We’ve had some halo media delve into the unnerving Kig-Yar, although none as immersive than Hunt the Truth’s Season 2 (Part Four: Jackals). I feel up until this point, the harsh reality of the pirate species was never really done justice. Their trophy walls alone express this point… Chur 'R-Zhal is spine-chilling.
So I ask: Does anyone feel like Jackals in the Halo Universe should be taken a lot more seriously after this masterpiece? Not that I didn’t to begin with, but the terryifying, descriptive atmosphere of S2 E4 really did set a standard; the Kig-Yar are not to be taken lightly.
The Kig-Yar was always taken seriously, even by the covenant. They incited a rebellion in High Charity when they tried to sterilize the Unggoy population long before contact with the Humans.
> 2533275030819984;2:
> The Kig-Yar was always taken seriously, even by the covenant. They incited a rebellion in High Charity when they tried to sterilize the Unggoy population long before contact with the Humans.
Yes I know, I’m speaking fear-factor. We had never really been given such a surreal angle at them.
On Buck’s home world jackals ate a whole city of humans, and in Halo 4 a guy gets pounced on by a jackal right in front of you. Those 2 moments were enough to make me fear kig-yar
Yeah, I think when they are portrayed as the ‘chickens’ behind the shield its kinda miss leading to what they are actually like, for me anyway, that Kig-Yar surgeon really made me fully appreciate how morbid they really are…
Those Kig-Yar in Hunt the Truth were not exactly representative of their species, so quite irrelevant for setting any bar tbh. As a species that has been built up to thrive on trade, which is a cooperative business, it doesn’t serve any purpose to go down that road.
Honestly, the more the writers attempt to make the Covenant species “scary” and beastly, the more flat and one dimensional they become.
> 2533274835068816;6:
> Those Kig-Yar in Hunt the Truth were not exactly representative of their species, so quite irrelevant for setting any bar tbh. As a species that has been built up to thrive on trade, which is a cooperative business, it doesn’t serve any purpose to go down that road.
>
> Honestly, the more the writers attempt to make the Covenant species “scary” and beastly, the more flat and one dimensional they become.
I think that’s kind of the point though, showing us different things about their species, we’ve never got a chance to see this sort of thing before, sure Kig-Yar can be quite cowardly, and just come off as push overs in game, but I think what the OP is saying is that they really should not be taken as lightly as they are being portrayed as a lot of the time. And if you mean we’ve never seen Kig-Yar being “scary” before then I think all those civilians who got munched on Draco III would have to sincerely disagree with you…
> 2535409049025678;7:
> [I think that’s kind of the point though, showing us different things about their species, we’ve never got a chance to see this sort of thing before, sure Kig-Yar can be quite cowardly, and just come off as push overs in game, but I think what the OP is saying is that they really should not be taken as lightly as they are being portrayed as a lot of the time.
Of all the Kig-Yar that ever got talked about, Chol Von got more attention than the Kig-Yar in Hunt the Truth, or any other Kig-Yar. Before her was Chur’R’Yuut from the Cole Protocol - and not the Kig-Yar mentioned with regards to Draco III.
This is because Chol and Chur are characters that are more complex than any sort of reliance upon making them scary or beastly. The latter examples are merely intended to shock the audience and don’t have any long term impact on the story or plot like a proper character could. If the Kig-Yar or any other Covies start getting more attention, then I want more of the focus to be on creating good characters with interesting perspectives and beliefs as opposed to the emphasis being on how to make them more scary, and risk turning them into one dimensional caricatures. Halo 4 and Spartan Ops did that with the Elites, and it just made them seem uninteresting to me.
I also don’t think it matters if the Kig-Yar are depicted as being more timid and more of a push-over in the game. That makes them unique. If everyone in the Covenant is to behave the same with regards to being scary and intimidating then we may as well just have one Covenant species. The Kig-Yar are tenacious, cunning and sly, so even if they are weaker they still get what they want through other means.
HtT kind of wasted an opportunity to show us more Kig-Yar characters with positive or redeemable traits imo, and I honestly don’t know what the point of that whole scene was. If it was to just make them seem more scary, then I question how that improves their characterisation. There are ways of making them more intimidating without reducing them to essentially animals.
> And if you mean we’ve never seen Kig-Yar being “scary” before then I think all those civilians who got munched on Draco III would have to sincerely disagree with you…
That isn’t what I was saying. I said that attempts to continue with that kind of characterisation will have a very short term payoff and likely kill off most people’s interest in them in the long run.
To civilians yes they should be feared but among military personnel no, if u ask a spartan or even a Marine what they take more seriously as a threat,an elite or jackal they’ll choose elite everytime.Jackals while fierce don’t have that shock factor of an elite,brute or hunter
> 2533274830166194;9:
> To civilians yes they should be feared but among military personnel no, if u ask a spartan or even a Marine what they take more seriously as a threat,an elite or jackal they’ll choose elite everytime.Jackals while fierce don’t have that shock factor of an elite,brute or hunter
It’s not that Jackels are more lethal than Elites , it’s just the point that they shouldn’t be taken lightly. And I’ll give you Spartans, but I guarantee anyone else would or does fear them.
> 2533274835068816;8:
> > 2535409049025678;7:
> > [I think that’s kind of the point though, showing us different things about their species, we’ve never got a chance to see this sort of thing before, sure Kig-Yar can be quite cowardly, and just come off as push overs in game, but I think what the OP is saying is that they really should not be taken as lightly as they are being portrayed as a lot of the time.
>
>
> Of all the Kig-Yar that ever got talked about, Chol Von got more attention than the Kig-Yar in Hunt the Truth, or any other Kig-Yar. Before her was Chur’R’Yuut from the Cole Protocol - and not the Kig-Yar mentioned with regards to Draco III.
>
> This is because Chol and Chur are characters that are more complex than any sort of reliance upon making them scary or beastly. The latter examples are merely intended to shock the audience and don’t have any long term impact on the story or plot like a proper character could. If the Kig-Yar or any other Covies start getting more attention, then I want more of the focus to be on creating good characters with interesting perspectives and beliefs as opposed to the emphasis being on how to make them more scary, and risk turning them into one dimensional caricatures. Halo 4 and Spartan Ops did that with the Elites, and it just made them seem uninteresting to me.
>
> I also don’t think it matters if the Kig-Yar are depicted as being more timid and more of a push-over in the game. That makes them unique. If everyone in the Covenant is to behave the same with regards to being scary and intimidating then we may as well just have one Covenant species. The Kig-Yar are tenacious, cunning and sly, so even if they are weaker they still get what they want through other means.
>
> HtT kind of wasted an opportunity to show us more Kig-Yar characters with positive or redeemable traits imo, and I honestly don’t know what the point of that whole scene was. If it was to just make them seem more scary, then I question how that improves their characterisation. There are ways of making them more intimidating without reducing them to essentially animals.
>
>
>
>
> > And if you mean we’ve never seen Kig-Yar being “scary” before then I think all those civilians who got munched on Draco III would have to sincerely disagree with you…
>
>
> That isn’t what I was saying. I said that attempts to continue with that kind of characterisation will have a very short term payoff and likely kill off most people’s interest in them in the long run.
Chur 'R-Zhal is not a great character, we’ve had barely any time with them. If I didn’t explain myself clearly, I simply mean I feel that the Kig-Yar (Or these specifically viscous group) did a good job on being presentable. Those who don’t read novels would easily pick up the idea that Kig-Yar pose a credible threat as oppose to what we see a lot throughout the games. You’re right, those characters are far better! But not all Kig-Yar are going to be as competent and the atmosphere of actually hearing them in such a dark tone was great for we had only really been given snippets of information like the incident on Draco III. The much more serious tone was highly appreciated and welcomed by me as these Kig-Yar were simply rag-tag pirates. Kig-Yar haven’t always been depicted as such and I prefer when they’re not but my point is that this way a great way to provide a surreal angle on what many Jackals would be like.
As for Spartan Ops, no real Covenant one dimensional characters were given. Perhaps you don’t like seeing Covenant Loyalism? The practice of the Covenant isn’t one that can simply be stomped out, thus this spiral of factions rising and radical beliefs is simply true to what would happen.
> 2533274916736578;10:
> > 2533274830166194;9:
> > To civilians yes they should be feared but among military personnel no, if u ask a spartan or even a Marine what they take more seriously as a threat,an elite or jackal they’ll choose elite everytime.Jackals while fierce don’t have that shock factor of an elite,brute or hunter
>
>
> It’s not that Jackels are more lethal than Elites , it’s just the point that they shouldn’t be taken lightly. And I’ll give you Spartans, but I guarantee anyone else would or does fear them.
Anyone will fear them just not to the degree of an elite,brute,or hunter
> 2533274881094048;11:
> Chur 'R-Zhal is not a great character, we’ve had barely any time with them. If I didn’t explain myself clearly, I simply mean I feel that the Kig-Yar (Or these specifically viscous group) did a good job on being presentable. Those who don’t read novels would easily pick up the idea that Kig-Yar pose a credible threat as oppose to what we see a lot throughout the games. You’re right, those characters are far better! But not all Kig-Yar are going to be as competent and the atmosphere of actually hearing them in such a dark tone was great for we had only really been given snippets of information like the incident on Draco III. The much more serious tone was highly appreciated and welcomed by me as these Kig-Yar were simply rag-tag pirates. Kig-Yar haven’t always been depicted as such and I prefer when they’re not but my point is that this way a great way to provide a surreal angle on what many Jackals would be like.
If HtT was to show that not all Kig-Yar are competent and as sophisticated and civilised as let’s say humans or Sangheili, then what would give players the opposite impression if they had never read the books and heard of peeps like Chol Von? You’ve proposed this HtT episode as a solution to a problem which to my knowledge doesn’t exist. People who only play the games have no idea how competent or refined Kig-Yar can be.
I think you’re talking about power, whilst I’m talking about character. Kig-Yar lack power in the games (As well as character), and so HtT offered game players a way to see that they don’t lack power from the perspective of normal humans. That’s fine. What I’m merely saying is that I wished they had done that whilst not making them seem like psychopaths out of Mad Max or something, which would have improved their character aspect from the games.
> As for Spartan Ops, no real Covenant one dimensional characters were given. Perhaps you don’t like seeing Covenant Loyalism? The practice of the Covenant isn’t one that can simply be stomped out, thus this spiral of factions rising and radical beliefs is simply true to what would happen.
I think the old Covenant at this point are by definition one dimensional and flat. They have only one or two notable aspects: Kill humans and worship Forerunners. There’s nothing interesting about them beyond that, which makes them one dimensional. Jul 'Mdama in Spartan Ops to my knowledge never once went over his deeper motivations for leading this Covenant remnant, and just sounded like Generic Religious Fanatic #56. The old Covenant don’t deviate from killing humans or worshipping Forerunners; they exist solely to do these things so that they can be antagonists. This makes them flat and unchanging.
Indeed I don’t like seeing it anymore. Never forget that Halo is a work of science fiction and it has to remain interesting to the audience to be successful. Rehashing the same conflict indefinitely might sound historically accurate, but I think most story fans would have grown bored of it and moved on by then. As a work of fiction, it has to keep people interested otherwise it will start losing popularity.
I think they’d be taken more seriously if you didn’t spend most of the game as a 7 foot tall armored supersoldier capable of tearing one in half with their bare hands. As a civilian with no weapons against one…yeah, you’d be freaked.
King-Yar in general are pretty fierce, but the T’savoans are probably the most dangerous.
> 2533274904397463;4:
> On Buck’s home world jackals ate a whole city of humans, and in Halo 4 a guy gets pounced on by a jackal right in front of you. Those 2 moments were enough to make me fear kig-yar
And in Halo 5 Guardians, a SoS Elite gets ganged up on by a group of Jackals and one tackles him to the ground before killing him right when you enter the building where Thel is held up in.
> 2533274883030212;15:
> King-Yar in general are pretty fierce, but the T’savoans are probably the most dangerous.
T’Vaoans* sorry I had to
The Halo games have always been a broad stroke on the canvas of the greater canon – the center stroke, to be sure, but one that seldom features nuance. Halo 4 being the exception. ODST sort of also, plus the first mission of Reach (with the whole Insurrection theory, the focus on civilians).
More than that, every Halo game involves us playing a super soldier. ODST isn’t supposed to, but you are still, mechanically, pretty much the same as in Halo 3. The games are all run-and-gun, where you are a bigger deal than grunts, crawlers, watchers, and (relevant here) jackals.
But I’d love to see a game where you play as a regular-sized person, in a way that you don’t get the opportunity to just pop a jackal in the head. Even unggoy are pretty frightening to look at – but a game where you, say, have to survive a Predator-style Kig-yar hunt would be pretty interesting.
> 2678033349858034;18:
> The Halo games have always been a broad stroke on the canvas of the greater canon – the center stroke, to be sure, but one that seldom features nuance. Halo 4 being the exception. ODST sort of also, plus the first mission of Reach (with the whole Insurrection theory, the focus on civilians).
>
> More than that, every Halo game involves us playing a super soldier. ODST isn’t supposed to, but you are still, mechanically, pretty much the same as in Halo 3. The games are all run-and-gun, where you are a bigger deal than grunts, crawlers, watchers, and (relevant here) jackals.
>
> But I’d love to see a game where you play as a regular-sized person, in a way that you don’t get the opportunity to just pop a jackal in the head. Even unggoy are pretty frightening to look at – but a game where you, say, have to survive a Predator-style Kig-yar hunt would be pretty interesting.
Like what happened to Holly Tanaka.
> 2533275013291255;16:
> > 2533274904397463;4:
> > On Buck’s home world jackals ate a whole city of humans, and in Halo 4 a guy gets pounced on by a jackal right in front of you. Those 2 moments were enough to make me fear kig-yar
>
>
> And in Halo 5 Guardians, a SoS Elite gets ganged up on by a group of Jackals and one tackles him to the ground before killing him right when you enter the building where Thel is held up in.
Oh yes, that one. I always have fun stabbing him as Locke.