NEW MAPS and why we need them in MM (w/LINKS)

Hello, everyone. (yes, there is a TL;DR)

This thread suggests an alternative approach to improving the current state of matchmaking. I feel that the importance of maps is underestimated in these forums. I will try to explain why we need better maps.

The reason why we need better maps is because a map decides HALF of what a game plays like. The other half is decided by the sandbox and gametype. A map can be so good, that it will make people forget about any issues that can be found in the sandbox.
Two examples: A map that has most encounters in medium range will essentially nerf the DMR, and a map that has a lot of flanking routes and few corners will nerf the boltshot.

Another thing a map can fix is the spawns; spawns are vital to the way a game plays. Spawns should be placed so that the player or team that just died is at a disadvantage, and that isn’t always the case for current matchmaking.

The ones in matchmaking right now just aren’t good enough when you compare them to some of the community maps that are already starting to appear.

  • Almost all of them are just too large for the amount of players that play on them. This results in players more rarely running into eachother. It also ensures that most encounters are held at long range, something that was typical of big team battle in previous halos. What’s worse is that fighting at long range simply isn’t fun (imo), because of the bounce mechanic. Also, because finding eachother is more difficult, people tend to sit back at a vantage point and watch the map for enemies, because they don’t want to run around endlessly without finding someone, and getting them out in the open is easy with the DMR. In other words, large maps slow down gameplay and encourage this kind of camping.
    The opposite effect is achieved as well sometimes: an encounter is had in one specific area, teammates rush in to help. After everyone dies, people rush back to the hotspot, but both teams do so, and because of the slow feedback of knowing the enemy’s position because of the large map and the long time it takes people to get there, eventually everyone rushes that same place of the map during the rest of the match because they know or think the enemy is there and that will speed up the game. (if that made any sense). This is especially true with the forerunner artifact house on Complex.

This is also one of the reasons everyone votes for Haven: it’s the only small, symmetrical map in Halo 4. Small, symmetrical maps are almost a definition of Halo: an arena shooter.

  • Some are more easily broken by jetpack than others. Especially Abandoned: That map greatly revolves around top mid control. Jetpackers can easily go top mid from all directions, completely bypassing the routes that are covered by a map setup, surprise the enemy team and easily gain top control. Just because they selected jetpack.

  • The look of the map sometimes gains priority over gameplay! Solace in perticular is symmetrical, yet the bases are asymmetrical. The base with the crates is much easier to defend imo, having all of those crates as cover. Not to mention Solace Oddball: you can just take the oddball and hide at the edge of the map in your base, with the crates providing plenty of cover while your team picks off intruders. And when they do completely overpower you, you can throw it off the map. Jungle base has neither of these features. Jungle base also has dirt hallways, which interfere with grenade throwing.

From now on, all maps added to matchmaking should be the small, symmetrical type of map that is typical of Halo. Right around the size of Haven would be ideal. They should form the majority of all maps.

The first map that always comes to mind when I mean small and symmetrical is Midship/Heretic.
It was very small: you could litterally crossmap and it would feel like medium to long range. On Halo 4 complex, shooting from the central structure to either of the team’s spawns already feels like crossmapping, distance-wise.
Midship was also very open, yet you could always get to cover in time. Unless of course, you ran bottom or top mid like an idiot.
Midship also had clearly defined positions of power: the bases, the towers. Jetpack can’t even break midship because of the openness and how top mid is easily accessible without it. Maps like midship are just so good that it still plays nice with a flawed sandbox.

Other remakes that would play fantastically on Halo 4: <mark>Lockout/Blackout, The Pit, Citadel, Warlock, Foundation…</mark>

Community maps that are comfirmed to play fantastically: <mark>Simplex, Lotus, Station 9, … Links follow in the next post.</mark>**
And what happened to <mark>Relay</mark>?! Relay is quite large, but it still looks like one of the better maps on the disc, yet 343i doesn’t put it in matchmaking?! incomprehensible.
TL; DR Just adding all of the maps above (and below with links) as alternatives for the current maps would already make Halo 4 matchmaking as epic as it should be.
A counterargument might be “but then we have way too many maps to memorise!”. That may be true, but Halo 4 holds your hand when it comes down to getting to know maps. Halo 4 maps, even the current maps in matchmaking, have a good flow. On top of that, all power weapons are simply indicated in your HUD. The time it takes to learn a map on Halo 4 is very short. And that will especially be the case for the maps I mentioned, as they have a simple layout.
Another thing I want to draw attention to is how adding the custom maps MLG uses into regular matchmaking will bring the casual and MLG communities more together. Halo keeps MLG popular and MLG keeps Halo popular. I would really hate to see MLG’s support for the Halo franchise end because of both communities alienating from eachother.
What are your thoughts on this?

Epic remakes:
Wizard/Warlock
Lockout/Blackout
Narrows
The Pit

Epic Custom maps:
Simplex
Cella (inspired by Guardian)
Lotus
Station 9
(Schism)
Dispatch
Stigma
Edifice

343i maps:

Relay! Edit: perhaps choose Dispatch over Relay due to their strong resemblance.

Agreed, could use a couple new maps, and the 4 sided maps warlock foundation and midship would be epic for multiteam, if they ever get around to multiteam

We dont need new maps, just better playlists and better gameplay.

> We dont need new maps, just better playlists and better gameplay.

Why?

Every one of those remakes plays like -Yoink- with sprint, AAs, and flinch instead of descope.

More maps would be better

AMEN!! The maps in this game are too big! The biggest problem revolves around all the corners, crates, boxes, doorways, etc. that the maps have (besides Haven;the best) because they promote camping and hiding. Haven should be the role model! Open, symmetrical, small, arena like, it embodies what Halo stands for!!

Yes, this is exactly what Halo 4 needs. You hit the nail on the head. Smaller, symmetrical maps. And I actually played on a Lockout remake in a Custom Game a couple of days ago and it played really well. I also played on the Narrows remake, Atrocity, and thoroughly enjoyed myself on that too.

> Every one of those remakes plays like Yoink! with sprint, AAs, and flinch instead of descope.

I’m simply suggesting an alternative approach to the improvement of matchmaking. I’m not stating that everything would be fixed just by adding epic maps.

I’m saying that adding more genuinely fun maps to play on would act as a buffer to counter any inconsistencies in the sandbox, as well as allow for more opportunities to have fun when playing.

The annoying flinching mechanic won’t be noticed if most of the encounters are held at medium to short range, where nobody zooms in anyway, because the map doesn’t allow it. The most overpowered armor abilities can be nerfed, simply because the map wouldn’t promote their useage, though I agree, sprint needs to be countered by a 3-5 second respawn time.

Nothing felt better in Halo 3 than playing on a map like the Pit and knowing how it was such a great map. It was one of those maps that you could instantly fall in love with. And Halo 3’s map packs brought more epic maps: a remake of Midship and an all new Citadel. I instantly fell in love with that one too.

I haven’t felt anything like it ever since. Don’t underestimate the influence of a good map and good spawns on a game.

No, the game wouldn’t be perfect if epic maps were added. But neither would the game be perfect if the sandbox were to get a perfect rebalance and competitive gametypes. The maps would still be dull. As I said: each weighs in at 50%, and both need to be adressed. This thread is about the aspect that is easily forgotten on these forums.

The addition of more small maps into Matchmaking is one of the many things we have planned for early 2013.

Thank you for your suggestions!

The pit is awesome, I hope 343 uses it

Personally, I hate symmetrical maps. But I can understand how and why people like them, and I don’t mind playing them. The symmetry just bugs my creative mind…

And I will support more maps, just to break up the monotony of playing the same maps over and over again.

On the other hand, if only the map selection would go through all available maps being played once before any one map can be played a second time, I think a lot of people would find that some maps are not half as bad as they think they are.

So, yes, more maps, please. But also less chances to play the same map three times in a row…

> The addition of more small maps into Matchmaking is one of the many things we have planned for early 2013.
>
> Thank you for your suggestions!

Awesome to see an official reply! :slight_smile: Thank you for easing our minds!

Agreed, game desperately needs forge maps in rotation would help keep the people who are fan of Halos arena shooter roots happier.

I didn’t read the whole thing, but yes we do need more maps. They should re-make (size) all of the most popular halo maps in each previous halo game, and put it into one big DLC. I think that would liven things up in the lack of maps area.

I think it’s about time the community demanded free maps.

> I think it’s about time the community demanded free maps.

This. I refuse to buy the crimson DLC. It wasn’t good at all in my opinion. I am happy I got to play on them before purchasing.

Actually, I don’t feel like big maps are a problem of H4 right now. For example, I really enjoy playing maps like Solace, because they feature a lot of cover and combine long and short range passages.

You guys keep expressing, that corners are the problem (correct me, if I got you wrong). Then, would you like to see a map with quarter-circles instead of corners all the time?

If you don’t like corners, just use Promethean vision or throw a grenade. And btw. I didn’t encounter many people sitting at some corner all game long camping, so I don’t see this as a major problem.

Back to the topic: I would also highly appreciate a bigger variety in maps. Alongside with small maps I think there should also be some more large maps for BTB (sorry, “Big team Infinity Slayer” :wink: ) and for Dominion. I just miss a map like Reach’s Hemorrhage, where there are many vehicles and enough space to really carry out a ballte with them.

Edited by Moderator - Please do not post spam.

*Original post, click at your own discretion.

HALO 4 NEEDS MORE VARIETY WITHOUT DILUTION

Unnecessary repetition causes boredom and disinterest. IMO, I believe this issue is hurting Halo 4 the most, therefore some careful changes to the playlists should occur in order to address the problem without creating another… such as a significant dilution of the player population amongst the playlists by creating too many.

Take a look at how Halo 4’s population numbers have dwindled incredibly fast as a form of evidence in regards to the effect of disinterest that I’m referring to as the cause.
Halo 4 Population Tracking

THE PLAYLISTS:

The Details

THE MAPS:

Another area that desperately needs additional variety is in the amount and diversity of maps. Don’t be afraid to use the Forge yourselves 343i! Forge existing maps. Create something new and re-name it. Plus, start including the custom game or forge only maps as well as different versions of them too.

THE FORGE & CUSTOM GAMES:

Pretty much everything is covered here, athough I don’t believe everything listed is imperative