Drop pods or ordnance drops in MP will they be fare and BALANCED
Example
Halo 3 on the pit
( ordnance drop is ROCKETS )
The score is 49 - 49 will they drop in a BALANCED AREA or will they drop in Red side or blue side
Because this if not EVEN OR IN A neutral spot COULD BE Terrible
Just my 2 cents
The ordinance drops seemed to drop almost right next to the player who ordered it.
although I don’t boast much Halo 3 knowledge I would imagine on a map like the pit where rocket is essential, it wouldn’t be on your ordnance list and instead spawn on map as usual. However your ordnance would probably have something like shotguns or sticky detonator that spawns close to you. I like to think the power weapons will be sort of tiered with top tier power weapons as a pickup exclusive while lower tiered power weapons can be called in
I think its just Infinity game-types only as far as personal ordinance drops are concerned.
Not sure what the power weapon system will be like outside of Infinity game-types, if its going to be the traditional one with static timers and locations or if its going to be a mix in “Regular” H4 modes for example. I hope they clarify this soon.
Sorry for the mix up
NOT TALKING ABOUT PERSONAL ORDNANCE DROPS
> The ordinance drops seemed to drop almost right next to the player who ordered it.
He means the one’s that control power weapons like the Rockets, not the personal one’s that are (as far as we know) exclusive to Infinity Slayer.
The only references I have to this is:
Given those two things, I’ll take a guess rockets will be available on some maps, but not them all.
> I think its just Infinity game-types only as far as personal ordinance drops are concerned.
>
> Not sure what the power weapon system will be like outside of Infinity game-types, if its going to be the traditional one with static timers and locations or if its going to be a mix in “Regular” H4 modes for example. I hope they clarify this soon.
As far as I have understood, the power weapons will come as ordnance drops somewhere around the maps and the locations will vary. Could be a bad thing for competition if players don’t get to know about the weapon before it drops. I also don’t see much possibilities for it on symmetric maps due to nature of how power weapons need to be placed. Granted, it never sounded like a very good system to begin with and I’d only be happy to see static locations and timers to return.
Couldn’t the same thing happen with the other system? The only difference is that instead of one team being able to count on their Rockets being somewhere, it’s anyone’s guess. Also because of the visual cue everyone will rush for it likely leading to the final kill anyway.
> > I think its just Infinity game-types only as far as personal ordinance drops are concerned.
> >
> > Not sure what the power weapon system will be like outside of Infinity game-types, if its going to be the traditional one with static timers and locations or if its going to be a mix in “Regular” H4 modes for example. I hope they clarify this soon.
>
> As far as I have understood, the power weapons will come as ordnance drops somewhere around the maps and the locations will vary. Could be a bad thing for competition if players don’t get to know about the weapon before it drops. I also don’t see much possibilities for it on symmetric maps due to nature of how power weapons need to be placed. Granted, it never sounded like a very good system to begin with and I’d only be happy to see static locations and timers to return.
Here’s the problem if ReD teams side get first set of ROCKETS and BLUE team gets last set we have a problem
They need to BALANCED AND EVEN OR _______Rage
> > I think its just Infinity game-types only as far as personal ordinance drops are concerned.
> >
> > Not sure what the power weapon system will be like outside of Infinity game-types, if its going to be the traditional one with static timers and locations or if its going to be a mix in “Regular” H4 modes for example. I hope they clarify this soon.
>
> As far as I have understood, the power weapons will come as ordnance drops somewhere around the maps and the locations will vary. Could be a bad thing for competition if players don’t get to know about the weapon before it drops. I also don’t see much possibilities for it on symmetric maps due to nature of how power weapons need to be placed. Granted, it never sounded like a very good system to begin with and I’d only be happy to see static locations and timers to return.
So teams will not be able to “Set-up” and hold down positions for PW’s any-more because the locations will be semi-random? If that is true, I totally disagree with taking a large piece of the strategical puzzle away from Halo gameplay in the default. I dont know when “random” somehow became linked with “fun” in FPS but it is definitely a trend that is killing the potential of competitive FPS. You do not see these kind of “semi-random” game designs in a genre of games like RTS or Fighting games.
Totally agree, that the static locations and timers of the Power item system is key to Halo. If the issue really was that kids were not timing PW’s in default MM, then why not just have a waypoint appear 30 seconds before the spawn of the PW? Anything would be better than random game mechanics.
> Couldn’t the same thing happen with the other system? The only difference is that instead of one team being able to count on their Rockets being somewhere, it’s anyone’s guess. Also because of the visual cue everyone will rush for it likely leading to the final kill anyway.
If the rockets just drop somewhere out of the blue, it simply isn’t fair. One team is bound to get lucky be closer to the location. That just isn’t fair and really breaks power weapon control of any kind. Unless there comes at least a thirty seconds long countdown showing where the power weapon will drop, the system will be completely unfair and favor luck as either of the teams can’t really know where the weapon will drop before it drops. In which case someone is bound to get the weapon without fighting for it first.
> So teams will not be able to “Set-up” and hold down positions for PW’s any-more because the locations will be semi-random? If that is true, I totally disagree with taking a large piece of the strategical puzzle away from Halo gameplay in the default. I dont know when “random” somehow became linked with “fun” in FPS but it is definitely a trend that is killing the potential of competitive FPS. You do not see these kind of “semi-random” game designs in a genre of games like RTS or Fighting games.
>
> Totally agree, that the static locations and timers of the Power item system is key to Halo. If the issue really was that kids were not timing PW’s in default MM, then why not just have a waypoint appear 30 seconds before the spawn of the PW? Anything would be better than random game mechanics.
If I understood the months old reveals correctly: no. It is said that the locations won’t really be random, but that doesn’t really matter unless we get some kind of timer telling us that there is a rocket launcher about to drop over there in thirty seconds. Regardless, no matter how they handle this, I really don’t see it being a good replacement for the static spawn system.
Using the Pit as an example, the smart way of handling it would be this.
Take the the standard layout of the pit: Rockets, Camo, Sword, Overshield. They all have their usual timers. After they have the initial drop in the usual places. However after they all have been picked up the location they will spawn at next depends on the order and whether or not a weapon or power up has been picked(Obviously overshield shouldn’t drop ontop of an unclaimed rocket launcher).
These weapons always spawn in neutral locations where the power ups would normally be. So maybe you would see Rockets in Sword room or Overshield in Camo, etc.
As for the gimme power weapons(Sniper and shotgun) they should obviously spawn in each teams home area. So in this case the shotgun and sniper might trade places. Something similar could occur with mid tier weapons like the Brute shot and Needler swapping spawns. Grenade locatios would also likely vary a bit
Here is what should NOT happen.
Drops should NOT be one big pool of power weapons. One team should not by the luck of the draw get both sniper rifles in their zone while the other team gets Rockets and a Shotgun.
There needs to be a clear divide between ordinance that is fought over and gimme ordinance on symmetrical maps, especially on BTB. Could you imagine playing BTB and seeing the other team have Both Sniper rifles drop on their side on a map like Coag or Valhalla? Or if 1 team luckily gets the sniper right in their base and takes out the enemy trying to get their sniper that while spawning in the “friendly” zone but it is still closer to the front line.
Ordinance can work but they have to be implemented properly
From what I have Heard is that 343i has set it up where there are not just single spawn points for weapons they will shift around the map and in turn shift the focus of the battles to diffrent areas of the map. I can’t remember where the announced it but they talked about it in one of the videos on halo waypoint.
> Totally agree, that the static locations and timers of the Power item system is key to Halo. If the issue really was that kids were not timing PW’s in default MM, then why not just have a waypoint appear 30 seconds before the spawn of the PW? Anything would be better than random game mechanics.
> If I understood the months old reveals correctly: no. It is said that the locations won’t really be random, but that doesn’t really matter unless we get some kind of timer telling us that there is a rocket launcher about to drop over there in thirty seconds. Regardless, no matter how they handle this, I really don’t see it being a good replacement for the static spawn system.
I would almost say 45 seconds-min, otherwise there is no way im playing Halo that way. The power item system was perfectly fine. I am not going to be playing guessing games in what goodies im getting and where while running around like a chicken with its head cut off. Keep the new PW system in Infinity, I want to play Halo in Halo 4.
>
What about the timers? If you suddenly just drop rockets to the sword room out of the blue, neither team will be prepared for it an the team that happens to be closer will have the advantage. Each weapon either would need to have a static drop clock for it to work (for example, rockets drop every two minutes), or at least a 30-60 seconds long countdown telling that the weapon is about to drop over there. Also, if you have the sniper rifle dropping on one team’s side, you also need to drop it to the other team’s side too in couple of seconds for things to be balanced.
In the end, I really see no benefit of such a system. If you make it so that it actually works for gameplay, it’s basically the old system, but the locations of each power weapon just get mixed with every spawn. That’s why I believe it would only be better to go with the old system that does things in a more simple manner and more consistently.
> I would almost say 45 seconds-min, otherwise there is no way im playing Halo that way. The power item system was perfectly fine. I am not going to be playing guessing games in what goodies im getting and where while running around like a chicken with its head cut off. Keep the new PW system in Infinity, I want to play Halo in Halo 4.
I wasn’t exactly sure about the length of the timer. Thirty seconds was just a quick number, I’d personally rather go with one minute. But I really do agree with you, I see no benefits to this new system and would rather see it being restricted to Infinity Slayer.
> Drop pods or ordnance drops in MP will they be fare and BALANCED
>
>
> Example
> Halo 3 on the pit
> ( ordnance drop is ROCKETS )
> The score is 49 - 49 will they drop in a BALANCED AREA or will they drop in Red side or blue side
>
>
>
>
> Because this if not EVEN OR IN A neutral spot COULD BE Terrible
>
>
>
> Just my 2 cents
It really depends on the situation. From my understanding, ordinance/power weapons will spawn at predictable areas of the map for all players to see. Now, whether it drops on red base, blue base, or a neutral location is slightly moot, for all players should know, with plenty of head time, where the ordinance will drop, thus allowing either team ample time to react, prepare, and set-up.
I’m sure 343i’s put precautions in place to ensure fairness and balance are present, I wouldn’t worry too much. This is a situation that one would see maybe one out of every twenty games.
> So teams will not be able to “Set-up” and hold down positions for PW’s any-more because the locations will be semi-random? If that is true, I totally disagree with taking a large piece of the strategical puzzle away from Halo gameplay in the default.
Frankie already commented about this numerous times. The same location drop will not contain the same weapon in it the next time. Period. A sniper on Asylum, for example, could spawn on shotgun “area”, “turret” area", or “stage” area based on a predictability scheme. Granted it could be more diverse then my example above and might include cross map or height level changes depending on the map, but the facts as I understand them is Power Weapons especially are going to be more randomized then ever before, but not where one sniper on the map is going to be strategically placed to be given to a team. The team with a good setup will account for that and be able to maintain PW control, though I’m sure this is just one of things people are going to inevitably complain about.
> I dont know when “random” somehow became linked with “fun” in FPS but it is definitely a trend that is killing the potential of competitive FPS. You do not see these kind of “semi-random” game designs in a genre of games like RTS or Fighting games.
Frankie already bluntly said this is being done so newer players will stand more of a chance at staying alive because, like tsassa said, no one can sit on a weapon zone and be guaranteed a power weapon, but instead could be a pair of frag grenades instead. If nothing else, map control is being switched as the primary concern for maintaining these control ports. Failure to do so WILL cost you the match in a evenly squared off match…
> Totally agree, that the static locations and timers of the Power item system is key to Halo. If the issue really was that kids were not timing PW’s in default MM, then why not just have a waypoint appear 30 seconds before the spawn of the PW? Anything would be better than random game mechanics.
He he he, I love Little English Halo Blog… Frankie has also said the ordnance drop pods will be predictable with a timer attached and a location zone visible for everyone to see/know which will have to be secured. Now, what is in the pod , we won’t know till it hits and a beacon ignites to say what weapon is present…
> It really depends on the situation. From my understanding, ordinance/power weapons will spawn at predictable areas of the map for all players to see. Now, whether it drops on red base, blue base, or a neutral location is slightly moot, for all players should know, with plenty of head time, where the ordinance will drop, thus allowing either team ample time to react, prepare, and set-up.
>
> I’m sure 343i’s put precautions in place to ensure fairness and balance are present, I wouldn’t worry too much. This is a situation that one would see maybe one out of every twenty games.
It’s not really that straightforward. If you think about symmetric maps, each team has their own side of the map. It’s not fair to drop the weapon on other side of the map when the other team can only spawn on the opposite side of the map whilst the other gets to spawn close to the drop location of the weapon. The location does matter, and the only balanced location on symmetric maps where the other team doesn’t get a free weapon is the middle area of the map that is egual distance from both sides of the map.
> > It’s not really that straightforward. If you think about symmetric maps, each team has their own side of the map. It’s not fair to drop the weapon on other side of the map when the other team can only spawn on the opposite side of the map whilst the other gets to spawn close to the drop location of the weapon. The location does matter, and the only balanced location on symmetric maps where the other team doesn’t get a free weapon is the middle area of the map that is egual distance from both sides of the map.
>
> If it spawns at red or blue base (in the case of symmetrical maps), it doesn’t necessarily mean it grants them a “free weapon.” Granted, it makes it easier for one team and more challenging for another to get it, however if ordinance drops are predictable then both teams should know ahead of time where it’s going to drop regardless.
>
> Let’s stick with the Pit, for example. The score’s 49-49, and rockets are about to spawn. They spawn mid-green, which is in the middle of the map, however both teams still need to set-up at the location.
>
> Let’s say rockets spawned at red courtyard instead. Both teams know when rockets will spawn, and both teams still need to set-up their positions to obtain the rockets. Granted, it’s harder for the blue team, but it really shouldn’t make a difference against a skilled team. The spawning is dynamic enough to keep the red team from spawning behind blue (or become spawn killed by blue), etc. If blue team is in the correct position (red objective/shotty, red tower, red ramp, red S2), it would force red team to spawn at blue base anyways, making this whole situation moot.
>
> Regardless, I’m sure 343i’s thought a fair amount of balancing issues, so I don’t think this would be a problem to begin with.