No Forge is better than buggy Forge. There, I said it.
A working co-op on launch is better than a working co-op a month after launch. There, I said it.
The problem here isn’t buggy vs. polished. Rather, it’s one of promises not being kept. The idea of the initial delay was to launch the game in a complete state, something that was universally appreciated. The latest idea is to launch the game with missing features and eventually add those missing features in.
For me, it raises questions about whether or not the existing features that will launch are going to be polished or not. If major features are missing, what else should we be concerned about?
> 2533274858347535;2:
> A working co-op on launch is better than a working co-op a month after launch. There, I said it.
Maybe so but it is what it is at this point. The core components that make the game aka Campaign and MP are shipping Day 1 with or without the Co-Op.
> 2533274858347535;2:
> A working co-op on launch is better than a working co-op a month after launch. There, I said it.
Jeez what a pointless thing to say. Not a single soul is claiming its a good thing that coop and forge won’t be there at release. You aren’t brave or saying some ‘gotcha’ point by saying this. We get that you are mad, but can you gain some perspective at least?
It is so unbelievably sad that people can’t understand this point. I knew the community was known for its toxic takes and anger, but I really thought most of that was in the past. Such an entitled group of people, I genuinely can’t understand it. In what world do people really want buggy messes and crashes, compared to waiting for something that is buttery smooth? And to those who say they don’t want that, they would rather the game be delayed until it is all ready, you accomplish nothing by screaming at 343 on twitter and reddit and even in these forums, because the poor devs didn’t wanna release it broken either, or have to release forge and coop separately, that was a Microsoft decision. You can express disapproval, but you can behave like a functioning adult when you do it.
> 2533274824050480;3:
> The problem here isn’t buggy vs. polished. Rather, it’s one of promises not being kept. The idea of the initial delay was to launch the game in a complete state, something that was universally appreciated. The latest idea is to launch the game with missing features and eventually add those missing features in.
>
> For me, it raises questions about whether or not the existing features that will launch are going to be polished or not. If major features are missing, what else should we be concerned about?
im glad to hear not everybody is being an ignorant fanboy about this because, yes, this very concerning. i have been suspicious of infinite ever since the delay. the departure of head staff did not help with my fears. if this isn’t all 343 have had to cut, I fear to see what else might be missing from infinite.
> 2533274802341352;6:
> It is so unbelievably sad that people can’t understand this point. I knew the community was known for its toxic takes and anger, but I really thought most of that was in the past. Such an entitled group of people, I genuinely can’t understand it. In what world do people really want buggy messes and crashes, compared to waiting for something that is buttery smooth? And to those who say they don’t want that, they would rather the game be delayed until it is all ready, you accomplish nothing by screaming at 343 on twitter and reddit and even in these forums, because the poor devs didn’t wanna release it broken either, or have to release forge and coop separately, that was a Microsoft decision. You can express disapproval, but you can behave like a functioning adult when you do it.
im not sure where exactly where this is coming from, but my thing is that there doing it again. MCC released broken and buggy. 5 released with an incomplete multiplayer. We want Infinite to release stable, polished, and complete. We don’t care how long it takes. We want it done right or not at all.
> 2533274966926413;8:
> > 2533274802341352;6:
> > It is so unbelievably sad that people can’t understand this point. I knew the community was known for its toxic takes and anger, but I really thought most of that was in the past. Such an entitled group of people, I genuinely can’t understand it. In what world do people really want buggy messes and crashes, compared to waiting for something that is buttery smooth? And to those who say they don’t want that, they would rather the game be delayed until it is all ready, you accomplish nothing by screaming at 343 on twitter and reddit and even in these forums, because the poor devs didn’t wanna release it broken either, or have to release forge and coop separately, that was a Microsoft decision. You can express disapproval, but you can behave like a functioning adult when you do it.
>
> im not sure where exactly where this is coming from, but my thing is that there doing it again. MCC released broken and buggy. 5 released with an incomplete multiplayer. We want Infinite to release stable, polished, and complete. We don’t care how long it takes. We want it done right or not at all.
As much as I agree with you, and I do agree with you, that desire doesn’t matter to Microsoft. We are lucky we got a full year delay. As for MCC being released broken and buggy, the decision to delay forge and coop is an action that keeps Infinite from being buggy at launch. As for the incomplete multiplayer like Halo 5, we don’t know what will be a part of multiplayer at launch, and so saying multiplayer will flop is just being disingenuous. Delaying forge and coop are decisions that help make what we do get stable, polished, and complete. Again, there are no more delays, Microsoft won’t allow it. So now it is more about what all do we release? Just the stable polished bits, or all of it, including bugs that might crash campaigns or cause all kinds of issues, or a forge that corrupts peoples files or breaks in other ways? Again, I do wish that we got all of these features at launch, and I do think that another delay would be healthy, but we are past that point. Like it or not, for a release date coming up in a couple months, it is smarter and safer to not launch the game with incomplete features.
No Halo is better than unfinished Halo. There I said it.
> 2533274802341352;6:
> It is so unbelievably sad that people can’t understand this point. I knew the community was known for its toxic takes and anger, but I really thought most of that was in the past. Such an entitled group of people, I genuinely can’t understand it. In what world do people really want buggy messes and crashes, compared to waiting for something that is buttery smooth? And to those who say they don’t want that, they would rather the game be delayed until it is all ready, you accomplish nothing by screaming at 343 on twitter and reddit and even in these forums, because the poor devs didn’t wanna release it broken either, or have to release forge and coop separately, that was a Microsoft decision. You can express disapproval, but you can behave like a functioning adult when you do it.
lol, if you think that just because they cut coop campaign and forge for launch means the game is going to be buttery smooth, you’re in a for a rude awakening (or an insane amount of detachment from reality). No, it means the game we’re getting is going to be such a buggy mess that certain features aren’t even up to the state of being a buggy mess.
> 2533274802341352;9:
> > 2533274966926413;8:
> > > 2533274802341352;6:
> > > It is so unbelievably sad that people can’t understand this point. I knew the community was known for its toxic takes and anger, but I really thought most of that was in the past. Such an entitled group of people, I genuinely can’t understand it. In what world do people really want buggy messes and crashes, compared to waiting for something that is buttery smooth? And to those who say they don’t want that, they would rather the game be delayed until it is all ready, you accomplish nothing by screaming at 343 on twitter and reddit and even in these forums, because the poor devs didn’t wanna release it broken either, or have to release forge and coop separately, that was a Microsoft decision. You can express disapproval, but you can behave like a functioning adult when you do it.
> >
> > im not sure where exactly where this is coming from, but my thing is that there doing it again. MCC released broken and buggy. 5 released with an incomplete multiplayer. We want Infinite to release stable, polished, and complete. We don’t care how long it takes. We want it done right or not at all.
>
> As much as I agree with you, and I do agree with you, that desire doesn’t matter to Microsoft. We are lucky we got a full year delay. As for MCC being released broken and buggy, the decision to delay forge and coop is an action that keeps Infinite from being buggy at launch. As for the incomplete multiplayer like Halo 5, we don’t know what will be a part of multiplayer at launch, and so saying multiplayer will flop is just being disingenuous. Delaying forge and coop are decisions that help make what we do get stable, polished, and complete. Again, there are no more delays, Microsoft won’t allow it. So now it is more about what all do we release? Just the stable polished bits, or all of it, including bugs that might crash campaigns or cause all kinds of issues, or a forge that corrupts peoples files or breaks in other ways? Again, I do wish that we got all of these features at launch, and I do think that another delay would be healthy, but we are past that point. Like it or not, for a release date coming up in a couple months, it is smarter and safer to not launch the game with incomplete features.
They don’t need to launch them with incomplete features, launch it with them complete 
it’s that easy. Instead the day one impressions will get hit, as well as missing features effecting its reviews. It’s so sad people have gotten so used to half -Yoinked!- games that now we’re letting stuff like this slide lol. Some of us have standards
What an extraordinary and deep thought, to say that you are the greatest thinker of our time would be the understatement of the century!
> 2533274923562209;11:
> > 2533274802341352;9:
> > > 2533274966926413;8:
> > > > 2533274802341352;6:
> > > > It is so unbelievably sad that people can’t understand this point. I knew the community was known for its toxic takes and anger, but I really thought most of that was in the past. Such an entitled group of people, I genuinely can’t understand it. In what world do people really want buggy messes and crashes, compared to waiting for something that is buttery smooth? And to those who say they don’t want that, they would rather the game be delayed until it is all ready, you accomplish nothing by screaming at 343 on twitter and reddit and even in these forums, because the poor devs didn’t wanna release it broken either, or have to release forge and coop separately, that was a Microsoft decision. You can express disapproval, but you can behave like a functioning adult when you do it.
> > >
> > > im not sure where exactly where this is coming from, but my thing is that there doing it again. MCC released broken and buggy. 5 released with an incomplete multiplayer. We want Infinite to release stable, polished, and complete. We don’t care how long it takes. We want it done right or not at all.
> >
> > As much as I agree with you, and I do agree with you, that desire doesn’t matter to Microsoft. We are lucky we got a full year delay. As for MCC being released broken and buggy, the decision to delay forge and coop is an action that keeps Infinite from being buggy at launch. As for the incomplete multiplayer like Halo 5, we don’t know what will be a part of multiplayer at launch, and so saying multiplayer will flop is just being disingenuous. Delaying forge and coop are decisions that help make what we do get stable, polished, and complete. Again, there are no more delays, Microsoft won’t allow it. So now it is more about what all do we release? Just the stable polished bits, or all of it, including bugs that might crash campaigns or cause all kinds of issues, or a forge that corrupts peoples files or breaks in other ways? Again, I do wish that we got all of these features at launch, and I do think that another delay would be healthy, but we are past that point. Like it or not, for a release date coming up in a couple months, it is smarter and safer to not launch the game with incomplete features.
>
> They don’t need to launch them with incomplete features, launch it with them complete it’s that easy. Instead the day one impressions will get hit, as well as missing features effecting its reviews. It’s so sad people have gotten so used to half -Yoinked!- games that now we’re letting stuff like this slide lol. Some of us have standards
Did you just skip over everything I said? Obviously as a fellow consumer of a game I’ve been playing since I was like 8 years old, I want it to be complete when it launches. But you and me aren’t in charge of making that decision are we? In fact, the actual dudes making the game aren’t in charge of that decision either. Some number cruncher guy disconnected from the studio is saying “money number will go up if you release it this year, and we like when that happens, so release it”. And when 343 says “hey the game is missing some features, can we get a delay?” all that number cruncher dude hears is “money number must wait to go up” which is unacceptable. I know it sounds dumb, because it is, but that’s just how business works. If you don’t like that, you might need to look more into how to increase the say employees have in their own workplace. So, with that in mind, <em>the game will release this year, no matter what, even if the game crashes instantly upon launching.</em> So, 343 are doing the best they can to ensure that the gameplay experience is smooth and reliable, which means not releasing unfinished content on day 1. This does in fact mean that there IS finished content, such as the campaign itself, and multiplayer itself. Making games ain’t easy, and it’s a lot harder when the higher ups just wanna see the money number go up. Telling 343 they should just release the game when it’s finished is just preaching to the choir.
> 2533274793006817;10:
> No Halo is better than unfinished Halo. There I said it.
>
>
> > 2533274802341352;6:
> > It is so unbelievably sad that people can’t understand this point. I knew the community was known for its toxic takes and anger, but I really thought most of that was in the past. Such an entitled group of people, I genuinely can’t understand it. In what world do people really want buggy messes and crashes, compared to waiting for something that is buttery smooth? And to those who say they don’t want that, they would rather the game be delayed until it is all ready, you accomplish nothing by screaming at 343 on twitter and reddit and even in these forums, because the poor devs didn’t wanna release it broken either, or have to release forge and coop separately, that was a Microsoft decision. You can express disapproval, but you can behave like a functioning adult when you do it.
>
> lol, if you think that just because they cut coop campaign and forge for launch means the game is going to be buttery smooth, you’re in a for a rude awakening (or an insane amount of detachment from reality). No, it means the game we’re getting is going to be such a buggy mess that certain features aren’t even up to the state of being a buggy mess.
Well damn, didn’t know you got an early copy and have been experiencing all the bugs and broken features. This is just baseless speculation my guy. You might be right, you might be dead wrong, but we, all of us, shouldn’t just be using these bad faith arguments all the time.
If Forge and Coop released in whatever the current state is now, we already know these crazy fans will be at 343’s throats. 343 just take your time and deliver the game, no matter what 343 does people are just guna scream at them
> 2533274802341352;14:
> > 2533274793006817;10:
> > No Halo is better than unfinished Halo. There I said it.
> >
> >
> > > 2533274802341352;6:
> > > It is so unbelievably sad that people can’t understand this point. I knew the community was known for its toxic takes and anger, but I really thought most of that was in the past. Such an entitled group of people, I genuinely can’t understand it. In what world do people really want buggy messes and crashes, compared to waiting for something that is buttery smooth? And to those who say they don’t want that, they would rather the game be delayed until it is all ready, you accomplish nothing by screaming at 343 on twitter and reddit and even in these forums, because the poor devs didn’t wanna release it broken either, or have to release forge and coop separately, that was a Microsoft decision. You can express disapproval, but you can behave like a functioning adult when you do it.
> >
> > lol, if you think that just because they cut coop campaign and forge for launch means the game is going to be buttery smooth, you’re in a for a rude awakening (or an insane amount of detachment from reality). No, it means the game we’re getting is going to be such a buggy mess that certain features aren’t even up to the state of being a buggy mess.
>
> Well damn, didn’t know you got an early copy and have been experiencing all the bugs and broken features. This is just baseless speculation my guy. You might be right, you might be dead wrong, but we, all of us, shouldn’t just be using these bad faith arguments all the time.
You know what is wild speculation? Thinking that anybody that says they should delay the game is a toxic nonfunctioning adult. Saying that anybody who thinks they should have had the game done, a game several years in development and even got an extra year delay from a game they considered releasing last year mind you, “eNTitLeD” is pretty wild, baseless speculation too.
Damn, didn’t know you have done a deep psychiatric assessment of every single person talking about Halo Infinite. Or you know, maybe we shouldn’t just be using these bad faith arguments all the time, such as “if you disagree with exactly what I think you’re entitled toxic bad mans.”
> 2535450418639942;15:
> If Forge and Coop released in whatever the current state is now, we already know these crazy fans will be at 343’s throats. 343 just take your time and deliver the game, no matter what 343 does people are just guna scream at them
I almost wonder if Bungie was still in charge of making Halo and was in this same predicament how many of them would, instead of making pointless posts about demanding delays that won’t happen, be instead saying “I can wait 3 months, I know Bungie will deliver in due time! :)”
> 2533274802341352;5:
> > 2533274858347535;2:
> > A working co-op on launch is better than a working co-op a month after launch. There, I said it.
>
> Jeez what a pointless thing to say. Not a single soul is claiming its a good thing that coop and forge won’t be there at release. You aren’t brave or saying some ‘gotcha’ point by saying this. We get that you are mad, but can you gain some perspective at least?
The perspective is that 343i have been working on this game for 6 years, and after having the game delayed for a year, they still can’t provide basic features that older Halos on 3 year dev cycles had at launch.
Bear in mind that 343i are a much bigger team than Bungie ever were as well, and no doubt have more resources at their disposal.
> 2533274793006817;16:
> > 2533274802341352;14:
> > > 2533274793006817;10:
> > > No Halo is better than unfinished Halo. There I said it.
> > >
> > >
> > > > 2533274802341352;6:
> > > > It is so unbelievably sad that people can’t understand this point. I knew the community was known for its toxic takes and anger, but I really thought most of that was in the past. Such an entitled group of people, I genuinely can’t understand it. In what world do people really want buggy messes and crashes, compared to waiting for something that is buttery smooth? And to those who say they don’t want that, they would rather the game be delayed until it is all ready, you accomplish nothing by screaming at 343 on twitter and reddit and even in these forums, because the poor devs didn’t wanna release it broken either, or have to release forge and coop separately, that was a Microsoft decision. You can express disapproval, but you can behave like a functioning adult when you do it.
> > >
> > > lol, if you think that just because they cut coop campaign and forge for launch means the game is going to be buttery smooth, you’re in a for a rude awakening (or an insane amount of detachment from reality). No, it means the game we’re getting is going to be such a buggy mess that certain features aren’t even up to the state of being a buggy mess.
> >
> > Well damn, didn’t know you got an early copy and have been experiencing all the bugs and broken features. This is just baseless speculation my guy. You might be right, you might be dead wrong, but we, all of us, shouldn’t just be using these bad faith arguments all the time.
>
> You know what is wild speculation? Thinking that anybody that says they should delay the game is a toxic nonfunctioning adult. Saying that anybody who thinks they should have had the game done, a game several years in development and even got an extra year delay from a game they considered releasing last year mind you, “eNTitLeD” is pretty wild, baseless speculation too.
>
> Damn, didn’t know you have done a deep psychiatric assessment of every single person talking about Halo Infinite. Or you know, maybe we shouldn’t just be using these bad faith arguments all the time, such as “if you disagree with exactly what I think you’re entitled toxic bad mans.”
You seem a little tilted. Maybe the shoe fit then huh? Look man, don’t even pretend like you haven’t seen literally dozens of people, if not more, lose their absolute minds over this stuff. And yea totally, I absolutely said that anyone who didn’t agree with exactly what I was saying was a toxic nonfunctioning adult, and entitled. You really got me there. Why did you even change what you were originally talking about in order to attack me, anyway? Realize you were… just… baselessly speculating…?
> 2533274796617122;18:
> > 2533274802341352;5:
> > > 2533274858347535;2:
> > > A working co-op on launch is better than a working co-op a month after launch. There, I said it.
> >
> > Jeez what a pointless thing to say. Not a single soul is claiming its a good thing that coop and forge won’t be there at release. You aren’t brave or saying some ‘gotcha’ point by saying this. We get that you are mad, but can you gain some perspective at least?
>
> The perspective is that 343i have been working on this game for 6 years, and after having the game delayed for a year, they still can’t provide basic features that older Halos on 3 year dev cycles had at launch.
>
> Bear in mind that 343i are a much bigger team than Bungie ever were as well, and no doubt have more resources at their disposal.
To be a bit more fair, half of that time was spent building an entirely new engine. As for the rest of the time (and even that time) 343 had to start making everything cross platform, which the people working on Halo have never had to do bar MCC. Not to mention that games are far bigger, more detailed, and way more complex than they ever used to be. I think it is totally fair to say that games take more time to make these days, and definitely more time to make good. Unfortunately, there are no doubt higher ups who either don’t know this, or don’t care (probably both) and are demanding this game get released at a certain time finished or not. And I don’t even think that hiring more people who make this better necessarily, as there is such a thing as ‘too many chefs in the kitchen’. Not to mention Covid having the entire team working from home for over a year now. The team has faced a lot of challenges, and the least we can do is keep that in mind.