How could Reach have survived? Well, let’s just say we grew the UNSC numbers. So in that case the UNSC would have:
200 ships
60 orbital MAC guns
20 nuclear mines
That would all be in orbit around the planetary defense.
So, lets just say that was all there at the battle, could Reach have survived? (Covenant doesn’t change its numbers)
Definitely not. The Covenant had ~750 ships, still putting the UNSC at about a 4:1 disadvantage. Historically, even if humans had a 3:1 advantage, they weren’t guaranteed victory, and still suffered heavy losses if they did win. If you multiplied UNSC forces by 10, they still might not be able to do it.
> 2535423049533744;1:
> How could Reach have survived? Well, let’s just say we grew everything by 10. So in that case the UNSC would have:
> 162 ships
> 30 orbital MAC guns
> 14 nuclear mines
> That would all be in orbit around the planetary defense.
> So, lets just say that was all there at the battle, could Reach have survived? (Covenant doesn’t change its numbers)
Doubtful. The covenant wanted that forerunner structure underneath sword base, so they would’ve sent a larger fleet to back up Thel’s had he called for it. In the long run covenant ships still outnumbered and out classed the UNSC.
> 2535423049533744;1:
> How could Reach have survived? Well, let’s just say we grew everything by 10. So in that case the UNSC would have:
> 162 ships
> 30 orbital MAC guns
> 14 nuclear mines
> That would all be in orbit around the planetary defense.
> So, lets just say that was all there at the battle, could Reach have survived? (Covenant doesn’t change its numbers)
Reach had a total of 20 ODPs in the original timeline, IIRC. An additional ten won’t change much. Multiplying it by ten, however… that would assist considerably.
They’d also need a lot more than 162 naval assets in local to beat back the 300+ craft that the Covenant threw into the Epsilon Eridani campaign.
They’d need a complete post-war upgrade (as in, all Marathon CAs in local are swapped for Autumn CAs, all various UNSC frigates are swapped out for Stridents, and UNSC Trafalgar/every Epoch CVH and Valiant CC in local upgraded with post-war shields) to hold the Epsilon Eridani system. That, or somehow power up the Babd Catha Forerunner vessel and bring it to bear against the Covenant.
> 2533274942408157;4:
> > 2535423049533744;1:
> > How could Reach have survived? Well, let’s just say we grew everything by 10. So in that case the UNSC would have:
> > 162 ships
> > 30 orbital MAC guns
> > 14 nuclear mines
> > That would all be in orbit around the planetary defense.
> > So, lets just say that was all there at the battle, could Reach have survived? (Covenant doesn’t change its numbers)
>
>
> Reach had a total of 20 ODPs in the original timeline, IIRC. An additional ten won’t change much. Multiplying it by ten, however… that would assist considerably.
> They’d also need a lot more than 162 naval assets in local to beat back the 300+ craft that the Covenant threw into the Epsilon Eridani campaign.
>
> They’d need a complete post-war upgrade (as in, all Marathon CAs in local are swapped for Autumn CAs, all various UNSC frigates are swapped out for Stridents, and UNSC Trafalgar/every Epoch CVH and Valiant CC in local upgraded with post-war shields) to hold the Epsilon Eridani system. That, or somehow power up the Babd Catha Forerunner vessel and bring it to bear against the Covenant.
i think your forgetting the 14 nuclear mines lol
How heavily defended Reach was was irrelevant. Even if they staved off the first offense, the Covenant would have returned with a bigger and badder armada and obliterated it.
As others have said, even with 10x the assets they would have been outnumbered and overwhelmed in a very short amount of time.
> 2533274846085892;6:
> How heavily defended Reach was was irrelevant. Even if they staved off the first offense, the Covenant would have returned with a bigger and badder armada and obliterated it.
>
> As others have said, even with 10x the assets they would have been outnumbered and overwhelmed in a very short amount of time.
That’s honestly insane. Holy crap. I forgot how scary the Covenant was. Without the Great Schism, humanity was done for.
> 2535423049533744;5:
> > 2533274942408157;4:
> > > 2535423049533744;1:
> > > How could Reach have survived? Well, let’s just say we grew everything by 10. So in that case the UNSC would have:
> > > 162 ships
> > > 30 orbital MAC guns
> > > 14 nuclear mines
> > > That would all be in orbit around the planetary defense.
> > > So, lets just say that was all there at the battle, could Reach have survived? (Covenant doesn’t change its numbers)
> >
> >
> > Reach had a total of 20 ODPs in the original timeline, IIRC. An additional ten won’t change much. Multiplying it by ten, however… that would assist considerably.
> > They’d also need a lot more than 162 naval assets in local to beat back the 300+ craft that the Covenant threw into the Epsilon Eridani campaign.
> >
> > They’d need a complete post-war upgrade (as in, all Marathon CAs in local are swapped for Autumn CAs, all various UNSC frigates are swapped out for Stridents, and UNSC Trafalgar/every Epoch CVH and Valiant CC in local upgraded with post-war shields) to hold the Epsilon Eridani system. That, or somehow power up the Babd Catha Forerunner vessel and bring it to bear against the Covenant.
>
>
> i think your forgetting the 14 nuclear mines lol
Unless those nukes are NOVAe, they won’t change much of anything.
> 2535458356653045;7:
> > 2533274846085892;6:
> > How heavily defended Reach was was irrelevant. Even if they staved off the first offense, the Covenant would have returned with a bigger and badder armada and obliterated it.
> >
> > As others have said, even with 10x the assets they would have been outnumbered and overwhelmed in a very short amount of time.
>
>
> That’s honestly insane. Holy crap. I forgot how scary the Covenant was. Without the Great Schism, humanity was done for.
They were also pulling their punches and not letting humanity face their full might.
> 2535458356653045;7:
> > 2533274846085892;6:
> > How heavily defended Reach was was irrelevant. Even if they staved off the first offense, the Covenant would have returned with a bigger and badder armada and obliterated it.
> >
> > As others have said, even with 10x the assets they would have been outnumbered and overwhelmed in a very short amount of time.
>
>
> That’s honestly insane. Holy crap. I forgot how scary the Covenant was. Without the Great Schism, humanity was done for.
The lore of Fleet Battles paints a pretty grim picture. By 2552, Marathons were being put into service with half completed hulls, and Frigates were largely being manned by skeleton crews in order to field as many ships as possible.
> 2533274819594227;10:
> > 2535458356653045;7:
> > > 2533274846085892;6:
> > > How heavily defended Reach was was irrelevant. Even if they staved off the first offense, the Covenant would have returned with a bigger and badder armada and obliterated it.
> > > As others have said, even with 10x the assets they would have been outnumbered and overwhelmed in a very short amount of time.
> >
> >
> > That’s honestly insane. Holy crap. I forgot how scary the Covenant was. Without the Great Schism, humanity was done for.
>
>
> The lore of Fleet Battles paints a pretty grim picture. By 2552, Marathons were being put into service with half completed hulls, and Frigates were largely being manned by skeleton crews in order to field as many ships as possible.
Don’t forget how Halberd-class destroyer hulls were being put into fleet escort duties with a bare minimum of functional systems… despite the Halberd DD having a heckuva lot better armament than the Paris-class heavy frigate (with most of its 7800LT tonnage being taken up by its armor, which could be stripped down if material cost was an issue).
Halberd DDs are 50m shorter than the Paris heavy FFG to boot, and pack dual light-coil MACs instead of the Paris-class’ single light-coil MAC.
> 2533274819594227;10:
> > 2535458356653045;7:
> > > 2533274846085892;6:
> > > How heavily defended Reach was was irrelevant. Even if they staved off the first offense, the Covenant would have returned with a bigger and badder armada and obliterated it.
> > >
> > > As others have said, even with 10x the assets they would have been outnumbered and overwhelmed in a very short amount of time.
> >
> >
> > That’s honestly insane. Holy crap. I forgot how scary the Covenant was. Without the Great Schism, humanity was done for.
>
>
> The lore of Fleet Battles paints a pretty grim picture. By 2552, Marathons were being put into service with half completed hulls, and Frigates were largely being manned by skeleton crews in order to field as many ships as possible.
That’s some deep lore their brother.
I really got to pay more attention to the ship engagements in the books…
> 2533274942408157;11:
> > 2533274819594227;10:
> > > 2535458356653045;7:
> > > > 2533274846085892;6:
> > > > How heavily defended Reach was was irrelevant. Even if they staved off the first offense, the Covenant would have returned with a bigger and badder armada and obliterated it.
> > > > As others have said, even with 10x the assets they would have been outnumbered and overwhelmed in a very short amount of time.
> > >
> > >
> > > That’s honestly insane. Holy crap. I forgot how scary the Covenant was. Without the Great Schism, humanity was done for.
> >
> >
> > The lore of Fleet Battles paints a pretty grim picture. By 2552, Marathons were being put into service with half completed hulls, and Frigates were largely being manned by skeleton crews in order to field as many ships as possible.
>
>
> Don’t forget how Halberd-class destroyer hulls were being put into fleet escort duties with a bare minimum of functional systems… despite the Halberd DD having a heckuva lot better armament than the Paris-class heavy frigate (with most of its 7800LT tonnage being taken up by its armor, which could be stripped down if material cost was an issue).
>
> Halberd DDs are 50m shorter than the Paris heavy FFG to boot, and pack dual light-coil MACs instead of the Paris-class’ single light-coil MAC.
Ah yes. Might as well throw in there that the UNSC raided the CMA’s treasury to fund the creation of more destroyers as losses began to mount, and attempted to do the same to the CAA, but ended up cannibalizing them because they resisted.
Reach will fall, no matter how much strength the UNSC throws at the Covenant! It was the Fleet of Particular Justice that attacked Reach, the third biggest fleet of the Covenant!
It was actually 3 different fleets combined together to form the armada of 750 ships (Thel only contributed 60 of them) that hit Reach. That said, the Covenant can build huge fleets when they want to. Just see Regret’s fleet of 500 ships he had to invade Earth and High Charity’s fleet which is significantly larger.
> 2533275013291255;16:
> It was actually 3 different fleets combined together to form the armada of 750 ships (Thel only contributed 60 of them) that hit Reach. That said, the Covenant can build huge fleets when they want to. Just see Regret’s fleet of 500 ships he had to invade Earth and High Charity’s fleet which is significantly larger.
Just look at the largest losses the Covenant suffered against humanity during the war:
Battle of Psi Serpentis (over 300 ships)
Fall of Reach (approx. 210 ships)
Operation: FIRST STRIKE (approx. 488 ships)
NOVA Bomb detonation (over 300 ships)
That’s at least 1300 vessels lost from these 4 engagements alone and the Covenant shrugged them off like they were nothing. Only the mysterious enemy they were fighting against on another front (that has only been hinted at so far) and the Great Schism saved humanity.
> 2533274849782428;17:
> > 2533275013291255;16:
> > It was actually 3 different fleets combined together to form the armada of 750 ships (Thel only contributed 60 of them) that hit Reach. That said, the Covenant can build huge fleets when they want to. Just see Regret’s fleet of 500 ships he had to invade Earth and High Charity’s fleet which is significantly larger.
>
>
> Just look at the largest losses the Covenant suffered against humanity during the war:
>
> Battle of Psi Serpentis (over 300 ships)
> Fall of Reach (approx. 210 ships)
> Operation: FIRST STRIKE (approx. 488 ships)
> NOVA Bomb detonation (over 300 ships)
>
> That’s at least 1300 vessels lost from these 4 engagements alone and the Covenant shrugged them off like they were nothing. Only the mysterious enemy they were fighting against on another front (that has only been hinted at so far) and the Great Schism saved humanity.
“Mysterious enemy”. I’m intrigued. What are you referring to here?
> 2533274905624999;18:
> > 2533274849782428;17:
> > > 2533275013291255;16:
> > > It was actually 3 different fleets combined together to form the armada of 750 ships (Thel only contributed 60 of them) that hit Reach. That said, the Covenant can build huge fleets when they want to. Just see Regret’s fleet of 500 ships he had to invade Earth and High Charity’s fleet which is significantly larger.
> >
> >
> > Just look at the largest losses the Covenant suffered against humanity during the war:
> >
> > Battle of Psi Serpentis (over 300 ships)
> > Fall of Reach (approx. 210 ships)
> > Operation: FIRST STRIKE (approx. 488 ships)
> > NOVA Bomb detonation (over 300 ships)
> >
> > That’s at least 1300 vessels lost from these 4 engagements alone and the Covenant shrugged them off like they were nothing. Only the mysterious enemy they were fighting against on another front (that has only been hinted at so far) and the Great Schism saved humanity.
>
>
> “Mysterious enemy”. I’m intrigued. What are you referring to here?
There’s a few moments in some of the early Halo novels where human characters are perplexed about how long it’s taken the Covenant to finish off humanity. So Halsey hypothesizes that the Covenant are actually at war with a more powerful enemy on another front.
With Halo Wars 2, this enemy is likely to have been the Banished.
It wouldn’t matter whether or not you multiplied by 20. Earth had over 300 ODPS and Covenant still managed to break through.
For the UNSC to be successful at Reach all classes of ships would need to be upgraded with post war shields, weapons and engines, Broadswords instead of Longswords and ODPs have CIWS and faster firing more powerful MACs and on site powerplants. As well as an increase in the number of ships especially heavy tonnage ships, battlecruisers and super carriers and ODPs.
The planet side forces also need post war upgrading, Mammoths to provide orbital defence, Mantis regiments of all variants to ambush at various points. HW2 Grizzlies and Scorpions battalions all varieties striking staging areas and all the warthogs, Kestrels and other vehicles providing fast, harassing attacks or delaying actions.
The Spartans IIs need to be augmented with the IIIs and IVs to conduct proper high value raids. While ODSTs and regular forces would need all the post war weapons, armour, logistical medical advancements.
Research into Forerunner tech also needs to be further on so as to provide any weapons, vehicles and equipment for a greater edge.
Only with all these upgrades then will Reach and the inner colonies stand a chance of of surviving the invasion that fell upon Reach.