customizable, that would require extra time/coding.Common sense should tell you that this would take significantly longer than “a few hours” to do.

You could argue that if Bungie could do it, 343i can… but let’s put a few factors into consideration. In two of the three Bungie-made Halo titles that permitted playable Elites in MP, you also played as one during the Campaign. It was a more integral part of development that could be justified for the time & resources demanded because it was necessitated by the narrative. “What about Halo: Reach?” you may ask. Let’s note that Reach offered a shorter (and more linear) Campaign than what’s been reported about H5: Guardians’ AND shipped with fewer MP maps at launch (17 individual maps as opposed to 20, and that’s including the Firefight maps).

Halo 5 also includes more weapons than any of the other three, which contributes to the time it would require to allow a second playable model (especially when you consider the implications of Smart Scope). Without a doubt, it features more player abilities than in H2 and H3. Reach had Active Camouflage, Armor Lock, Drop Shield, Evade, Hologram, Jetpack, and Sprint in the form of Armor Abilities. H5 has Sprint, Thrusters, Clamber, Slide, Shoulder Charge, Ground Pound, and Stabilizers in the form of Spartan Abilities. They’re equal if you look at it that way… but with the power-ups in H5 requiring an animation to activate, that’s one more animation (all power-ups seem to use the same animation) that needs to be applied for addition models to have full functionality.

Halo 5: Guardians “probably” has more content than Reach (and probably any other Halo game), so I find it ludicrous to accuse 343i of being “lazy” just because you can’t play as an Elite. I also find it ridiculous to claim that the developers are “oppressing”, “ignoring”, or “teasing” those that love the lore and culture behind the Elites when they are taking us to Sangheilios in-game.

*EDIT: For clarification and additional thoughts.

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> > > > > 2533274829675476;10763:
> > > > > > 2535414395721320;10721:
> > > > > > Halo 5 should have playable Elites on matchmaking. Look at all of this Sangheili yoink they’re adding! Yet, we can’t even be one like we used to, like we want to, like we love to? I’m sorry 343, but why? Balance, hitboxes, competition: are these more important than your fans, loyal to Halo since times of old? At least let us know you’re listening, let us know you hear us, let us know you care . A 343 official, post here and talk to us about why? If not here, pm me please. I just need a logical reason for my crushed dreams and memories. Please. Please 343, please.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Considering the entire multiplayer experience for this game is built around competitive gameplay, YES. All of those things are more important than sticking elites into multiplayer.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Halo 2, halo 3, halo reach. All competitive all featuring elites. Stop defending their laziness
> > > >
> > > > I honestly wish they’d bring back elites, theres no reason not to. They can easily change hitbox aswell as the elites body to make it work. Halo 5 looks so much better than halo 4, but I just don’t want to play as a spartan in MP. Before anyone goes “omg its just a player model wats the big deal” It’s my preference, you wouldn’t understand since you prefer playing as a spartan.
> > >
> > >
> > > It totally makes sense. They have the models and the lore so why not do it.
> >
> >
> > Because they dont want to take a few hours out of their schedule to please the minority elite fan base.
>
>
> Please stop being such armchair developers.
>
> To add playable Elites, the following would need to happen:
>
> - Arrange a first-person POV on the existing Elite model.
> - Create first-person models & animations for all base actions (sprinting, thrusting, clambering, sliding, throwing grenades, etc.).
> - Create animations for equipping, zooming (first-person only), firing, and reloading each and every weapon available in the MP sandbox. Third-person equipping and firing animations would already exist for some weapons, but AI-controlled Elites don’t need to reload. All would all require first-person animations.
> - Create a HUD for the Sangheili perspective, not to mention creating/tweaking existing overlays for when zooming with various weapons.
> - Code all models, animations, HUD, and overlays to work without issue.
> - Assuming you want these Elite models to be customizable, that would require extra time/coding.
> Common sense should tell you that this would take significantly longer than “a few hours” to do.

I agree