I was really excited about it … then played one match … then remembered “Oh yeah, I hated this map in Halo 3 … I’d always veto it because I suck terribly in the damn pit.” At least it wasn’t “Snowbound”. “Virtigo” however is a blast.
> To be clear, you feel that an ability everyone will be able to do imbalances things.
Out of curiosity, by that logic are you insinuating jetpack is balanced? If so, then using that same idea I could state that a one shot kill weapon that killed everyone on the map when fired that everyone spawned with was also balanced, but obviously that is not the case.
Just because everyone can spawn with it doesn’t mean it isn’t unbalanced.
> In this case, “things” refers to previously determined paths that are still useful but are also instead now useless to someone who has a jetpack.
It’s not that it’s a previously determined path that has become useless, but a power position on the map that generally defined the outcome of events. With the implamentation of jetpack, it’s no longer a very advantageous position as it can be taken out by anybody who cares to spawn with that ability.
In the past, it required teamwork, well placed grenades or a power weapon more powerful than the Sniper (IE, rockets, OS or possibly shotty) to effectively counter the position.
Now anybody can do it at any time, assuming the sniper is otherwise engaged (or even without that, really).
So I guess you could say that, yes, it does imbalance previously determined paths, which is precisely why it is not balanced with the rest of the sandbox.
> And this started off by fearing sprint would make the 1-shot if to the head but still 2-shots regardless sniper harder to use?
You’re oversimplifying it Reaper. Then again, I view you as oversimplifying and you likely view me as overcomplicating.
But no, it started out as me pointing out the flaws of utilising The Pit with infinity settings, with the effectiveness of the sniper tower being one of the main concerns in regard to how Infinity would change the map.
So what is your take on the changes infinity could bring to the gameplay? You’ve read mine, I’d like to see what you think the possible effects of jetpack and sprint could be (as well as the now ignored comments regarding the sword room).
Only thing I don’t like about the new Pit is the amount of power weapons.
2 shotguns, a rocket launcher, 2 snipers, sword and I think there is couple Needlers too.
Also a IC spawns at some point.
not cool.
> Only thing I don’t like about the new Pit is the amount of power weapons.
>
> 2 shotguns, a rocket launcher, 2 snipers, sword and I think there is couple Needlers too.
> Also a IC spawns at some point.
> not cool.
The old pit had all that as well, and likely more I think.
Let me see:
- Rocket
- Sniper [X2]
- Mauler [X2]
- Shotgun [X2]
- Sword [X2]
- OS
- Camo
- Brute Shot [X2](I think this was in all version, don’t quote me on that.)
If you like more halo 3 pit and mecanics, why don`t you play halo 3? I play it now and then and there are always players…
It looks amazing man ? I haven’t played it yet but just by watching a few videos of it I can certainly say there is nothing to moan about.
I disagree.
It’ll take some getting used to wrt the hole in the sword room but apart from that I’m loving it.
Any ‘skill’ jumps you’re talking about were probably never intended in the original anyway, and saying it’s only good if ‘you’re a casual’ doesn’t help your argument.
I played hundreds of games on the original in Halo 3 and I love this remake already.
Pitfall isnt a bad map. Its an arena map but Halo4 isnt an arena shooter. Or maybe its Handout Halo settings…excuse me, Infinity settings. I dont even think it will play well with current Throwdown settings because sprint doesnt work well on smaller maps. Its too easy to escape, too easy. This SLOWS gameplay because running AWAY means less points being scored and more time waiting and/or chasing. Also Boltshots, Jet Packs, Camo, are made for a different style FPS. The type of FPS that empowers players at the cost of balance. I ran into all of these my first(and only) match and I turned off my 360 literally laughing out loud. Probably the most frustrating and ridiculous match I ever played, and we won!
The Pit was a map about set ups and power positions no matter the gametype. Infinity settings are based around helping every player get points. 343 said it, not me. Of course I’m paraphrasing but that about sums up Infinity. Infinity goes against the build of The Pit IMO. It has nothing to do with nostalgia. It has to do with what Halo was and what it is now. You cant force an arena style map into a custom class clusterf*@! shooter.
I dont even know anymore. Why did 343 do this? A forge remake would have saved them time and money.
> I dont even know anymore. Why did 343 do this? A forge remake would have saved them time and money.
IDK, why did Bungie do it?
> > I dont even know anymore. Why did 343 do this? A forge remake would have saved them time and money.
>
> IDK, why did Bungie do it?
Because they were being original…
I dont like Halo 4 mainly because of Infinity but 343 should make sure maps work with custom loadouts in mind. Or make maps for specific settings. Not just throwing things in because they can. Thats why we have PODs,loadouts, perks now.
> Because they were being original…
I don’t understand how that’s a valid reason.
> > Because they were being original…
>
> I don’t understand how that’s a valid reason.
What are you asking again? Why did bungie make the Pit? The only answer I can give is they were being original. Also Bungie made an MP arena shooter. Their maps fit the games style, for the most part. Arena style maps dont play good with AAs, perks , and scorestreaks, IMO.
It looks like you are trying to argue without an argument. I made myself clear in my first post. If you think I’m wrong then please explain. I’m still trying to figure out how 343’s philosophy with Infinity settings have helped Halo or gaming in general. Obviously Infinity settings directly conflict with how Halo used to be played as an arena shooter.
> > To be clear, you feel that an ability everyone will be able to do imbalances things.
>
> Out of curiosity, by that logic are you insinuating jetpack is balanced? If so, then using that same idea I could state that a one shot kill weapon that killed everyone on the map when fired that everyone spawned with was also balanced, but obviously that is not the case.
>
> Just because everyone can spawn with it doesn’t mean it isn’t unbalanced.
Your accusation makes little sense.
I asked a question to which you are avoiding answering and giving some sort of counter question based on a stickman yet revealed.
> So what is your take on the changes infinity could bring to the gameplay? You’ve read mine, I’d like to see what you think the possible effects of jetpack and sprint could be (as well as the now ignored comments regarding the sword room).
You’ve explained to me how playing the map like Throwdown or Pro doesn’t play the same as Infinity, you haven’t explained any balances or imbalances beyond pointing out that the Sniper Tower is a power position (which automatically implies imbalance due to the power it possess).
Your concern is not with the map and how its made but instead Infinity and how it plays non?
> > What are you asking again? Why did bungie make the Pit? The only answer I can give is they were being original. Also Bungie made an MP arena shooter. Their maps fit the games style, for the most part. Arena style maps dont play good with AAs, perks , and scorestreaks, IMO.
>
> No, I’m asking why Bungie did full remakes instead of forged ones.
> > > What are you asking again? Why did bungie make the Pit? The only answer I can give is they were being original. Also Bungie made an MP arena shooter. Their maps fit the games style, for the most part. Arena style maps dont play good with AAs, perks , and scorestreaks, IMO.
> >
> > No, I’m asking why Bungie did full remakes instead of forged ones.
>
> Oh, I’m sorry. Maps like Heretic, Blackout and Avalanche probably coudnt be remade in H3 Forge . Reach remakes were on disc maps or community remakes. Anniversary Map Pack was 343 not Bungie.
> Your accusation makes little sense.
> I asked a question to which you are avoiding answering and giving some sort of counter question based on a stickman yet revealed.
Not an accusation, that’s just what it looked like. Lack of question mark seemed to point out that it wasn’t a question, sorry for mis-interpreting.
> You’ve explained to me how playing the map like Throwdown or Pro doesn’t play the same as Infinity, you haven’t explained any balances or imbalances beyond pointing out that the Sniper Tower is a power position (which automatically implies imbalance due to the power it possess).
So you point out that I didn’t answer you’re question but then don’t answer mine?..
Anyway, my first post was talking about possible unbalances to the power position. Yes, power positions are unbalanced, that is the point of them. They are also an important part of map design, because without a power position a map has no particular flow or area to gravitate towards.
What a power position does is draw attention to that area and make it an impotant part to hold. If you want to win the match, you have to do a couple things. Control the powerweapons, and control the power position.
The jetpack breaks the main power position, making it significantly less useful. Sprint also contributes to this, as I have stated numerous times. I am talking about how Infinity Slayer impacts the map The Pit. The entire point of this thread was to discuss why the pit would be bad for Halo 4, was it not?
Now, with a lack of power position on map players will gravitate towards power weapons. The two power weapons that are conveniently placed next to eachother, reachable in a matter of seconds and also have the most cover are the Sword and the Overshield. So, it seems likely that in the times rockets are not up, players will be sticking to the sword area, no?
It’s the most powerful postion on the map, has the most advantages especially combined with Infinity settings, and has the overshield below it to boot. There’s really no reason not to sit there, as it supplies you with weapons and cover from the rest of the map.
Hence my point, it will likely become very camped in regular games because it is unbalaced. A power position shouldn’t supply a power weapon as well, none-the-less two.
> Your concern is not with the map and how its made but instead Infinity and how it plays non?
My concern now is that you keep stating that I’m saying things I’m not saying, and telling me I said them.
But no, my concern is that The Pit is going to play significantly lower in quality due to the fact that it is not designed for Infinity slayer, again as I’ve stated numerous times.
EDIT: Pardon that, the start of my second response (on this post) contradicts the second half of it a little bit by stating “players gravitate towards nothing if there are no power positions” which isn’t entirely true. They tend to gravitate towards rewarding positions and powerweapons after that.
Sorry for the wrong-wording, but my point still stands.
The only real problem I have with it are the random ordnance spawns and playing infinity slayer on it. Other than that it plays surprisingly well.
Can’t wait to play it in LS (legendary BRs on Pitfall would be amazing).
Oh noooo… Boo hoo hoo… I can’t do one stupid little jump this map sucks now… Pout… Be thankful 343 is doing this at all. They absolutly don’t have to give out maps made by their bungie predecessor. They did an unessisary kindness.
I’ve played Ricochet and CTF on this map. It worked very well with those gametypes. I don’t have any input on Infinity Slayer as I haven’t played it on Pitfall.
Generally I think The Pit was a good map for Objective, Team Swords, and SWAT.
I love it, they don’t need to make it PIXEL PERFECT to be a good map. Yeesh.