My thoughts as a Forger

My thoughts as a Forger to Players and Developer alike

I consider myself a serious forger, not a competitive one, not causal, but one who takes pride in making maps that are beautiful, and fun to play on. I love forge, the creativity, and flexibility of the parts in Reach were astounding. you could make Forerunner, Human, even Covenant themed maps if you knew how to use the parts right.

I will say that Halo 4 is a great game, and that there were some improvements introduced in H4’s forge mode.

having said that, there are some things that bug me.

-Forge parts don’t line up when using coordinates
—this is very obvious when using the coordinate grid to line up pipes, yes you can use magnets, but weren’t magnets supposed to help the coordinate system, not replace it? Personally I think magnets are fine for lining up large amounts of objects, but will never replace the coordinate grid for functionality

-The bump glitch is still here
—the problem found in Reach was that sometimes, your parts would get jostled around between save and load, this was normally combated by realigning the parts using the fine-tuning option, however, in halo 4, that option was removed, in favor of magnets. The issue is that the magnets do not account for this glitch, and so the parts continue to be misaligned.

-The forge blocks are rounded and notched
—while the parts may look good on their own, having gaps in your map makes it look sloppy and cobbled together, the only fix being to merge the two parts until the gaps are covered by another part. The problem with this is:

-Removal of the fine-tuning option
—I’ve almost never used the fine-tuning option to line up parts, what I did use it for was something far more important: getting rid of z-fighting, that annoying flicker you get when two parts have conflicting geometry. activating fine-tuning,and flicking the joystick allowed you to not only get rid of z-fighting without introducing noticeable bumps, but also allowed for a technique called “texturing”, where you could select which block texture would appear

-The new forge textures
—the textures for the forge blocks in particular look fantastic by themselves, however, when you start combining pieces, those extra details just make the design look cluttered. the fact that most (if not all) parts are now no longer symmetrical in design further adds to this sense disorder

The kicker

these are all rather small issues individually, but compounded, it makes for a very sloppy looking map, no matter how well designed the original layout was. Parts don’t line up, there are holes everywhere in the map, the textures are chaotic, and most merged parts have obvious z-fighting. parts that aren’t merged are easy to discern from the surrounding structure, making everything seem less like a structure, and more like a collection of blocks.

I have high hopes for H4, the potential is there, but I feel that the few mistakes have caused some rather serious issues. I don’t expect 343 Industries to drop everything and fix this game, but at the same token, I hope they do not ignore it simply because the game has already been sold to the purchaser. The likeliness of them actually reading this is depressingly slim and even more so to act upon it, but not for want of trying.

I don’t expect to have a totally new UNSC vehicle, or some new gun, or armor skin, I wouldn’t mind going without. I would not post this if the issue was simply me asking for some sort of customization. It is the errors in the game’s base functionality, small issues that my have been overlooked during development, small errors that may have not have shown up during beta testing, but issues all the same.

thank you for your time.

Fine tuning needs to come back and the coordinates as well need to actually match

About using the coordinates. I feel your pain. The problem though is that if piece A is the one in place, and piece B is the one you are trying to place, piece A might be in between 2 coordinate points if it was manually placed. Meaning that if you are solely using coordinates for piece B, it will never match up to something in between the points of piece A. Way to fix this, is grab piece A, press B button, select the coordinates option. When going into the coordinates option (without actually changing anything), it should auto align the selected piece with the nearest coordinate points built into the system. Then it will be on the same track as piece B. Irritating I know…

100% Agreed on everything. Also to note the old game modes need to be brought back, sure they weren’t favored in multiplayer but in things like custom games they were essential. Stockpile, Territories(Dominion doesn’t work for all maps), Halo ball, Invasion, Infection(Changing Loadouts), A true 1-flag, Race, and more. Also a lot of customization options were removed. Another thing with the textures is the coloring on everything looks too similar and its hard to fix without precision editing. Halo Reach forge was a huge step up from 3’s the problem with 4’s is the fact that it doesn’t seem to be a step up from Reach it feels like a step up from 3’s again. You may never change these things an we will just adjust but it would be a big help. PS When designing a forge map next time keep in mind we enjoy not only flat terrain but a large area of rolling hills. Whoever designed that building on impact hates forgers too.

Forge is nothing but a severely lacking map editor. Halo could’ve been so much more if they allowed it to be on pc, but microsoft wants people to buy Xboxes so they keep it exclusive to this system.

Your best bet is to map on pc games if you have a lot of problems with Forge.

:open_mouth: a well laid out post with constructive criticism and no major whining! am i still on the halo 4 forum?!?!?!

this is by far the best post in explaining how the features of forge can be improved and tweaked!

but sadly forge seems to have taken on a style abit like photoshop…they add new stuff that you dont really need and make the old techniques harder to use :frowning:

hopefully a update will be in the works soon and our troubles will be gone :slight_smile:

Finally, someone who feels our concerns on Halo 4 Forge. Halo: Reach’s Forge opened many opportunities to many Forgers and beginners alike. Myself, started in Reach, an my most prized creation was a Halo Control Room. With the abilities at my disposal to work with precision, coordinates,and snaps, I was able to create a believable Forerunner structure that I was an still am proud of to this very moment and day. Now, with time passed, November 6th comes along and I have the game in my hands. I rush to Forge just like my fellow friends and Family I have formed among Forgehub. And what are we looking at?

A Downgrade.

What? We have no precision anymore, replaced with magnets. So I try them out to learn one thing. The speed of the Monitor is unforgiving when working with blocks. It brought back terrible memories from Halo 3 of trying to build a map. Now I do not mean to sit here an sound like I am complaining. But it feels as more of a Downgrade to Forge then a Upgrade. Sure. Everything is made to look good and polished. But looks for Forge only go so far for us. In my opinion, Halo 4’s Forge was a opportunity, ignored. I’m hoping for our lovely Halo community to reach out to 343, and get a update to fix things.

> Forge is nothing but a severely lacking map editor. Halo could’ve been so much more if they allowed it to be on pc, but microsoft wants people to buy Xboxes so they keep it exclusive to this system.
>
> Your best bet is to map on pc games if you have a lot of problems with Forge.

I do help make Halo CE custom maps, but I also like forge mode for its ease of use.

Well said OP. Hopefully these issues will be resolved soon. I am not a hardcore forger, but I do enjoy making detailed maps. The details are hard to get with Halo 4 forge. I imagine with time these issues will be less noticeable, but it would be nice to get the fine tuning back at least.

-Thug

Good, valuable input as to how forge can be improved!

> Good, valuable input as to how forge can be improved!

I’m glad people agree, I think that if points are shown and supported, that you get better results than the usual “343i, fix this nao!”

so any news on forge changes, or is what we have, what we are stuck with?