The only overpowered weapon is the Magnum. Everything else works just fine.
> People complain about no bloom because the better player wins now, and that is not “fair”.
Lol QFT
> > People complain about no bloom because the better player wins now, and that is not “fair”.
>
> Lol QFT
Except that’s flawed because even in default Reach the better play can and still usually does win. Skill still is there no matter how you look at it, so it wasn’t “fair” from the start and it’d be even less “fair” now. Either way, I don’t mind the additions, I however dislike people believing they are a Godsend and think that the previous version was just the equivalent of a pile of crap sprinkled with glitter.
> All it needs is a RoF cap and it will be awesome.
Agreed.
> > > > Instead of reducing bloom they should increase it for the DMR.
> > >
> > > Neither increasing nor decreasing bloom works due to the way bloom, bullet magnetism, and the code for coming up with a random spot where a bullet lands under bloom interact with each other. Regardless of whether you increase or decrease bloom, spamming will be more effective than pacing your shots, which is why zero bloom is the only viable solution.
> >
> > im not sure this can be proven, until we can tinker with 120% bloom (or more bloom).
> >
> > to me, more bloom seems like the obvious solution to our perceived problem in ‘bloom’.
> >
> > no bloom is also a great way to make our problem go away, however.
>
> Increasing bloom doesn’t work because the code responsible in Reach for determining a random location where a bullet goes inside the reticle when it’s expanded by bloom places it close to the reticle’s center far too much.
>
> You can verify that yourself if you start a custom game on a non-Forge map (no decals on Forge objects) like Countdown. Start shooting the DMR as quickly as possible until the reticle has reached its maximum size (i.e. full bloom) and quickly turn to face a wall; keep shooting so bloom doesn’t reset. Empty the remaining magazine into the wall and you’ll notice that an unproportional large number of bullets hit quite close to the reticle’s center.
>
> If you now add bullet magnetism to the equation, you’ll easily see that this will result in a large amounts of bullets hitting the target despite bloom.
>
> Additionally, someone pacing his shoots will have to wait longer for his bloom to reset to an acceptable level than he has to wait with default bloom. This in turn means that a spammer can fire even more rounds in the same time than his pacing opponent. And with bullet magnetism and the tendency for bullets to hit close to the reticle’s center this will not benefit pacing shooters but spammers.
>
> In a nutshell, increasing bloom also increases the time it takes for a pacing shooter to kill his opponents, and spammers benefit from this since even though they are going to miss more rounds, being able to fire even more rounds more than makes up for that.
What he said. bloom is broken and random. i’d rather know where my shot is going to land, not just guess.
> > > > Instead of reducing bloom they should increase it for the DMR.
> > >
> > > Neither increasing nor decreasing bloom works due to the way bloom, bullet magnetism, and the code for coming up with a random spot where a bullet lands under bloom interact with each other. Regardless of whether you increase or decrease bloom, spamming will be more effective than pacing your shots, which is why zero bloom is the only viable solution.
> >
> > im not sure this can be proven, until we can tinker with 120% bloom (or more bloom).
> >
> > to me, more bloom seems like the obvious solution to our perceived problem in ‘bloom’.
> >
> > no bloom is also a great way to make our problem go away, however.
>
> Increasing bloom doesn’t work because the code responsible in Reach for determining a random location where a bullet goes inside the reticle when it’s expanded by bloom places it close to the reticle’s center far too much.
>
> You can verify that yourself if you start a custom game on a non-Forge map (no decals on Forge objects) like Countdown. Start shooting the DMR as quickly as possible until the reticle has reached its maximum size (i.e. full bloom) and quickly turn to face a wall; keep shooting so bloom doesn’t reset. Empty the remaining magazine into the wall and you’ll notice that an unproportional large number of bullets hit quite close to the reticle’s center.
>
> If you now add bullet magnetism to the equation, you’ll easily see that this will result in a large amounts of bullets hitting the target despite bloom.
>
> Additionally, someone pacing his shoots will have to wait longer for his bloom to reset to an acceptable level than he has to wait with default bloom. This in turn means that a spammer can fire even more rounds in the same time than his pacing opponent. And with bullet magnetism and the tendency for bullets to hit close to the reticle’s center this will not benefit pacing shooters but spammers.
>
> In a nutshell, increasing bloom also increases the time it takes for a pacing shooter to kill his opponents, and spammers benefit from this since even though they are going to miss more rounds, being able to fire even more rounds more than makes up for that.
So then what would think would be a good way to solve it keep it at 85%? Or change the reticule and make it slightly bigger?
I would like to mention that bullet spread has been in ALL HALO GAMES, Reach just shows it as visual bloom. If 343i modded the gametype to still have bullet spread with no visible bloom effect, then you still have vanilla Reach gameplay, but people wouldn’t know that, they would just spam the trigger thinking that all shots hit, then go WTF. That is how the previous games played, you had pace your shots with accurate weapons, ZB in its current form encourages the “who shoots first wins” concept because of no bullet spread, but that doesn’t happen all the time because of other faccters like host and an individuals actual skill at getting headshots. Please, no flaming.
> Sorry bub, I’m just being objective. My numbers don’t change at all when playing ZB. I just think it feels silly. ZB Reach only serves to make tryhards THINK they are actually good. Head shots with ZB are far too easy to keep me interested.
the shooting is not a spam fest if a skilled player that times the shots that they get into someone it takes more skill and whoever can do it the best wins its the way the dmr was intended to be a skill weapon
> the shooting is not a spam fest if a skilled player that times the shots that they get into someone it takes more skill and whoever can do it the best wins its the way the dmr was intended to be a skill weapon
lol necropost.
Those who play the game on a professional level, and get paid to do so, would disagree with you.
Also, why the heck are you complaining? There are TWO playlists with ZB in it. TWO.
Go play something else and stop trolling.
WOW! I can’t believe there are players out there who actually prefer Vanilla Reach…
I guess they haven’t played any other Halo title?
After watching MLG Columbus I have to disagree 10000000000000% with this.
Bloom just slows down the gameplay way to much. Combine the slow kill times with sprint and you have a game where you can make any mistake and just sprint away before anyone can punish you for it. With no bloom, if you over extend too far away from cover, or you put yourself in a bad situation, guess what? You’re getting gunned down for it.
Bloom is also very inconsistent. Too many times players can just spam the trigger when they aren’t supposed to, and they’ll walk away with a 5 shot, while the person pacing his shots the correct way gets punished for not playing the wrong way. What this does is just create a game where everyone is spamming eachother and thus making a super random game.
I agree the kill times can be a bit longer by slowing down the RoF, but you have to understand that 343 didn’t design the DMR, and bungie never had the intention of putting it to zero bloom (even though they should have) In Halo 4 the BR won’t have bloom and will be much better because there will be a slightly longer kill time most likely, and there will be a pause in between bursts that gives players a chance to try and work around that when fighting someone.
Ultimatley though I know ZB DMR > Bloom DMR anyday. Maybe not so much in the casual playlists, but for balance and competitiveness definitely. I like to aim my shots and know when I hit them, rather then go into theater after a match to see if the bloom worked in my favor or not.
Adding bloom to halo is like trying to set a speed limit in racing games. Only in Reach’s case the cops only pull you over half of the time.
> the shooting is not a spam fest if a skilled player that times the shots that they get into someone it takes more skill and whoever can do it the best wins its the way the dmr was intended to be a skill weapon
It was Intended to be a skill weapon, but using your example what about the times where the skilled player times their shots the right way, and some player just comes up and spams 5 quick shots and gets the kill? You can’t argue that it won’t happen because it does all the time, and even if you still want to argue that, you can’t deny that there is the possibility of it happening. That makes the weapon unskilled.
Even if you want to argue “oh well it only happens very rarely” thats still a fail argument because it shouldn’t happen at all. A skill weapon should be 100% about skill, nothing luck based.
> That makes the weapon unskilled.
false dichotomy… less skilled, not unskilled.
> Even if you want to argue “oh well it only happens very rarely” thats still a fail argument because it shouldn’t happen at all. A skill weapon should be 100% about skill, nothing luck based.
Why? 100% might not be the optimal once all factors are taken in. You shouldn’t be so dogmatic with your policy claims.
5 month old thread? Really?
Are you referring to Zero Bloom Slayer? If so that is true because it simply doesn’t work except in MLG because Non-headshot weapons don’t do enough damage compared to the rof of ZB DMR/Magnum/N’ifle.
I’m not saying Zero Bloom is bad as a whole it just doesn’t work with the rest of the Reach sandbox but it works for MLG. TU works for the rest of Reach.
Of course Halo 4 should have all weapons designed with ZB(IE: proper Halo) in mind.
Well since there are only 2 playlists (MLG and ZB) that use ZB, I don’t see why it is such an issue. You have every other playlist to play in, all which have either full bloom or 85% bloom.
Personally, I think ZB requires having better aim that if there was bloom. All bloom did on the DMR was make 1v1 duels a coin flip. However, ZB on the DMR does make it a sniper rifle since it has such high range. If the DMR had lower range and a capped Rate of Fire, it would be much better.
I agree, actually being able to shoot people is not my thing, bring back the Designated marksman Random so that I have a chance of killing people who are better than me. /sarcasm.
ZB should be in every gametype, I don’t have time for any of this 85% -Yoink!-
> No bloom i think is bad, i get like one hit killed with it… Its too powerfull i think 343i should slow the fire rate down and have somewhat bloom percentage on it.
take cover and move then u won’t be killed so easily