Please fix spawn times on Mount Lam Lam

The BTB map Mount Lam Lam is without question my personal least favorite map in matchmaking, but with a couple of simple changes it can become one of the better maps. It has poor terrain for driving (that’s what BTB is about!) is very campy and has messed up spawn times. The spawn times problem we can fix, making the map a lot more fun to play.Here is the issue I am attempting to fix: flow of gameplay is poor because power vehicles spawn to quickly; and objective games slog on because weaker vehicles spawn too slowly.

Current spawn times:
Mongoose 135 seconds
Ghost 140 seconds
Regular Hog: 140 seconds
Rocket Hog: 30 seconds

The weapons for taking out the rocket hog have reasonable spawn times but the rocket hog can dominate the map quickly as the sniper laser and rockets have 150- 180 second re-spawn times. All it takes is two people dedicated to rocket hogging to totally take over the map. that is wrong.

What I purpose for a fix:
mongoose: 30 seconds
Ghost: 40 seconds
Regular hog: 60 seconds
Rocket hog: 150 seconds

This will make spawn times more reasonable and gameplay flow smoother.What do you guys think about this fix and is there anything else you would like to see done to make this map better?

I thought that the Rocket Hogs were far less effective against infantry than the regular Hogs were.

Rocket hogs are equal in effectiveness to regular hogs against infantry. Against other vehicles Rocket hogs are far more effective.

I always tought Mount Lam Lam was good for driving, but the again, I rarely use Warthog, but I know it’s very good for ghost unless you try splattering people near the edges. (I’ve tried, didn’t work so well for me) Though, I usually try from the wrong direction just to see what happens. What comes to warthog driving, I have done it a little, didn’t seem that bad if you’re a good driver, the map also gives chances for the players to hide from the Warthog.

I somewhat agree about it being too campy, but more sightline blocking blocks between the bases could have easily gotten the snipers out of their bases. I still like the map as one of the best maps in BTB, other being Wayont.

what comes to the spawn timers, the Ghost definitely shouldn’t spawn that quickly. If I can already rack up 20 splatters with it in a regular match against decent opponents with the current spawn time, I see 40 seconds to be way too quick. I think that the spawn time should be more like 90 seconds although even that sounds slightly too fast.

I personally didn’t even realize that Rocket Hog spawns that quickly, it definitely needs to be changed, that’s way too fast. Although I rarely run into palyers who can effectively use it. Otherwise your spawn suggestiuons for the Mongoose and regular Warthog sound good, but again, 40 seconds for Ghost would be way too fast.

One thing I should also say is that I was somewhat shocked to learn that the turrets never actually respawn, that is something I would also like too se changed. Although, I must admit that’s not entirely for balance or map flow purposes.

Mount Lam Lam has very unbalanced driving. Blue teams vehicles have to go up a steep hill for starting and that gives the other team a huge advantage. If you hit into someone to try to splatter them with something other than a ghost on the edges of this map there is a high likelihood that you will be knocked off the map for doing so. Splattering is already tough in Reach because of armor lock, evade and the abundance of power weapons.

I think we can agree that the spawn timers need adjusting though; what about having the following:

Ghost: 90 seconds
Mongoose: 30 seconds
Regular hog: 90 seconds
Rocket hog: 150 seconds
Turrets: 180 seconds; max on map 2

> Mount Lam Lam has very unbalanced driving. Blue teams vehicles have to go up a steep hill for starting and that gives the other team a huge advantage. If you hit into someone to try to splatter them with something other than a ghost on the edges of this map there is a high likelihood that you will be knocked off the map for doing so. Splattering is already tough in Reach because of armor lock, evade and the abundance of power weapons.
>
> I think we can agree that the spawn timers need adjusting though; what about having the following:
>
> Ghost: 90 seconds
> Mongoose: 30 seconds
> Regular hog: 90 seconds
> Rocket hog: 150 seconds
> Turrets: 180 seconds; max on map 2

I already got sick of Armor Lock and decided that I should completely remove it from my life. taht worked out pretty well. I only play playlists with no Armor lock excluding BTB, in BTB I only play objective. With Armor Lock out of the picture, I realized that many people really have lost their dodging skills because of Armor Lock.

What comes to the Warthog driving, red team aldo have a hill, although not very steep. They usually don’t seem to have an advantage that big. The again, what would I know about warthog driving on Mount Lam Lam. I can still see that there are some pretty nasty hills on the map. (I have also experieced them with Ghost, sometimes flipping me over)

To the spawn times, those sound pretty good. I’d be happy with them.

> > Mount Lam Lam has very unbalanced driving. Blue teams vehicles have to go up a steep hill for starting and that gives the other team a huge advantage. If you hit into someone to try to splatter them with something other than a ghost on the edges of this map there is a high likelihood that you will be knocked off the map for doing so. Splattering is already tough in Reach because of armor lock, evade and the abundance of power weapons.
> >
> > I think we can agree that the spawn timers need adjusting though; what about having the following:
> >
> > Ghost: 90 seconds
> > Mongoose: 30 seconds
> > Regular hog: 90 seconds
> > Rocket hog: 150 seconds
> > Turrets: 180 seconds; max on map 2
>
> I already got sick of Armor Lock and decided that I should completely remove it from my life. taht worked out pretty well. I only play playlists with no Armor lock excluding BTB, in BTB I only play objective. With Armor Lock out of the picture, I realized that many people really have lost their dodging skills because of Armor Lock.
>
> What comes to the Warthog driving, red team aldo have a hill, although not very steep. They usually don’t seem to have an advantage that big. The again, what would I know about warthog driving on Mount Lam Lam. I can still see that there are some pretty nasty hills on the map. (I have also experieced them with Ghost, sometimes flipping me over)
>
> To the spawn times, those sound pretty good. I’d be happy with them.

If only there were some sort of optimatch thread for 343i we could try to get them to look into fixing it up and making gameplay on this map smoother.

> > > Mount Lam Lam has very unbalanced driving. Blue teams vehicles have to go up a steep hill for starting and that gives the other team a huge advantage. If you hit into someone to try to splatter them with something other than a ghost on the edges of this map there is a high likelihood that you will be knocked off the map for doing so. Splattering is already tough in Reach because of armor lock, evade and the abundance of power weapons.
> > >
> > > I think we can agree that the spawn timers need adjusting though; what about having the following:
> > >
> > > Ghost: 90 seconds
> > > Mongoose: 30 seconds
> > > Regular hog: 90 seconds
> > > Rocket hog: 150 seconds
> > > Turrets: 180 seconds; max on map 2
> >
> > I already got sick of Armor Lock and decided that I should completely remove it from my life. taht worked out pretty well. I only play playlists with no Armor lock excluding BTB, in BTB I only play objective. With Armor Lock out of the picture, I realized that many people really have lost their dodging skills because of Armor Lock.
> >
> > What comes to the Warthog driving, red team aldo have a hill, although not very steep. They usually don’t seem to have an advantage that big. The again, what would I know about warthog driving on Mount Lam Lam. I can still see that there are some pretty nasty hills on the map. (I have also experieced them with Ghost, sometimes flipping me over)
> >
> > To the spawn times, those sound pretty good. I’d be happy with them.
>
> If only there were some sort of optimatch thread for 343i we could try to get them to look into fixing it up and making gameplay on this map smoother.

I agree; there should be an Optimatch-esque area in these forums. I’m assuming it’s coming. In the meantime, you could contact the map author - Noooooch - via XBL/Bnet and have a chat with him about it. He’s a nice guy. As far as I remember from playtesting (pre-matchmaking), the map did not suffer from many of the issues highlighted here. I know for certain that Jeremiah/Bungie screwed around with weapons and vehicles quite considerably (as usual) before adding it into Matchmaking. Maybe Nooch could be persuaded to convince 343i to fix a few things via some of the CCs (Community Cartographers). If you need a reference when you contact him, Nooch knew me as Tribal.

Thank you; I sent Noooooch a link to this thread. Hopefully he can help fix some of the game flow issues.

I can get over the falling off the map all the time thing if the spawn timers are turned down on the vehicles that have trouble staying on this map, I really do think that these changes would make the map a lot more enjoyable for the vast majority of the BTB crowd. Thanks to everyone who has put input into this thread and feel free to bring new ideas to the table about improvements for this map =)