Radar Nerfs and my opinions

Games Halo Infinite
1

So, in playing the tech test over the last few days I’d noticed that several times the radar seemed to show me nothing of enemy movements or enemies just straight up disappearing off of it when I can clearly see them running about.

So I did some tests and found the only actions that put you on the radar are sprinting and shooting. So you can throw grenades, run about at full “combat speed” so long as you don’t sprint, even jump all willy-nilly and no enemies within radar range could do jack about it.

This completely removes the utility of crouching, as it was a sacrifice of speed for stealth, and while the argument can be made that sprint showing on the radar is a tradeoff of a kind, it already has the tradeoff of not having your weapon ready if someone rounds a corner on you. (i’ve been informed that the italicised statement is false when talking about H5 and Infinite)

On a slightly different note, the bots almost seem to have a better “radar” as even if you try and crouch walk up behind one, if it’s not distracted by one of your friendlies it will immediately round on you and unload into you.

I feel this is a pretty big and unnecessary nerf to something that is a staple in the Halo series, and I don’t see how they settled on this being the radar they were happy with.

Just my opinions, feel free to think differently, but I’m not happy with this change

2

I agree, everyone should be on radar at all times unless crouching.

3

> 2533274846706692;2:
> I agree, everyone should be on radar at all times unless crouching.

Or standing still.

4

> 2535437900382369;1:
> This completely removes the utility of crouching, as it was a sacrifice of speed for stealth, and while the argument can be made that sprint showing on the radar is a tradeoff of a kind, it already has the tradeoff of not having your weapon ready if someone rounds a corner on you.

This doesn’t exist since H5G, as you can immediately shoot out of sprint. Infinite does the same.

I actually don’t like the change in radar either, but that’s what people get for wanting sprint shoved into Halo: It needs to fit into the sandbox somehow and this is just the latest iteration of 343 trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.
Granted, it’s the best solution yet, but the radar nerf didn’t even need to happen if sprint had just been removed outright.

5

im gonna be the minority here, but radar was never that useful. People need to learn to not play the radar and instead to play the game. Audio is pretty good from a location detection basis. It really isnt needed at this point

6

I actually really like the new radar and think its a natural evolution for Halo because it helps speed up the methodical nature of the game while also allowing the player to have the options on how they want to enter combat.

7

I agree, everyone should be on radar at all times unless crouching. Its made sprint even more useless

8

It has been tough. I also think UI could use some help. I miss grenades being top left.

9

> 2533274840624875;5:
> im gonna be the minority here, but radar was never that useful. People need to learn to not play the radar and instead to play the game. Audio is pretty good from a location detection basis. It really isnt needed at this point

Playing with radar in mind and using it strategically is part of the Halo experience.

10

> 2533274840624875;5:
> im gonna be the minority here, but radar was never that useful. People need to learn to not play the radar and instead to play the game. Audio is pretty good from a location detection basis. It really isnt needed at this point

Imagine saying this about any other mechanic that had been in the game from the beginning:

“Weapon spawns were never that useful. People need to learn to not play the weapon spawns and instead to play the game. Starter weapons are pretty good from a damage basis. It really isnt needed at this point.”

“grenades were never that useful. People need to learn to not play with grenades and instead to play the game. guns are pretty good from a killing basis. they really aren’t needed at this point”

“Weapons with zoom was never that useful. People need to learn to not play at range and instead to play the game. Aiming is pretty good from a point-and-click basis. It really isnt needed at this point”

“melee was never that useful. People need to learn to not use melee in close combat and instead to play the game. guns is pretty good from a killing basis. It really isnt needed at this point”

If we look at each of the movement types that we have available and the pros and cons that come with them, it paints a fairly restricting picture, which Radar is just a part of.

Crouching Pros:

  • hidden on radar - quieter than walking - weapon always upCrouching Cons:
  • Extremely slowWalking Pros:
  • hidden on radar - fairly quiet - weapon always up - pretty good speedWalking Cons:
  • Slower than sprintingSprinting Pros:
  • Slightly faster than walking - can use slidingSprinting Cons:
  • On radar - loudSo now Crouching is useless, sprint has barely any benefits to just walking, and all of us are arguing about how these affect our favourite systems from previous games while none of us should actually be happy with the implementation of any of them
11

Its crazy how these same topics keep coming up. Have you not read others and taken an opinion in them?..you don’t need a radar there at all times feeding you so much information that the game becomes completely so predictable. Pay attention to your surroundings, be more aware. You shouldn’t be able to know someone’s across a long hallway cause you see a red dot on your radar before the players even walked into that hallway. This leads to drawn out predictable stand offiish fights and all people will do is peak shot the entire match too scared to engage each other. By the time you’ve crouch walked to where you want to go it’s too late.

Crouch walking does not use its utility. You are still in stealth mode and people won’t be hearing your movement when you close in on them. Havent you heard how loud people are when they move?

So much opens when the radar works this way. I’ve said it probably in 3 or 4 threads by now. Players cross more pathways, more map space is used, more unique engagements, players adopt a higher IQ as they learn to play this way and realize what they could do and where they could go. All this is gained, while what is lost? You being able to see someone’s an entire level below you because he took a step? That a guy is about to round a far away corner before he’s even on the freaking screen?

Even if you’re at a corner and you don’t realize the entire enemy team is on the other side of that corner…its foolish to just roam around the map that way anyways and not take the precautions of being with team mates or realizing if they’re in a fight or not, where they’re at in correspondence to you, how much map you’ve all already covered and where the enemies are most likely undoubtedly at realizing you’ve all walked over half the map and are about to run into an entire team.

Maybe once pvp is in and you take all this into account, once you realize hey…I can flank these guys. They aren’t going to see me pinging on their radar miles away because I took 1 small step on the map revealing my entire play before it was even ever close to happening…you yourself will make some epic plays and discover how much more dynamic a match can feel this way.

And yes. It’s an old staple of old halo to have the radar being that powerful where the ranked mode would sometimes have no radar. I feel like this is the perfect version. Not too much not too little and not the extreme of removing the radar. I get the points being made but I feel like so much more points could be made for the counter argument.

12

> 2533274842046585;11:
> Its crazy how these same topics keep coming up. Have you not read others and taken an opinion in them?..you don’t need a radar there at all times feeding you so much information that the game becomes completely so predictable. Pay attention to your surroundings, be more aware. You shouldn’t be able to know someone’s across a long hallway cause you see a red dot on your radar before the players even walked into that hallway. This leads to drawn out predictable stand offiish fights and all people will do is peak shot the entire match too scared to engage each other. By the time you’ve crouch walked to where you want to go it’s too late.
>
> Crouch walking does not use its utility. You are still in stealth mode and people won’t be hearing your movement when you close in on them. Havent you heard how loud people are when they move?
>
> So much opens when the radar works this way. I’ve said it probably in 3 or 4 threads by now. Players cross more pathways, more map space is used, more unique engagements, players adopt a higher IQ as they learn to play this way and realize what they could do and where they could go. All this is gained, while what is lost? You being able to see someone’s an entire level below you because he took a step? That a guy is about to round a far away corner before he’s even on the freaking screen?
>
> Even if you’re at a corner and you don’t realize the entire enemy team is on the other side of that corner…its foolish to just roam around the map that way anyways and not take the precautions of being with team mates or realizing if they’re in a fight or not, where they’re at in correspondence to you, how much map you’ve all already covered and where the enemies are most likely undoubtedly at realizing you’ve all walked over half the map and are about to run into an entire team.
>
> Maybe once pvp is in and you take all this into account, once you realize hey…I can flank these guys. They aren’t going to see me pinging on their radar miles away because I took 1 small step on the map revealing my entire play before it was even ever close to happening…you yourself will make some epic plays and discover how much more dynamic a match can feel this way.
>
> And yes. It’s an old staple of old halo to have the radar being that powerful where the ranked mode would sometimes have no radar. I feel like this is the perfect version. Not too much not too little and not the extreme of removing the radar. I get the points being made but I feel like so much more points could be made for the counter argument.

It’s strange that you say that radar makes the game slower, yet you advocate for slowing the game even further by only ever moving around in one large blob of people, looking for the other blob of people. Also doesn’t seem very unique to me, meanwhile having a radar that works more would mean that you could decide if a fight was in your favour, or not and choose your engagement style from there, whether you want to be cautious because there’s more enemies, get an early prenade off to reduce their health, go full on because you have more teammates nearby than them, or just not engage at all.

And you seem to forget that the radar not working on a walking target goes both ways, so if people moved around in a large blob, all it would take for a single enemy to wipe out your team would be to walk up behind your group (who cannot hear his individual footsteps, because hey, a group of people walking around is fairly loud) and press the melee button four times. Doesn’t seem so high IQ to me.

A staple of halo’s combat that separated it from the other shooters was the fact that fights took time and you could prepare for them, instead of being about twitch reactions. But with the way it is, what I’ve seen the bots do very often is walk behind, toss a nade at your feet and the moment it detonates, one tap with the sidekick, with barely any time for the player to react. And the bot didn’t even have to make the sacrifice of using a crouch movement speed to make sure they could wouldn’t be seen before leaving a player with not even half a second to react before they died. And if that’s what the bots can do, I can predict that PVP is gonna be even worse.

And for the people who wanted sprint in the game, they’re left with a 10% speed increase that lets them slide a bit while lighting them up like a christmas tree to nearby enemies

13

I feel like the radar needs a slight buff, besides the problems presented here.
I’m a more aggressive type of player who is always looking for a head on fight and the radar always help me keep a fast paste between fights.
I can find a new enemy as soon as I’m done with my previous one thanks to the radar, I feel like without the radar it would becoming a seeking game and that would slow down fire fights.
The buff I propose for the radar is a way to tell we’re the enemy is vertically ( is he above or below you?).
The maps have a lot of verticality and I always find my self having to run up stairs to look for an enemy just to find out their not there, and when I jump back down there going back up the stairs. That really annoys me and slows down the gameplay.

14

> 2535437900382369;12:
> > 2533274842046585;11:
> > Its crazy how these same topics keep coming up. Have you not read others and taken an opinion in them?..you don’t need a radar there at all times feeding you so much information that the game becomes completely so predictable. Pay attention to your surroundings, be more aware. You shouldn’t be able to know someone’s across a long hallway cause you see a red dot on your radar before the players even walked into that hallway. This leads to drawn out predictable stand offiish fights and all people will do is peak shot the entire match too scared to engage each other. By the time you’ve crouch walked to where you want to go it’s too late.
> >
> > Crouch walking does not use its utility. You are still in stealth mode and people won’t be hearing your movement when you close in on them. Havent you heard how loud people are when they move?
> >
> > So much opens when the radar works this way. I’ve said it probably in 3 or 4 threads by now. Players cross more pathways, more map space is used, more unique engagements, players adopt a higher IQ as they learn to play this way and realize what they could do and where they could go. All this is gained, while what is lost? You being able to see someone’s an entire level below you because he took a step? That a guy is about to round a far away corner before he’s even on the freaking screen?
> >
> > Even if you’re at a corner and you don’t realize the entire enemy team is on the other side of that corner…its foolish to just roam around the map that way anyways and not take the precautions of being with team mates or realizing if they’re in a fight or not, where they’re at in correspondence to you, how much map you’ve all already covered and where the enemies are most likely undoubtedly at realizing you’ve all walked over half the map and are about to run into an entire team.
> >
> > Maybe once pvp is in and you take all this into account, once you realize hey…I can flank these guys. They aren’t going to see me pinging on their radar miles away because I took 1 small step on the map revealing my entire play before it was even ever close to happening…you yourself will make some epic plays and discover how much more dynamic a match can feel this way.
> >
> > And yes. It’s an old staple of old halo to have the radar being that powerful where the ranked mode would sometimes have no radar. I feel like this is the perfect version. Not too much not too little and not the extreme of removing the radar. I get the points being made but I feel like so much more points could be made for the counter argument.
>
> It’s strange that you say that radar makes the game slower, yet you advocate for slowing the game even further by only ever moving around in one large blob of people, looking for the other blob of people. Also doesn’t seem very unique to me, meanwhile having a radar that works more would mean that you could decide if a fight was in your favour, or not and choose your engagement style from there, whether you want to be cautious because there’s more enemies, get an early prenade off to reduce their health, go full on because you have more teammates nearby than them, or just not engage at all.
>
> And you seem to forget that the radar not working on a walking target goes both ways, so if people moved around in a large blob, all it would take for a single enemy to wipe out your team would be to walk up behind your group (who cannot hear his individual footsteps, because hey, a group of people walking around is fairly loud) and press the melee button four times. Doesn’t seem so high IQ to me.
>
> A staple of halo’s combat that separated it from the other shooters was the fact that fights took time and you could prepare for them, instead of being about twitch reactions. But with the way it is, what I’ve seen the bots do very often is walk behind, toss a nade at your feet and the moment it detonates, one tap with the sidekick, with barely any time for the player to react. And the bot didn’t even have to make the sacrifice of using a crouch movement speed to make sure they could wouldn’t be seen before leaving a player with not even half a second to react before they died. And if that’s what the bots can do, I can predict that PVP is gonna be even worse.
>
> And for the people who wanted sprint in the game, they’re left with a 10% speed increase that lets them slide a bit while lighting them up like a christmas tree to nearby enemies

Entirely missing the point…
These scenarios you are using are ridiculous and you give away why you really want the radar to be so powerful…you’re basically saying you want an easy means of playing the game. You want that easy pre nade on that easily predicted target because you knew he was there by a red dot on your radar from him literally taking a step far outside your field of view behind a wall somewhere. You want to safely decide if you should take a fight on or leave it alone.

In those regards though, perhaps I’ve mistaken my opinion though because this is the social settings and perhaps we lose the social aspect of the game when the radar is tuned for higher difficulty and more of a competitive stand point on the settings. I still hold the opinion that the game feels way more dynamic and unique with such settings, but to players just wanting to hop on in and not have to worry about such things and use a strong tool like the radar to kind of more or less dictate a lot of their decision making it’s understandable. Maybe its more of a relaxed feeling for you guys.

15

I’m not sure when it happened in the evolution of FPS but between Halo and COD where by the aim of the game was to play using the radar I for one am glad its toned down now and there is more reliance on the players skill of understanding audio positioning and map flow to work out where players will be rather than just staring bottom left of the screen the whole time.

Less radar reliance gives players with better movements and map control the advantage not those who have mastered looking for the game to hand them all the info.

to each there own.

16

I think that the radar needs some work, as it needs to be far more potent, for the entirety of the halo games, radar is begin a core element of gameplay, it is a powerful tool even more now as they nerf the UI, it is harder to find your allies compared to pervious games so when enemies are with shields down is harder to find a proper play around to help team mates, plus it is harder to identity ally from foe while in combat, it was far easier before red vs blue with a huge marker that highlighted when allies were in combat (if the huge color difference was not enough) so you can go and assist, but now mostly ally and foe are the same color so you have no idea who is who until a few seconds later, and it happens very often as you are getting shoot not knowing ally or enemy only way to know? check you bar health… so the radar previously was an incredibly tool as depending on what you saw it completely changed the way you play the next seconds, when you saw the 4 red dots you know that you have the entire enemy team coming to you, run, throw grenades, shoot, switch to sword, etc. Now you dont have that option so if you are recharging your shields or running to pick up an item you have no idea whats waiting for you so the game is more about react no strategy and that is key for a halo game… strategy.
If you think that this game is not about strategy I urge you to watch the infinite multiplayer again.

17

> 2533274816921820;6:
> I actually really like the new radar and think its a natural evolution for Halo because it helps speed up the methodical nature of the game while also allowing the player to have the options on how they want to enter combat.

I have really enjoyed the new radar. It provides viability to both the sprint/slide aggressive play style and the nore traditional halo style. In my opinion 343 really did a good job of meshing modern fps mechanics and the traditional Halo feel.

18

The new radar is a deal breaker for me personally. It’d be the same as them removing armor and rechargeable shields.

19

I’m hoping it’s only because it’s arena slayer. This radar is terrible.

20

> 2533274840624875;5:
> im gonna be the minority here, but radar was never that useful. People need to learn to not play the radar and instead to play the game. Audio is pretty good from a location detection basis. It really isnt needed at this point

Theres MLG for that, and even then, as of right now, you can spawn near a teammate whose IN A GUN FIGHT. Truth be told, I cant see any of these maps in an MLG playlist. Especially Live Charge. I like them but if we talking about modes where there isnt radar, then those spawns either have to be perfectly balanced, or they need to designate new maps altogether for No radars. Meanwhile an enemy is coming (walking mind you) and youll never know because theres an enemy already infront of you. Yes the sound is good, its the best freaking modern FPS shooter that knows how to use audio correctly (as it should cause its Halo) but this radar is misleading as all types of hell. Merely just looking for people is not going to help because while you may think youre holding down your zone with your team, someone nearby, has thrown a grenade and gotten close enough to kill you. Theres no sense of general direction of where the enemy team could be.

Best part to? In a match in live wire I saw one enemy cool. Lord and behold someone invisible was right infront of him and they both lit me up faster than city spotlight. And one was running, one was walking. VERY misleading.