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Games Other Halo
1

First of all, Grifball’s requirements are completely different than those of traditional competitive Halo multiplayer. Grifball gets its own game type – just like fans of zombie got Flood Mode – because that’s what it is: a gametype. It’s a niche market with a very specific framework. 343 saw a way that it could support that community, so it did.

MLG, on the other hand, is a collection of constantly changing, constantly updating gametypes and maps, so the needs of the community can’t be fulfilled with a single gametype. You’re ignoring all of the foundational things that 343 has done for competitive gaming.

So what has MLG gotten? First of all, several maps designed specifically for competitive MLG-style gaming (I’m thinking of Adrift). More importantly, 343 has given you the most customizable Halo experience yet. MLG will have an unprecedented level of flexibility in fine tuning the exact competitive experience it wants to create. That’s a big deal. On top of that, you have a much-improved forge mode that will make it even easier for the MLG community to create and share competitive maps. Competitive gaming is a dynamic and user-generated experience; 343 can’t build that for you, so it gave you all the tools to build it for yourself.

Also, remember that as large as the competitive community is, it’s still a fraction of the Halo community overall. 343 has just as much responsibility to the 50 percent of people who never play Halo multiplayer as they do to competitive gamers.

In short, the entire Halo 4 experience has been designed to accomodate MLG and competitive gamers. If you’re hungry for your own playlist, you will get it in Slayer Pro, and I’m sure that once MLG gets its hands on the game and actually has a chance to develop its gametypes, you will have a dedicated MLG playlist. What more do you want?

Monitor notes:

  1. It’s Grifball. One ‘f’ please!

  2. Do not single out others.

2

  1. adrift isnt that good of a competitive map, its not like it cant be used for certain gametype however overall the map isnt all that competitive. I personally see haven and solace as better examples but whatever you say bro.

  2. you talk about 343i giving the competitive community the “tools” necessary for competitive play, this is ridiculous on so many levels. it is true that they could always make their own maps and settings, however this can really kill the amount of people playing in such playlists. what Im basically saying is that the ideal halo is the one played out of the box.

clan system, ranking system, spectator mode among other things are ALL things that the competitive community could greatly benefit from that 343 has yet to confirm/add to halo.

in the end you can debate all you want to about how much 343 has done for the competitive community, however it is very clear which community is supported more.

  1. who the hell is sugarierauto578?
3

> 1. adrift isnt that good of a competitive map, its not like it cant be used for certain gametype however overall the map isnt all that competitive. I personally see haven and solace as better examples but whatever you say bro.
>
> 2. you talk about 343i giving the competitive community the “tools” necessary for competitive play, this is ridiculous on so many levels. it is true that they could always make their own maps and settings, however this can really kill the amount of people playing in such playlists. what Im basically saying is that the ideal halo is the one played out of the box.
>
> <mark>clan system, ranking system, spectator mode</mark> among other things are ALL things that the competitive community could greatly benefit from that 343 has yet to confirm/add to halo.
>
> in the end you can debate all you want to about how much 343 has done for the competitive community, however it is very clear which community is supported more.
>
> 3. who the hell is sugarierauto578?

I agree with you about the out of the box point you brought up. Like the OP said, 343 has as much responsibility to one half of the community as it does to the other, so the out of the box game should be able to cater to both.
I just thought it would be worth noting that clan systems can’t exist due to complications with Microsoft. They don’t want users having a 2nd friends list, and Live doesn’t support the feature. The ranking system hasn’t even been officially explained yet and people still feel the need to jump to conclusions and be quick to state that it isn’t included in H4. And I guess a spectator mode is something 343 could have gotten around to… especially since people have been asking for it for as long as the game has even been in development.
I do think you’re right about 343 catering to a certain community more then the other. All the info they’ve put emphasis on has that community in mind. It’s obvious who they’re trying to market the game to, but I don’t think that means the game will be strictly for them.

4

Your post doesn’t really make all that much sense. Firstly Adrift is not a good competitive map, as too many of the areas are isolated and do not provide many options for teamwork.

Second, you make a big deal of supposedly saying that this is the most customizable game yet, when the whole CTF gametype has been changed drastically from its once competitive nature, and is now completely unchangeable. The current CTF in H4 will be virtually unusable by MLG.

Third, the MLG community no longer want to tweak their way into a niche, where a lot of casual gamers lose interest and stop watching it. Halo is struggling at events because it is too far removed from original gameplay. Therefore MLG are trying to use as many of the standard gametypes as possible, but 343 are not making it easy. Especially with stuff like the CTF, and random and personal ordinances.

So your post was rather invalid…

5

> 1. adrift isnt that good of a competitive map, its not like it cant be used for certain gametype however overall the map isnt all that competitive. I personally see haven and solace as better examples but whatever you say bro.
>
> 2. you talk about 343i giving the competitive community the “tools” necessary for competitive play, this is ridiculous on so many levels. it is true that they could always make their own maps and settings, however this can really kill the amount of people playing in such playlists. what Im basically saying is that the ideal halo is the one played out of the box.
>
> clan system, ranking system, spectator mode among other things are ALL things that the competitive community could greatly benefit from that 343 has yet to confirm/add to halo.
>
> in the end you can debate all you want to about how much 343 has done for the competitive community, however it is very clear which community is supported more.
>
> 3. who the hell is sugarierauto578?

  1. Being someone who has played the game and has played on Adrift, I’ll have to say that I think you’re VERY wrong… Adrift was a very fun and competitive map with very faced paced action. Same thing goes for Haven. But Solace… Damn, I actually didn’t like that map. It was boring and slightly frustrating…

  2. 343 are catering to the competitive audience. Most of the things you named either can’t be done, or is already confirmed in. Clan system can’t happen because Microsoft doesn’t like the idea. Skill based ranking system already confirmed to be in by Frankie himself and spectator mode was confirmed to not be in due to the fact that it could cause major lag on their servers and could lower the experience for others, so they didn’t put it in.

  3. No damn clue.

6

> Your post doesn’t really make all that much sense. Firstly Adrift is not a good competitive map, as too many of the areas are isolated and do not provide many options for teamwork.
>
> Second, you make a big deal of supposedly saying that this is the most customizable game yet, when the whole CTF gametype has been changed drastically from its once competitive nature, and is now completely unchangeable. The current CTF in H4 will be virtually unusable by MLG.
>
> Third, the MLG community no longer want to tweak their way into a niche, where a lot of casual gamers lose interest and stop watching it. Halo is struggling at events because it is too far removed from original gameplay. Therefore MLG are trying to use as many of the standard gametypes as possible, but 343 are not making it easy. Especially with stuff like the CTF, and random and personal ordinances.
>
> So your post was rather invalid…

Thanks for your post. Sorry, I’m quite new to this forum thing … my post was originally intended as a reply but it seems to have posted as a new topic. I’ll figure it out eventually.

More to your points:

No need for the frustration, friend. I used Adrift as an example only because Kynan Pearson singled it out as a map intentionally designed for competitive play, and I did not recall hearing that about any other maps. It seems a bit premature for you to write off a map that hasn’t even been released to the public yet.

Yes, CTF has been drastically changed. I don’t particularly like the changes they’ve made there either – I do not intend to imply that 343i is perfect or will make a perfect game. But again, it’s premature to say CTF will be “unusable” by MLG. Christ, MLG found a way to make STARCRAFT a competitive game that people want to watch, and it’s an RTS. As for the ordinance business, you should know that random/personal ordinance is only in Infinity Slayer. In Slayer Pro weapon drops are tuned to function exactly like classic weapon spawns. They are on timers and will drop to the same location every time they spawn.

And finally, I repeat: competitive and MLG players (and I am a competitive player) are a minority in the Halo community. Like it or not, friend, we ARE a niche. Hyper-competitive gaming always will be. When MLG had Halo 3 on the circuit they did not have audience problems, and it was quite removed from ‘original gameplay’ even then. Personally, I think that MLG Reach has suffered because Reach itself suffered. Bloom was terrible, and most of the armor abilities were terrible. Competitive gaming became a lot more about mastering all those variables and a lot less about individual talent. I also agree with the people who want a skill-based ranking system in H4. I truly believe that taking out the 1-50 system was the worst mistake Bungie made with Reach.

If the Halo community as a whole enjoys Halo 4 and continues to play it years after the release as we did with H3, MLG H4 will stay popular. People don’t pay money to watch games they don’t play; that’s just how it is.

7

Firstly, OP, nicely written post.

Explanations without flaming, presenting clear points for discussion, and labeling the singling out of others is not allowed.

You get a higher level of respect for those points. Now to your post…

> First of all, Grifball’s requirements are completely different than those of traditional competitive Halo multiplayer. Grifball gets its own game type – just like fans of zombie got Flood Mode – because that’s what it is: a gametype. It’s a niche market with a very specific framework. 343 saw a way that it could support that community, so it did.

Overall good points, but the competitive merit to those gametypes is hardly what competitive gamers would ideally like. For the longest time, competitive gamers have been asking for a spectator mode to draw in greater amounts of people, they have asked for a ranking structure to rival the 1-50 system when it was announced it wouldn’t return, they have asked for a clan system similar to that of Halo 2.

While 343 has listened to some of these ideas, none of them are in the game. Whatever the reason may be, whatever logic has been approved of, 343 has chosen to not input them. From a competitive gamer standpoint, this is frustrating. You expect a game developer to care about its individual assets (the player base) but three simple requests could not be honored? On top of the modifications and, in my opinion, down grades they have made for Halo 4?

Sorry, but they have a point and 343 needs to understand there is a way to do things. It’s in their best interest, at this point in time, to consider the idea of hiring a consulting firm to help there efforts. While they may continue existing after all of this, they are in need of understanding the public business side of things. A failure like we’ve seen in the past few weeks needs to be fixed if 343 looks to broaden the horizons the way Bungie has accomplished before.

> MLG, on the other hand, is a collection of constantly changing, constantly updating gametypes and maps, so the needs of the community can’t be fulfilled with a single gametype. You’re ignoring all of the foundational things that 343 has done for competitive gaming.
>
> So what has MLG gotten? First of all, several maps designed specifically for competitive MLG-style gaming (I’m thinking of Adrift). More importantly, 343 has given you the most customizable Halo experience yet. MLG will have an unprecedented level of flexibility in fine tuning the exact competitive experience it wants to create. That’s a big deal. On top of that, you have a much-improved forge mode that will make it even easier for the MLG community to create and share competitive maps. Competitive gaming is a dynamic and user-generated experience; 343 can’t build that for you, so it gave you all the tools to build it for yourself.

All very good and noteworthy points. I agree.

> Also, remember that as large as the competitive community is, it’s still a fraction of the Halo community overall. 343 has just as much responsibility to the 50 percent of people who never play Halo multiplayer as they do to competitive gamers.

I agree.

> In short, the entire Halo 4 experience has been designed to accomodate MLG and competitive gamers. If you’re hungry for your own playlist, you will get it in Slayer Pro, and I’m sure that once MLG gets its hands on the game and actually has a chance to develop its gametypes, you will have a dedicated MLG playlist. What more do you want?

The items listed above.

Beyond that, competitive gamers of all calibers would always like higher recognition and a trophy or two signed by the development teams… /sarcasm