⚔ Ranked and Social 🏖

Games Halo Infinite
1

Whats the story everyone. This topic is about big parties and how they effect Ranked and Social playlists. I call it an issue but its really not a big deal and it can be easily improved. Also ill be touching on some topics that already have forums about those certain topics. So please dont get side tracked and try to stay on this topic. For example if anyone wants to talk about how earning XP in infinite will work please go a find a topic about that

Sorry if this is a bit long. Any feed back would be great and any ideas on what to add will be great too. I guess i just want this to be talked about more and addressed properly so that 343i will know and understand what us halo fans like and dont like for Halo infinite.

One issue that is not being talked about enough that will make multiplayer worse to play over time is…

There is no clear line between Ranked and Social

You cant really play any casual games anymore. Since we’re all waiting for the next flight ive hopped back on the MCC. It has crossplay and its free to play…so its kinda the closest thing we have to experience halo infinite. It was such a good feeling to play a new Halo title again with the 1st flight and i cant wait to play the next one but i was frustratedly reminded of a problem ive dealt with for years and somthing i hope infinite wont have to deal with when i was playing the MCC. I have experienced this issue with big parties in Social playlist who play too competitive. Over the many years of my no sleep or eat gamer days, from halo 3’s multiplayer to halo 5’s. Back in the day this would happen now and again, not too often to talk about really or to bring it up as an issue. Even though it may be a small issue it can impact multiplayer in a big way. For example years ago you would get this maybe 2 out of 10 games being against big parties but nowa days its more like 8 out of 10 games. Ive experienced this on the MCC and its happening nearly every game. I was quickly reminded of this and why i stopped playing halo for a long time because of it. When you’re pitted against a hyper sweaty party that destroys you it’s so frustrating and there is nothing you can do but die and spawn over and over. Being spawn trapped is horrible and I know it gets boring on the winning team too. Its difficult to get a kill when your team is a big party that control the whole map and give out to you for being there and most times teamkill you. Its funny just how they make it out to be so competitive and I wonder why they take it so seriously in a social playlist? Ive seen this issue throughout the halo games but nothing as worse now in halo MCC. Maybe its because its free to play? or maybe because of crossplay? or maybe because of SBMM but the question is why isn’t it just imporved?

If 343i is to take a lot from the MCC and past halo games for halo infinite, this will be a problem that will affect gameplay as it happens relentlessly to me every time i simply …try to play an actual game!

Reminder ill be touching on some topics that will trigger people so please anything im about to say please find a topic/forums and give your opinion there

So I play on console and I like to play the way i like to. I dont like PC vs Console so i turn of crossplay. I dont like KB/M vs Controller so i turn off input in the settings. When i do this i get a penalty of longer search times. This has me waiting up to an hour to try and find and game. These filters dont work and are broken in the options. So when i reset them i get a game straight away. Now with a game loading in its “Skilled Based Matchmaking” turn to ruin the game. 8 out of 10 games your pitted against parties and all you have is a team of randoms ready to play a loosing game straight from the start. Oh and lets not forget to thank SBMM for the lag and high ping it does for matchmaking. All i keep thinking is why are these big MLG parties in social? Years ago there was an update were only parties faced off against parties but like i mentioned having this in the settings as an option doesn’t work and would increase search times for games also people wouldn’t be happy if parties only faced of against other parties.

So my idea on how to improve Ranked and Social

Ranked
I think it should be more appealing for people who wanna play strictly competitive games. BTB gametype will be 24 players. So in Ranked playlists you can have a full team in a party of 12 players max. Ranked can feel tedious, when all you have are a few gametypes and maps with no other options. So why not have more options in ranked, more maps, more gametypes a more better experience for ranking up in each gametype while having “Arena” being the big gametype for ranked to work towards e-sports. Also in ranked there will be a practice mode in all the maps and gametypes. Play against your friends or bots and this will not effect your rank.

Social
This is supposed to be for casual players that dont have that much time to play competitively. Social would have all the usual gametypes/maps as ranked but more gametypes like heavies, fiesta, zombies, and custom gametypes…etc. Now im about to say something that might trigger people so please ive put a lot of thought into this. In Social playlists the max party size of players will be 4 players max. Except for custom games.This is fair and will give games like BTB and others a better chance at being fun and casual to play while gametypes like slayer would still be affected by parties that are hyper sweaty gamers and for some reason choose not to play in ranked? Ive been lenient with this decision becuse people would freak if you are not aloud to party up in social, even though there is always an option to party up in ranked with a full team of 12 players. This I think will be fair and there will be always people who dont like playing ranked but want to be with there friends so 4 being the max for parties in Social is fair.

This should be an issue to talk about nothing too serious but something that should be addressed at least. I know that if halo infinite will be like this straight from the start I can easily see people losing interest and stop playing multiplayer. I mean its free to play, imagine someone new whos whats to play and experiences what i explained. They would easily make the decision to not play again because it was free to begin with. We all know that SKMM and gametypes like Battle Royal make games more competitive and addictive. I feel like most games nowa days feel like slot machines in casinos. Didnt win try again until you get that satisfactory big win that you worked so hard for and when you do, the difficulty will be increased because of SBMM. We as gamers done so well against big game corporations with loot boxs, play to win, and other things but we still wont talk about SBMM.

At the very least i hope 343i makes it that SBMM will be softer and less strict, with a wider range of players to match with that wont be the same skill level as you are.

As for Ranked and Social i hope 343i do a better job for infinite and im sure they will but… if we dont talk about the subject now it will be overlooked and it will be there from day one.

All I want is it to be fair and not have you to work so hard to play a game.

Its 2007, you come home from school, boot up the 360, sit back with a snack and drink, play some games of halo and end the day to some new friends ya met online, say bye and GG.

Life was good and it can be again.

2

I am sorry to say I didn’t read your post, but I wanted to say I like the icons in the subject line. That is all.

3

Regarding Mcc: let’s be real on its population, it’s not going to be good enough to always properly match players how some people want to be matched. Typically your games try to match players based on skill so that games aren’t blowouts and yes, that even includes social albeit they make the parameters for social more lenient. I don’t know if Mcc does it this way, but halo 5 would try matching teams vs teams, I saw it plenty when I used to be part of a gaming community playing in large groups. I imagine that’s how infinite will be as well but it should ideally perform better because it’ll have more pop on launch. Long term though? Who knows.

As for sweaty players in social: that’s unavoidable but I’d also ask how that’s actually an issue, people will play how they want and like I tell others who complain how sweaty social can be, social or ranked you’re still playing to win, the only difference is one has a ranked associated with you and the other doesn’t. It’s also because of less lenient pentameters that blowouts happen more often in social as well, or how an inferior player matches up vs a superior one.

at best 343 can curb things which they’ve been trying, but you also need the population to make that run right, as a game loses pop over time, the less the parameters work and the more it’ll prioritize on just trying to find you a game.

4

Came here to say the same thing. Cool icons.

5

I think having a reason to play ranked would help the community, because getting higher skilled players to play more of it over social helps keep social free from these players destroying them. MCC for instance, I might have a challenge to win 2 ranked games. That’s over in half na hour and unless I want to improve my rank, there’s no other incentives to play. The ranking system on MCC isnt very good mind, so I’m glad Infinite is using a similar H5 system.

It doesn’t bother me personally, but I think crossplay should be disabled if you want it but of course you get longer match times as a result. It won’t actually make much of a difference unless you’re in the top <1%. You’ll probably find all the top players in Snipers and SWAT use keyboard and mouse. Most top players probably will in every playlist tbh. Some people get frustrated when they lose to someone on a different input, oh mouse is too easy, too much aim assist etc etc. Both have advantages, if you are of similar skill then you are of similar skill. No two people’s skills are identical I might be Plat 2 with decent aim and terrible map awareness and you might be Plat 2 with terrible aim and fantastic map awareness, that can be true even if we are on the same input. Everyone has the option to use either input if one has a noticeable advantage also.

My issue with ranked is it is usually highly stressful, so I play social to relax. I don’t want my social games to be as stressful and super close and highly skill based matchmaking. This means sometimes you do really well and sometimes you do really bad. That’s how I like it.

6

Cheers lads for the like on my icons :laughing:
And i really do appreciate any comments about this topic positive and negative feedback is good. I call it an issue but its really not. My main goal is to have this topic discussed more. Glad that im not the only one who experience this. I just want it all to be fair for everyone. I dont play that much Ranked but I would if it was more appealing and then jump back onto social to wind down. Understandably yes all games in ranked and social are to play for the win but its been so long now that i experienced playing a game and not really playing the game for the win. For example one time both teams where trying to tip over the elephant on sandtrap and both sides where talking and having such a laugh. Things like this dont exist anymore. Maybe because there are so many clans nowa days or discord or even streamers have there followers. I dunno really!

7

I wanna point something out. You said have ranked games of BTB with 12 party members? As of a great idea that is, ranked BTB would be harder to find games and match people around the same skill level as you. That mean you’d have to find 23 other players that are searching that playlist that are around your rank. Of course that’s likely not gonna happen, then we’ll be at block number one where everyone is complaining about MM balancing in ranked.

8

The more I think about it the more I think Social needs multi-team.

3 v 3 v 3 on standard maps. 8 v 8 v 8 on BTB maps.

Smaller teams make it harder to dominate the map… and you have the chaos of being outnumbered 2:1

9

> 2585548714655118;8:
> The more I think about it the more I think Social needs multi-team.
>
> 3 v 3 v 3 on standard maps. 8 v 8 v 8 on BTB maps.
>
> Smaller teams make it harder to dominate the map… and you have the chaos of being outnumbered 2:1

How will multiteam work with the friend or foe system? I feel like the system will become confusing with more than 2 colors.

10

If population is fine then I want to avoid full parties playing against me whenever possible since it’s always full of try-hards that also involve cheating by exploiting maps to spawn trap in other games so I want to avoid that as much as possible. For ranked if I’m searching solo then I expect to avoid full party teams whenever possible since randoms are not going to have fun against coordinated teams and will end up being stressful. As for matchmaking in general I hope they deal with griefers too in Infinite since MCC lately seems to be getting more of these trolls that do nothing but make the game unplayable. Anyway I’m mostly concerned that Infinite will be full of hackers so I’m hoping they let me turn off cross-play for a while until population lowers.

11

usually competitive players like slayer, snipers and FFA, maybe something new but no BTB
the larger the team the harder to coordinate, so competitive with 12 players wouldnt be competitive, they like small groups or lonewolf
i´d seen teams with 3 players vs 4 players dominate the map, is not about numbers all the time

im a casual player H5, so i stay off ranked, at least until i get a ranked, just for the reqpack

BTW loved the 2 swords icon

12

> 2533274963798898;9:
> > 2585548714655118;8:
> > The more I think about it the more I think Social needs multi-team.
> >
> > 3 v 3 v 3 on standard maps. 8 v 8 v 8 on BTB maps.
> >
> > Smaller teams make it harder to dominate the map… and you have the chaos of being outnumbered 2:1
>
> How tf will multiteam work with the friend or foe system? I feel like the system will become confusing with more than 2 colors.

That type of an immature response isn’t welcome here. I’m guessing you didn’t read my two points about staying on topic. If you want to talk about FOF system go find a topic that posts about it there. If you want to talk to people you address them probably with a respectful comment. If not, you’re making yourself look narrow minded and come across as a childbrain. If you want to try again you can try and redeem yourself.

Common sense is good but not all Sense is common

13

> 2533274829873463;10:
> If population is fine then I want to avoid full parties playing against me whenever possible since it’s always full of try-hards that also involve cheating by exploiting maps to spawn trap in other games so I want to avoid that as much as possible. For ranked if I’m searching solo then I expect to avoid full party teams whenever possible since randoms are not going to have fun against coordinated teams and will end up being stressful. As for matchmaking in general I hope they deal with griefers too in Infinite since MCC lately seems to be getting more of these trolls that do nothing but make the game unplayable. Anyway I’m mostly concerned that Infinite will be full of hackers so I’m hoping they let me turn off cross-play for a while until population lowers.

Man fair play to ya, that was spoken like a true scholar. That was exactly what was in my head and you put it out so intelligently. All i did was ramble on. Gawd im getting so old as a halo veteran im unable to speak my mind. Thanks for the more compact straight to the point and well spoken version of what I was trying to say :laughing:

Clever minds think a like but i cant type to save me life

14

> 2533274818433952;13:
> > 2533274829873463;10:
> > If population is fine then I want to avoid full parties playing against me whenever possible since it’s always full of try-hards that also involve cheating by exploiting maps to spawn trap in other games so I want to avoid that as much as possible. For ranked if I’m searching solo then I expect to avoid full party teams whenever possible since randoms are not going to have fun against coordinated teams and will end up being stressful. As for matchmaking in general I hope they deal with griefers too in Infinite since MCC lately seems to be getting more of these trolls that do nothing but make the game unplayable. Anyway I’m mostly concerned that Infinite will be full of hackers so I’m hoping they let me turn off cross-play for a while until population lowers.
>
> Man fair play to ya, that was spoken like a true scholar. That was exactly what was in my head and you put it out so intelligently. All i did was ramble on. Gawd im getting so old as a halo veteran im unable to speak my mind. Thanks for the more compact straight to the point and well spoken version of what I was trying to say :laughing:
>
> Clever minds think a like but i cant type to save me life

I guess so. Was just thinking from experience since just wanted a fair balanced match. :open_mouth:

15

> 2535436557871072;7:
> I wanna point something out. You said have ranked games of BTB with 12 party members? As of a great idea that is, ranked BTB would be harder to find games and match people around the same skill level as you. That mean you’d have to find 23 other players that are searching that playlist that are around your rank. Of course that’s likely not gonna happen, then we’ll be at block number one where everyone is complaining about MM balancing in ranked.

Thats a great point man. Think i said BTB is because I would like Ranked to have more variety with gametypes. I experience big parties of 12 on the MCC in social all the time and think that having two teams of sweaty gamers play in ranked would be fair. All honesty i would just like big parties to have more options to play than just in social so someone like me who plays casually not be destroyed by them. Yep you’re right matchmaking with people in the same skill level as you would make for longer search times and it would suck. Im not sure how MM can be improved, maybe if teams loaded in separately so rather than waiting for 23 players you would be only waiting on your team of 12 to load in a lobby first and then get paired up with another team of 12 whos ready to play. Thanks for the feedback man

16

I’m just hoping the ranking system for infinite doesn’t rely on if your team wins the game. But instead relies on personal skill, i can’t count how many times I’ve been ranked diamond 4+ and end up getting knocked down to plat after 4 games because I’m the only one getting kills. I personally don’t think you should have to have a pre made squad to rank up.

17

> 2533274818433952;15:
> > 2535436557871072;7:
> > I wanna point something out. You said have ranked games of BTB with 12 party members? As of a great idea that is, ranked BTB would be harder to find games and match people around the same skill level as you. That mean you’d have to find 23 other players that are searching that playlist that are around your rank. Of course that’s likely not gonna happen, then we’ll be at block number one where everyone is complaining about MM balancing in ranked.
>
> Thats a great point man. Think i said BTB is because I would like Ranked to have more variety with gametypes. I experience big parties of 12 on the MCC in social all the time and think that having two teams of sweaty gamers play in ranked would be fair. All honesty i would just like big parties to have more options to play than just in social so someone like me who plays casually not be destroyed by them. Yep you’re right matchmaking with people in the same skill level as you would make for longer search times and it would suck. Im not sure how MM can be improved, maybe if teams loaded in separately so rather than waiting for 23 players you would be only waiting on your team of 12 to load in a lobby first and then get paired up with another team of 12 whos ready to play. Thanks for the feedback man

Maybe separate teams from solo q’rs like in H5? If you que with people, make where you’re facing other people who are queing together also? Ik the population drop is rly rly low, but it could improve.

18

> 2533274963798898;9:
> > 2585548714655118;8:
> > The more I think about it the more I think Social needs multi-team.
> >
> > 3 v 3 v 3 on standard maps. 8 v 8 v 8 on BTB maps.
> >
> > Smaller teams make it harder to dominate the map… and you have the chaos of being outnumbered 2:1
>
> How will multiteam work with the friend or foe system? I feel like the system will become confusing with more than 2 colors.

Does it need more colours?

Just have one foe colour that covers both opposing teams. If you really have to know what team you are shooting (which is probably more of a ranked mindset than social) then you could have a team icon over their head.

19

I think H5 has a solid solution in place, and it should be semi leveraged for MCC/Infinite. The solo/duo que playlist helps a TON when you’re tired of being party stomped, but it’s only available in ranked, so you still get some of the issues with only having super sweaty games.

What if the concept of the “solo que” were implemented into the game via the match making composer. Something like checkboxes where you could enable one or both of

  • Match with solos - Match with partiesSo if you are a solo player, and you don’t want to match with parties, you can only enable “match with solos”, and then any playlist/game combo you’ve chosen would only match you with other solo players.

If you are a party, you can only “match with parties”, but empty slots (like if you’re running a 3 person party) would be filled by any solo players who also have “match with parties” enabled.

I bet there would be nuances that would have to be worked out, but I think the idea could cut back on a lot of match making frustrations.

20

> 2535440557112363;16:
> I’m just hoping the ranking system for infinite doesn’t rely on if your team wins the game. But instead relies on personal skill, i can’t count how many times I’ve been ranked diamond 4+ and end up getting knocked down to plat after 4 games because I’m the only one getting kills. I personally don’t think you should have to have a pre made squad to rank up.

The opposing view is that it is a team game. Just like any other ‘sport’.

I agree it’s frustrating when you go down and it wasn’t your fault.

But the problem is that an individual rank promotes anti-team behaviour. Fighting for equipment and power weapons would only get worse… and we’ve all seen those players who crouch walk around the map curating their KD and not doing anything to help the team (eg. putting their body on the line to rush overshield).

I can see why the focus in all on the win.

The only other way to do it would be to have two rankings. One is your team ranking… based solely on the W/L of your team. The other a more individual ranking - based on your individual performance. But how? You could have a minimum score (KDA or damage) that you need to achieve depending on your MMR relative to the team’s total MMR (the better players have a higher bar to reach). If you make this score during the game it’s a personal ‘win’ and your personal ranking goes up. You could buff the scores by 20% for the team win and drop them similarly for a team loss to keep the emphasis on the win.

The thing is that your team ranking could simply be the % of wins from the last 100 games. That % then reflects form and tendency to be a good (or bad) team-mate.