In certain moments in the game it doesn’t matter what power weapon you have. You won’t be able to get to an objective. All three movement equipment pieces gives you a chance to close the gap. Yes. Even the repulsor. You can use it to bounce yourself upwards. You can’t do that with a sniper or any otyer power weapon. When you have a weapon you are static. Which means that advantage you have because of the power weapon is also static.
i dont agree. weapons beat other weapons and the whole point is to be wary of them just like you should be wary of other people with movement buffs so you can potentially out play them. more often than not you wont though. someone will use the grapple to kill you just like how they will use a rocket to easily kill you.
grifbal with the Diminisher of Hope gravity hammer and the Bloodblade energy sword and the skull is the ball.
rocket race but then we both rocket launcher and shewer’s for the shooter.
and use not a mongoose but then a razorback.
1 Like
Heres the problem. You can’t go from point A to point B with a rocket. Point B being the ledge that’s too high to jump or crouch jump. Or even spring jump for that matter. Positioning and gun skill are two different things. A grapple can do this. It can make this movement. A rocket can’t. You talk about outplaying but if your in a different place because of the movement equipment then there is no outplaying. Me being able to be in a different spot is a different advantage then having a rocket launcher. Movement ablities belong on the spartan. Not on the field.
I am just saying it is the nature of shooters to get boosts when you kill someone even when the design is really basic. Also I said nothing about damage boost, especiallly for the rest of the game.
I never said any of this. Its possible to have simple class based system that I described and have none of the things you just mentioned. You think it needs to be a whole new game while I explain its just literally a variation of what halo infinite will already be with a few extra simple visual designs to convey enemy class information to players such as an armor effect when you get one kill, that upgrades until you get to the ultimate.
Im not sure you understood my idea.
theres not much skill in shooting someone with a rocket launcher just like its not much skill closing the distance with a grapple. Having both of them almost guarantees a kill. The point is to not let your opponent have them. Also I think most people would choose rockets over a grapple as its way more advantageous but I guess it depends on the situation.
Bazaar is the only map where you can “not let them have it”. Otherwise the grapple spawns on both sides of the map in behemoth. The thruster spawns near one team in streets. There is no map where the equipment is fair and even if it was it’s still boring. Id rather everyone playing with the grapple instead of just one person. I want to have fun. Not limited fun. It’s a video game after all
It’s not a boost, it’s literally required to make the game work, even if spawntime was instant, they’d still have to move the player so there isn’t spawn-killing, or the dude who just won didn’t get immediately killed by a person he just beat before he had time to heal.
The damage boost was an example of why the system would be poor, after all a person with the speed boost would always be able to get a power weapon. A person with a jump boost probably wouldn’t need repulsor or grapple.
You’re talking about whole new mechanics that as you said…
Just because you don’t explicitly say it doesn’t mean it doesn’t come with the field. Smoke grenades would be an ability feature.
Heck, the example of Valorant has Champions, which leads into my whole stanza of why it wouldn’t work.
With these abilities (especially the movement ones) there’s no reason to have other things such as grapple and thrust, and vice versa, you can’t just mindlessly add things without acknowledging how it affects other things.
I’m saying it’s not simple, not simple enough to justify the work for one game mode at the least.
You’re talking about adding “simple” mechanics like “classes” when other games have their entire foundation built on that mechanic.
Edit: Even visual indicators would be a pain just to clue in what class an enemy is… am I supposed to deduce what they can do via abilities? Or are they just going to have a floating marker over their head?
Just leave halo as is, there’s no reason to add this.
Edit Edit: I have no qualms with the idea of kill X people get X boost, the problem comes with the “classes” and “ultimates” aspect.
when you kill someone in halo you get boosts. Your boosting your score, your manipulating spawn locations, your able to pick up their gear, your able to get to the power weapon. Just because this is normal for halo doesnt mean its not classed as a way to boost yourself.
you dont get boosts unless you get 1 kill so every match starts off equal. Also those were just ideas of the top of my head. theres probably better more fair and interesting boost mechanics.
these ulltimates can easilly be equipment allready in the game. So instead of only 1 equipment appearing in the map, several appear because people have chosen different ultimates (equipment) that they would like to play with and not just the few that the map offers.
I think you over complicate things. This is a mode. Its not changing the whole game. In this mode equipment can be disabled and replaced with ulltimate ammo that you pick up instead.
I think cool amour effects would do the job and when you reach ultimate status you look llike a super sayian powering up. This mode still plays like halo, its just how you get equipment is slightly different and the buffs you get per class are just ment to be really minor that its barely noticable.
Not a boost, a requirement.
Picking up the power weapon is an advantage, yes, but this is a mechanic to encourage map flow and Tactical plays. They can opt to remove this mechanic among others to make new game types akin to swat and is not a boost, it can “boost” killing potential but is not a boost in and of itself.
Killing someone to progress your score as that’s how the game works, is not a boost.
The game having to respawn a player, is not a boost, that is a requirement to make the game work effectively. A persons ability to utilize respawn time and the knowledge of what to do with it would probably be labled as “skill”.
The issue here is snowballing and how it will affect other present mechanics.
Then why make them ultimates?
This just sounds like removing equipment from the map and into spawns, which sounds like more effort than it’s worth and again, takes away from the arena aspect of Halo. And most maps tend to have 3 sometimes 2 granted, but I prefer it that way so you have to choose what you’re willing to fight for.
Again, ultimates and classes are changing the whole game. Even just moving equipment into spawns changes Halo infinite to Halo 4 and Reach, at best, a poor clone of other games at worst.
We already have armor effects, but I’m not opposed to that idea in and of itself, but we don’t need classes or ultimates to do that.
Kills grant boost: yes.
Moving equipment and such into an allready familiar concept of prior (and other games) for the sake of one game mode: no
…which is a requirement to boost how you play. fighting for a power weapons is a specific mechanic put in the game just like my idea of killing people to get a small boost could be a specific mechanic put in the game.
makes no sense. killing someone to win the rockets boosts way more than my idea to kill someone to get something like faster reload times. you could say their balanced with each other. my idea requires just killing someone, while getting rockets requires fighting someone near rockets. however, sometimes rockets are uncontested and would be even easier to get than my boost idea.
ive explained how this boost idea after a kill dont really change much of anything or shouldnt but maybe youre still right. maybe the boost should only last like 10 seconds after a kill to prevent snowball effects. That way mechanics can be a lot more creative and powerful too. Just discussing things with you has potentially improved the idea.
I answered that. “So instead of only 1 equipment appearing in the map, several appear” And if 343 make more interesting neutral equipments in the future that alter the map for everyone then it will be even more interesting for unique gameplay that a normal limited selection of equipment on the map would do.
killing people would be the slow way of getting an equipment. you would still be able to pick up ammo on the map for your equipment and essentially be like fighting for an equipment.
i dont think it is. its adding on top of what is allready there and offering a different unique mode to play.
isnt that the point of separate game modes. to be different. swat completelly removes equipment.
I think youre afraid of change and scarred by halo 4 and reach.
valorant is basically counter strike turned into a hero shooter and it works. halo can do something just as different too in different modes to offer different experiances. And it wouldnt take much work to make a class based mode using equipment’s as ultimates.
Being rewarded for killing someone and being encouraged to fight over something are two different things, one is a boost, the other is a mechanic.
Again, one rewards you for killing, the rockets being there encourages you to go there and fight so the other guys don’t get it.
Back at square 1, why have the option to select equipment at all then if it’s still gonna be on the map?
Countered that:
Halo 4 and Reach literally do this, you select a loadout, it comes with equipment, only difference is you don’t need to kill for it. You’re just emulating an older title and other current titles.
It’s not change, it’s the opposite, you’re just copying prior games, don’t know why I would be scarred, I liked Reach, 4 was alright, I don’t know why you’d want to turn halo infinite into those games, especially when you can go to MCC and play them.
Valorant bases it’s ENTIRE GAME around it being a hero shooter, that’s what makes it Valorant, that’s what makes Hero and class games those games, I don’t know why you’d want Halo, which is not those games, to become a crude copy of those games, for 1 mode.
Notice how Valorant, Overwatch, League, division and Destiny don’t make game modes (with the exception of D2 momentum) trying to copy halo? Notice how Halo doesn’t do Loadouts anymore? Probably a reason for that.
Hey, look, it’s Halo 4 and Reach again, just with needless steps.
semantics
because more equipment will activate on the map. there will be more unique gamepllay happening instead of what limited placed equipment can do. In a 4v4 or more, imagine all the different types of equipment that would get used iin one match. If they are neutral equipment too, it will make the map fun and different for everyone and stop maps getting stale. A big reason why valorant is so popular i think.
the difference is, those games had terrible maps and their class system wasnt balanced. if you think my idea is a carbon copy that will automatically not work then i dont know why we are disccussing game design.
I’m suggesting one mode and my idea is different. Youre acting like i hate infinite and want the whole game to turn into a hero shooter. Its a game mode, similar to how everyone will make a battle royale game mode when forge comes out. everyone will be playing it. But how dare they, its too far away from halo.
so its only fun if a company turns and dedicates all their resources into one style of game? its impossible to make one simple game mode with classes? I think you need to chill and stop taking games so seriously. Halo could make a simple class based mode and it could become their best mode. Then that would give 343 information that thats what players want. or it could fail so they try their next idea whether its another classed bassed idea or not.
Just because reach or 4 failed doesnt mean class based systems should never return. Reach and 4 are terrible implementations with clear design flaws.
One mode that sounds like nothing but taking aspects from prior and/or different games, and slightly tweaking them to be centered around kills, it barely sounds different.
You have given me no reason to believe otherwise. It sounds like trading out Promethean vision for grapple hooks.
I think it makes sense for a game to be centered around one idea, I think it makes sense for games to move forward. I do not think putting loadouts in Halo infinite is in any way moving forward or worth the time and effort when Halo 4 on MCC is still going strong.
No, I think 343i could devote their resources elsewhere for things more deserving, not implementing a classes game mode in a game that is nothing about classes.
Players are voicing what they want on these very forums, considering it’s only us 2 here, it doesn’t seem like this is what too many people want.
Same could be said about Halo Infinite, but that’s a different topic.
A custom games mode featuring BR themes is vastly different than 343i devoting what would be considered far too many resources into an already saturated game type. I do not mind Halo BR, but I do not want 343i focusing on making THAT, when they need to improve what’s already here.
I was trying to take your idea seriously, but I apologize, I’ll just lightly joke about it and move on.
No, I just don’t understand how “classes” would be of any benefit to Infinite, again, when Halo 4 and Reach are easily accessible and allready feature some aspects of your idea.
i hate reach and 4’s class systems yet I still want one. tellling me to go play those games solves nothing since the reason i want a class base system is to make make equipment more numerous while still fighting for them on the map by picking up ultimate ammo instead of set equipment. killing is not the main way of getting equipment but if it really is a problem it can easily be removed and the focus ccan be on the ammo for ultimates on the map. aka it plays exactly like normal halo infinite except more equipment is possible.
In halo 4 and reach, you start with abillities. In my idea you dont. THAT is the major difference and completely changes game balance so please stop comparing to those unbalanced messes of a game. If you dont notice the vast difference in that then you know nothing about game desiign i’m afraid.
As for what people want. they dont know what they want. 90% of the community hated sprint. Now theyre fine with it because it was properly done and maps were designed correctly. Same improvements can be done with a class based system, but carry on with your cave man logic. Nothing left to talk about.
Infinite doesn’t need one.
If equipment is numerous there’s no reason to fight for it.
This… this ruins every thing you’ve built… just make equipment spawn faster and make each spawn random, huzzah, no need for classes or ultimates.
Then literally nothing needs to change. This is what halo infinite is already doing.
“vast”… funny joke, and the same could be said about your knowledge of game design, so stop wasting time with half baked insults.
Then you don’t read these forums enough, or just block out everything that doesn’t agree with your viewpoint… how convenient.
I’d rather stick to my logic than whatever you’re on.
irrelevant.
I dont think you understand half the things I say because that has no baring on what ive said in all this thread.
Now youve just ruined the classic halo gameplay unless youre trying to turn it into a fiesta mode where its just chaos. youre proving my point that you dont understand game design and im not saying it to hurt your feelings. it would be impossible to control ultimate ammo or equipment if they were just constantly spawning.
most complaints on here are toxic, non constructive or about obvious things that should be changed .
most people talk like “sprint bad, remove it” when really all this time it just needed balancing and now most acccept it.
Great post OP, didn’t read as it would Ultimately culminate in more slights and pointless running in circles, just thought you should know.
thanks for wasting my time and good luck in the future crapping on other peoples ideas that you dont even want to understand properly.
Hey, I didn’t start with the insults, but whatever. Maybe you’ll come up with something with more appeal other than throwing classes into Halo.