Marines buff too much?

Warning: high levels of salt incoming.

Jusg trying to monkey with the Johnson buff and going for a fast tech 2 build in team war. And all I se evey game is 3 full infantry armies hitting me and my allies at the 5 minute mark, before I can even build 1 Mantis. I’m no pleb, I know how to micro and macro well and know my build order is sound with making my own marines to take nodes and supplies and help defend. But it’s too overwhelming when every game all 3 opponents go infantry rush. Cutter is back on top again as best leader, that’s for sure. The couple games I’ve got to tech 2 and 3 against opponents that don’t rush, my mech army can usually steamroll with his new power wheel order. But the last 4 games I played can’t even make it to tech 2. I’m hoping this is not going to be what the game devolves into, and only time will tell. But ATM I am worried and quite salty.

Yeah I’m quitting till Cutter gets toned down a lot. With marine buffs, jack rabbit nerfs and hero nerfs it’s back to Cutter moping the floor with every unsc hero except maybe Jerome and less likely Kinsano.

So did Forge get nerfed? or they just buffed other leaders to compete with forge?

> 2533274805640921;3:
> So did Forge get nerfed? or they just buffed other leaders to compete with forge?

https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/forums/38bd6e2ebbb14e5b9b359bb029588800/topics/mid-season-balance-update---sept-7/5cb4edfb-9c28-48bf-8413-5ccf900195a5/posts

Read the patch notes.

> 2533274845021192;2:
> Yeah I’m quitting till Cutter gets toned down a lot. With marine buffs, jack rabbit nerfs and hero nerfs it’s back to Cutter moping the floor with every unsc hero except maybe Jerome and less likely Kinsano.

Cutter is damn good right now but I’m going to hold off on saying it’s hopeless until a few more things are tried. I like the general direction of the patch (love it, actually) but I will concede Marines are absurd right now. If scouts beat them when upgraded this would be a really good state of balance.

I’ll probably try shrapnel choppers as colony, with the symbiotes buff and all.

Isabel and Forge can match Cutter- holo decoy and heavy metalled marines can tank about everything.

> 2533274812650916;5:
> If scouts beat them when upgraded this would be a really good state of balance.

It wouldn’t actually since scouts transition very poorly into T2 as opposed to marines.

> 2533274821521504;7:
> > 2533274812650916;5:
> > If scouts beat them when upgraded this would be a really good state of balance.
>
> It wouldn’t actually since scouts transition very poorly into T2 as opposed to marines.

Yeah. But that’s a trade off. Get map control/expand.

> 2533274812650916;8:
> > 2533274821521504;7:
> > > 2533274812650916;5:
> > > If scouts beat them when upgraded this would be a really good state of balance.
> >
> > It wouldn’t actually since scouts transition very poorly into T2 as opposed to marines.
>
> Yeah. But that’s a trade off. Get map control/expand.

I agree but I think scouts should beat marines without needing upgrades. Grenades should even out and shrapnel rounds for example should help the match up slightly in favor of scouts again (if micro’d properly).

> 2533274821521504;9:
> > 2533274812650916;8:
> > > 2533274821521504;7:
> > > > 2533274812650916;5:
> > > > If scouts beat them when upgraded this would be a really good state of balance.
> > >
> > > It wouldn’t actually since scouts transition very poorly into T2 as opposed to marines.
> >
> > Yeah. But that’s a trade off. Get map control/expand.
>
> I agree but I think scouts should beat marines without needing upgrades. Grenades should even out and shrapnel rounds for example should help the match up slightly in favor of scouts again (if micro’d properly).

Then what would the point of shrapnel rounds be? There would be no point in investing 450 power for an upgrade to a unit that doesn’t scale to mid game.

Upgraded scouts are expensive and require immense investment. There should be a good chance of a return that.

> 2533274812650916;10:
> > 2533274821521504;9:
> > > 2533274812650916;8:
> > > > 2533274821521504;7:
> > > > > 2533274812650916;5:
> > > > > If scouts beat them when upgraded this would be a really good state of balance.
> > > >
> > > > It wouldn’t actually since scouts transition very poorly into T2 as opposed to marines.
> > >
> > > Yeah. But that’s a trade off. Get map control/expand.
> >
> > I agree but I think scouts should beat marines without needing upgrades. Grenades should even out and shrapnel rounds for example should help the match up slightly in favor of scouts again (if micro’d properly).
>
> Then what would the point of shrapnel rounds be? There would be no point in investing 450 power for an upgrade to a unit that doesn’t scale to mid game.
>
> Upgraded scouts are expensive and require immense investment. There should be a good chance of a return that.

Shrapnel rounds should help you:

A) beat upgraded infantry with splash damage for marines and detect for grunt mines.
B) more dps to maybe take one, max two minibases out.

Un upgraded scouts > un upgraded infantry
Upgraded infantry > un upgraded scouts
Upgraded scouts >= upgraded infantry

The third match up would go down to who micro better. But if you left them units standing still scouts should come on top.

I don’t get why marines got buffed in the first place, they were 100% fine where they were at. They were viable into the mid game, and lost value in the late game, as it should be. Welcome to Broken Wars 2: The Marine Menace.

> 2533274843481335;12:
> I don’t get why marines got buffed in the first place, they were 100% fine where they were at. They were viable into the mid game, and lost value in the late game, as it should be. Welcome to Broken Wars 2: The Marine Menace.

I don’t think they should lose value late game. But having their early and mid propelled this much has broken the game. I haven’t payed enough attention pre patch, but after the patch combat mechanic makes their HP bar huge.

Flames also got a big buff, as well as snipers, but the sniper one isn’t as big as the other two.

> 2533274821521504;13:
> > 2533274843481335;12:
> > I don’t get why marines got buffed in the first place, they were 100% fine where they were at. They were viable into the mid game, and lost value in the late game, as it should be. Welcome to Broken Wars 2: The Marine Menace.
>
> I don’t think they should lose value late game. But having their early and mid propelled this much has broken the game. I haven’t payed enough attention pre patch, but after the patch combat mechanic makes their HP bar huge.
>
> Flames also got a big buff, as well as snipers, but the sniper one isn’t as big as the other two.

I’m fine with the Sniper one, they were too far outclassed by Rangers, and I always thought they took a bit too much pop for their effectiveness. Flamers are still outclassed by Snipers so unless you’re concerned with building damage they’re not useful. I honestly don’t think you buff Marines to the point where they are viable late game without breaking them in the early/mid game. They’re a T1 unit, they’re viability should fade over the course of the game, no one uses scout units past T1, no ones uses Grunts past T1, No one uses JP Brutes after T1, Marines should not be viable past T2.

> 2533274843481335;14:
> > 2533274821521504;13:
> > > 2533274843481335;12:
> > > I don’t get why marines got buffed in the first place, they were 100% fine where they were at. They were viable into the mid game, and lost value in the late game, as it should be. Welcome to Broken Wars 2: The Marine Menace.
> >
> > I don’t think they should lose value late game. But having their early and mid propelled this much has broken the game. I haven’t payed enough attention pre patch, but after the patch combat mechanic makes their HP bar huge.
> >
> > Flames also got a big buff, as well as snipers, but the sniper one isn’t as big as the other two.
>
> I’m fine with the Sniper one, they were too far outclassed by Rangers, and I always thought they took a bit too much pop for their effectiveness. Flamers are still outclassed by Snipers so unless you’re concerned with building damage they’re not useful. I honestly don’t think you buff Marines to the point where they are viable late game without breaking them in the early/mid game. They’re a T1 unit, they’re viability should fade over the course of the game, no one uses scout units past T1, no ones uses Grunts past T1, No one uses JP Brutes after T1, Marines should not be viable past T2.

Interesting to see everyone complaining about this meta before even figuring out what’s good and what isn’t.

> 2533274916206345;6:
> Isabel and Forge can match Cutter- holo decoy and heavy metalled marines can tank about everything.

  • Isa can roll hogs if need be when she hits T2.

Tech 3 Marines beat my Tech 1 Assault Elites and Suicide Grunts (With a Chosen)
Something isn’t adding up. Oh yeah, They over buff to much…

> 2533274936603132;17:
> Tech 3 Marines beat my Tech 1 Assault Elites and Suicide Grunts (With a Chosen)
> Something isn’t adding up. Oh yeah, They over buff to much…

Not sure if this is sarcasm, I’m going to think it is. Though I don’t think this is what anyone’s suffering right now lol, the buffs are static which means you don’t need any upgrades for them to be in effect.

Marines were definitely buffed too much because two marines can now capture TWO nodes by themselves!! What is this madness. Meanwhile banished need to make at least 3 squads to take one power node and don’t get get me started on cannon fodder.

> 2533274818651339;19:
> Marines were definitely buffed too much because two marines can now capture TWO nodes by themselves!! What is this madness. Meanwhile banished need to make at least 3 squads to take one power node and don’t get get me started on cannon fodder.

i think cannon fodder was nerfed to much and a bit exaggerated