MJOLNIR Mk.VI in Halo 4 and canon

Games Other Halo
1

Since it seems 343i has been doing a few more replies directly than they usually do, maybe we can get to the bottom of something. Yes we are back at the issue of Master Chief’s armor. But this isn’t about it changing, I’m pretty satisfied with the answer that Cortana changed it while Chief was in cryo.

No, my problem stems from what seems to be a design choice they made that doesn’t appear to have had much thought put into what it might do for the canon. Now we can understand Chief having his Mk.VI changed in cryo right? Alright. So pray tell me why it also appears in the Prologue?

  1. The Prologue would have to be set before 2552, the year Mk.VI was made. Yet we see Spartan-IIs wearing it…so that is an error.

  2. There was no point in the war where the Spartan-IIs have Mk.VI on the main field. The closest would be Black Team, but that was prototype armor and still in 2552.

  3. The only armor any Spartan-II would be wearing at this time would be either Mk.IV or Mk.V (since retconned to be available since 2551).

So thus far I’ve heard two answers for this issue.

  1. It is a retcon, some have gone so far as to say that ALL MJOLNIR now looks like this. The problem with that should be obvious. To retcon all the armor like that is to wipe out a rather significant part of Halo. I find it hard to accept that in Halo: CE, Chief no longer looks like this. I find it hard to accept that Red Team in Halo Wars no longer look like this.

The retcon argument is bad too since unmodified Mk.VI in the multiplayer and since multiplayer is canon…that makes it even harder to swallow.

  1. It was because the studio who did the CGI for Halo 4 only had one model to work with and used it. This makes more sense, but I can’t help but feel disappointment that 343i would say how much they love the lore and let that detail slide.

Conclusion

So in conclusion, yes I know we’ve been down this road before many times, but I just hope we get an answer some day about this. I’m definitely going to add this question to the News Section’s “Suggest a topic for the Halo Bulletin”, but I doubt it will ever get a response. Hopefully though, maybe 343i can answer the question here.

Doubtful, but I can dream. So does anybody wish to know what is going on or am I as a “canon geek” alone in this?

2

Because it looks cool. It’s the same as going back and comparing the Star Wars trilogies.

3

I too find myself wanting an explanation to this, since it really makes no sense for the Spartans in the video to be wearing the Cortana special Mark VI armour. I’m fine with and embrace every other video change in the game, but this is one thing that just makes no sense to me at all.

4

Well if they fixed this in future flashbacks to pre Halo 4 where armor designs are in the correct timelines would that help ?

5

> Well if they fixed this in future flashbacks to pre Halo 4 where armor designs are in the correct timelines would that help ?

I’d accept it, I mean it isn’t like they could patch a cutscene, nor is it realistic for them to do so.

> Because it looks cool. It’s the same as going back and comparing the Star Wars trilogies.

Looking cool should never override canon. And even then Star Wars doesn’t necessarily redesign it’s ships and such.

6

I was wondering too.

7

I’ve always been the sort of person that thinks if you can’t do something properly, then don’t do it at all, so the inconsistencies bothered me as well.

8

> Because it looks cool. It’s the same as going back and comparing the Star Wars trilogies.

Last time I checked, the Clone Troopers had different armour during the Clone Wars, and it was even slightly different during Episode III, just befor Order 66 was executed and all the other stuff that went down.

“Because it looks cool” is becoming an increasingly stale reason for crapping on canon.

9

I agree that it was not a good call on 343’s part to make these particular decisions.

On the other hand, though, when taking into account how the cinematic is presented, it seemed more thematic rather than fully literal.

In other words, it was basically a broad, stylized interpretation of an otherwise vast series of separate events.

Clues that show that it does not depict actual events apart from the conversation between Halsey and the interrogator are everywhere.

Here are some examples.

-Halsey showing Cortana to John in a hangar bay. The first meeting between John and Cortana did not happen that way at all.

-The massive size and height of the Brute Chieftain and his hammer; no Gravity Hammer was that long or massive, and no Brute was that large.

-The thrusters in the Spartan’s armor; even when John uses them in the Shutdown cinematic, they are far too weak provide that much thrust in a planetary environment. They are more effective in zero-gravity, and even then, for only brief bursts.

-John being outfitted with the upgraded armor; that never happened, since we all know that Cortana did that work while he was in the Cryotube, years after John got the suit on Cairo Station in October 2552.

In many ways, it is like the “Halo: Legends” two-part segment ‘Origins.’ That was canonically inaccurate in a wide number of ways, which was really just a thematic representation piece, which was the caveat allowing for such wide-ranging deviations.

The same applies here, and it is shared to a minor degree in the ending CG segment, when John is shown as being so mu.ch taller than Palmer, when there is actually only about a 2-3 foot height difference.

10

I agree with what you are saying OP; canon might not be important to some but it’s crucial to being immersed in this game.

My understanding of it is…

Master Chief only had his software/firmware upgraded in cyro by Cotanna, there is no actual way for this physical Mark VI suit to be changed- parts replaced, shoulder pads etc.

Now the Mark VII does have nanotechnology in the suit for such an upgrading even in cyro, but apart from Naomi-010 from the books, no one else wears it. Basically the Chief has been in the same suit Mark VI since Halo 2.

The physical differences I play it up to retcon, yes all MJOLNIR suit now looks the way the Mark VI does. It is disappointing to think that the classic look of the Mark V in Halo:CE no longer exists. But let’s face it, things like this happen. Nothing we say are ever going to change it back, so we adapt.

What is frustrating is that the Mark VI suit in Halo 4 Multiplayer doesn’t look like the Chief’s. I play that up to slight variantion when MJOLNIR GEN2 production went private.

What would have been perfect was if 343i that taken a longer time to do the Prologue and showed the rest of the Spartan IIs in Mark IV/V, classic Halo:CE style. Regardless, we are left with all MJOLNIR looks like the Mark VI.

TBH, I’m fine with it.

EDIT: I like Marag Suun reasons for it as well, nicely said.

11

>

All perfectly acceptable rationales. That said, I think 343i has a hard time keeping MJOLNIR consistent. In Halo 4, we see each Spartan-II in the same, albeit wrong, armor. That is consistent with the lore. Yet in Forward Unto Dawn and the Fall of reach comics, they all have differing armor. I can’t for the love of me see why consistency is not key.

12

could it have to do with the “September anomaly”? 117 was given Mark VI on october 20th, but it was never stated that 117 was the 1st to receive Mark VI (as far as i know)+^^+ it was likely the Mark VI was being developed as early as 1550, probably tested in 2551-2552 (which would explain Mark VI gear available to Noble Team on reach, by leveling up of course) but Mark V during 2551 and the 1st half of 2552 was the mainstream configuration+^^+ i just can’t help but think of all the subtly different car models out-dating each other every year+^_^+

of course, this pic taken about 1:15 into the prologue http://i50.tinypic.com/2cofrxz.png shows spartans that should be wearing the Mark IV armor until 2551 when Mark V armor was introduced with it’s fancy shields (that came from a 1000 year old jackal shield that didn’t self destruct like most covie tech)+^^+ so i see what your getting at, well, CG like that costs $$$ and i don’t think the prologue impacts the game, or how well it sells, enough for anyone to redo+^^+
my question now, in Halo 4, what configuration are we on now? GEN 2 armor yes, but what Mark? i assume Mark I was prototype, II would have been testing, so are we using GEN 2 Mark III? IV?

13

> my question now, in Halo 4, what configuration are we on now? GEN 2 armor yes, but what Mark? i assume Mark I was prototype, II would have been testing, so are we using GEN 2 Mark III? IV?[/color]

With a new generation there are likely different rules. They may not work with Marks anymore.

14

This is all throughout the game, you know. It’s not just those Spartans in the beginning. It’s also the Sangheili Storm in the beginning. It’s also the redesigned UNSC logo appearing all over the UNSC Forward Unto Dawn, which was lost before this logo was designed. It’s also the new models of the Assault Rifle, Battle Rifle, and Warthog - all issued in 2554 or later - appearing stored in the UNSC Forward Unto Dawn, lost in 2553. It’s the fact that Cortana’s “special” Mk. VI armor so closely resembles all of the GEN2 models (which she has had no contact with), rather than the GEN1 models. It’s also the fact that Master Chief is so much taller in the CGI scenes than in-engine cutscenes. It’s also the fact that the Didact can immediately emerge from his Cryptum at full power, without the resuscitation required in Halo: Cryptum. It’s also the fact that Sarah Palmer and all of the “important” Spartan-IVs never wear their helmets. It’s also when Sarah Palmer uses her MJOLNIR’s magnetic boots to avoid the Forerunner artifact’s anti-gravity effects, and yet we’ve never seen any other Spartans do that before.

I’m sure there are many more things that I am missing. A lot of canonical inconsistencies. It’s a sloppy job. The Mk. VI in the Prologue really is just the tip of the iceberg, in my opinion. This game is chock-full of little shortcuts - connections that could have been genuinely cool if depicted properly, but instead crap all over what we thought we knew about the universe before.

15

> > my question now, in Halo 4, what configuration are we on now? GEN 2 armor yes, but what Mark? i assume Mark I was prototype, II would have been testing, so are we using GEN 2 Mark III? IV?[/color]
>
> With a new generation there are likely different rules. They may not work with Marks anymore.

that’s possible, one of the above posts that ninjad in before i hit reply said something about GEN 2 armor being privatized, the Mark system was something used mainly by the Military similar to software revision numbers (version 1.0,1.0.5,1.1) and often shortened to “Mk” or “M”+^_^+

16

> >
>
> All perfectly acceptable rationales. That said, I think 343i has a hard time keeping MJOLNIR consistent. In Halo 4, we see each Spartan-II in the same, albeit wrong, armor. That is consistent with the lore. Yet in Forward Unto Dawn and the Fall of reach comics, they all have differing armor. I can’t for the love of me see why consistency is not key.

In Halo 4: Forward Unto Dawn, it could very easily be chalked up to budget and not making any more suits of MJOLNIR. Easy solution, that. As for the Fall of Reach comics… no idea. 343 Industries only oversaw that, maybe? I don’t know. I don’t know why consistency is not key, either.

17

> > Because it looks cool. It’s the same as going back and comparing the Star Wars trilogies.
>
> Last time I checked, the Clone Troopers had different armour during the Clone Wars, and it was even slightly different during Episode III, just befor Order 66 was executed and all the other stuff that went down.
>
> “Because it looks cool” is becoming an increasingly stale reason for crapping on canon.

I thought that the clone trooper armor just got updated. The Episode III armor looks like the link between the original clone trooper armor and the imperial stormtrooper. I thought the change was intentional so you could see the transition.

18

> > > Because it looks cool. It’s the same as going back and comparing the Star Wars trilogies.
> >
> > Last time I checked, the Clone Troopers had different armour during the Clone Wars, and it was even slightly different during Episode III, just befor Order 66 was executed and all the other stuff that went down.
> >
> > “Because it looks cool” is becoming an increasingly stale reason for crapping on canon.
>
> I thought that the clone trooper armor just got updated. The Episode III armor looks like the link between the original clone trooper armor and the imperial stormtrooper. I thought the change was intentional so you could see the transition.

It was, the Clones armor did go through upgrades.

19

> > > Because it looks cool. It’s the same as going back and comparing the Star Wars trilogies.
> >
> > Last time I checked, the Clone Troopers had different armour during the Clone Wars, and it was even slightly different during Episode III, just befor Order 66 was executed and all the other stuff that went down.
> >
> > “Because it looks cool” is becoming an increasingly stale reason for crapping on canon.
>
> I thought that the clone trooper armor just got updated. The Episode III armor looks like the link between the original clone trooper armor and the imperial stormtrooper. I thought the change was intentional so you could see the transition.

especially considering how many years are between II and III in that storyline (3 or 4 i think?)+^^+ militaries have to keep their stuff up to date, or they fall behind in the arms race (whichever canon it is+^^+)

20

I thought Master Chief was a lot taller than Palmer in the ending CGI was from the rapid evolution the Librarian did to him. Since when the Chief and Palmer first meet, Chief was only a few inches taller.