Promethian vision is overpowered.

As it is, based on footage that I have seen, I find it highly overpowered. I dont mind it being implemented into the game, but I think a few things need to be changed first in order for it to be more balanced for matchmaking.

-The recharge time needs to be longer. Based on the footage I have seen, you could use it again after maybe 3 seconds of waiting to use it within close proximity. But if you wait 5 seconds, you get it all back and you can ping across the map and find everyone again. That is not long enough in my book. The recharge time needs to be longer. It gives a higher chance of abuse, and doesnt allow people to play sneaky/make a flank and try and disrupt the enemy teams set up.

-The distance that this AA can reach is to big. I don’t think it is balanced to be able to see some one who is literally, on the exact opposite end of the map. It takes away from the game in a negative way, and ruins strategy and tactics, as I said before. I think if it stretches was within a reasonable distance of the player using it (maybe the distance of their radar), that’s fine, but to be able to see 65-75% of the map with an AA is not balanced.

I think these small adjustments could really help the game out and allow for balanced game-play online, and in customs/lans/whatever. Otherwise, everyone could spam it, and I mean EVERYONE. If people think this wont get abused, you are kidding yourself because it will. Just look at the shotgun abuse in MW3. It is ridiculous some games, and takes away from a potentially fun game. It doesn’t take skill, and it is now considered a staple class for players to use, and abuse.

A lot of people have also been saying that if you are skilled, you can just use radar and you wont need the Promethian Vision, which is really false. Not using it wont make you better, it will only put you at a disadvantage, which will cause you to die more, and thus cause you to dislike the game, thus you rage, and call the game “stupid”. This isnt hard to see I hope. I know that we have to wait and see what they do with it, but I dont care about what the game will be like in November, I care about what they have shown us now. And I hope the message is clear that based on what we have already seen, there needs to be small adjustments made for the best game-play possible.

I completely agree with all you just said.

I agree that you shouldn’t be able to see the complete opposite side of the map but thats about it.

ProVision isn’t overpowered for most players, it’s the skill of the player which allows them to get kills. However in the hands of a skilled player it is overpowered; the ability to locate enemies quickly and see what weapons they have is extremely useful information if interpreted correctly.

Unfortunately we cannot judge the game fully until it has been released but it wouldn’t surprise me if ProVision gets nurfed in the first update for Halo 4.

nope. PV is balanced. it seems good because MLG was new to halo 4. didn’t know the maps or how they would flow. it was stated by 343 before that PV would help people who arn’t situationally aware. and thats what MLG footage so far is. the recharge speed is slower already. it was sped up because they were using AA effiency wich lets AA’s recharge faster. and the range is at most only half of the map. and thats on those 2 small maps they played. on bigger maps it will help even less.

> I completely agree with all you just said.

Same.

> ProVision isn’t overpowered for most players, it’s the skill of the player which allows them to get kills. However in the hands of a skilled player it is overpowered; the ability to locate enemies quickly and see what weapons they have is extremely useful information if interpreted correctly.
>
> Unfortunately we cannot judge the game fully until it has been released but it wouldn’t surprise me if ProVision gets nurfed in the first update for Halo 4.

This is what I said in my op:

“I know that we have to wait and see what they do with it, but I dont care about what the game will be like in November, I care about what they have shown us now. And I hope the message is clear that based on what we have already seen, there needs to be small adjustments made for the best game-play possible.”

I totally disagree with you in saying that we cant judge the game until it is released. Sure we can. 343 released gameplay and showed off h4 at E3, I have every right to pick it apart and say what should be fixed and adjusted. Based on what I have seen so far, things need to be adjusted. If they fix it, awesome, they are only making the game better. But that is determined by IF they fix the bugs that are in the game.

I do feel that it should take at least take a much longer time for the pulse to sweep out. You can see the other side of the map in about a second, which doesn’t seem to make sense to me.

It just seems like something abusable.

I like the concept though.

> > ProVision isn’t overpowered for most players, it’s the skill of the player which allows them to get kills. However in the hands of a skilled player it is overpowered; the ability to locate enemies quickly and see what weapons they have is extremely useful information if interpreted correctly.
> >
> > Unfortunately we cannot judge the game <mark>fully</mark> until it has been released but it wouldn’t surprise me if ProVision gets nurfed in the first update for Halo 4.
>
> This is what I said in my op:
>
> “I know that we have to wait and see what they do with it, but I dont care about what the game will be like in November, I care about what they have shown us now. And I hope the message is clear that based on what we have already seen, there needs to be small adjustments made for the best game-play possible.”
>
> I totally disagree with you in saying that we cant judge the game until it is released. Sure we can. 343 released gameplay and showed off h4 at E3, I have every right to pick it apart and say what should be fixed and adjusted. Based on what I have seen so far, things need to be adjusted. If they fix it, awesome, they are only making the game better. But that is determined by IF they fix the bugs that are in the game.

There, I’ve highlighted something important. I do believe we can judge a game partly but not objectively aka. This will be this. And as for the OP reference in that case I do agree with you.

I’m fine with how it is, but if it was just a single pulse thing like a radar or whatever, I’d be fine too. Something that just goes bleep, sends out a pulse, and outlines everyone within range for a brief moment after the pulse.

Nearly every loadout in the MLG gameplay has the perk which shortens the recharge of AAs in it.

So we don’t know how long the cooldown really is.

According to that 343i guy there might be a perk which makes you invisible from PV.

How about just remove it from MM? Inb4 I get trolled how I must be joking because it’s meant to be part of the new “experience”. What, you mean where things like Map control are utterly -Yoink!- even more than Reach? And don’t even say that the Motion sensor is the same as it, because there is a huge difference between being able to see the exact position of the player, even when they’re crouching, to being able to see little red dots on a motion sensor. There is a huge difference between the two, don’t even compare them.

Edit: Not the mention the fact that you can find players much easier, and (I was going to originally write this but didn’t) you are capable of seeing what they’re using, and the ability pretty much breaks things like flanking as well as map control.

To be honest, it’s quite funny really, because casual players are going to get utterly dominated, is that what they really want? Obviously, it seems more of the casual players want it in. I’m definitely going to abuse it, and I’m going to kill noobs even easier. It doesn’t make sense that they think us “more skilled players” wont use it, because we will use it, and abuse it because they refuse to remove it/nerf it.

> How about just remove it from MM? Inb4 I get trolled how I must be joking because it’s meant to be part of the new “experience”. What, you mean where things like Map control are utterly -Yoink!- even more than Reach? And don’t even say that the Motion sensor is the same as it, <mark>because there is a huge difference between being able to see the exact position of the player</mark>, even when they’re crouching, to being able to see little red dots on a motion sensor. There is a huge difference between the two, don’t even compare them.

That’s not what makes ProVision good, it’s being able to see what weapon the enemy has and being able find players quickly which makes it overpowered.

> > How about just remove it from MM? Inb4 I get trolled how I must be joking because it’s meant to be part of the new “experience”. What, you mean where things like Map control are utterly -Yoink!- even more than Reach? And don’t even say that the Motion sensor is the same as it, <mark>because there is a huge difference between being able to see the exact position of the player</mark>, even when they’re crouching, to being able to see little red dots on a motion sensor. There is a huge difference between the two, don’t even compare them.
>
> That’s not what makes ProVision good, it’s being able to see what weapon the enemy has and being able find players quickly which makes it overpowered.

Exactly, further adding to what I said as to why it should be removed.

> > > How about just remove it from MM? Inb4 I get trolled how I must be joking because it’s meant to be part of the new “experience”. What, you mean where things like Map control are utterly -Yoink!- even more than Reach? And don’t even say that the Motion sensor is the same as it, <mark>because there is a huge difference between being able to see the exact position of the player</mark>, even when they’re crouching, to being able to see little red dots on a motion sensor. There is a huge difference between the two, don’t even compare them.
> >
> > That’s not what makes ProVision good, it’s being able to see what weapon the enemy has and being able find players quickly which makes it overpowered.
>
> Exactly, further adding to what I said as to why it should be removed.

Removed or Nerfed(- heavily in some aspects)

> > > > How about just remove it from MM? Inb4 I get trolled how I must be joking because it’s meant to be part of the new “experience”. What, you mean where things like Map control are utterly -Yoink!- even more than Reach? And don’t even say that the Motion sensor is the same as it, <mark>because there is a huge difference between being able to see the exact position of the player</mark>, even when they’re crouching, to being able to see little red dots on a motion sensor. There is a huge difference between the two, don’t even compare them.
> > >
> > > That’s not what makes ProVision good, it’s being able to see what weapon the enemy has and being able find players quickly which makes it overpowered.
> >
> > Exactly, further adding to what I said as to why it should be removed.
>
> Removed or Nerfed(- heavily in some aspects)

I sincerely hope it’s removed, while it looks like a fun thing to use, but it will totally mess up competitive play.

Not wanting to argue but there’s a chance it was put on a faster cooldown to make the game more fast paced, after all it was a demo and it was MLG. I understand that at the same time all of us are watching to get an idea and editing gameplay isn’t going to help. But we saw how much 343 could change everything when Reach was handed over, ProVision could be severely cut back, just becasue of the unfamiliarity it was given a wider range so players had a better view of the map.

Just remove it.

> ProVision isn’t overpowered for most players, <mark>it’s the skill of the player</mark> which allows them to get kills. However in the hands of a skilled player it is overpowered; the ability to locate enemies quickly and see what weapons they have is extremely useful information if interpreted correctly.
>
> Unfortunately we cannot judge the game fully until it has been released but it wouldn’t surprise me if ProVision gets nurfed in the first update for Halo 4.

that

And posts like these are how games become nerfed.This is what happened to grenades in the reach beta. It was oh wah wah the grenades are to strong i should be able to stand 3 feet away and survive after being shot. And then bungie nerfed grenades to almost a halo 3 level.

Anyone who knows the maps and knows how to use radar does not need to use it. Its not too strong it is a good tool. It would be good to use against crouchers and also for noobs to see where things are going on.