Hey everyone. It seems like the jackrabbit opener in deathmatch is a little too powerful for most players to counter it effectively. A possible nerf idea that I had to fix this, is to move the repair drone upgrade to tier 2. This way the jackrabbit opener can still be used as a strong opener to gain that oh so valuable map control over your opponent, but not become a monstrously hard to stop easy win strategy. If you all have any other suggestions or think that jackrabbits are in a good place right now i would love to hear it.
I like this idea, another suggestion I though of is changing how turrets work.
Reduce the cost of turrets (they cost the equivalent of 3 Grunts or two Marines, do they do more damage than them? No.) But also reduce they’re dps against other units, but increase it versus Scout units.
This way turrets would be worth their cost and would stop Scout rushes, without being terribly overpowered
> 2533274927740213;2:
> I like this idea, another suggestion I though of is changing how turrets work.
>
> Reduce the cost of turrets (they cost the equivalent of 3 Grunts or two Marines, do they do more damage than them? No.) But also reduce they’re dps against other units, but increase it versus Scout units.
>
> This way turrets would be worth their cost and would stop Scout rushes, without being terribly overpowered
Turrets do stop scout rushes however that is a different topic…jackrabbits yea i think there has been enough complaints that they should receive some kind of nerf next patch. i agree escort drone needs to be at least tier 2 but i really dont think its enough, they are still cheaper and faster then everything else and have decent burst damage with grenade launcher. they need to get all the scouts up to the same lvl. the chopper vs ghost vs rabbit should be almost the same, that way everyone has a fair shot at map control.
Unsc already can’t beat good banished. Jackrabbits are fine they just need to make all scouts compete on the same level and nerf banished late game.
> 2533274851915620;3:
> > 2533274927740213;2:
> > I like this idea, another suggestion I though of is changing how turrets work.
> >
> > Reduce the cost of turrets (they cost the equivalent of 3 Grunts or two Marines, do they do more damage than them? No.) But also reduce they’re dps against other units, but increase it versus Scout units.
> >
> > This way turrets would be worth their cost and would stop Scout rushes, without being terribly overpowered
>
> Turrets do stop scout rushes however that is a different topic…jackrabbits yea i think there has been enough complaints that they should receive some kind of nerf next patch. i agree escort drone needs to be at least tier 2 but i really dont think its enough, they are still cheaper and faster then everything else and have decent burst damage with grenade launcher. they need to get all the scouts up to the same lvl. the chopper vs ghost vs rabbit should be almost the same, that way everyone has a fair shot at map control.
All they need to do is cost far more power because there should be a negative for rushing and failing and as of now there is not they can still hit tech 2 with 30 or 40 seconds of you if you don’t rush so there needs to be a downfall for people that rush and fail not just 30 second draw back becuase they will have full map controll and pass you back up very quickly so honestly rushing is really the only way this game should be played
> 2728966917066801;5:
> > 2533274851915620;3:
> > > 2533274927740213;2:
> > > I like this idea, another suggestion I though of is changing how turrets work.
> > >
> > > Reduce the cost of turrets (they cost the equivalent of 3 Grunts or two Marines, do they do more damage than them? No.) But also reduce they’re dps against other units, but increase it versus Scout units.
> > >
> > > This way turrets would be worth their cost and would stop Scout rushes, without being terribly overpowered
> >
> > Turrets do stop scout rushes however that is a different topic…jackrabbits yea i think there has been enough complaints that they should receive some kind of nerf next patch. i agree escort drone needs to be at least tier 2 but i really dont think its enough, they are still cheaper and faster then everything else and have decent burst damage with grenade launcher. they need to get all the scouts up to the same lvl. the chopper vs ghost vs rabbit should be almost the same, that way everyone has a fair shot at map control.
>
> All they need to do is cost far more power because there should be a negative for rushing and failing and as of now there is not they can still hit tech 2 with 30 or 40 seconds of you if you don’t rush so there needs to be a downfall for people that rush and fail not just 30 second draw back becuase they will have full map controll and pass you back up very quickly so honestly rushing is really the only way this game should be played
you have to think about how that will affect the other units in the game, if they make scouts cost to much then they wont be able to counter marine spam…and that is what they are intended to do. like i said before they need to make all scout units play on the same lvl…Jackrabbits are not fine, they need a nerf along with chopper/ghost slight buff…the jackrabbit is cheaper, faster, and has its own personal healing drone, anyone who thinks that is “fine” shouldnt be giving input.
> 2533274851915620;6:
> > 2728966917066801;5:
> > > 2533274851915620;3:
> > > > 2533274927740213;2:
> > > > I like this idea, another suggestion I though of is changing how turrets work.
> > > >
> > > > Reduce the cost of turrets (they cost the equivalent of 3 Grunts or two Marines, do they do more damage than them? No.) But also reduce they’re dps against other units, but increase it versus Scout units.
> > > >
> > > > This way turrets would be worth their cost and would stop Scout rushes, without being terribly overpowered
> > >
> > > Turrets do stop scout rushes however that is a different topic…jackrabbits yea i think there has been enough complaints that they should receive some kind of nerf next patch. i agree escort drone needs to be at least tier 2 but i really dont think its enough, they are still cheaper and faster then everything else and have decent burst damage with grenade launcher. they need to get all the scouts up to the same lvl. the chopper vs ghost vs rabbit should be almost the same, that way everyone has a fair shot at map control.
> >
> > All they need to do is cost far more power because there should be a negative for rushing and failing and as of now there is not they can still hit tech 2 with 30 or 40 seconds of you if you don’t rush so there needs to be a downfall for people that rush and fail not just 30 second draw back becuase they will have full map controll and pass you back up very quickly so honestly rushing is really the only way this game should be played
>
> you have to think about how that will affect the other units in the game, if they make scouts cost to much then they wont be able to counter marine spam…and that is what they are intended to do. like i said before they need to make all scout units play on the same lvl…Jackrabbits are not fine, they need a nerf along with chopper/ghost slight buff…the jackrabbit is cheaper, faster, and has its own personal healing drone, anyone who thinks that is “fine” shouldnt be giving input.
I never said it was fine but I don’t see 343 fixing the real issue because it is very broken they are faster shoot 360 degrees on the move which is really what makes them amazing in the beginning and they heal on top of all of that I just don’t see 343 fixing all the issues because the unit would have to be 100 percent redone but an increase in cost would at least put them behind when people did spam them
> 2533274927740213;2:
> I like this idea, another suggestion I though of is changing how turrets work.
>
> Reduce the cost of turrets (they cost the equivalent of 3 Grunts or two Marines, do they do more damage than them? No.) But also reduce they’re dps against other units, but increase it versus Scout units.
>
> This way turrets would be worth their cost and would stop Scout rushes, without being terribly overpowered
Turrets are not the issue. Turrets are fine at the moment and also very effective at stoping any scout rushes. The issue is fighting them off outside your base with T1 units.
Currently the only consistent counter I’ve seen is engineers+choppers/ghosts. I haven’t tried it since I haven’t faced JR in the last few days (strangely enough).
I’m now seeing a lot of Shipmaster (broken tier) and Atriox (locust spam). Even the Kinsanos I’ve been faced don’t JR rush me, don’t know what’s going on honestly.
> 2533274811417927;4:
> Unsc already can’t beat good banished. Jackrabbits are fine they just need to make all scouts compete on the same level and nerf banished late game.
Nerf locusts pls
> 2533274843762975;1:
> Hey everyone. It seems like the jackrabbit opener in deathmatch is a little too powerful for most players to counter it effectively. A possible nerf idea that I had to fix this, is to move the repair drone upgrade to tier 2. This way the jackrabbit opener can still be used as a strong opener to gain that oh so valuable map control over your opponent, but not become a monstrously hard to stop easy win strategy. If you all have any other suggestions or think that jackrabbits are in a good place right now i would love to hear it.
So basically you say that not being able to heal stops it? Not true. The enemy will focus you down if they are half competent (turrets do this as well) so you will just loose units instead of getting them all black bar. Heal doesn’t matter
> 2533274820642782;10:
> > 2533274843762975;1:
> > Hey everyone. It seems like the jackrabbit opener in deathmatch is a little too powerful for most players to counter it effectively. A possible nerf idea that I had to fix this, is to move the repair drone upgrade to tier 2. This way the jackrabbit opener can still be used as a strong opener to gain that oh so valuable map control over your opponent, but not become a monstrously hard to stop easy win strategy. If you all have any other suggestions or think that jackrabbits are in a good place right now i would love to hear it.
>
> So basically you say that not being able to heal stops it? Not true. The enemy will focus you down if they are half competent (turrets do this as well) so you will just loose units instead of getting them all black bar. Heal doesn’t matter
I never said that removing the repair drone will stop the rush. I have no problem with rush units in the game since rushing is and should be viable option in every RTS game. The reason why the repair drone will reduce the power of jackrabbits is because it will reduce the cost effectiveness. The problems that I have had with jackrabbits is that they can easily poke into your base and deal a ton of damage then leave before the turrets kill too many of them and heal them self back to full health. Without the repair drone there will be a lot of one shot kill jackrabbits mixed in the army that can be targeted by your own units easily.
> 2533274843762975;11:
> > 2533274820642782;10:
> > > 2533274843762975;1:
> > > Hey everyone. It seems like the jackrabbit opener in deathmatch is a little too powerful for most players to counter it effectively. A possible nerf idea that I had to fix this, is to move the repair drone upgrade to tier 2. This way the jackrabbit opener can still be used as a strong opener to gain that oh so valuable map control over your opponent, but not become a monstrously hard to stop easy win strategy. If you all have any other suggestions or think that jackrabbits are in a good place right now i would love to hear it.
> >
> > So basically you say that not being able to heal stops it? Not true. The enemy will focus you down if they are half competent (turrets do this as well) so you will just loose units instead of getting them all black bar. Heal doesn’t matter
>
> I never said that removing the repair drone will stop the rush. I have no problem with rush units in the game since rushing is and should be viable option in every RTS game. The reason why the repair drone will reduce the power of jackrabbits is because it will reduce the cost effectiveness. The problems that I have had with jackrabbits is that they can easily poke into your base and deal a ton of damage then leave before the turrets kill too many of them and heal them self back to full health. Without the repair drone there will be a lot of one shot kill jackrabbits mixed in the army that can be targeted by your own units easily.
You are missing the point. It doesn’t work like that most of the time. Again, you loose way more units than you have to heal by the end of most engagements, negating effectiveness of heal and by extension negating the argument of “cost effectiveness”.
> 2533274820642782;12:
> > 2533274843762975;11:
> > > 2533274820642782;10:
> > > > 2533274843762975;1:
> > > > Hey everyone. It seems like the jackrabbit opener in deathmatch is a little too powerful for most players to counter it effectively. A possible nerf idea that I had to fix this, is to move the repair drone upgrade to tier 2. This way the jackrabbit opener can still be used as a strong opener to gain that oh so valuable map control over your opponent, but not become a monstrously hard to stop easy win strategy. If you all have any other suggestions or think that jackrabbits are in a good place right now i would love to hear it.
> > >
> > > So basically you say that not being able to heal stops it? Not true. The enemy will focus you down if they are half competent (turrets do this as well) so you will just loose units instead of getting them all black bar. Heal doesn’t matter
> >
> > I never said that removing the repair drone will stop the rush. I have no problem with rush units in the game since rushing is and should be viable option in every RTS game. The reason why the repair drone will reduce the power of jackrabbits is because it will reduce the cost effectiveness. The problems that I have had with jackrabbits is that they can easily poke into your base and deal a ton of damage then leave before the turrets kill too many of them and heal them self back to full health. Without the repair drone there will be a lot of one shot kill jackrabbits mixed in the army that can be targeted by your own units easily.
>
> You are missing the point. It doesn’t work like that most of the time. Again, you loose way more units than you have to heal by the end of most engagements, negating effectiveness of heal and by extension negating the argument of “cost effectiveness”.
If someone is letting there jackrabbits die rather then microing them away to heal then the rush will be much easier to hold off by turtling up and teching to tier 2 anyway. they might as well have not even gotten the upgrade if they didn’t intend to use it. If your playing against a good player they will micro the jackrabbits away as there health gets low which is the main reason why I find the rush to be a little too powerful right now.
> 2533274843762975;13:
> > 2533274820642782;12:
> > > 2533274843762975;11:
> > > > 2533274820642782;10:
> > > > > 2533274843762975;1:
> > > > > Hey everyone. It seems like the jackrabbit opener in deathmatch is a little too powerful for most players to counter it effectively. A possible nerf idea that I had to fix this, is to move the repair drone upgrade to tier 2. This way the jackrabbit opener can still be used as a strong opener to gain that oh so valuable map control over your opponent, but not become a monstrously hard to stop easy win strategy. If you all have any other suggestions or think that jackrabbits are in a good place right now i would love to hear it.
> > > >
> > > > So basically you say that not being able to heal stops it? Not true. The enemy will focus you down if they are half competent (turrets do this as well) so you will just loose units instead of getting them all black bar. Heal doesn’t matter
> > >
> > > I never said that removing the repair drone will stop the rush. I have no problem with rush units in the game since rushing is and should be viable option in every RTS game. The reason why the repair drone will reduce the power of jackrabbits is because it will reduce the cost effectiveness. The problems that I have had with jackrabbits is that they can easily poke into your base and deal a ton of damage then leave before the turrets kill too many of them and heal them self back to full health. Without the repair drone there will be a lot of one shot kill jackrabbits mixed in the army that can be targeted by your own units easily.
> >
> > You are missing the point. It doesn’t work like that most of the time. Again, you loose way more units than you have to heal by the end of most engagements, negating effectiveness of heal and by extension negating the argument of “cost effectiveness”.
>
> If someone is letting there jackrabbits die rather then microing them away to heal then the rush will be much easier to hold off by turtling up and teching to tier 2 anyway. they might as well have not even gotten the upgrade if they didn’t intend to use it. If your playing against a good player they will micro the jackrabbits away as there health gets low which is the main reason why I find the rush to be a little too powerful right now.
You are still not understanding…
Ok. SO. Jackrabbits go into a base with, two turrets. the turrets auto-aggro target only ONE rabbit until it dies. ok, now past this they could target separate ones but by then first turret is pretty close to down for all intensive purposes so that’s basically ~3 dead and… wait. no more wounded? but, how can this be you ask? Whelp it’s because turrets don’t switch off of units unless they kill em’. so 
Say they engauge an army of early marines, now this is a different story I know but would be fair if heal was moved up because marine heal is too.
So I hope that you can get through your head what I am trying to tell you…
> 2533274820642782;14:
> > 2533274843762975;13:
> > > 2533274820642782;12:
> > > > 2533274843762975;11:
> > > > > 2533274820642782;10:
> > > > > > 2533274843762975;1:
> > > > > > Hey everyone. It seems like the jackrabbit opener in deathmatch is a little too powerful for most players to counter it effectively. A possible nerf idea that I had to fix this, is to move the repair drone upgrade to tier 2. This way the jackrabbit opener can still be used as a strong opener to gain that oh so valuable map control over your opponent, but not become a monstrously hard to stop easy win strategy. If you all have any other suggestions or think that jackrabbits are in a good place right now i would love to hear it.
> > > > >
> > > > > So basically you say that not being able to heal stops it? Not true. The enemy will focus you down if they are half competent (turrets do this as well) so you will just loose units instead of getting them all black bar. Heal doesn’t matter
> > > >
> > > > I never said that removing the repair drone will stop the rush. I have no problem with rush units in the game since rushing is and should be viable option in every RTS game. The reason why the repair drone will reduce the power of jackrabbits is because it will reduce the cost effectiveness. The problems that I have had with jackrabbits is that they can easily poke into your base and deal a ton of damage then leave before the turrets kill too many of them and heal them self back to full health. Without the repair drone there will be a lot of one shot kill jackrabbits mixed in the army that can be targeted by your own units easily.
> > >
> > > You are missing the point. It doesn’t work like that most of the time. Again, you loose way more units than you have to heal by the end of most engagements, negating effectiveness of heal and by extension negating the argument of “cost effectiveness”.
> >
> > If someone is letting there jackrabbits die rather then microing them away to heal then the rush will be much easier to hold off by turtling up and teching to tier 2 anyway. they might as well have not even gotten the upgrade if they didn’t intend to use it. If your playing against a good player they will micro the jackrabbits away as there health gets low which is the main reason why I find the rush to be a little too powerful right now.
>
> You are still not understanding…
>
> Ok. SO. Jackrabbits go into a base with, two turrets. the turrets auto-aggro target only ONE rabbit until it dies. ok, now past this they could target separate ones but by then first turret is pretty close to down for all intensive purposes so that’s basically ~3 dead and… wait. no more wounded? but, how can this be you ask? Whelp it’s because turrets don’t switch off of units unless they kill em’. so
>
> Say they engauge an army of early marines, now this is a different story I know but would be fair if heal was moved up because marine heal is too.
>
> So I hope that you can get through your head what I am trying to tell you…
I totally understand what you are saying, but the support drone moving to tech 2 is the best option. Not only does the heal disappear super early, but so does the extra DPS from the drone. Remember it shoots as well and can attack air units. So the extra DPS and healing ability are gone early on, now marines/grunts can defend or a tech 2 turtle will win with air since rabbits can’t shoot them anymore. And before everyone says air beats them now, I will agree. However, by the time I get one hornet, they have 20 rabbits. And 20 rabbits beats 1 or 2 hornets.
> 2533274811521263;9:
> > 2533274811417927;4:
> > Unsc already can’t beat good banished. Jackrabbits are fine they just need to make all scouts compete on the same level and nerf banished late game.
>
> Nerf locusts pls
I honestly think locusts are perfect the way they are. if they are nerfed they will be absolutely worthless like in halo wars 1 they are quite literally glass cannons they do enormous amounts of damage to builds and they are decently fast but fragile as crap. trust me I love using the locusts one of my favorite units to use and I can tell you from a ton of exp just build an atrioxs chosen 1 chosen can seriously take out like 7-8 locusts by himself with minimal to no back up trust me locust are no where near op’d
> 2533274799880813;15:
> > 2533274820642782;14:
> > > 2533274843762975;13:
> > > > 2533274820642782;12:
> > > > > 2533274843762975;11:
> > > > > > 2533274820642782;10:
> > > > > > > 2533274843762975;1:
> > > > > > > Hey everyone. It seems like the jackrabbit opener in deathmatch is a little too powerful for most players to counter it effectively. A possible nerf idea that I had to fix this, is to move the repair drone upgrade to tier 2. This way the jackrabbit opener can still be used as a strong opener to gain that oh so valuable map control over your opponent, but not become a monstrously hard to stop easy win strategy. If you all have any other suggestions or think that jackrabbits are in a good place right now i would love to hear it.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So basically you say that not being able to heal stops it? Not true. The enemy will focus you down if they are half competent (turrets do this as well) so you will just loose units instead of getting them all black bar. Heal doesn’t matter
> > > > >
> > > > > I never said that removing the repair drone will stop the rush. I have no problem with rush units in the game since rushing is and should be viable option in every RTS game. The reason why the repair drone will reduce the power of jackrabbits is because it will reduce the cost effectiveness. The problems that I have had with jackrabbits is that they can easily poke into your base and deal a ton of damage then leave before the turrets kill too many of them and heal them self back to full health. Without the repair drone there will be a lot of one shot kill jackrabbits mixed in the army that can be targeted by your own units easily.
> > > >
> > > > You are missing the point. It doesn’t work like that most of the time. Again, you loose way more units than you have to heal by the end of most engagements, negating effectiveness of heal and by extension negating the argument of “cost effectiveness”.
> > >
> > > If someone is letting there jackrabbits die rather then microing them away to heal then the rush will be much easier to hold off by turtling up and teching to tier 2 anyway. they might as well have not even gotten the upgrade if they didn’t intend to use it. If your playing against a good player they will micro the jackrabbits away as there health gets low which is the main reason why I find the rush to be a little too powerful right now.
> >
> > You are still not understanding…
> >
> > Ok. SO. Jackrabbits go into a base with, two turrets. the turrets auto-aggro target only ONE rabbit until it dies. ok, now past this they could target separate ones but by then first turret is pretty close to down for all intensive purposes so that’s basically ~3 dead and… wait. no more wounded? but, how can this be you ask? Whelp it’s because turrets don’t switch off of units unless they kill em’. so
> >
> > Say they engauge an army of early marines, now this is a different story I know but would be fair if heal was moved up because marine heal is too.
> >
> > So I hope that you can get through your head what I am trying to tell you…
>
> I totally understand what you are saying, but the support drone moving to tech 2 is the best option. Not only does the heal disappear super early, but so does the extra DPS from the drone. Remember it shoots as well and can attack air units. So the extra DPS and healing ability are gone early on, now marines/grunts can defend or a tech 2 turtle will win with air since rabbits can’t shoot them anymore. And before everyone says air beats them now, I will agree. However, by the time I get one hornet, they have 20 rabbits. And 20 rabbits beats 1 or 2 hornets.
Now that is a good point.
> 2533274813115252;16:
> > 2533274811521263;9:
> > > 2533274811417927;4:
> > > Unsc already can’t beat good banished. Jackrabbits are fine they just need to make all scouts compete on the same level and nerf banished late game.
> >
> > Nerf locusts pls
>
> I honestly think locusts are perfect the way they are. if they are nerfed they will be absolutely worthless like in halo wars 1 they are quite literally glass cannons they do enormous amounts of damage to builds and they are decently fast but fragile as crap. trust me I love using the locusts one of my favorite units to use and I can tell you from a ton of exp just build an atrioxs chosen 1 chosen can seriously take out like 7-8 locusts by himself with minimal to no back up trust me locust are no where near op’d
As someone who has literally lost 11 locusts to 1 atriox chosen with no back up, I can agree with this. Also micro is meaningless, because the Atriox chosen shot disables the locust.
For Jackrabbits, there needs to be another option to counter them away from the base other that spamming Jackrabbits yourself. There should always be multiple options to counter everything. Having Jackrabbits as the only counter makes the games boring as you and your enemy do the same thing all the time. The skill of the game should come from scouting what the enemy is doing and being able to switch to different units to beat your enemy. I think rushing is a very important part of RTS games but giving only 1 option to counter a skilled opponent is not good.
Locust need to stop being able to kite everything and still kill a bunch of units. My fix would be to increase damage and speed but make them not able to attack while moving. This would make having 5 or 6 locust for a sneak attack very good but not spam-able like they are now. Compliment them with other units and you can take down bases if you micro well.
The most OP strat at the moment is Kinsano turret rush in 3v3. You just send all units to 1 base before the 1:30 min mark, drop 2 turrets and take a base and kill units and drop a 3rd turret once the first 2 go and while you are doing that you are also sending more units to their base. Also if they happen to unlock tier 2 Helljumper drop, base is dead.
> 2533274811521263;9:
> > 2533274811417927;4:
> > Unsc already can’t beat good banished. Jackrabbits are fine they just need to make all scouts compete on the same level and nerf banished late game.
>
> Nerf locusts pls
its not actually locust that need a nerf, its how much range they gain with the ship master ability that makes them really strong, locust on other banished leaders are actually balanced quite well