Quit Penalty Idea

So I was on the MCC last night and we had a guy on the other team quit but his quit took awhile and we were able to kill him four more times before he stopped respawning. Me and my friend thought what if in Halo 5 instead of quit bans just keep the person in the game for either the rest of the game or for a few minutes to get killed but not hurting the score for the team he was playing for just the guys own personal stats. His spartan just respawns and stands still and however many times he dies goes against his personal stats not the actual game he quit from.

Let me know what you think?

You are assuming most people care about their stats.

I’ve found that generally speaking the -Yoinks!- of MM don’t care about their stats, ranks, etc.

> 2535445935493284;2:
> You are assuming most people care about their stats.
>
> I’ve found that generally speaking the -Yoinks!- of MM don’t care about their stats, ranks, etc.

I agree and disagree, the reason I thought of this was because we started a game against a guy with a 3 KD and we wrecked him and his teammate to start the game and after he started 0 and 3 he quit to preserve his KD. I agree not everyone cares about their stats but people who quit to preserve them because it’s not a game they can go 20 and 2 may not quit as much. If the game is really one sided I understand quitting because that’s not fun for anyone.

I like the reputation system in the MCC. It will eventually pool habitual quitters into the same matches, meaning those who don’t quit a lot play with those who don’t quit a lot. It’s not a system that really punishes or rewards, it just pools you with like-minded people.

Edit: Avatar buddies!

> 2533274803493024;4:
> I like the reputation system in the MCC. It will eventually pool habitual quitters into the same matches, meaning those who don’t quit a lot play with those who don’t quit a lot. It’s not a system that really punishes or rewards, it just pools you with like-minded people.
>
> Edit: Avatar buddies!

Yeah I like that system as well.

Though having to deal with quitters on either team is always annoying, I don’t think a “punishment” is the answer. Mostly because with online gaming you can never be 100% sure if it was an actual quit-out or if the individual just lost their internet connection or something. I’ve lagged out of games before because of server issues and it would be very unfair to see my stats take a deliberate hit for something totally out of my control. As other people have said on similar threads, instead of punishing supposed quitters they would do better to reward players who routinely finish their games.

> 2533274920039666;6:
> Though having to deal with quitters on either team is always annoying, I don’t think a “punishment” is the answer. Mostly because with online gaming you can never be 100% sure if it was an actual quit-out or if the individual just lost their internet connection or something. I’ve lagged out of games before because of server issues and it would be very unfair to see my stats take a deliberate hit for something totally out of my control. As other people have said on similar threads, instead of punishing supposed quitters they would do better to reward players who routinely finish their games.

That’s a good point and I don’t know how you could reward players though, I think if they should just do ranked and unranked stats then the peoples manipulating their stats will be seen by everyone.

> 2743710844422774;3:
> > 2535445935493284;2:
> > You are assuming most people care about their stats.
> >
> > I’ve found that generally speaking the -Yoinks!- of MM don’t care about their stats, ranks, etc.
>
>
> I agree and disagree, the reason I thought of this was because we started a game against a guy with a 3 KD and we wrecked him and his teammate to start the game and after he started 0 and 3 he quit to preserve his KD. I agree not everyone cares about their stats but people who quit to preserve them because it’s not a game they can go 20 and 2 may not quit as much. If the game is really one sided I understand quitting because that’s not fun for anyone.

Eh, idk.

In general I feel as though positive reinforcements are always better than negative. Negative reinforcements only lead to negative feelings and more, reactive negative actions.

> 2535445935493284;8:
> > 2743710844422774;3:
> > > 2535445935493284;2:
> > > You are assuming most people care about their stats.
> > >
> > > I’ve found that generally speaking the -Yoinks!- of MM don’t care about their stats, ranks, etc.
> >
> >
> > I agree and disagree, the reason I thought of this was because we started a game against a guy with a 3 KD and we wrecked him and his teammate to start the game and after he started 0 and 3 he quit to preserve his KD. I agree not everyone cares about their stats but people who quit to preserve them because it’s not a game they can go 20 and 2 may not quit as much. If the game is really one sided I understand quitting because that’s not fun for anyone.
>
>
> Eh, idk.
>
> In general I feel as though positive reinforcements are always better than negative. Negative reinforcements only lead to negative feelings and more, reactive negative actions.

You’re probably right, I just don’t know how they reinforce finishing a game as opposed to punishing for quitting.

> 2533274920039666;6:
> Though having to deal with quitters on either team is always annoying, I don’t think a “punishment” is the answer. Mostly because with online gaming you can never be 100% sure if it was an actual quit-out or if the individual just lost their internet connection or something. I’ve lagged out of games before because of server issues and it would be very unfair to see my stats take a deliberate hit for something totally out of my control. As other people have said on similar threads, instead of punishing supposed quitters they would do better to reward players who routinely finish their games.

Right. One of those people would be me! Behavioral research shows (I was a behavioral therapist for a number or years… sorry :P) that while punishment changes behavior in the sort term, (ie. the next game) it doesn’t make lasting changes. as soon as the threat of that punishment is removed, the behavior returns. Rewarding good behavior, catching people being “good” rather than “bad”, has better outcomes as it pertains to lasting behavioral change.

That said, there is a place for punishment. While it doesn’t necessarily have a lasting effect, it can have a strong immediate effect. We are dealing with gamers for maybe a couple hours of their day here, not trying to deal with behavioral kids so a strong aspect of punishment would be appropriate as long as it is weighted appropriately with rewards for not quitting.

I had a long post about this during the beta, but here is a snapshot:

1) Punishment should be used for habitual quitters. Not one-off issues. Those who occasionally have a disconnect or irl issue need not worry! Their should be a warning, then immediate follow through on the next instance of quitting within a given time period. If you are AFK for more than 2 minutes, you will get booted from the game and that counts as a quit. For example, everybody gets one quit per hour “for free” no warning, nothing negative, no big deal. Upon the second instance of quitting within that hour, you are presented with a warning that stays on the screen for 10 seconds (that way you are forced to read it) and get put on probation. It would say something like:

> “You have quit for the second time within the past hour. You have been placed on probation for the next hour. If you quit another match within that hour, you will be banned from matchmaking for 15 minutes and lose significant rank points.”

if they don’t quit for the next hour, no harm no foul. They should be alerted when the probation is over. If they do quit again within the hour then they would be alerted with:

> “You have quit another match before your probation period is over. You have now been banned from matchmaking for 15 minutes and will be eligible to search again at [insert time here]. You have also lost an additional x-number of rank points. You will remain on probation for one hour after you start your next game. Remember: every instance of quitting increases your chances of matching up against other habitual quitters.”

If they quit again withing an hour, the last message basically repeats itself. But if they don’t quit for an hour after the next game starts, they will be removed from probation and the entire process resets. They will be alerted that they are off probation and rewarded back half of the additional rank points they lost before. We want to “catch them being good” remember.

2) Rewards should be given to those who start and complete consecutive games. This is important and as much weighting should be given to this as reasonably possible. Ideally this would be happening to players more frequently than the punishments would. Rewards could include things like XP bonuses, avatars, nameplates, armor permutations, achievements, invitations to community events, lotteries, playlist invites to beta test new playlists, early access to DLC, etc etc.

> 2743710844422774;9:
> > 2535445935493284;8:
> > > 2743710844422774;3:
> > > > 2535445935493284;2:
> > > > You are assuming most people care about their stats.
> > > >
> > > > I’ve found that generally speaking the -Yoinks!- of MM don’t care about their stats, ranks, etc.
> >
> >
> > Eh, idk.
> >
> > In general I feel as though positive reinforcements are always better than negative. Negative reinforcements only lead to negative feelings and more, reactive negative actions.
>
>
> You’re probably right, I just don’t know how they reinforce finishing a game as opposed to punishing for quitting.

They just cant get the quoting system here right…

anyway, see #2 of my post above ^^

> 2533274798578400;10:
> > 2533274920039666;6:
> > Though having to deal with quitters on either team is always annoying, I don’t think a “punishment” is the answer. Mostly because with online gaming you can never be 100% sure if it was an actual quit-out or if the individual just lost their internet connection or something. I’ve lagged out of games before because of server issues and it would be very unfair to see my stats take a deliberate hit for something totally out of my control. As other people have said on similar threads, instead of punishing supposed quitters they would do better to reward players who routinely finish their games.
>
>
> Right. One of those people would be me! Behavioral research shows (I was a behavioral therapist for a number or years… sorry :P) that while punishment changes behavior in the sort term, (ie. the next game) it doesn’t make lasting changes. as soon as the threat of that punishment is removed, the behavior returns. Rewarding good behavior, catching people being “good” rather than “bad”, has better outcomes as it pertains to lasting behavioral change.
>
> That said, there is a place for punishment. While it doesn’t necessarily have a lasting effect, it can have a strong immediate effect. We are dealing with gamers for maybe a couple hours of their day here, not trying to deal with behavioral kids so a strong aspect of punishment would be appropriate as long as it is weighted appropriately with rewards for not quitting.
>
> I had a long post about this during the beta, but here is a snapshot:
>
> 1) Punishment should be used for habitual quitters. Not one-off issues. Those who occasionally have a disconnect or irl issue need not worry! Their should be a warning, then immediate follow through on the next instance of quitting within a given time period. If you are AFK for more than 2 minutes, you will get booted from the game and that counts as a quit. For example, everybody gets one quit per hour “for free” no warning, nothing negative, no big deal. Upon the second instance of quitting within that hour, you are presented with a warning that stays on the screen for 10 seconds (that way you are forced to read it) and get put on probation. It would say something like:
>
>
> > “You have quit for the second time within the past hour. You have been placed on probation for the next hour. If you quit another match within that hour, you will be banned from matchmaking for 15 minutes and lose significant rank points.”
>
>
> if they don’t quit for the next hour, no harm no foul. They should be alerted when the probation is over. If they do quit again within the hour then they would be alerted with:
>
>
> > “You have quit another match before your probation period is over. You have now been banned from matchmaking for 15 minutes and will be eligible to search again at [insert time here]. You have also lost an additional x-number of rank points. You will remain on probation for one hour after you start your next game. Remember: every instance of quitting increases your chances of matching up against other habitual quitters.”
>
>
> If they quit again withing an hour, the last message basically repeats itself. But if they don’t quit for an hour after the next game starts, they will be removed from probation and the entire process resets. They will be alerted that they are off probation and rewarded back half of the additional rank points they lost before. We want to “catch them being good” remember.
>
> 2) Rewards should be given to those who start and complete consecutive games. This is important and as much weighting should be given to this as reasonably possible. Ideally this would be happening to players more frequently than the punishments would. Rewards could include things like XP bonuses, avatars, nameplates, armor permutations, achievements, invitations to community events, lotteries, playlist invites to beta test new playlists, early access to DLC, etc etc.

This is pretty well thought out and I think things like armor which I don’t really care about, but then again I don’t quit unless my whole team quit, would go a long way. This community seems to love having armor that other people don’t have, and early access to DLC would be cool as well. I just hope 343 takes the time to implement something like this.

> 2743710844422774;12:
> > 2533274798578400;10:
> > > 2533274920039666;6:
> > > Though having to deal with quitters on either team is always annoying, I don’t think a “punishment” is the answer. Mostly because with online gaming you can never be 100% sure if it was an actual quit-out or if the individual just lost their internet connection or something. I’ve lagged out of games before because of server issues and it would be very unfair to see my stats take a deliberate hit for something totally out of my control. As other people have said on similar threads, instead of punishing supposed quitters they would do better to reward players who routinely finish their games.
> >
> >
> > Right. One of those people would be me! Behavioral research shows (I was a behavioral therapist for a number or years… sorry :P) that while punishment changes behavior in the sort term, (ie. the next game) it doesn’t make lasting changes. as soon as the threat of that punishment is removed, the behavior returns. Rewarding good behavior, catching people being “good” rather than “bad”, has better outcomes as it pertains to lasting behavioral change.
> >
> > That said, there is a place for punishment. While it doesn’t necessarily have a lasting effect, it can have a strong immediate effect. We are dealing with gamers for maybe a couple hours of their day here, not trying to deal with behavioral kids so a strong aspect of punishment would be appropriate as long as it is weighted appropriately with rewards for not quitting.
> >
> > I had a long post about this during the beta, but here is a snapshot:
> >
> > 1) Punishment should be used for habitual quitters. Not one-off issues. Those who occasionally have a disconnect or irl issue need not worry! Their should be a warning, then immediate follow through on the next instance of quitting within a given time period. If you are AFK for more than 2 minutes, you will get booted from the game and that counts as a quit. For example, everybody gets one quit per hour “for free” no warning, nothing negative, no big deal. Upon the second instance of quitting within that hour, you are presented with a warning that stays on the screen for 10 seconds (that way you are forced to read it) and get put on probation. It would say something like:
> >
> >
> > > “You have quit for the second time within the past hour. You have been placed on probation for the next hour. If you quit another match within that hour, you will be banned from matchmaking for 15 minutes and lose significant rank points.”
> >
> >
> > if they don’t quit for the next hour, no harm no foul. They should be alerted when the probation is over. If they do quit again within the hour then they would be alerted with:
> >
> >
> > > “You have quit another match before your probation period is over. You have now been banned from matchmaking for 15 minutes and will be eligible to search again at [insert time here]. You have also lost an additional x-number of rank points. You will remain on probation for one hour after you start your next game. Remember: every instance of quitting increases your chances of matching up against other habitual quitters.”
> >
> >
> > If they quit again withing an hour, the last message basically repeats itself. But if they don’t quit for an hour after the next game starts, they will be removed from probation and the entire process resets. They will be alerted that they are off probation and rewarded back half of the additional rank points they lost before. We want to “catch them being good” remember.
> >
> > 2) Rewards should be given to those who start and complete consecutive games. This is important and as much weighting should be given to this as reasonably possible. Ideally this would be happening to players more frequently than the punishments would. Rewards could include things like XP bonuses, avatars, nameplates, armor permutations, achievements, invitations to community events, lotteries, playlist invites to beta test new playlists, early access to DLC, etc etc.
>
>
> This is pretty well thought out and I think things like armor which I don’t really care about, but then again I don’t quit unless my whole team quit, would go a long way. This community seems to love having armor that other people don’t have, and early access to DLC would be cool as well. I just hope 343 takes the time to implement something like this.

Right. That reminds me actually… an addendum to what I wrote above. If half the team has already quit, the second half to quit does not receive a penalty. Doesn’t seem fair to punish the people that got screwed by their team.

> 2533274798578400;13:
> > 2743710844422774;12:
> > > 2533274798578400;10:
> > > > 2533274920039666;6:
> > > > Though having to deal with quitters on either team is always annoying, I don’t think a “punishment” is the answer. Mostly because with online gaming you can never be 100% sure if it was an actual quit-out or if the individual just lost their internet connection or something. I’ve lagged out of games before because of server issues and it would be very unfair to see my stats take a deliberate hit for something totally out of my control. As other people have said on similar threads, instead of punishing supposed quitters they would do better to reward players who routinely finish their games.
> > >
> > >
> > > Right. One of those people would be me! Behavioral research shows (I was a behavioral therapist for a number or years… sorry :P) that while punishment changes behavior in the sort term, (ie. the next game) it doesn’t make lasting changes. as soon as the threat of that punishment is removed, the behavior returns. Rewarding good behavior, catching people being “good” rather than “bad”, has better outcomes as it pertains to lasting behavioral change.
> > >
> > > That said, there is a place for punishment. While it doesn’t necessarily have a lasting effect, it can have a strong immediate effect. We are dealing with gamers for maybe a couple hours of their day here, not trying to deal with behavioral kids so a strong aspect of punishment would be appropriate as long as it is weighted appropriately with rewards for not quitting.
> > >
> > > I had a long post about this during the beta, but here is a snapshot:
> > >
> > > 1) Punishment should be used for habitual quitters. Not one-off issues. Those who occasionally have a disconnect or irl issue need not worry! Their should be a warning, then immediate follow through on the next instance of quitting within a given time period. If you are AFK for more than 2 minutes, you will get booted from the game and that counts as a quit. For example, everybody gets one quit per hour “for free” no warning, nothing negative, no big deal. Upon the second instance of quitting within that hour, you are presented with a warning that stays on the screen for 10 seconds (that way you are forced to read it) and get put on probation. It would say something like:
> > >
> > >
> > > > “You have quit for the second time within the past hour. You have been placed on probation for the next hour. If you quit another match within that hour, you will be banned from matchmaking for 15 minutes and lose significant rank points.”
> > >
> > >
> > > if they don’t quit for the next hour, no harm no foul. They should be alerted when the probation is over. If they do quit again within the hour then they would be alerted with:
> > >
> > >
> > > > “You have quit another match before your probation period is over. You have now been banned from matchmaking for 15 minutes and will be eligible to search again at [insert time here]. You have also lost an additional x-number of rank points. You will remain on probation for one hour after you start your next game. Remember: every instance of quitting increases your chances of matching up against other habitual quitters.”
> > >
> > >
> > > If they quit again withing an hour, the last message basically repeats itself. But if they don’t quit for an hour after the next game starts, they will be removed from probation and the entire process resets. They will be alerted that they are off probation and rewarded back half of the additional rank points they lost before. We want to “catch them being good” remember.
> > >
> > > 2) Rewards should be given to those who start and complete consecutive games. This is important and as much weighting should be given to this as reasonably possible. Ideally this would be happening to players more frequently than the punishments would. Rewards could include things like XP bonuses, avatars, nameplates, armor permutations, achievements, invitations to community events, lotteries, playlist invites to beta test new playlists, early access to DLC, etc etc.
> >
> >
> > This is pretty well thought out and I think things like armor which I don’t really care about, but then again I don’t quit unless my whole team quit, would go a long way. This community seems to love having armor that other people don’t have, and early access to DLC would be cool as well. I just hope 343 takes the time to implement something like this.
>
>
> Right. That reminds me actually… an addendum to what I wrote above. If half the team has already quit, the second half to quit does not receive a penalty. Doesn’t seem fair to punish the people that got screwed by their team.

Yeah players shouldn’t be penalized if half their team quits for sure, that would be ridiculous to make a couple of players get rolled and waste their time and the full teams time.

well I’ve wondered if we should be given an option to forfeit. Sometimes your down a player or two, sometimes your just flat out getting spanked. I know the game “Hero’s Order and Chaos” will let your team forfeit if your whole team agrees to it

Should we be able to forfeit? It would still count against you as a loss but you don’t have to worry about your stats going down the toilet or wasting either teams time.

it shouldn’t even be an option to forfeit unless the other team are way ahead of you. Plus maybe it gives the other team a small bonus for beating you into submission.
idk I’m torn about it.

I’m a selfish individual, I care about my stats. I leave games when my team is getting completely obliterated, to save my stats.

IMO a great way to combat this would be increased search times for games, similar to what LoL does for quitters.

Either way, it’s not going to make me stop quitting during a match if my team is getting bent over.

This would be horrible. Instead of punishing just the player, you also punish his team. It’s a terrible idea.

> 2640503352964730;15:
> well I’ve wondered if we should be given an option to forfeit. Sometimes your down a player or two, sometimes your just flat out getting spanked. I know the game “Hero’s Order and Chaos” will let your team forfeit if your whole team agrees to it
>
> Should we be able to forfeit? It would still count against you as a loss but you don’t have to worry about your stats going down the toilet or wasting either teams time.
>
> it shouldn’t even be an option to forfeit unless the other team are way ahead of you. Plus maybe it gives the other team a small bonus for beating you into submission.
> idk I’m torn about it.

I actually really like that idea, down like 25 kills or 2 captures to zero or something, the entire team gives up and that way the game just ends, nothing worse than having the whole team quit except one player who is away from their controller and you have to sit there and try and kill him until the time runs out or the rounds end in an objective game.

> 2533274814063318;16:
> I’m a selfish individual, I care about my stats. I leave games when my team is getting completely obliterated, to save my stats.
>
> IMO a great way to combat this would be increased search times for games, similar to what LoL does for quitters.
>
> Either way, it’s not going to make me stop quitting during a match if my team is getting bent over.

That’s not a bad idea, a friend of mine told me that evolve makes anyone who quits wait one minute or something like that before they can start another game, it’s just annoying enough to keep people from quitting.

> 2533274892061674;17:
> This would be horrible. Instead of punishing just the player, you also punish his team. It’s a terrible idea.

No the kills don’t go for either team they just go against the player who quit, so if his guy is killed thirty times or one time it only goes against the player who quits personal stats not his team that is still playing the game.