I made this post one another Thread however I felt it could use its own thread to see what others thought about it. I also wanted to elaborate a little bit.
The Halo community is extremely diverse and there are many ways to enjoy Halo. Completely different communities have come out of the many features and elements that are available in Halo.
An example of some of the communities are:
Griff Ballers
Social Gamers
Forgers
Competitive Gamers
Artists
Many more I am sure.
Why is this thread called ranking? In Halo Reach one of these communities was neglected quite heavily, the competitive gamers. Some would say that the Arena was for the competitive gamer however the system is not good for many reasons. It only allows for Team Slayer which is the most popular game type however it is not the only game type. (Many more reasons why the Arena system was not good however I don’t want to get into that.)
Imagine that they removed the Grif Ball playlist. Do you think that community would be happy? How about they remove forge? How would the forgers feel?
This is why the competitive community was so upset about Reach. The game had many great elements however the competitive gamer felt very left out. I can only hope that 343 rights this wrong and gives the competitive community what they want.
An end note: I want people’s opinions on this however it is not meant to be about the flaws or perks of a ranking system. It is about how a community feels left out of the Halo Universe.
Its funny you mention the grifball playlist as an example because according to Frank it won’t be in at launch.
Back on topic though, you’re not really stating what you want. You want competetive players to feel like they have something of their own to look forward in Halo. Thats great, but you need to elaborate on ideas of how to incorporate competetive play in the game. All you have done is stated the flaws of arena but you have failed to follow through and bring new ideas to the table. Based on the title you want 343 to bring back ranked playlists, but I think that time has past.
Just try to put out some ideas of what competetives would like added.
> > If the competitive community feels left out, it’s because they left.
>
> And do you think the other communities would leave if their elements were removed?
> > > If the competitive community feels left out, it’s because they left.
> >
> > And do you think the other communities would leave if their elements were removed?
>
> No, I don’t. The vast majority just play Halo.
They play halo in one of the 5 catagories he mentioned, so he is saying why the hell should one have to suffer at the expense of another?
> If the competitive community feels left out, it’s because they left.
The competitive community left because Reach gave them very little to work with. They didn’t just up and leave for no reason. There are many factors in Reach that make it bad from a competitive stand point.
One, the maps. Now before you go bashing what I say here, you need to be able to look at this from a competitive players point of view. Most of the maps on Reach suck for competitive play. Almost every single competitive map was created in forge because the vanilla Reach maps lack two things. One being size. Many of them were too large and not small enough for competitive play and the other is symmetry.
Look back at the days of Halo 2. Sanctuary, Warlock, Lockout, Midship, Beaver Creek. 5 great maps for competitive play. 5 doesn’t seem like a lot but compare that to Reach and you’ll see what I’m saying. What vanilla Reach maps are actually considered GOOD competitive maps? From my time playing MLG customs back around the time Reach launched, I can’t really think of any. I guess Zealot would be considered the best b/c its the most symmetrical but the size of it keeps it from being a good map. Countdown is the only other vanilla map that was used in competitive play and even then it didn’t play all that well.
The other and probably the biggest problem was the DMR. The bloom completely ruined that weapon for competitive play. Again, you need to look at this from a competitive players point of view. The bloom took away most of the skill gap that Reach could have had because of one thing, spam shot. Much too often could you time your shots and get beat by someone who just fires off 5 quick shots and hits that lucky 5 head shot. This factors into regular matchmaking as well. The inconsistency of the weapon is what made it unsuitable for competitive play. You can make the case of zero bloom being introduced but it was introduced too late. I feel that Reachs’ competitive scene would be much larger if zero bloom was included from day 1. Zero bloom brings back the skill involved since the player with the better shot will win almost every time, the way it should be.
So really, as long as H4 has atleast 4 to 6 maps that work well in the competitive environment and has a decent sized skill gap, the game can thrive competitively. It just all goes back to the OP, did 343i keep the competitive community in mind when working on certain aspects of the game?
Tl;Dr Reach sucks competitively b/c of maps and bloom.
> Its funny you mention the grifball playlist as an example because according to Frank it won’t be in at launch.
>
> Back on topic though, you’re not really stating what you want. You want competetive players to feel like they have something of their own to look forward in Halo. Thats great, but you need to elaborate on ideas of how to incorporate competetive play in the game. All you have done is stated the flaws of arena but you have failed to follow through and bring new ideas to the table. Based on the title you want 343 to bring back ranked playlists, but I think that time has past.
>
> Just try to put out some ideas of what competetives would like added.
I don’t think it’s the community’s job to outline a design doc for multiplayer so certain groups and aren’t left out. When 343 took Halo on they took with it the obligation to try and please all the different people that Bungie brought in, ignoring certain people (like competitive gamers) is a bit lazy.
OP said competitive gamers should get a true-skill ranking system. There you go. Beyond that, well they aren’t paying 343 for nothing, are they?
> > Its funny you mention the grifball playlist as an example because according to Frank it won’t be in at launch.
> >
> > Back on topic though, you’re not really stating what you want. You want competetive players to feel like they have something of their own to look forward in Halo. Thats great, but you need to elaborate on ideas of how to incorporate competetive play in the game. All you have done is stated the flaws of arena but you have failed to follow through and bring new ideas to the table. Based on the title you want 343 to bring back ranked playlists, but I think that time has past.
> >
> > Just try to put out some ideas of what competetives would like added.
>
> I don’t think it’s the community’s job to outline a design doc for multiplayer so certain groups and aren’t left out. When 343 took Halo on they took with it the obligation to try and please all the different people that Bungie brought in, ignoring certain people (like competitive gamers) is a bit lazy.
>
> OP said competitive gamers should get a true-skill ranking system. There you go. Beyond that, well they aren’t paying 343 for nothing, are they?
> I made this post one another Thread however I felt it could use its own thread to see what others thought about it. I also wanted to elaborate a little bit.
>
> The Halo community is extremely diverse and there are many ways to enjoy Halo. Completely different communities have come out of the many features and elements that are available in Halo.
>
> An example of some of the communities are:
>
> - Griff Ballers
> - Social Gamers
> - Forgers
> - Competitive Gamers
> - Artists
> - Many more I am sure.
>
> Why is this thread called ranking? In Halo Reach one of these communities was neglected quite heavily, the competitive gamers. Some would say that the Arena was for the competitive gamer however the system is not good for many reasons. It only allows for Team Slayer which is the most popular game type however it is not the only game type. (Many more reasons why the Arena system was not good however I don’t want to get into that.)
>
> Imagine that they removed the Grif Ball playlist. Do you think that community would be happy? How about they remove forge? How would the forgers feel?
>
> This is why the competitive community was so upset about Reach. The game had many great elements however the competitive gamer felt very left out. I can only hope that 343 rights this wrong and gives the competitive community what they want.
>
> An end note: I want people’s opinions on this however it is not meant to be about the flaws or perks of a ranking system. It is about how a community feels left out of the Halo Universe.
> > I made this post one another Thread however I felt it could use its own thread to see what others thought about it. I also wanted to elaborate a little bit.
> >
> > The Halo community is extremely diverse and there are many ways to enjoy Halo. Completely different communities have come out of the many features and elements that are available in Halo.
> >
> > An example of some of the communities are:
> >
> > - Griff Ballers
> > - Social Gamers
> > - Forgers
> > - Competitive Gamers
> > - Artists
> > - Many more I am sure.
> >
> > Why is this thread called ranking? In Halo Reach one of these communities was neglected quite heavily, the competitive gamers. Some would say that the Arena was for the competitive gamer however the system is not good for many reasons. It only allows for Team Slayer which is the most popular game type however it is not the only game type. (Many more reasons why the Arena system was not good however I don’t want to get into that.)
> >
> > Imagine that they removed the Grif Ball playlist. Do you think that community would be happy? How about they remove forge? How would the forgers feel?
> >
> > This is why the competitive community was so upset about Reach. The game had many great elements however the competitive gamer felt very left out. I can only hope that 343 rights this wrong and gives the competitive community what they want.
> >
> > An end note: I want people’s opinions on this however it is not meant to be about the flaws or perks of a ranking system. It is about how a community feels left out of the Halo Universe.
>
> <mark>http://cheezburger.com/6525917440</mark>
Arena was taken off of the Rating System (which restricted the gametype selections to TS only because of an inability to accurately score the intangibles) and changed to W/L around Season 7 I believe.
> (Many more reasons why the Arena system was not good however I don’t want to get into that.)
I’ve heard many of them. I find them to be lacking.
> > If the competitive community feels left out, it’s because they left.
>
> The competitive community left because Reach gave them very little to work with. They didn’t just up and leave for no reason. There are many factors in Reach that make it bad from a competitive stand point.
>
> Tl;Dr Reach sucks competitively b/c of maps and bloom.
I hear what you say and I believe you. But remember, the maps came from campaign, and there was neither the time or the will to put the required effort into maps. Bungie was done with Halo. That being said, they created Arena. It would have worked if only the ranks didn’t reset. Well, actually, if the ranks didn’t reset it wouldn’t have worked. In any event, had the competitive community supported Arena, there would have been more maps, games, etc. But no, no permanent ranks, no Arena. Well, Reach lives without the competitive community, and 343i has learned a few things.
> > Its funny you mention the grifball playlist as an example because according to Frank it won’t be in at launch.
> >
> > Back on topic though, you’re not really stating what you want. You want competetive players to feel like they have something of their own to look forward in Halo. Thats great, but you need to elaborate on ideas of how to incorporate competetive play in the game. All you have done is stated the flaws of arena but you have failed to follow through and bring new ideas to the table. Based on the title you want 343 to bring back ranked playlists, but I think that time has past.
> >
> > Just try to put out some ideas of what competetives would like added.
>
> I don’t think it’s the community’s job to outline a design doc for multiplayer so certain groups and aren’t left out. When 343 took Halo on they took with it the obligation to try and please all the different people that Bungie brought in, ignoring certain people (like competitive gamers) is a bit lazy.
>
> OP said competitive gamers should get a true-skill ranking system. There you go. Beyond that, well they aren’t paying 343 for nothing, are they?
In other words, “We don’t know what we want, but whatever you come up with, it’s not that.”
How do you get a true-skill ranking system? A system that accurately ranks you based upon your individual skill. You figure that out and you have a guaranteed job with 343i, if not Microsoft.