It seems like the best way to stay excited for Halo 4 is to not visit the forums. I’m surprised so many here are railing on 5sk BR and armor abilities that, to my knowledge, haven’t been demonstrated yet.
What’s up with that? I mean, I’m concerned about 5sk but I don’t seem to be sweating bullets over it. I’m interested to see how armor abilities will affect this game, but I’m not condemning it.
Those of us “railing on the 5sk BR” are providing overwhelming evidence showing how it’s detrimental. Also, it HAS been demonstrated by MLG players.
The Armor Abilities are an extension of what was done in Reach. Most AAs in Reach were poorly implemented and did nothing to improve the overall gameplay. The demonstration of PromVision during E3 painted a picture that AAs in H4 are going down the same line. Rather than augmenting gameplay, they become gameplay with actual gunplay taking a backseat.
> Those of us “railing on the 5sk BR” are providing overwhelming evidence showing how it’s detrimental.
To what? A certain playing style?
> Also, it HAS been demonstrated by MLG players.
I find it interesting that so many use this appeal to authority fallacy.
> The Armor Abilities are an extension of what was done in Reach.
Sans armor lock and who knows what else.
> Most AAs in Reach were poorly implemented and did nothing to improve the overall gameplay. The demonstration of PromVision during E3 painted a picture that AAs in H4 are going down the same line.
is baffled by some name I haven’t heard of
> Rather than augmenting gameplay, they become gameplay with actual gunplay taking a backseat.
Yes, they are strategic and not tactical. One has to consider the map in order to pick an appropriate AA. I don’t know what Swordbase is usually voted for in Reach, but that usually means I’m going with the jetpack. If it’s a tight quarters map like Countdown I’m usually about the hologram. When it’s a horizontal friendly map like Powerhouse I’m confident with sprint. After that I’m picking AA’s to adapt to enemy play styles. I’m just confused as to why that gameplay is considered bunk.
> Those of us “railing on the 5sk BR” are providing overwhelming evidence showing how it’s detrimental. Also, it HAS been demonstrated by MLG players.
>
> The Armor Abilities are an extension of what was done in Reach. Most AAs in Reach were poorly implemented and did nothing to improve the overall gameplay. The demonstration of PromVision during E3 painted a picture that AAs in H4 are going down the same line. Rather than augmenting gameplay, they become gameplay with actual gunplay taking a backseat.
Id like you to show us a link where an mlg player is complaining about the BR.
Eh, most people complaining don’t really think about it. They here “armor mods are somewhat similar to perks”, and get enraged that the word “perk” was in there. There’s also those purists who want everything to be the exact same except with a new gun or two, and get infuriated when it seems like the developers are changing “their” franchise. THEN they try to think up an excuse to be angry at it, when really it’s just fanboy rage.
Sure, there are some people with a couple valid arguments, but the vast majority should be ignored.
It doesn’t matter if it’s been demonstrated by MLG players because, guess what… you’re not as good as them and will not play at as high of a level as them. The way they use it is not the way you willl us it and vice versa.
> It doesn’t matter if it’s been demonstrated by MLG players because, guess what… you’re not as good as them and will not play at as high of a level as them. The way they use it is not the way you willl us it and vice versa.
I also feel this is a valid point. Most people do not play at the level of MLG players. I understood the argument with bloom in that any equally matched pair of players was robbed of having their marksmanship measured against each other, but in the area of Halo 3 styled weapons I just did not see that as the case.
> > Those of us “railing on the 5sk BR” are providing overwhelming evidence showing how it’s detrimental.
>
> To what? A certain playing style?
To the sandbox balance and teamwork.
> > Also, it HAS been demonstrated by MLG players.
>
> I find it interesting that so many use this appeal to authority fallacy.
Reading comprehension is a wonderful thing. No appeal to authority. 5sk with the BR has been demonstrated by MLG players at E3.
@DigitalArtard on this one, I never said MLG players complained about the BR. Therefore no link.
> > The Armor Abilities are an extension of what was done in Reach.
>
> Sans armor lock and who knows what else.
Did I say they were bringing back everything exactly as it was? No, so I’m not entirely certain what point it is you’re trying to make.
> Most AAs in Reach were poorly implemented and did nothing to improve the overall gameplay. The demonstration of PromVision during E3 painted a picture that AAs in H4 are going down the same line.
> is baffled by some name I haven’t heard of
Oh my goodness. I’m someone with an opinion and with a train of thought behind those opinions. Shock. Awe. I must be famous!
> Rather than augmenting gameplay, they become gameplay with actual gunplay taking a backseat.
> Yes, they are strategic and not tactical. One has to consider the map in order to pick an appropriate AA. I don’t know what Swordbase is usually voted for in Reach, but that usually means I’m going with the jetpack. If it’s a tight quarters map like Countdown I’m usually about the hologram. When it’s a horizontal friendly map like Powerhouse I’m confident with sprint. After that I’m picking AA’s to adapt to enemy play styles. I’m just confused as to why that gameplay is considered bunk.
Sigh.
You’re acting as if I’m the ignorant lout spouting things “because I say them and therefore I’m right.”
AAs can be strategic and tactical. The problem isn’t that they’re useful, the problem is that they alter Halo gameplay at such a fundamental level. Just consider Sanctuary/Asylum. In Halo 2, holding ring 2 was the best tactical position. In Reach, this is thrown out the window with the addition of Jetpack and the ability to fly over the top of the stronghold.
Now, one can argue whether or not that’s beneficial, but there’s no arguing that it fundamentally changes the way the game is played.
The game’s evolving. That is what games do. It is really not a big deal. Halo 3 was different from Halo 2 which was radically different from Halo:CE.
> > Those of us “railing on the 5sk BR” are providing overwhelming evidence showing how it’s detrimental.
>
> To what? A certain playing style?
>
>
>
>
> > Also, it HAS been demonstrated by MLG players.
>
> I find it interesting that so many use this appeal to authority fallacy.
>
>
>
> > The Armor Abilities are an extension of what was done in Reach.
>
> Sans armor lock and who knows what else.
>
>
>
> > Most AAs in Reach were poorly implemented and did nothing to improve the overall gameplay. The demonstration of PromVision during E3 painted a picture that AAs in H4 are going down the same line.
>
> is baffled by some name I haven’t heard of
>
>
>
> > Rather than augmenting gameplay, they become gameplay with actual gunplay taking a backseat.
>
> Yes, they are strategic and not tactical. One has to consider the map in order to pick an appropriate AA. I don’t know what Swordbase is usually voted for in Reach, but that usually means I’m going with the jetpack. If it’s a tight quarters map like Countdown I’m usually about the hologram. When it’s a horizontal friendly map like Powerhouse I’m confident with sprint. After that I’m picking AA’s to adapt to enemy play styles. I’m just confused as to why that gameplay is considered bunk.
1: to a more skillful playing style. Map positioning is an important skill, and the longer kill times are, the more the skill is diminished.
2: Well thats awful dumb of you to say. It has nothing to do with authority, you said its never been demonstrated, and he told you who demonstrated. Did you not read your own OP?
3: and finnaly, none of the AAs in reach made it more skillfor or strategic. They simply offered easy ways to make up for lack in skill. Read Halo - Official Site (en)
I’ll just be playing the classic playlists, if the new ones are good then I’ll be playing both. If the BR is worse than the DMR, I’ll use the DMR. No big deal.
Halo 4 5shot br is a horrible way to “speed up” game-play. 343 complained that the spawn system in previous halo games did not speed up game-play but yet they ive the br a 5 shot kill rate which in fact slows game-play down for those who use this particular medium ranged weapon.
This is a beta so I am hoping that the br’s damage is subjected to change in favor of the traditional halo games. Also the armor abilities are still a annoying factor in a game since not only do you have a built in one but now you can have another one in place of sprint.
Gha… Dizzying mis-use of the quote tag is making some replies unreadable. However, the brief I got was that AA’s did not augment skill, merely made up for some sort of lack of skill (I can see this argument from the armor lock component for losing a gun fight and then screaming for help, as well as the Jet pack for being used to bypass map choke points).
When it comes to the 5sk vs a 3 or 4sk, shouldn’t it be more important to consider the time it takes to get the kill? Shouldn’t an engagement with the utility weapon only be measured in time and not the number of shots? I know from the game play that has been shown so for, it seems like it can be potentially very fast (Well, Halo 3 fast but not 2 and certainly not CE).
> Gha… Dizzying mis-use of the quote tag is making some replies unreadable. However, the brief I got was that AA’s did not augment skill, merely made up for some sort of lack of skill (I can see this argument from the armor lock component for losing a gun fight and then screaming for help, as well as the Jet pack for being used to bypass map choke points).
>
> When it comes to the 5sk vs a 3 or 4sk, shouldn’t it be more important to consider the time it takes to get the kill? Shouldn’t an engagement with the utility weapon only be measured in time and not the number of shots? I know from the game play that has been shown so for, it seems like it can be potentially very fast (Well, Halo 3 fast but not 2 and certainly not CE).
Sorry about the quotes, idk why they mess up…
It applies to all AAs, except maybe hologram since that things borderline useless.
Thirdly, CE had the best utility weapon system by far. A 0.6 kill time if you were good enough, but most pros couldnt even get a 9sk. Basically infinite skill gap and quick kill times.
> Gha… Dizzying mis-use of the quote tag is making some replies unreadable. However, the brief I got was that AA’s did not augment skill, merely made up for some sort of lack of skill (I can see this argument from the armor lock component for losing a gun fight and then screaming for help, as well as the Jet pack for being used to bypass map choke points).
>
> When it comes to the 5sk vs a 3 or 4sk, shouldn’t it be more important to consider the time it takes to get the kill? Shouldn’t an engagement with the utility weapon only be measured in time and not the number of shots? I know from the game play that has been shown so for, it seems like it can be potentially very fast (Well, Halo 3 fast but not 2 and certainly not CE).
I’m assuming you’re talking about someone making points out of my original post, and my response. I’m accustomed to HTML tags, but this forum seems to do strange things. I apologize for the strangeness.
Anyway, timing is undoubtedly important. However, to show evidence of how quantity of shots affects gameplay, check this out:
> 5 shot kill doesn’t reward teamshooting properly while a 4 shot kill does.
>
> Evidence:
>
> 5 shot kill
>
> 1 player - 5 shots
> 2 players - 3 shots
> 3 players - 2 shots
> 4 players - 2 shots
>
> 4 shot kill
>
> 1 player - 4 shots
> 2 players - 2 shots
> 3 players - 2 shots
> 4 players -1 shot
>
> With a 4 shot kill, the two-man teamshot, the most widely used on in the game, and the four-man teamshot, the most difficult teamshot to execute, are rewarded much more.
>
> While a five shot kill rewards a two-man teamshot a little (not as much as 4 shot kill), and a four-man teamshot not at all. 5 shot kill three-man teamshot is the only one that it does better than the four man teamshot.
> Yes, they are strategic and not tactical. One has to consider the map in order to pick an appropriate AA. I don’t know what Swordbase is usually voted for in Reach, but that usually means I’m going with the jetpack. If it’s a tight quarters map like Countdown I’m usually about the hologram. When it’s a horizontal friendly map like Powerhouse I’m confident with sprint. After that I’m picking AA’s to adapt to enemy play styles. I’m just confused as to why that gameplay is considered bunk.
I lol’d when I heard you talk about using the Hologram in a serious way.
> Anyway, timing is undoubtedly important. However, to show evidence of how quantity of shots affects gameplay, check this out:
>
>
>
> > 5 shot kill doesn’t reward teamshooting properly while a 4 shot kill does.
> >
> > Evidence:
> >
> > …
> >
> > With a 4 shot kill, the two-man teamshot, the most widely used on in the game, and the four-man teamshot, the most difficult teamshot to execute, are rewarded much more.
> >
> > While a five shot kill rewards a two-man teamshot a little (not as much as 4 shot kill), and a four-man teamshot not at all. 5 shot kill three-man teamshot is the only one that it does better than the four man teamshot.
I understand where you’re comming from, and I agree with your quote that a 4 shot BR is more teamplay rewarding, bit I don’t think that’s the same thing as teamplay promoting.
When you need 5 shots to kill an enemy it’s even more important that you have a teammate or 3 near you so that you can coordinate the shots and kill the enemy within the same time as it would take for the 4 shot BR to kill the same target.
I also think that a 5 shot BR can widen the skillgap too since you need more shots to be placed perfectly and therefore require better aim to get the perfect kill.
I’m basing my statement on the thought that the 4 shot- and 5 shot BR have about the same minimum kill time. If the kill time for the 5 shot BR is significant longer to the 4 shot BR I might consider to rethink my statement. Please enlight me if you know a comparison between the two.
Edit; Read where your quote came from so I guess I have to reconsider the whole thing. 
> It seems like the best way to stay excited for Halo 4 is to not visit the forums.quote]
>
> I’ve been avoiding this fourm, but I stopped by and it is excatly the same as it has been since E3. Nothing but a whole bunch of “I could do better”, “343i doesn’t know what they’re doin”, “This game is going to suck”. I’m gonna get hyped up for Halo 4 somewhere else!!!
>
> PEACE!!
>
> P.S. Don’t even try to hate on me, cuz I’m not even checking back!
>
>
> P.P.S. Something went wrong with the quote, but oh well!!
MLG should shut the F up!
they’ll be able to modify damage and movement like they could earlier, and therefore make it a 1 shot if the want.
MLG is a small community. not a divine authority…
MLlawls