Reasoning behind a DMR nerf.

Games Other Halo
1

Before getting your -Yoink!- in a bunch, this is going to show as much reasoning behind it as possible to show you why the DMR needs a very tiny nerf to it.

Lets start off with the facts. The kill times for the BR without missing a shot is 1.800 seconds. The DMR is 1.680. There is a .120 difference between the two.Proof Here
Obviously there are other things that need to be taken into account, like movement, how skilled both players are, did they both have full shields. There are a lot of people who never miss there shots, i very rarely do. So when i go up against someone with a DMR that doesn’t miss there shots either i generally end up losing every time.

At close-medium range a BR should have the ability to beat someone using a DMR for balancing purposes. The DMR is meant for medium-long range engagements so why should it excel at close range too? There is no reason.

I have heard people say the DMR takes more skill than the BR which is why it should be better… wrong. There are benefits to both weapons. You have to keep the BR crosshair on someone longer because of the burst shots while the DMR can be jerked around the screen as long as the bullet hits. If just 1 bullet misses out of the 15 fired from the BR then another burst is needed to kill. If 2 are missed the burst will still only be 6. If the DMR misses a shot then its going to mean you have to hit them one time more, less room for error. DMR headshots kick guns up really well making the BR harder to use at any given time and makes it more likely you miss a shot. Its not a big deal at close range but at longer ranges it can tear it to shreds. Anyways, the BR will take more skill at long ranges specifically because its not designed for long ranges and has no aim assist. I would say the DMR takes more skill at closer ranges but it doesn’t because it has a distinct advantage over BR’s, kill time.

Some people say the DMR just needs a damage reduction, i say no. It would decrease the kill time significantly to the point of the weapon being pointless unless at super long ranges. Other people say that it needs more bloom, i disagree. Adding bloom would decrease long range accuracy while not significantly changing close range to medium battle. Then there are the people who think the BR needs to get a damage boost and become a 4 shot, no. Just no. Then it would completely dominate everything and they would have to increase the kill times on most of the weapons.
Here is my idea on how to solve this problem. Decrease the DMR’s time between shots fired by .035s or .04s. This will make the kill time on the DMR a little less than the BR’s. With .035s the kill time will become 1.820 while .04s will become 1.840. I believe .04s will be more logical because this means the BR will win at close range encounters but as the range increases the DMR will eventually take lead because of its longer range. The farther the target is from a BR, the more likely you miss one shot and increase your kill time by a lot. The extra .04s seconds of kill time the BR will have over the DMR means that if both players shoot at each other at close range, the BR will win and it will be unlikely that lag takes effect and the BR user dies as well.

Trust me, i didn’t forget about the one long range that beats the DMR either. The light rifle. Which loses at close range against a BR but destroys a DMR at long range. Its simple enough, if the light rifle isn’t nerfed along with the DMR then it will become extreme powerful making it OP. So basically drop the fire-rate the same amount as you did with the DMR but only for its scoped shots. So it would take .04s more between each shot. Because right now its balanced and fair but if its long range capabilities are not toned down along with the DMR then it will have an incredible advantage at long range making the DMR rather pointless.

TL;DR Version
Drop the DMR’s fire-rate by .04s per shot so that it takes .04s longer to kill someone than the BR. Decrease the fire-rate of the light rifle’s scoped in shot by the same amount to keep it balanced with the DMR.
So there, extensive reasoning behind why i think the DMR should be nerfed slightly. If you didn’t read all of my incredibly long post then you honestly shouldn’t reply. Also, discuss your reasoning. I don’t want someone to disagree with me and not post why. I want a legitimate reason as to why you think or don’t think the DMR should get a nerf.

2

The DMR is fine. Changing it will destroy the whole balance of this game.

If it ain’t broke don’t fix it.

3

Can we start banning people for starting DMR Nerf threads? I don’t even care if you’re making good points anymore, it’s just getting annoying.

On topic - The time differential between how long it takes to get a DMR kill versus a BR kill is still fairly small, and its also inconsequential. The only way the difference between the BR and DMR becomes a factor is if two players encounter each other and open fire simultaneously and both never miss a shot.

This is a scenario that actually doesn’t happen that often in Halo 4 because in a majority of cases encounters begin with one player getting a jump on another player, and even with skilled players they still miss shots (for various reasons).

The DMR is fine. The BR is fine. A majority of complaints I see about this can be solved simply by executing better situational awareness. The difference between the DMR and BR is a fraction of a second, if you alter either of those guns you’re almost assuredly going to further distance the two guns apart in terms of balance rather than bring them together.

4

Dont nerf the DMR, buff the BR to a 4 shot kill if anything need to be touched. I say leave them as they are and just use the DMR and adapt.

5

> Can we start banning people for starting DMR Nerf threads? I don’t even care if you’re making good points anymore, it’s just getting annoying.
>
> On topic - The time differential between how long it takes to get a DMR kill versus a BR kill is still fairly small, and its also inconsequential. The only way the difference between the BR and DMR becomes a factor is if two players encounter each other and open fire simultaneously and both never miss a shot.
>
> This is a scenario that actually doesn’t happen that often in Halo 4 because in a majority of cases encounters begin with one player getting a jump on another player, and even with skilled players they still miss shots (for various reasons).
>
> The DMR is fine. The BR is fine. A majority of complaints I see about this can be solved simply by executing better situational awareness. The difference between the DMR and BR is a fraction of a second, if you alter either of those guns you’re almost assuredly going to further distance the two guns apart in terms of balance rather than bring them together.

If the time differential is so small then why not just bring the DMR to the same kill time? Exactly. I get into a lot of 1v1 fights where we both open fire at about the same time. DMR always wins at close range just because it has a faster kill time.
Off-Topic: If you banned the Nerf DMR posts that actually just complained then i would understand but why would you ban a post that has actual evidence on why the DMR is too powerful at close range and even gives an idea on how to fix it without messing with its long range capabilities?
How about we ban the two people in here that didn’t even read my OP but posted anyways. One saying the DMR is fine how it was without any evidence or the other guy saying to just buff the BR to a 4 shot kill. How is that even fair? Making the BR have the fastest killing time out of all the weapons seems like a pretty stupid way to balance out the DMR.

6

The DMR has bloom so you can’t just spam the trigger like you can with the BR. Plus the BR is better at close range. Seems fair to me.

7

> > Can we start banning people for starting DMR Nerf threads? I don’t even care if you’re making good points anymore, it’s just getting annoying.
> >
> > On topic - The time differential between how long it takes to get a DMR kill versus a BR kill is still fairly small, and its also inconsequential. The only way the difference between the BR and DMR becomes a factor is if two players encounter each other and open fire simultaneously and both never miss a shot.
> >
> > This is a scenario that actually doesn’t happen that often in Halo 4 because in a majority of cases encounters begin with one player getting a jump on another player, and even with skilled players they still miss shots (for various reasons).
> >
> > The DMR is fine. The BR is fine. A majority of complaints I see about this can be solved simply by executing better situational awareness. The difference between the DMR and BR is a fraction of a second, if you alter either of those guns you’re almost assuredly going to further distance the two guns apart in terms of balance rather than bring them together.
>
> If the time differential is so small then why not just bring the DMR to the same kill time? Exactly. I get into a lot of 1v1 fights where we both open fire at about the same time. DMR always wins at close range just because it has a faster kill time.
> Off-Topic: If you banned the Nerf DMR posts that actually just complained then i would understand but why would you ban a post that has actual evidence on why the DMR is too powerful at close range and even gives an idea on how to fix it without messing with its long range capabilities?
> How about we ban the two people in here that didn’t even read my OP but posted anyways. One saying the DMR is fine how it was without any evidence or the other guy saying to just buff the BR to a 4 shot kill. How is that even fair? Making the BR have the fastest killing time out of all the weapons seems like a pretty stupid way to balance out the DMR.

Because your evidence that confirms its too powerful only confirms that there’s a 1/10th of a second difference between the kill time of a BR and a DMR. That’s a hurdle that can be overcome easily. This isn’t like a Pistol-Beats-Everything Halo 1 type of OP weapon.

8

No, the DMR does take a lot more skill to use, especially at close range because it has less auto aim and no spread. That’s why I always use the BR for CQ maps and usually do really well.

9

I agree with the dmr nerd but don’t touch the lr. Everytime your shot in scope (the only way its any good) your redicule bounces more than any gun. Its a drawback for the 4 sk

10

> The DMR has bloom so you can’t just spam the trigger like you can with the BR. Plus the BR is better at close range. Seems fair to me.

the bloom resets almost completely before the next shot. and the closer you are the less you need to worry about it. Your point is invalid

11

You want the DMR nerf’d because you cant land 5 shots on a moving target with it, yet other people can, so they beat you all the time.

If it is that amazing then use the freaking thing rather than moan about it. Truth is OP you can’t can you? you just can’t do anything with that gun… if it was the only gun in a game where everyone else was using the AR you’d probably start saying how the AR needs a good nerfing or the DMR a buffing.

just play the -Yoink!- game!

Edit, i know in your post you wanted more reasoning behind disagreements…

1: If the gun is so good why not use it?
2: the DMR is a harder gun to use, much less forgiving
3: Someone has already posted another thread linking to the awful timings that were done, this isn’t needed.
4: the difference in kill time is probably the same as some people lag… so its a useless thing to talk about
5: Like point 2, no spread means flinch is even more hampering.
6: Fire rate has nothing to do with weapon OP’ness, compare the pistol to the DMR…

You and many others want this change so you can win, you do not want skill, you want an easier life. All that will happen is, is that people will find other ways to kill you over and over… then you’ll moan about that new weapon, and then the game gets destroyed by people who cannot play it correctly and realise every weapon has a fitting scenario at which it is made to excel at.

12

Just watched the proof of kill times video you posted. I really didn’t realize there was a difference in kill time and spread however i still disagree on the nerf. The DMR has no aim assist and the BR has a ton. Thats how they have decided to balance it. If your a better more accurate shooter use the DMR if not use the BR.

My Theory:

If your going to tweak anything then tweak the BR. Increase damage of BR so that its a 4 shot kill. This will kill DMR up close but the DMR will still prevail at range. Although i would just stop complaining on the forums and get on Halo 4 and start practicing with your DMR.

13

> If your going to tweak anything then tweak the BR. Increase damage of BR so that its a 4 shot kill. This will kill DMR up close but the DMR will still prevail at range. Although i would just stop complaining on the forums and get on Halo 4 and start practicing with your DMR.

Good theory, remove the auto targeting too, and then these kids will complain that the gun is useless… you have to ask yourself why they are not using the DMR if it really is that superior? They will never be happy until they receive god-mode for being so awful.

14

listen lil children. you want the DMR nerfed because you suck, not because it’s OP. it’s a single shot, takes 5 rounds to kill if the last one is a head shot. stop with the crybaby threads. it’s funny that because some people are better at putting shots on target, the one’s that fail at hitting thier target believe the better players should be penalized. Grow up. the DMR is fine, you just need to get better.

I agree, BAN the nerf thread starters.

15

As a Storm rifle user, the DMR outclasses it in close range and any other starting weapon in this game, it needs to be nerfed, but that seems a bit too harsh. 0.2 or even 0.1 seconds is enough to fix it.

16

> They will never be happy until they receive god-mode for being so awful.

Agreed.

17

I think his point is that the BR is supposed to win close range, not be balanced. This makes sense because the DMR tears the BR a new -Yoink- hole at long range. there is no way a br will beat a dmr at long range so shouldnt the BR Actually have a significant or atleast slightly faster killtime short range?

18

And you cant just say adapt and play with the DMR. Then what is the point of having multiple primary weapon choices if one it out competing the other at every range. The only logical argument i’ve seen so far is the BR has more aim assist. Which btw does anybody have a link that proves this? I believe it but ide like to see how significant it is.

19

you’ll usually get a lot of opposition because everyone uses the DMR, no one wants their gun nerfed.

bloom doesnt do anything as it stands right now., because it resets so fast. it should have more bloom unscoped, less bloom scoped to make it geared towards mid-long engagements. BR should win short-mid vs DMR

20

Alright OP, you win. All you DMR hating community are right on this and I’ll admit it, the DMR is SLIGHTLY stronger than the BR. It is still not OP, but it is really strong for long range. I guess since I’m a BR user (personally I find it so much easier to use at closer range) I’m going to have to develop an actual strategy to get all the players with DMRs.

Unfortunately for you op, this game is not Call of Duty since the guns can’t all be balanced to the point where they are the same. In this game each gun serves its purpose and can be used in it’s own situation for strategic reasons so I don’t think 343i should spend any time trying to fix this and hey! maybe in Halo 5 the BR will be a bit stronger like in Halo Reach! And you’ll be able to whine and complain to your hearts content but for now you’ll have to stop because it’s getting annoying