RIP Armour Abilities

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

I’ve loved my halo games since the very start, i’ve enjoyed watching it evolve from 3’s MP to REACH to 4 and each time they implemented new stuff like the Custom loadouts and AA’s i thought it added a nice dynamic.

I loved sprint because it made me feel like the super soldier you’re supposed to be i mean what Yoinking soldier can’t yoinking run and jogs everywhere. ??
(most people ive seen moan about it because they’re able to run of before they die so they complain that they never got the kill) aww boohoo thats just selfish because you couldnt get a kill sprint needs to go?

I for one want sprint to stay

I can understand quarrels people had with AA’s but each one that gave an advantage had a disadvantage to another. personally i think they should just strip it down to reach’s style which everyone can agree on and is a good mix between 3 & 4.

for those that don’t like AA’s have now ruined halo for those that do. when you’re just but hurt someone is better than you with said ability.shame really.
[Edit]: Which also as halo fans that “care” for the community should have actually cared about there fellow halo brother and all come together for a compromise but no they just ruled it out and put they’re needs first!

We should all be coming together in a seperate thread to shape the multiplayer and help 343 to not end up torn between two factions and present them with a list of yoink we can all agree on that would let 343 make us the multiplayer we really crave. :slight_smile: just saying
[EDIT]: I am curious about the new Spartan abilities though? Anyone?

2

Ideally for me… sprint stays, along with loadouts. Get rid of the -Yoink!- AA’s, and we’re good to go.

This would be enough to restore balance, assuming the theoretical player in question knows weapons, maps, etc (aka they know how to set loadouts per map).

3

I like sprint, to a degree. It changes a lot of mechanics so it needs super tweaking to stay. (Flinching and the like)

I hate AAs, I like abilities, but so far we haven’t made them work. If they were pick ups I would not of minded them half as much as I have.

I like loadouts but I hate BR and DMR Spawn (aswell as sticky and boltshot spawn). Have AR spawns, and some Utility weapon for defense against long range but not an over powered spawn weapon (We’ve already seen this weapon :wink: ).

Fix Weapon drops. Power drops barely made a difference and personal drops unbalanced the game even further. Drops should be random and everyone should see it on their HUD.

I have a hard time believing people would be 100% against these types of changes. Or at least against trying them out maybe as part of the beta to see if they work better than what we have. It also doesn’t remove any features people like. Though forgive my snarkiness, but apparently don’t like enough to have them play the damn game.

All I ever hear is people love these features and it’s just the minority that don’t, but Halo 4 had them and it’s dead on its backside right now :confused:

4

Good riddance. I can live with sprint and loadouts too. Just ditch the AA’s and the stupid support upgrade/tactical package nonsense. If Frank truly meant “Equal Starts” those should be gone too. Or at least drastically altered.

5

> I loved sprint because it made me feel like the super soldier you’re supposed to be i mean what Yoinking soldier can’t yoinking run and jogs everywhere. ??

What super soldier runs out of breath after a few meters and hardly can keep up an ordinary speed when sprinting?
Does sprint feel conventional? Yes.
Does it give me the impression I am a Spartan? No.
The question is, what does it then?

> (most people ive seen moan about it because they’re able to run of before they die so they complain that they never got the kill) aww boohoo thats just selfish because you couldnt get a kill sprint needs to go?

They complain about that because it is truly an objective issue in Halo. Too often you have scenarios where you simply cannot kill a player that is sprinting from cover A to cover B. The player can reach the cover faster than you could land 4 shots with a BR on him/her for example. (what has to do with sprint, base movement, kill times and the incorporation of that into map design)
It is not selfish, it is just an imbalance between offensive and defensive gameplay. You have to put more effort into getting a kill than preventing death in H4. And sprint is one of the main reasons for that.
There are more things sprint messes with but I will leave it at that.

> I can understand quarrels people had with AA’s but each one that gave an advantage had a disadvantage to another. personally i think they should just strip it down to reach’s style which everyone can agree on and is a good mix between 3 & 4.

I am not someone who is inherently against the concept of AAs at spawn but HReach’s and H4’s implementation was just flawed and broken.

In Reach it seemed like as if they were intented to work as class abilities. You had 5 preset classes, each with a different AA.
But the AAs were in no way related or dependend on each other nor were they balanced among each other like it would have to be in a class system.
Eventually we were left with nothing more than individual advantages that all do different things, while some were extremely effective and powerful like Jetpack or even grant you a massive advantage by simply pushing a button like Armor Lock, others were outright useless in comparison like Hologram.
Halo 4 just kept that flawed implementation and tweaked it a little.

Anyway, before I have to bother another flawed implementation of AAs, Spartan Abilities, which seem to become new universal base player traits/mechanics, sound much more promising.

> when you’re just but hurt someone is better than you with said ability.shame really

When we would all play with the same ability or my ability is able to counter yours, etc. then complaining about losing would indeed just be the complaints of a sore loser.
But that is not the case.

Additionally, to get the desired effect from many AAs it is really enough to simply push the button.
It doesn’t need actual skill to look through walls, or sniping/flanking while being invisible, or becoming temporarily invincible, or healing yourself.

6

Loadouts fully removed from Halo’s coding (Truly and fully gone) would influence not only Matchmaking but the Custom Games community as well - something that some people either forget or just frankly don’t care about.

However, Halo 2 and 3 did just fine in the Custom Games department without Loadouts, so it might not be as bad as one might expect. Reach did a fantastic job with AA’s and Loadouts in regards to Custom Games, and now that AA’s are gone we have to see if Loadouts will be an option in Custom games (Not main Matchmaking) or if they’re gone too.

I know some people hate the very concept of Loadouts, and want them gone even from the Custom games side of Halo, but I don’t necessarily agree with that. So I voted for the AA’s gone, Loadouts staying. Just keep them out of the ‘ranked’ playlists and all is well in my eye. That is assuming of course Halo 5 will be modeled after Halo 3, with a Ranked / Social split. If not, then just keep them as a Custom Games option with it disabled by default in most or all of the Matchmaking side. Playlists like Action Sack and Grifball aside (I’m going to assume they’re gonna return as well)

7

No AA
No Loadouts
No Killstreaks
No Perks

8

I would like sprinting back, but I found it much more fair if everyone walked.

9

No AA’s and very limited custom loadouts (two or three primaries). Like have them ready for everyone in the start of the match. Well, then they wouldn’t be custom loadouts, but normal loadouts with only a different rifle. And I think that sounds good.
And what comes to sprint? I like it and I don’t like it.
Also no to personal ordnance.

edit: But I do hope that AA’s could stay for the custom games.

10

I’ll be honest, I loved Armor Abilities. Which is why the knowledge of no Halo Reach Anniversary or update go XB1 truly upsets me.

Of course, I can see why people complained. But I don’t neccessarily understand it, on the other hand, despite being able to see te flaws in that aspect. AA’s were, and still are (To my knowledge), unique to Halo in function and design among all contemporary FPSs. To blame the failiure of a franchise on them, what people did for Halo Reach and 4, was BS. Seeing as they could be turned off. Heck, in some playlists on Halo 4, they were never used.

I actually think that, if AA’s were introduced in a better way, more visible perhaps, people wouldn’t have the dislike for them that they do now.

On the subject of loadouts, I want them back, but with expanded features, and NOT personal to the player. As in, having a ‘Base Traits’ tab on the Loadouts, instead of the Loadout system from Halo 4 and Reach.

11

> No AA
> No Loadouts
> No Killstreaks
> No Perks

Why though? what is SO bad that it ruins halo?

12

They’re terrible and anti-Halo.

They do not belong in a Halo game and those that like them should go back to playing Call of Duty.

13

While some of the AA’s were creative in their own right, I’m not glad they’re going.
If I wanted to use them I’d just go back on Halo Reach/4.

14

> They’re terrible and anti-Halo.
>
> They do not belong in a Halo game and those that like them should go back to playing Call of Duty.

I don’t remember anything like halos AA’s ever being in cod nor hear them moaning about them.

Despite the fact I’ve never been a call of duty fan until the newly anounced AW they’re comunity don’t seem to be split in half were supposed to be a band of brothers and fans that would compromise to suit our fellow AA lovers and classic lovers.

15

> > No AA
> > No Loadouts
> > No Killstreaks
> > No Perks
>
> Why though? what is SO bad that it ruins halo?

AA’s should be map pick ups.

It’d allow for more powerful AA’s and a different balancing. It’d also remove on spawn advantages/disadvantages per rock-paper-siccors because you made a simple choice.

I do not like loadouts for I think that weapons then suffer the same fate as AA’s, balancing in order to have them as balanced as possible. I think removing loadouts would enable weapons to be more varied to each other and then be valid pick ups.

Killstreaks/Personal Ordnance is a very vast subject. You get points for doing some stuff, then you get a random asortment of equipment/weapons to choose from. In an even set up, this will more or less have a huge impact on the outcome of the match.

Perks go hand in hand with loadouts, with perks I also see loadouts as limitations to what you can do because of your chosen traits. You excell in the area for which the loadout is made and then some other areas that are closely related to it. But as soon as you want/need to do something else, you’re limited by your loadout. You can’t do as good as you could have with another loadout. As opposed to everyone having the same default single loadout where your only limit is your own skill.

If it ruins Halo or not is a subjective question, I’d say. For some this improves Halo, for others it makes Halo unplayable. That’s due to their picture of what Halo is, what it represents etc.

For me those things makes Halo less enjoyable because to me, Halo is a game where player skill should be dominant, not what he might get in his/her ordnance or his/her loadout.

There are plenty of occasions where the Dexterity perk have saved my life, not my own skill. There are a buttload of times when the Survivor perk saved my life. Many instances where my team has been down ten kills, gotten one or two very lucky drops and turned the game around. A lot of the weapons I’ve picked up from the map that spawned there at match start are contributed to me using the Mobility perk, then killing any opponent who didn’t have mobility.

You could argue that skill is adapting to unknowns, like a jetpack, or a PO/GO acquired Laser when in a vehicle. That’s however one player facing a challenge from another player who wasn’t challenged at all. I’m making an effort to survive while my equally good player gets/has equipment that requires less effort from him/her to survive. I’m making an effort to ambush someone, and that is immediatley immediatley countered by just having Promethan Vision. That’s not a challenge to the one having the Promethean Vision now is it?

I hate it in Magic: The Gathering when I’m sitting there after three mulligans due to no mana/land cards in the hand, and then the fourth hand is also void of any mana cards, while the deck is about 50% mana cards.

While Magic and Halo are worlds apart, and I happen to enjoy Magic, it’s not fun when there’s no challenge to work against, meaning that everything is right for you but your opponent is struggling, or the other way around, when I’m struggling and my opponent is just walking in a park.

Just last week, I had such a bad Mana week it was ridiculous. MtG: DotP 2013, a deck full of mana, five mulligans, no land, 10 draws later, first land gets out. Next day, play with live cards against the most obnoxious player I’ve ever seen. Play with deck I’ve won so many times with against him. I open with four mana, a counter and then two good creatures. There’s little I can do when all I’m drawing is mana, in a deck with 35% mana deck. Naturally he wins as I get nothing but mana out. Reaction? “Holy crap my deck is so BEAST, RAAKDOOS, your deck is now CRAP! RAKDOOOS!”. Not that it has anything to do with Halo’s stuff, I sometimes see that mentality in Halo as well. Players getting all kinds of Anti armor weapons nullifying our vehicles, and snipers to keep us down when we have no vehicles while we get speed boosts, grenades and sticky detonators.

Fun times indeed knowing my opponent didn’t have to do much to win.

16

> Ideally for me… sprint stays, along with loadouts. Get rid of the -Yoink!- AA’s, and we’re good to go.
>
> This would be enough to restore balance, assuming the theoretical player in question knows weapons, maps, etc (aka they know how to set loadouts per map).

See for me this is a good compromise I like sprint and AAs you want AAs gone the majority say okay sprint stays and AAs go. Two partys happy. With the addition of new Spartan abilities which I still think people will moan about -_-

17

I do understand what you’re saying the only point im trying to put across is that it should be a thing disscussed on these forums between us in a civil fashion where fans of both classic and new can pinpoint problems caused for eachother present 343 with our solution as the players and then the ultimate compromise leads to the best halo multiplayer for us all. And hopefully with the beta being so early this may be 343s plan :slight_smile: what do you think?

18

> I’ve loved my halo games since the very start, i’ve enjoyed watching it evolve from 3’s MP to REACH to 4 and each time they implemented new stuff like the Custom loadouts and AA’s i thought it added a nice dynamic.
>
> I loved sprint because it made me feel like the super soldier you’re supposed to be i mean what Yoinking soldier can’t yoinking run and jogs everywhere. ??
> (most people ive seen moan about it because they’re able to run of before they die so they complain that they never got the kill) aww boohoo thats just selfish because you couldnt get a kill sprint needs to go?
>
> I for one want sprint to stay

All of these things destroy Halo.
I find it hard to believe that anybody who played Halo before Reach would like anything about any of the things you mentioned.

Boohoo? It’s not about getting out-played and then whining, it’s about people being able to escape death easily without having to do anything requiring skill.
What happens next? You chase them. But guess what… since you’re sprinting as well, you can’t shoot them as they run away, and by the time this “cat and mouse” chase is over, the person’s shield has recharged.
Cheap or not (here’s a hint: it is), how is any of that fun? How is that advancing gameplay?

Makes you feel like a super soldier, huh?
A super soldier who can only run for 5 seconds, and a super soldier who can’t run and shoot at the same time. Phenomenal.
…pretty sure I can run longer than Chief.
You see, in Halo 3, for example, your spartans were always running. Being the super soldiers that they were, they didn’t have to stop from doing any other actions while running. They could run backwards, forward, jump, shoot, all without losing much momentum. They were like everyone’s Dad when they were 4: super capable.
Enough about that, though.
The biggest issue Sprint has on the gameplay is simply the fact that you can’t shoot as you traverse the map. Halo has become a game of “get there, then shoot”, rather than “always be prepped for battle and shoot at everything you see as you traverse the map and take control of positioning”.
Maps have gotten bigger to compensate for sprint, so either you put yourself at a disadvantage speed-wise (and take an extraordinarily long time to cross the map), so you can actually shoot the guns you are given, or you sprint and face-forward the entire time… and do nothing else.
Fantastic.

19

> > No AA
> > No Loadouts
> > No Killstreaks
> > No Perks
>
> Why though? what is SO bad that it ruins halo?

I dont want this to sound rude but are you new to these forums? These topics have been discussed to death. Having to copy and paste the same arguments every 2 and a half days is annoying. I suggest using the search bar and look for threads involving said topics.

on the topic of loadouts, I like to at it like a pick 2 out 3 option

you got
-unique weapons
-balance
-loadouts

you can’t have unique weapons and balance if each player gets to pick their starting weapon. It’ll give the advantage to the person using the better weapon. So if you like cookie cutter weapons that all do the same thing like in call of duty than full customizable loadouts are for you.

I wouldn’t mind seeing loadouts return but they would have to be very limited so that we could still have balance and unique weapons. Another thing wrong with loadouts is depending on what I pick and what you pick, our little skirmish may have already been decided before it even started. And if the point of having loadouts is so you can customize your play style than what is the point of having limited loadouts that aren’t really customizable? I understand and have seen some interesting arguments that were pro loadout but personally I think halo would be better off without them.

sprint is a placebo and needs to go.

AA are random. You can’t know what ability your opponent picked until they use it and it gives a player either an advantage or a disadvantage depending on how it is used. You should beat someone because you displayed more skill than them not because you were better equipped.

20

I’d be convinced easier on the whole ‘AA’s are bad’ if people stopped being so sarcastic about it, and stop acting like they know everything on the subject.

Oh, and if they expanded thier points to actually make sense.

Saying ‘Sprint is a placebo’ is incorrect. It allows faster map treversing. Granted, while it does result in ‘Get there, then shoot’ moments, that’s because of how players use this.

Sprint’s original purpose was explained in the Halo Reach edition of Official Xbox Magazine, where it was explained in the interveiws section that sprint was to be used in a more tactical mind process. Seeing as I don’t have the issue on hand right now, I can only paraphrase, but it was intended to be used in the capacity of hunting down opponents, or gaining the advantage via flanking. Not blind rushing, like what happens more frequently. In the case described in that issue of OXM, using sprint to assassinate a sniper who was decimating your team by outflanking him, or, a case many people complain about, getting into cover.

The idea of an arena game is to be more skilled than the other person. Not to rush blindly. If you decide to chase down a sprinting player, and he klls you, it wasn’t because sprint is overpowered. It’s because you lacked the foresight to imagine that he would decide to turn arond and attack once his shields recharged.

Another complaint I see entirely too often is people using sprint to go into cover. This is also a useless and inaccurate point. A player tends to instinctively put something between them, and thier aggressor. Sprint allows them to do it faster, and this was one of several original goals of the Sprint function. Now, the reason why it’s a moot point is because it’s something players do without sprint all the time. Sprinting to cover merely reduces thier chances of dying, something all people want to do in a game.

Of course, I can see the issues of sprinting and small maps. It encourages players to rush objectives. But, that’s only a real problem in Halo 4, due to the lack of a tradeoff that it had compared to Halo Reach, between having another ability, or get to the objective faster.