This was in another thread, thought I’d make a poll… It could be like evade but more limited.
I would rather have a rebalanced first person thruster pack as the ‘default’ AA with no Sprint.
Thruster would be ideal for a number of reason. Thruster single burst of speed compared to constant sprint is less effective at running away and closing distances. At the same time there are a greater number of strategies you can use with a thruster when you are in a 1v1 situation than you would have with sprint.
The problem with an evade or roll is that it tends to do wierd things with the hitbox where the thruster remains more consistent with the ‘normal’ hitbox. Evade worked for Elites but it was a little broken with Spartans.
A first person thruster would also be a better ‘default’ AA as you are not being constantly thrown into third person which can be a little nauseating at times.
Thruster Pack 2.0
*First Person
*Shorter distance covered
*Slightly Faster Recharge
Following on with the thruster pack idea, there’s a couple more good points to it (should we need a sprint replacement at all). The first being it requires a little more thought to use than sprint. Meaning you can only really use it once per engagement, and you have think about how you’re going to use it. Will you use it to juke your opponents shot or launch yourself behind a wall? And if you’re using it to escape, you have to be aware of your surroundings and the best possible exit, because unlike sprint this is going to launch you once in one direction, and should you miss your target you’re essentially screwed.
Secondly is that it’s omni-directional. One of sprints problems being a movement mechanic is that it can only be used to travel forward. Any jumps that require its use will also require you to make yourself defenceless and travel in a straight path. Thrustherpack being omni-directional gives you a better range of movement, which would let you use those sorts of jumps in combat and under fire.
Now on the other hand it really doesn’t bring anything interesting to the table either. Being able to change direction mid-air is useful, but not exactly a huge feature. So in that way it’s pretty pointless. If it were a choice between default thruster and no thruster, I’d choose no thruster, but it would certainly be preferable to sprint.
Evade/Roll or Thruster Pack could not replace Sprint because they serve two different functions. Sprint is supposed to get you around the map more quickly, but Evade and TP are to be used to, of course, evade.
There is no such thing as a good “fix” or “replacement” for Sprint because the very concept of a base trait that allows players to move faster than combat speed at the cost of their ability to fire will inherently break the game.
> Evade/Roll or Thruster Pack could not replace Sprint because they serve two different functions. Sprint is supposed to get you around the map more quickly, but Evade and TP are to be used to, of course, evade.
>
> There is no such thing as a good “fix” or “replacement” for Sprint because the very concept of a base trait that allows players to move faster than combat speed at the cost of their ability to fire will inherently break the game.
I would not want thruster to ‘replace’ sprint.
Ideally I don’t want sprint to be in the game at all. I have also not really cared for the implementation of AAs thus far. However I do think that there is room for a “fourth leg of fun”. The biggest problem I have had with AA’s thus far is loadouts. I think there is potential as long as they are placed on the map.
For me a default thruster is less about ‘replacing’ sprint and more about trying to balance AAs. For it to be the utility AA where as things like Jetpack or Hardlight would be niche pickups.
> Evade/Roll or Thruster Pack could not replace Sprint because they serve two different functions. Sprint is supposed to get you around the map more quickly, but Evade and TP are to be used to, of course, evade.
>
> There is no such thing as a good “fix” or “replacement” for Sprint because the very concept of a base trait that allows players to move faster than combat speed at the cost of their ability to fire will inherently break the game.
It’s a replacement for a default ability, not a replacement in the sense that it serves the same purpose.
Thruster Pack is clearly all about maneuverability, and not how fast you can cover certain distances, like Sprint is.
Sprint is unusable in combat, and actually detriments combat due to forcing players to have a slower base movement for balancing purposes. As well as promoting/imbalancing a player’s ability to either run away or Melee attack.
Thrust on the other hand, is beneficial to combat. Allowing players an extra option to add to their strafe. And certainly has little to no added benefit when running away from players, and only has a limited effect on Melee combat (actually it can counter itself as you can thrust in any direction).
Thrust is the superior default movement option.
And despite being a classic Halo (Halo 2 especially) fanboy, I can see the benefit of a little more than just base movement to make the game feel more fast paced. And having played Halo 3 recently, I certainly would prefer a default thrust over simple movement. Though it’s not necessary if our base movement is crisp and fast enough, Halo 3 was so slow compared to Halo CE and 2.
> Now on the other hand it really doesn’t bring anything interesting to the table either. Being able to change direction mid-air is useful, but not exactly a huge feature. So in that way it’s pretty pointless. If it were a choice between default thruster and no thruster, I’d choose no thruster, but it would certainly be preferable to sprint.
I also think implementing default thrusters as a simple evade mechanic would be indeed quite pointless. In the end it would likely even become quite annoying seeing everyone thrusting left and right to the point where it would be called the “cheap strafe”.
However, I think the aspect that thrusters allow you to change direction in mid-air is the most interesting because it offers the potential that the ability can become more than a simple evade mechanic once you incorporate it into map design.
Default thrusters allow you to design specific and intentional map elements that can only get reach, overcome or used by using the thrusters and hence allow you to design a different kind of map structure, flow and general gameplay.
But even though I really like the idea of such kind of maps I think the ability and with it the gameplay would get old/dull relatively fast when it is the constant default ability for the entire game.
Why I think it would be better to have only a few maps that work with a certain (unconventional) movement mechanics like thrusters while the vast majority gets designed and plays without them.
With that we could even implement Jetpack in the same way and finally making proper (and not gamebreaking) use of such a, in my opinion, great movement mechanic and would not have to cripple it by trying to balance it as an advantage, be it placed on the map or available at spawn.
I don’t mind some of the ideas that I’ve read above. However I’m definitely opposed to the idea of evade replacing sprint. i would rather have sprint over evade. The whole game would just have Spartans barrel rolling all over the place. That just seems like the most irritating game play ever.
I don’t want to make a new topic so I will ask here because it relates with what’s being talked about so what is with the hate on sprint?
Here is a link explaining why no sprint is better for halo. (credit to Gobias) http://forums.halofollower.com/index.php?/topic/550-why-no-sprint-is-better-for-halo/
definitely, I agree with you a 100%,but I felt that thruster pack was more balanced than evade
woops I forgot to say that I was replying to WerepyreND
how about an integrated jetpack/thrusterpack as a standard ability
> how about an integrated jetpack/thrusterpack as a standard ability
We’re looking to tone down Sprint, not blow it into something different altogether.
Jetpack as a default ability would be AWFUL in Halo, it’s already bad enough that technically everyone could have one if they wanted.
The reasons Thrust are better by default are as follows:
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Movement Speed should be crisp by default, Sprint forces it to be slow. Technically Spartans should pretty much always be running. Not as fast as Sprint is in Halo 4 per say, but about as fast as the player moves in Halo CE or 2.
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Thrust has canonically been built into Spartan armour since Mjolnir Mk VI. I see no reason it can’t be default from a fictional standpoint. From the same Canonical standpoint, a Spartan has the endurance and stamina of a well oiled machine, I see no reason they can’t opt to move at a brisk running pace at all times a’la Halo CE/2.
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Sprint removes from the options you have in combat by forcing a walking default movement pace, meaning your range of movement sideways and backwards is slow, and in combat you must stop firing to move quickly forward. This is BAD in almost every way.
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Thrust offers 1 extra option to add to a strafe, giving us movement in all directions, crouching, jumping, and thrusting (which we would obviously only be able to do once every 7-10 seconds anyway), which can act as a bonus to your strafe in any direction, from any position. I see no reason why having the option to thrust ONCE before you or the other player dies is a bad thing. It’s like a sideways jump tbh. Sprint adds NOTHING to a strafe.
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Evade messes up the hitboxes, Thrust does not. When a player evade/rolls, his head moves all around like crazy. When a player Thrusts, it stays firmly at the top of his model. This is better for gameplay.
oh… i just thought it would be cool if they added Jetpack/thruster as default because it would make people complain less about jetpack if everyone had it, but yeah i agree with you about sprint
Preferably just keep sprint as it is.
I know some people don’t like it, but Sprint is far from a real problem in Halo.
Evade/Thrusterpack however are more problematic in my eyes.
Firstly because they really don’t work well with the layout of maps. I don’t think I need to emphasize how many times you would just fly off of a map because you hit a little bump or ramp.
But my main gripe is this: while Sprint at least keeps you visible, Thrusterpack just acts like a portable teleporter. So even though you’re harder to hit using Sprint, and you might be able to get out of a fight, it is not nearly as sudden as Evade/Thrusterpack.
The latter two will just make you bail out of direct death instantly, or can be abused to get to an enemy way too quickly.
I’d rather have something where my enemy might get away but at least it happens fluently and I can still track him while he sprints, than to have people roll and fly around which would be disorientating and far more likely to negatively impact encounters between players.
Better option in my opinion would be to
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Increase Field-of-View
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Have a more responsive Strafe
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Lower Aim-Assist
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Lower Bullet Magnetism
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Better designed maps
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And if need be Increase Player Speed
Now you get all the positives of sprint without any of the negatives.
No thanks.
Sprint is bad as is and that idea would just make things worse.
I’m sorry but I vote no .
But good luck
I have no problem with sprint honestly. They gave us what we wanted and I’m not gone cry about it.