Making the Best out of the Recent Changes

Im just as upset about halo 4 as many of you all.
As pissed off as it makes me, its time for us to accept that 343 simply threw core gameplay almost completely out the window.
I cannot expect to play this halo game and have it feel competitively similar to past halo games. I dont really expect a similar MP experience at all. and it does tick me off, very much. Saying that 343 was working with MLG…is a lie, 343.

But i have been thinking of ways to make it a little better.
Before I continue, i expect responses to this thread to be calm and made in a rational way. I know I’m not a mod, but seriously things are much easier to work out of people do so calmly and rationally.

Anyway, the first issue i wish to address is progression unlocks.

This is based on the assumption that unlocks will be armor abilities.

Now we know AAs will be in the game, and that some unlocks will be AAs. We don’t, however, think that it is a good idea to give to the people that have been playing longer a bigger selection PERIOD. It is similar to halo Reach’s method of leveling based on play time instead of skill. No one liked that as much.

Am I saying that people should not be rewarded by play time? no. I am saying that play time should be a small factor of leveling up.
Based on the assumption that people WILL require skill to level up, i think there is a way to go about this. Armor Abilities acquired from leveling up should be about as useful,and have good uses in certain situations (and work VERY well in those situations), but in less situations AND they should require significantly more skill to use correctly. Does that make sense?

My next idea is based on customized loadouts. I certainly hope the weapons that we choose from are VERY limited, because there are obvious advantages between a pistol and a Needler, for example. the needler is not really a skilled weapon and if in halo 4 weapons even similar to it should NOT be able to be chosen. As stupid as it is to me for people to want to start with an AR instead of a BR or a DMR, there is no reason why they can’t. If you are competitive like me, you understand that its just more kills for you. Amirite?

Anyway, if grenades are like they are in Reach, grenades better not be selectable. Plasma grenades obviously had a HUGE damage advantage, and even though the frags in reach were stupidly easy, were even noob friendlier than the frags. so those need to be VERY, VERY carefully balanced. And im thinking there could be some visual notifier of what grenades a person has so we can adjust accordingly.

Armor abilities I hate. I honestly hate even thinking about a way to make them balanced, because they don’t belong. They better not be any more imbalanced than they were in Reach. but…forerunner vision is something everyone thats even slightly competitive will be watching VERY, VERY closely, along with jetpack. we can’t make the same mistakes twice. We cannot give anyone a distinct advantage like reach did.

refraining from armor customization until more is known.

As for the random weapon drops. It also has to be done VERY carefully. If there is a known pattern with known timing (EX. literally rotates, every 30 seconds) it could actually improve the skill gap, meaning more skilled players would know where a rocket launcher or sniper was at a certain time in the game. players who just were there would be lost and clueless in that sense unless they took the time to figure out the pattern elsewhere.

Ill probably add more later, or whatever. The people on this forum piss me off, so don’t expect me to come back to this thread too often.

You’re seriously suggesting that higher ‘SKILL’ levels should get better armour abilities just to pwn noobs even harder? If there going to screw up my game than i guess I’m in for ruining everybody elses time as well. Count me in.

> You’re seriously suggesting that higher ‘SKILL’ levels should get better armour abilities just to pwn noobs even harder? If there going to screw up my game than i guess I’m in for ruining everybody elses time as well. Count me in.

im actually suggesting the exact opposite. Im suggesting they get ones that work well in less situations, require more skill to use, and if used correctly they SHOULD pwn noobs with it. but they should be much HARDER to use.

> > You’re seriously suggesting that higher ‘SKILL’ levels should get better armour abilities just to pwn noobs even harder? If there going to screw up my game than i guess I’m in for ruining everybody elses time as well. Count me in.
>
> im actually suggesting the exact opposite. Im suggesting they get ones that work well in less situations, require more skill to use, and if used correctly they SHOULD pwn noobs with it. but they should be much HARDER to use.

This would literally get rid of the sole reason for armor abilities (decreasing the skill gap) in which case we should just do away with them anyway :stuck_out_tongue:

> > > You’re seriously suggesting that higher ‘SKILL’ levels should get better armour abilities just to pwn noobs even harder? If there going to screw up my game than i guess I’m in for ruining everybody elses time as well. Count me in.
> >
> > im actually suggesting the exact opposite. Im suggesting they get ones that work well in less situations, require more skill to use, and if used correctly they SHOULD pwn noobs with it. but they should be much HARDER to use.
>
> This would literally get rid of the sole reason for armor abilities (decreasing the skill gap) in which case we should just do away with them anyway :stuck_out_tongue:

thats obviously what i think (decreasing the skill gap is obviously a step backwards) but 343 doesn’t think that way in the slightest, so…whatever.

One good thing could come out of this. If only power-weapons are on the maps, it could help close the gap between the competitive community and casual community, because MLG and other competitive gaming organizations won’t have to change the map and weapon layouts too much.

The only thing I really want to say is regarding Forerunner Vision. A lot of people think it will allow you to see enemies no matter where they are. Frank O’Connor said very recently that that’s not the case at all. He said that it’s nowhere near that powerful, and a competitive player with good situational awareness would probably go so far as to find it basically useless.

> The only thing I really want to say is regarding Forerunner Vision. A lot of people think it will allow you to see enemies no matter where they are. Frank O’Connor said very recently that that’s not the case at all. He said that it’s nowhere near that powerful, and a competitive player with good situational awareness would probably go so far as to find it basically useless.

I understand why you people are trying to be optimistic, you just have to see it from our standpoint for a second. Competitively, taking away the advantage of using walls for cover is a terrible thought, and the idea makes us shiver…

To be fair, i’m thinking that Halo 4 will keep rank and a credit system separate. I believe that’s the most logical solution to make both sides happy. Get a numbered rank for your skill and credits to buy armor and such. I mean if you gain a lot of credits per game it means you’re doing something right and are pretty good in-game. Your rank, however, would reflect on your overall performance in ranked matches. Again, it sounds like the most logical solution at this point given how Reach’s ranks were one in the same, which was something the community, was against.

Why does everyone care so much about the skill gap?

because the skill gap is the most important part of any competitive game?
There should be, as stated several times, “no game generated luck”, or any game generated skill. it should all be player generated.

> > > > You’re seriously suggesting that higher ‘SKILL’ levels should get better armour abilities just to pwn noobs even harder? If there going to screw up my game than i guess I’m in for ruining everybody elses time as well. Count me in.
> > >
> > > im actually suggesting the exact opposite. Im suggesting they get ones that work well in less situations, require more skill to use, and if used correctly they SHOULD pwn noobs with it. but they should be much HARDER to use.
> >
> > This would literally get rid of the sole reason for armor abilities (decreasing the skill gap) in which case we should just do away with them anyway :stuck_out_tongue:
>
> thats obviously what i think (decreasing the skill gap is obviously a step backwards) but 343 doesn’t think that way in the slightest, so…whatever.

As far as i can tell 343 has to have done it on purpose to draw in a more casual crowd. If they seriously think preexisting halo fans want to play an unbalanced game than i feel truly sorry that they don’t even know why halo once had its fame and success. I can respect them more for selling out than i can for being clueless.

And i agree. im pointing out that even though they obviously care much more about the casuals, theres no reason to ditch competitive players completely…i mean, just LOOK at MLGs reaction. its pretty sad/funny.

> > The only thing I really want to say is regarding Forerunner Vision. A lot of people think it will allow you to see enemies no matter where they are. Frank O’Connor said very recently that that’s not the case at all. He said that it’s nowhere near that powerful, and a competitive player with good situational awareness would probably go so far as to find it basically useless.
>
> I understand why you people are trying to be optimistic, you just have to see it from our standpoint for a second. Competitively, taking away the advantage of using walls for cover is a terrible thought, and the idea makes us shiver…

What do you mean “you people”? :stuck_out_tongue:

I hear ya, I do. The only downside I can really think of is if you’re trying to ambush someone around a corner with a Sword or Shotgun. But if you think about it, that’s literally the only advantage that ability would have, avoiding ambushes. Which is powerful and all, but then that’s the only thing they can really avoid, if that’s the ability they chose.

And in regards to weapon drops, Frank said they would be telegraphed, so you’d know when and where a power weapon was spawning.

> > > The only thing I really want to say is regarding Forerunner Vision. A lot of people think it will allow you to see enemies no matter where they are. Frank O’Connor said very recently that that’s not the case at all. He said that it’s nowhere near that powerful, and a competitive player with good situational awareness would probably go so far as to find it basically useless.
> >
> > I understand why you people are trying to be optimistic, you just have to see it from our standpoint for a second. Competitively, taking away the advantage of using walls for cover is a terrible thought, and the idea makes us shiver…
>
> What do you mean “you people”? :stuck_out_tongue:
>
> I hear ya, I do. The only downside I can really think of is if you’re trying to ambush someone around a corner with a Sword or Shotgun. But if you think about it, that’s literally the only advantage that ability would have, avoiding ambushes. Which is powerful and all, but then that’s the only thing they can really avoid, if that’s the ability they chose.
>
> And in regards to weapon drops, Frank said they would be telegraphed, so you’d know when and where a power weapon was spawning.

we’ll just have to wait and see.

And by you people, i meant all the people trying to be optimistic and stuff. :stuck_out_tongue:

@Drewdude1234

I see you made your own thread so I came over.
Now some of these things do have me a little worried like weapon drops, but if they are predictable it’s ok and as for Forerunner Vision lets see how it works before we hit the panic button. While I like the idea to choose your starting weapon I agree it has to be limited (this isn’t CoD) such as choosing your utility weapon, BR, DMR, Carbine, then a pistol. Hell id be cool with the AR being a secondary weapon instead of primary because Halo has always favored utility weapons over it. As for a progression leveling system there needs to be one to keep casuals engaged, but at the same time there needs to be a separate “ranked” list for the competitive. As for ability unlocks for playtime if they are in Halo 4 I’m sure its not going to take days of playtime to unlock them, in CoD you had all the abilities fairly quick, so if they do it like that it doesn’t bother me because its another way to keep the player engaged and give them another reason to play. But if you wind up hating all of this 343i has promised “classic” style Halo for the forth game, plus MLG might come up with something you like.

> > > > The only thing I really want to say is regarding Forerunner Vision. A lot of people think it will allow you to see enemies no matter where they are. Frank O’Connor said very recently that that’s not the case at all. He said that it’s nowhere near that powerful, and a competitive player with good situational awareness would probably go so far as to find it basically useless.
> > >
> > > I understand why you people are trying to be optimistic, you just have to see it from our standpoint for a second. Competitively, taking away the advantage of using walls for cover is a terrible thought, and the idea makes us shiver…
> >
> > What do you mean “you people”? :stuck_out_tongue:
> >
> > I hear ya, I do. The only downside I can really think of is if you’re trying to ambush someone around a corner with a Sword or Shotgun. But if you think about it, that’s literally the only advantage that ability would have, avoiding ambushes. Which is powerful and all, but then that’s the only thing they can really avoid, if that’s the ability they chose.
> >
> > And in regards to weapon drops, Frank said they would be telegraphed, so you’d know when and where a power weapon was spawning.
>
> we’ll just have to wait and see.
>
> And by you people, i meant all the people trying to be optimistic and stuff. :stuck_out_tongue:

Yeah. I mean, I understand that casuals like all of the customization stuff. And it is kind of necessary with Spartan Ops, which is going to definitely be an amazing new part of this game. I am 100% okay with them adding those customization things in. But they don’t have to have the gameplay-changing things on every playlist. In fact, I think the only thing they REALLY need is to have a decent number of competitive playlists where everyone starts out with the same things and are matched up based on a skill rank, rather than a Spart Points rank. Something more akin to Halo 3’s matchmaking. If they can do that for the competitive players while keeping the new features for casuals, while also nailing Spartan Ops and campaign . . . this just might be the best game ever made.

And I do admit that I’m optimistic to a fault. It’s my inner-fan-boy. XD

I think its a good idea to keep them seperated, but if we do so, we should keep the whole thing seperate (what happens in ranked, stays in ranked. what happens in social, stays in social.)

> I think its a good idea to keep them seperated, but if we do so, we should keep the whole thing seperate (what happens in ranked, stays in ranked. what happens in social, stays in social.)

I agree with that, but I think Spartan Points should still be awarded in ranked playlists, for the sake of Spartan Ops. Otherwise, purely competitive players would be punished in that mode for not playing social playlists.

> > I think its a good idea to keep them seperated, but if we do so, we should keep the whole thing seperate (what happens in ranked, stays in ranked. what happens in social, stays in social.)
>
> I agree with that, but I think Spartan Points should still be awarded in ranked playlists, for the sake of Spartan Ops. Otherwise, purely competitive players would be punished in that mode for not playing social playlists.

that makes sense. so anything that happens in social stays in social, but points you get in ranked also go over to social.