Reorganizing tactical packages support upgs

So in halo 4 tac packs and support upgraded worked pretty good but I have an idea that could make them work far better.

Firstly we organize all the current ones into 5 categories while adding new ones to the mix as well.

Combat: containes things that directly make your spartan better at fighting, such as aiming faster and better and reloading quicker, etc etc.

Shields and armor: boosts shield regeneration and durability, stronger armor, etc.

Movement: things such as sprinting longer and faster, strafing quicker, jumping higher.

Utility: improves your armor ability and boosted energy regeneration for it, extended and more powerful radar, resistance to hostile AAs, improved HUD.

Support: greatly increased support from infinity, get more powerful, frequent ordnance, get more ammo and grenades, reroll ordnance.

So yes instead of picking 2 random little perks now you pick one category and get EVERYTHING! Much more powerful and better and has a theme. Whatcha think?

> So yes instead of picking 2 random little perks now you pick one category and get EVERYTHING! Much more powerful and better and has a theme. Whatcha think?

So a class based shooter without the dynamic of class specific weapons?

What’s the difference between picking a category and picking a class?

> What’s the difference between picking a category and picking a class?

Oh well when I think of a classes I think of two radically different styles of play with different mechanics, such as a Mage who needs to kite well and not let enemies within melee distance, and a warrior who needs to find a way to quickly close the gap.

Obviously there would be none of that, the Spartans still do battle in the same manner as always.

I still support the arena aspects too, with weapons and power ups on the map.

Since I don’t approve of tactical packages or support upgrades to begin with, I don’t think it is a good idea. Why should I be able to AIM better than someone else? Why should I get a better shielding system and armor than someone else? Why should I get better, more frequent ordinance than someone else? Why should I get more ammo and grenades than someone else?

You can argue that it can help further ones playstyle, but it doesn’t. I might like running around and pick Movement…but than I’m at a disadvantage for literally every other category. All that does is restrict my playstyle and putting me at odds against people who may have better ordinance, shield regeneration and better aim.

The only reorganizing I’d enjoy is the complete removal, and burning of all things related to support and tactical packages.

I hate when people talk about ‘playstyle’. ‘This option let’s me focus on my playstyle’, ‘loadouts help support different playstyles’, blah blah… it’s all rubbish.
There is more personal style and technique in Halos 1-3, and even Reach, than Halo 4 will ever have.

You can tell who is playing just by watching the screen of a player in Halo 3.
You can’t in Halo 4 because it’s so overly clustered and random, and the only way to win is to find whatever cheapest tactic exists at the current moment in time. You don’t win because you’ve developed an amazing technique or playstyle in Halo 4; you win because, by chance, you chose the better customization, or because you did something ridiculously cheap.

Sammy, because you never played the old Halos competitively, you don’t understand the amount of strategy they yielded.

If your ideas were a reality, you’d probably say something like ‘Aww, dang! I thought I had him. If only I’d chosen the #3 package! He’s smart to have chosen #5 for this scenario! I’ll get him next time! :)’ after losing a battle.
There’s nothing wrong with enjoying it…but those aren’t real strategies.

In Halo 3, when you lose, it’s because you didn’t calculate the best course of action in multiple categories.
You’ll think to yourself 'I should’ve shifted my body to the right a half-step to allow better cover, or ‘I should’ve taken out my sniper as a last-ditch-effort before dying’, or ‘I should’ve lobbed a grenade in that hallway to stop him from leaving so that my buddy could get him from behind’. Want to go even deeper?
‘I should’ve reloaded after I killed opponent#1 and dropped below because I knew opponents#2 and #3 would make it here by now, based on when I saw them leave from the other side, and now I only have enough ammo in my clip to kill one of them. After realizing this, I should’ve told my buddy to throw a sticky down here to provide cover while I attempted a secret crouch jump back up to grab the shotgun I remember opponent#1 dropping, and killing #2 and#3 with it, followed by quickly swapping to the sniper I had all along to kill opponent#4 before he grabbed the overshield I knew would be spawning in 4 seconds.’
Sound far fetched? It’s not. This was how the other Halos played.

TPs and SUs didn’t work well in Halo. They were a cheap rip off of perks that didn’t sit well with the fanbase and weren’t as interesting or balanced as the game they were trying to copy. Your idea is basically perks on steroids.

1 of 2 things I would like to see in the next Halo.

  1. Evolution of the Arena shooter and Halo’s best aspects from Halo CE, Halo2, Halo3. That means new ON MAP power-ups(turn some AAs into PUs) and power weapons(give them alt fire). More/bigger dynamic maps. Maps like High Ground, Zanzibar, Standoff where players can open/close defenses. Forge with customizable skyboxes, maybe weather effects. More flying vehicles. IDENTICAL STARTS OFF SPAWN with variants for each primary(team BRs, Team Carbines, Team whatever they add next). Custom lobby/ server search.

  2. 343 completely changes Halo MP for people like you. No middle ground, no more compromises, no hybrid gameplay mechanics, nothing resembling the Arena shooter I once loved. This way I can move on and give up all hope for Halo MP.

Destiny and COD: Advanced Warfare look pretty good. Halo 5…well “good” ideas on these forums are fun to read.

My buddy wants to contribute:

No one should ever be at an advantage in a competitive game.
The only advantages in an arena shooter should be for those who are holding down a map hot spot, or just because their actual skills are better.
You should never cator to someone’s playstyle. You should cator to peoples’ ability to adapt to a certain playstyle. By that I mean, instead of dropping players into a box with limitless tools, and therefore limiteless outcomes… you need to drop players into a box with a controlled environment. Sure, each box can be a different environement (aka:playstyle), but it’s then up to the player to decide which tactical route they will take, and those, with skill, will better adapt to that playstyle.

> The only reorganizing I’d enjoy is the complete removal, and burning of all things related to support and tactical packages.
>
> I hate when people talk about ‘playstyle’. ‘This option let’s me focus on my playstyle’, ‘loadouts help support different playstyles’, blah blah… it’s all rubbish.
> There is more personal style and technique in Halos 1-3, and even Reach, than Halo 4 will ever have.
>
> You can tell who is playing just by watching the screen of a player in Halo 3.
> You can’t in Halo 4 because it’s so overly clustered and random, and the only way to win is to find whatever cheapest tactic exists at the current moment in time. You don’t win because you’ve developed an amazing technique or playstyle in Halo 4; you win because, by chance, you chose the better customization, or because you did something ridiculously cheap.

Remove and burn them all. That is an idea I can co-sign on.

I think people like Sammy bring up play style because their style is usually I want to be able to play badly and horribly and not get punished for it. Those are the type that will spawn, walk straight to the enemy base, and try to grab and WALK the flag. I had a Reach MLG game the other day with someone like this and their sheer stupidity blows my mind because they fail to see the 100 things wrong with what they just did, not to mention the obvious one of leaving your team 3v4 on the other side of the map while you touch a flag you get killed touching half a second later.

It blows my mind. Sometimes I think the universe is trolling me.

I think that 343i should closely examine what Bungie experimented with in Reach. The entire game, including the campaign, was all about teamwork, and everyone in Noble Team was some sort of specialist. In multiplayer all the loadouts had names that hinted at the type of role you would serve as a team member. This was in line with standard military practice of having members serve specific roles in units: Rangers, Snipers, Medics, Scouts, Engineers, etc. Covenant units had specific roles, but until Reach Spartan units did not.

343i carried forth the concept of specialization in name only. AA’s, TU’s, SU’s, even weapons can be mixed and matched any way the player wants, totally obliterating the concept of specialization identity.

I’d like to see fixed loadouts geared toward actual military specializations listed above, and the removal of weird specializations like Stalker and Pioneer. I’m not in favor of TU’s and SU’s at all, especially one’s that replace characteristics that should be standard like picking up grenades, or things that make your equipment perform better like the one’s that make your shields or AA recharge faster.

I’m all for adding things, but nothing added should allow a player to ignore the importance of basic skills. The extra gear can add to the immersive aspect of the game (note that I said “immersive” and not “competitive”) but basic player skill should always be the determining factor in multiplayer. Everyone in a multiplayer game should be prepared to win using their weapon and their head, not their AA.

> > The only reorganizing I’d enjoy is the complete removal, and burning of all things related to support and tactical packages.
> >
> > I hate when people talk about ‘playstyle’. ‘This option let’s me focus on my playstyle’, ‘loadouts help support different playstyles’, blah blah… it’s all rubbish.
> > There is more personal style and technique in Halos 1-3, and even Reach, than Halo 4 will ever have.
> >
> > You can tell who is playing just by watching the screen of a player in Halo 3.
> > You can’t in Halo 4 because it’s so overly clustered and random, and the only way to win is to find whatever cheapest tactic exists at the current moment in time. You don’t win because you’ve developed an amazing technique or playstyle in Halo 4; you win because, by chance, you chose the better customization, or because you did something ridiculously cheap.
>
> Remove and burn them all. That is an idea I can co-sign on.
>
> I think people like Sammy bring up play style because their style is usually I want to be able to play badly and horribly and not get punished for it. Those are the type that will spawn, walk straight to the enemy base, and try to grab and WALK the flag. I had a Reach MLG game the other day with someone like this and their sheer stupidity blows my mind because they fail to see the 100 things wrong with what they just did, not to mention the obvious one of leaving your team 3v4 on the other side of the map while you touch a flag you get killed touching half a second later.
>
> It blows my mind. Sometimes I think the universe is trolling me.

Hahaha, I know that feel, bro. Modern shooters have destroyed tactical gaming and created that lazy style of play.

I do not want any more perks in halo. Why should I have a perk to have extra ammo? Why should I have a perk that increases my vehicles heath? Why should I have a perk to pick up grenades from dead enemies? No more perks, past halo’s did fine without them they should never return.

But guys come on, the halo universe encompasses so much more than a couple battle rifles clucking at each other on a tiny mirrored map.

Dont you want that to be reflected in our multiplayer?

> But guys come on, the halo universe encompasses so much more than a couple battle rifles clucking at each other on a tiny mirrored map.
>
> Dont you want that to be reflected in our multiplayer?

No, I don’t.
The simplicity created an endless amount of gameplay depth.
I don’t want another game where that has been compromised.

> But guys come on, the halo universe encompasses so much more than a couple battle rifles clucking at each other on a tiny mirrored map.
>
> Dont you want that to be reflected in our multiplayer?

But the multiplayer is more than just that. Sure, you start with a BR or an AR, but all these other weapons and abilities were found and earned, meaning having a Sword was something to fear, not “I’ll spawn with Plasma Grenades and solve that in a jiffy.” The struggle to fight for an advantage is what makes the game more fun and interesting. If I get killed with a Mauler, then I can say “Oh well, I’ll get him next time and take it.” But if that guy can spawn with a Boltshot, no matter how many times I kill him, he’ll probably keep spawning with it, meaning there is nothing I can do, just making the game a rage-fest.

I know you haven’t really played any pre-Reach games, but Sammy, I HIGHLY recommend you play a few games of Halo 3 with an open mind. If you like it, now you have a great new game to play. And even if you don’t like it, you’ll at least understand what actually happens.

The issue with Halo 3, and why I wouldn’t play it anymore, is that the technology is now too dated.
It might still be the most fun, but I have an Xbox One now. I want a next-gen Halo; one that goes back to its roots but with ground-breaking graphics and sound, with better social integration, etc., and one that introduces new and exciting things that do not cripple competition.

And I agree that the MP was not as simple as Sammy put it, but I didn’t want to focus on that part last post.

> But guys come on, the halo universe encompasses so much more than a couple battle rifles clucking at each other on a tiny mirrored map.
>
> Dont you want that to be reflected in our multiplayer?

What part of the Halo universe are perks?
You know arena Halo MP isnt a couple BRs “clucking” at each other. If that’s what you think then you probably shouldn’t play Halo. Or don’t speak so ignorantly about the original trilogy THAT PAVED THE WAY FOR 343 TO EVEN HAVE A FRANCHISE TO DEVELOP FOR.

Halo campaign, co-op, customs is where customization belong. Matchmaking should be (imo) balanced and build on Halo tradition.

Perks are basically rpg-like unlockables that COD4 introduced. A core element from another franchise. They aren’t based on plausible technology or abilities(juggernaut, dead eye, steady aim). Generally speaking Spartan/Elite base player traits are. Not only do perks take away from the somewhat believable future tech in the HALO UNIVERSE, they literally make no sense.

Can only pick up enemy grenades with a perk? Wtf? Is that staying true to the Halo universe, Sammy?

> I still support the arena aspects too, with weapons and power ups on the map.

This made me laugh.

The most universally accepted definition of arena shooter is a fast paced shooter where every player is equal in player based attributes from spawn.

This idea throws that concept out the window.

With Halo’s slower kill times compared to other games that use perks, the Tac/Sup packages give much more power to the individual and cause more problems than you seem to acknowledge.

While I’ll admit some packages are less of a problem than others, the fact they cause inherit player based attributes from the get go is the big problem.

Mobility/Resistor? The shield recharge ones? I used Resupply and the amount of 1v1s I won due to my ability that I could continuously prenade players was amazing. All because they wanted to sprint longer or call in ordnance faster.

So no. While I agree Halo isn’t a true arena shooter like Quake or Unreal Tournament and that demand for arena shooters is well, dying, I think the way for Halo is for every player to at least be equal off spawn in regards to their attributes and abilities. As it’s always been.