I have to say the Pro League does not inspire many AMs to actually compete to become pro. The chances of a team to have to be first or second in the Open Circuit is near impossible, considering how many competitors there are and even then, you have to play top 7th or 8th pro team and beat them. It’s really not fair and this seems to be in place because: A: there isn’t enough money since Worlds to support top 16; or B: they want to protect the top 8 pro teams and their sponsors because they are virtually the same top 8 teams from last season. Even being top 8, unless you are top 4, you get no money.
FYI: I’m not complaining on my own behalf, but I have a brother who is 7th on the open circuit this week. It would be really nice if there was still a top 16, even if the money was not great, but these AMs would still have a chance.
Please feel free to give your thoughts and even rationalizations for the OP.
so you want there to be money for each member of each team in the top 8 every week they have an open tourney? would you also support the pro league winners each week receiving money as well? that is a lot of monetary gifts to give out. theres like what? 8 weeks of open circuit, so thats 256 individual monetary gifts for the open circuit alone, more if you include pro league winners. your brother would receive like twenty bucks.
in his favor though, Optic and EG are gonna need some new players soon looks like. cuz man, those teams are not working out.
Top 1st gets $750; Top 2nd gets $250 in Open Circuit, but they aren’t labeled pro, unless they survive the end of the cups and beat top 7th and 8th pro team. There is no way they are going to beat a top 7th and 8th pro team and get that status. Most of these kids dont do it for the money in AM. Simply the recognition is what they want. I get your point that even top 8th in open circuit is good recognition, -but the chances of being picked up are still difficult considering nothing is going to change about pro-league, even in the fall.
And I might add that the top 1st and 2nd team on the Open Circuit at the end of the qualifying season get the $750 and $250 respectively. That means everyone doesnt get money, and only top 1 and 2 get money at the end of the cups. Why not take all of that money $1,000 and tier it out to the top 8 in Open Circuit and add them to pro status.
if the top 2 in open circuit get that money every cup, then I am mistaken. That was my assumption from looking at the standings on ESL, but please correct me if I am wrong.
What I am saying is that any monies that are given to top 2 in open circuit every week or at the end of the cup qualifiers (whichever is the case) should be split with the top 8 in open circuit, considering top 8 in Open Circuit is virtually the same thing as top 16 last season.
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> Why not take all of that money $1,000 and tier it out to the top 8 in Open Circuit and add them to pro status.
If we want to look at this literally, someone who is classified as a “pro” actually makes their living based upon what they do. If a player’s Halo-related income (including sponsorship, prize money, Twitch subscriptions, etc.) is enough to support themselves, they can safely be labeled as a professional. Otherwise, it is really just an honorary nickname.
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> > 2535434943334724;6:
> > Why not take all of that money $1,000 and tier it out to the top 8 in Open Circuit and add them to pro status.
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> If we want to look at this literally, someone who is classified as a “pro” actually makes their living based upon what they do. If a player’s Halo-related income (including sponsorship, prize money, Twitch subscriptions, etc.) is enough to support themselves, they can safely be labeled as a professional. Otherwise, it is really just an honorary nickname.
That isn’t exactly a fair statement considering there were plenty of pro teams that made money from 9th-16th, were considered “pro” and streamed, but streaming doesnt guarantee any money, especially if you are not partnered with Twitch. And i might add that even if you are partnered, doesnt earn that much unless you are a top streamer. In any other profession, i totally agree, bUt this is more of a hobby unless you are top 8 pro, have an organization, and are a really popular streamer. Several “pros” have had to have side jobs - even Lunchbox, who is a journyman electrician apprentice.
Also, money from streaming can involve more factors that just your pro-status. There are plenty of streamers who are a far cry from being considered good at games and can make many times over the money pros generate (from all gaming mediums) just from streaming. I am talking about the very entertaining, but frankly unskilled players. That isnt a knock on these entertainers, but it’s a fact.
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> That isn’t exactly a fair statement…
It wasn’t intended to be unfair, my friend… merely logical.
If some people (including your brother) think that being labeled as a “Halo pro” is a desirable status symbol, there is certainly nothing wrong with that. However, we can’t really deny the default definition of a professional simply because our aspirations tell us that it isn’t fair.
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> > 2535434943334724;8:
> > That isn’t exactly a fair statement…
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> It wasn’t intended to be unfair, my friend… merely logical.
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> If some people (including your brother) think that being labeled as a “Halo pro” is a desirable status symbol, there is certainly nothing wrong with that. However, we can’t really deny the default definition of a professional simply because our aspirations tell us that it isn’t fair.
I mean’t it wasn’t a fair statement considering all of the conditions of “making a living” in halo that supposedly make you a professional. The streamer “Activeee” makes a living from streaming halo 5 and he is by no means pro or close to it. He is very just entertaining.
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> I mean’t it wasn’t a fair statement considering all of the conditions of “making a living” in halo that supposedly make you a professional. The streamer “Activeee” makes a living from streaming halo 5 and he is by no means pro or close to it. He is very just entertaining.
If you want to differentiate between someone who is a professional Twitch streamer (like your example above) versus someone who is a professional Halo 5 competitor, there is nothing wrong with that. But at the end of the day, the definition of a professional isn’t really subjective.
If there was an AM league, who would be interested in joining? Also there actually might be people who are really good participating in the AM league. And then squashing the competition. So there might be a strict guideline in my view-point.
just because someone makes some money from a tournament doesn’t give them pro status. your brothers team getting $250 at the end of the cup doesn’t mean all of a sudden he is a pro halo player. also, again, that $1000 dollars that is being awarded means almost nothing if dished out to 8 teams. again, a team getting some winnings from Open Cup or from pro league doesn’t make them a pro.
the poster above is right, what makes someone a professional Halo player is that Halo is their job and what they use to support themselves. Of course this is easier when you are on a team like OG, CLG, EG where you may be paid to actually be on the team as well as receive sponsorships etc.
Also, if you have been watching pro league and scrims you would know that its entirely possible that an Open Cup team may beat a bottom tier pro league team. it has happened in scrims this week already. At least one of the pro league teams probably shouldn’t be there.
I do have to point out though, that the result would LIKELY be the same or very similar if the current setup was abolished and the pro league teams were thrown into the mix with the Open cup each week to battle it out, with the top 10 teams from the whole thing getting winnings. The 8 teams that are in the pro league now would probably be the top 8, with maybe 3-4 teams that will be at the top of the open cup taking those last two spots.
professional connotates skill man. I could make a living off of mcdonalds and still not be a professional. Making a living in halo is somewhat subjective if you consider streaming and that not every halo pro has been part of an organization. All i am saying is top 16 has always been considered pro in halo, regardless if the top 9-16 actually made a living. Back when halo 1 first came out you could be pro and there was not that much money involved in comparison to today. I am really speaking to the skill set that the top 16 teams have in this game. That should be recognized like it did last season, regardless if they have enough money to pay them like last season.
so its just being able to say they are in the “Pro League” instead of the “Open Cup” that you are arguing for?
I think thats justified. I do think that the matches are probably a little more interesting each week with this setup, but it doesn’t allow for as much underdog story. I could also see the argument of Halo still being on the comeback and this being a trial run. Halo 5 just isn’t as big as Halo 1-3 were. The competitive community isn’t as big of a pool to draw from.
But i can see your brother’s frustration. His team is obviously very skilled to be in the top 8 of the Open Cup. No doubt about it they are putting in work and playing well. Id love to be recognized if that was the case for myself as well. Hopefully Halo will continue to grow to the point where larger Pro Leagues seem viable to 343/Microsoft!
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> so its just being able to say they are in the “Pro League” instead of the “Open Cup” that you are arguing for?
>
> I think thats justified. I do think that the matches are probably a little more interesting each week with this setup, but it doesn’t allow for as much underdog story. I could also see the argument of Halo still being on the comeback and this being a trial run. Halo 5 just isn’t as big as Halo 1-3 were. The competitive community isn’t as big of a pool to draw from.
>
> But i can see your brother’s frustration. His team is obviously very skilled to be in the top 8 of the Open Cup. No doubt about it they are putting in work and playing well. Id love to be recognized if that was the case for myself as well. Hopefully Halo will continue to grow to the point where larger Pro Leagues seem viable to 343/Microsoft!
That is exactly what I am stressing. At the end of the day, my brother’s team could be top 3rd in points from the Open Circuit, but they won’t have any chance to compete for pro status. Not saying they deserve that right to challenge the pro-league, but it is not a very motivating for AMs when they arent “breaking” into pro-status. At the end of the season you either earned it or you didnt, but i dont understand the justification for there only being 8 teams instead of 16 in pro league? Im guessing they blew most of their funds on Worlds and cant pay the top 16 teams “a livable income”?
And i think they took away a lot of entertainment in pro-league and shifted it to the Open Circuit. It’s far more entertaining to watch the top 8 teams in open circuit battle for first and second every Sunday, over watching the pros in pro-league keeping their status, regardless of how they play (only caveat being the top 7th and 8th pro team has to fight for their spot at the end of the circuit cups).
I would much rather see the top 7th and 8th pro league status team have to fight the top 1 and 2 open circuit team every week. That would be more motivating to watch
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> > 2535468547991460;15:
> > so its just being able to say they are in the “Pro League” instead of the “Open Cup” that you are arguing for?
> >
> > I think thats justified. I do think that the matches are probably a little more interesting each week with this setup, but it doesn’t allow for as much underdog story. I could also see the argument of Halo still being on the comeback and this being a trial run. Halo 5 just isn’t as big as Halo 1-3 were. The competitive community isn’t as big of a pool to draw from.
> >
> > But i can see your brother’s frustration. His team is obviously very skilled to be in the top 8 of the Open Cup. No doubt about it they are putting in work and playing well. Id love to be recognized if that was the case for myself as well. Hopefully Halo will continue to grow to the point where larger Pro Leagues seem viable to 343/Microsoft!
>
>
> That is exactly what I am stressing. At the end of the day, my brother’s team could be top 3rd in points from the Open Circuit, but they won’t have any chance to compete for pro status. Not saying they deserve that right to challenge the pro-league, but it is not a very motivating for AMs when they arent “breaking” into pro-status. At the end of the season you either earned it or you didnt, but i dont understand the justification for there only being 8 teams instead of 16 in pro league? Im guessing they blew most of their funds on Worlds and cant pay the top 16 teams “a livable income”?
well i don’t think that the pros in pro league actually get paid anything by 343 or microsoft to be in pro league. i may be wrong there but I’m pretty sure. they may have a small contract from their team (CLG, EG, etc) but that isn’t a livable income either. most of them that make a living from Halo do it through twitch. but i also think most of the players on the teams in pro leagues are either students or have other jobs as well.
i definitely agree I love watching the open circuit streams. does your brother stream their matches? whats his team/gamertag?