ODST origins in QUAKE2

Quake2 was released in 1997/1998, while HaloCombatEvolved appeared somewhere about 2001. In Quake2 we clearly get that the soldiers assaulting the enemy encampment are what Halo would later refer to as “orbital drop shocktroopers”, the enhanced infantry sent to enemy territory in dedicated drop pods launched from an orbital carrier. The Quake2 original pattern of ODST would later be unfolded in Quake4, where the drop pods - at least accidentlly - suit the purpose of shooting through enemy reinforcements, employing the drop momentum, delivering the troopers directly into secured installations and fortresses, allowing to cause havoc more efficiently. Quake4 also in particular depicts that sometimes the ODST landings are very unfortunate, especially when point breakthrough coordinates are unclear. Does anyone have any data whether the original pattern of ODST was used anywhere before the Quake2 in digital gaming, at least among the shooters of all kinds?

By the way, Quake2 is one of the very few games I remember that I can tell had some real punch, meaning, delivering damage impact in this shooter felt like it ought to. The gunsounds, the enemy behaviours, the pace, the ambience, the music - though I would rather swap NIN from the original Quake in the place of default SonicMayhem - simply did the justice. Quake4, in turn, I would not recommend, TBH, for reasons given a bit further.

Quake2, just to get the feel of it, modded to match the modernday expectations a bit more with “Q2XP” mod, links HERE and HERE. Explosions could definitely be better, but minding it is all fanmade, it is good. You can also see inefficient AI response to being shot at from the Hyperblaster [the fiery toilet paper roll], ducking and doing nothing, but that is native - maybe if they could at least shoot simultaneously while ducking. Quake2 included handheld grenades, next to grenade launcher, but it was necessary to switch to it as a separate weapon. Quake2 begins with a famous back then intro depicting ODST assault going plan B, which I assume is the first ODST theme in digital gaming.

HERE is a Quake4 [2005] gameplay feature framing some ODST moments, gameplay without any mods. Time 04:00, the famous Dark Matter Gun, the shot of which is capable of gravitationally dragging weaker enemies throughout open spaces as it proceeds slowly, but it made rather meagre impression against any foe capable of sustaining more than one hit of it, so ultimately I would say, poor execution to a great idea. HERE, for the sake of environments. 09:00, TacSim? Also for the note, the field of view [FOV] employed in these footages is increased well above the typical gaming shooter 90 degrees via manual tweaking of the IDtech4 engine, matching the value of about 110, as I estimate. Quake4 itself, though, in all honesty, is very much meh, with fights feeling artificial and set up, enemies of plastic fabric - void of any Quake2 legacy - and overall design patterns, along with the plot, giving an impression you have already seen it somewhere else, even if there were any genuine or better made parts to it. Artstyle faults of Quake4 emerge in my perspective from developers looking to much away to other franchises, hoping to mesh up various influences into a coherent synergistic outcome, which could work but unfortunately failed, loosing also the crucial Quake2 vibe along the way. Any team of developers can fall into similar traps, so the mindset behind the problem should be given attention. Keeping focus on adequate themes is quite a difficulty in proper continuity of the franchise it seems. What I would experiment with is actually locking up oneself - as an artist or a designer - with only the products of priority importance and studying them solely until drop.

For your consideration, in Quake2, as well as in Quake4, we fight the “Strogg”, which is an extragalactic, perhaps silicon based and highly aware entity, capable of cybertechnological excellence, treating biological organisms like effective and advanced aggregates of spare parts, creating army of cyborgs to expand throughout the universe in a way very analogous to the Halo Flood. So this is roughly and arguably Flood combined with corrupted Cortana in a Joseph Stalin frenzy mode, lacking any compatibility with human empathy or sensibility, therefore emerging brutalistic. Death of millions is a statistic. The conjecture is that the Strogg refers to sentient carbonbased biological organisms as towards a virus. Wonder how would it be if to unleash Strogg versus the Flood. They would probably wreck quite a bit of the Galaxy in mutual struggle.

Getting back to ODST topic, I highly doubt personal capsules would be the thing of common use, as they are costly, save maybe for some specific scenarios with high casaulty expectations, in particular minding the intended wall breakthrough collision thing, that would take further reinforced capsules to manage the strain. In turn, I would rather see regular drop capsules to contain from three to about ten soldiers majority of times, especially for flat ground safe landings. Bigger capsules are simply more economic for common use. Individual capsules suit special commando missions more to my evaluation.

Bungie said,the idea of droping soldiers from the orbit into combat is based upon how the mobile infantery is deployed in the novel:Starship troopers.

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> Bungie said,the idea of droping soldiers from the orbit into combat is based upon how the mobile infantery is deployed in the novel:Starship troopers.

Allright, fiction is a big place, y’know, but the question is, in digital gaming?

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> > 2535408730995228;2:
> > Bungie said,the idea of droping soldiers from the orbit into combat is based upon how the mobile infantery is deployed in the novel:Starship troopers.
>
> Allright, fiction is a big place, y’know, but the question is, in digital gaming?

As I said,they are based upon an idea from starship troopers.
I doubt it that the ODST and the soldiers from Quake have any releation towards eachother.
And I also doubt it that the ODST have any direct precurssor in other games.

@EdgeHedgehog, you say that you doubt ODST and shocktroopers from Quake2 - mind I am talking about the formal sequel in the franchise - have anything in common. Allright, how would you define “orbital drop shocktroopers”? Do they have anything in common with being launched in a specialized capsule from the orbital carriership, landing directly on the battlefield or being even shot through directly inside the enemy structures? Because y’know, we have to have some criteria. I can see what you say, that ODST in Halo are not the ODST in Quake2, but ultimately, the theme is basically the same, these are that type of soldiers, this is that method.

Two things can be similar but completely unrelated. Bungie may not have taken inspiration from the Quake franchise at all. id Software and Bungie may have both looked to Starship Troopers for inspiration when creating infantry inserted via orbital drop.

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> Two things can be similar but completely unrelated. Bungie may not have taken inspiration from the Quake franchise at all. id Software and Bungie may have both looked to Starship Troopers for inspiration when creating infantry inserted via orbital drop.

You just basically stated that two people can come up with the same idea independently, without having anything to do with one another or even sharing the same sources, nonetheless the latter one is harder to prove, especially if things differ beyond just mere interpretation. But ODST seems ODST pretty much to me. Also I agree they could have both taken the inspiration from Starship Troopers, why not? Nonetheless, in digital gaming, Quake2 is the pioneer of ODST taken as a pattern.

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> > 2535437652903765;6:
> > Two things can be similar but completely unrelated. Bungie may not have taken inspiration from the Quake franchise at all. id Software and Bungie may have both looked to Starship Troopers for inspiration when creating infantry inserted via orbital drop.
>
> You just basically stated that two people can come up with the same idea independently, without having anything to do with one another or even sharing the same sources, nonetheless the latter one is harder to prove, especially if things differ beyond just mere interpretation.

Um… yes. That was my point.

> But ODST seems ODST pretty much to me.

And your point is…?

> Also I agree they could have both taken the inspiration from Starship Troopers, why not? Nonetheless, in digital gaming, Quake2 is the pioneer of ODST taken as a pattern.

Quake II may have introduced the idea of orbital troop insertion to video games, but given that Bungie’s inspiration was from Heinlein’s Starship Troopers, why does that matter?

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> Quake II may have introduced the idea of orbital troop insertion to video games, but given that Bungie’s inspiration was from Heinlein’s Starship Troopers, why does that matter?

Just consider the roots of ODST pattern and actually a very formidable shape of ODST pattern to have been pioneered in digital gaming by Quake2. Nothing more, but also nothing less.

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> @EdgeHedgehog, you say that you doubt ODST and shocktroopers from Quake2 - mind I am talking about the formal sequel in the franchise - have anything in common. Allright, how would you define “orbital drop shocktroopers”? Do they have anything in common with being launched in a specialized capsule from the orbital carriership, landing directly on the battlefield or being even shot through directly inside the enemy structures? Because y’know, we have to have some criteria. I can see what you say, that ODST in Halo are not the ODST in Quake2, but ultimately, the theme is basically the same, these are that type of soldiers, this is that method.

They have in common that they drop from high altitude.That was it.Otherwise,they are pretty diffrent.
And if you want to talk to me,please use the quote or the mention feauture,because @+shortlink doesnt show up in the notifications.

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> > 2535469324078285;5:
> > (…)
>
> They have in common that they drop from high altitude.That was it.Otherwise,they are pretty diffrent.
> And if you want to talk to me,please use the quote or the mention feauture,because @+shortlink doesnt show up in the notifications.

Let me put it this way: what is ODST?

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> > 2535408730995228;10:
> > > 2535469324078285;5:
> > > (…)
> >
> > They have in common that they drop from high altitude.That was it.Otherwise,they are pretty diffrent.
> > And if you want to talk to me,please use the quote or the mention feauture,because @+shortlink doesnt show up in the notifications.
>
> Let me put it this way: what is ODST?

A paratrooper on stereoids.Halo exclusive.
The idea of using airborn shocktrooper existed for quite a while now.
Both,the ODST and the Quake troopers are paratroopers,but they have evolved independent from each other.
The ODST got inspired by the Mobile infantery and the Quake trooper by whatever the creator from Quake took as insporation.(If you know it,please tell it me).

Well okay, lets just end it up here with nobody really knowing nothing, wanting to define nothing and just saying everything is exclusive. Also by no means am I any representative of any company that either exists or has existed in consecutive nearest past. I am just a dude asking questions.