The ODST pistol was fast firing and lethal. It had 12 rounds and could carry up to 60 rounds/ 5 magazines.
Why not change up gameplay by making a fast firing, semi auto Rifle? It will have 12 rounds as well, and will take 8 headshots to kill (maybe more or less to balance)
Maybe like the Battle rifle from the Halo 2 beta, where zoomed is single fire, except now even if its unzoomed its single shot fire still.
thoughts?
The stats you suggested wouldn’t make it a good utility weapon.
I would prefer a 4sk weapon with a capped RoF.
> The stats you suggested wouldn’t make it a good utility weapon.
>
> I would prefer a 4sk weapon with a capped RoF.
with all do respect We had 4 and 5 headshots to a kill weapons since Halo 2. How about a change in gameplay?
> > The stats you suggested wouldn’t make it a good utility weapon.
> >
> > I would prefer a 4sk weapon with a capped RoF.
>
> with all do respect We had 4 and 5 headshots to a kill weapons since Halo 2. How about a change in gameplay?
Every Halo has had a utility weapon, I’m all for changing gameplay as long as the core remains the same. A 8sk with a 12 round clip just wouldn’t make the best utility weapon. I personally would go for a 3sk weapon but that wouldn’t work online.
> > > The stats you suggested wouldn’t make it a good utility weapon.
> > >
> > > I would prefer a 4sk weapon with a capped RoF.
> >
> > with all do respect We had 4 and 5 headshots to a kill weapons since Halo 2. How about a change in gameplay?
>
> Every Halo has had a utility weapon, I’m all for changing gameplay as long as the core remains the same. A 8sk with a 12 round clip just wouldn’t make the best utility weapon. I personally would go for a 3sk weapon but that wouldn’t work online.
Why wouldn’t it? A reimagined 3sk magnum would be epic. I never understood the “won’t work online” excuse.
Not trying to sound snarky at all, just my thinking on the matter.
If the ROF was super fast an eight headshot kill would work, but the clip size would need to be like 24-30, having to reload after every kill with a precision weapon doesn’t make any sense.
> > > > The stats you suggested wouldn’t make it a good utility weapon.
> > > >
> > > > I would prefer a 4sk weapon with a capped RoF.
> > >
> > > with all do respect We had 4 and 5 headshots to a kill weapons since Halo 2. How about a change in gameplay?
> >
> > Every Halo has had a utility weapon, I’m all for changing gameplay as long as the core remains the same. A 8sk with a 12 round clip just wouldn’t make the best utility weapon. I personally would go for a 3sk weapon but that wouldn’t work online.
>
> Why wouldn’t it? A reimagined 3sk magnum would be epic. I never understood the “won’t work online” excuse.
>
> Not trying to sound snarky at all, just my thinking on the matter.
Because it was hard to hit with it in Halo CE with super low amounts of bullet magnetism and the need to lead your shots. In online conditions the pistol would be rendered useless, hitting with it would be near impossible unless you were host. When we apply bullet magnetism and hitscan to the weapon, it becomes incredibly easy to use and doesn’t have as big skill gap as it used to have, in fact, the skill gap would become very small.
In online conditions the best weapon to guarantee skill gap is a four shot kill, burst fire weapon like the BR with 1.5 second kill time, it requires you to keep your reticle on the opponent throughout the whole burst in order to get the four shot kill, adding more skill to aiming.
> > > > > The stats you suggested wouldn’t make it a good utility weapon.
> > > > >
> > > > > I would prefer a 4sk weapon with a capped RoF.
> > > >
> > > > with all do respect We had 4 and 5 headshots to a kill weapons since Halo 2. How about a change in gameplay?
> > >
> > > Every Halo has had a utility weapon, I’m all for changing gameplay as long as the core remains the same. A 8sk with a 12 round clip just wouldn’t make the best utility weapon. I personally would go for a 3sk weapon but that wouldn’t work online.
> >
> > Why wouldn’t it? A reimagined 3sk magnum would be epic. I never understood the “won’t work online” excuse.
> >
> > Not trying to sound snarky at all, just my thinking on the matter.
>
> Because it was hard to hit with it in Halo CE with super low amounts of bullet magnetism and the need to lead your shots. In online conditions the pistol would be rendered useless, hitting with it would be near impossible unless you were host. When we apply bullet magnetism and hitscan to the weapon, it becomes incredibly easy to use and doesn’t have as big skill gap as it used to have, in fact, the skill gap would become very small.
>
> In online conditions the best weapon to guarantee skill gap is a four shot kill, burst fire weapon like the BR with 1.5 second kill time, it requires you to keep your reticle on the opponent throughout the whole burst in order to get the four shot kill, adding more skill to aiming.
Reach’s netcode was amazing. H4’s will be better. Sure, non-hitscan weapons may still not work as they do on LAN, but there are definitely ways to create hitscan weapons with huge skill gaps. Throw strafe acceleration out the window. Reduce bullet magnetism and aim assist.
I do agree that burst fire weapons can increase the skill gap, but a 1.0-1.2 s perfect kill time would be ideal for the H4 utility weapon. Right between CE and H2 kill times. The shorter the kill time, the greater the gap between minimum and average kill times can be, and therefore the greater the skill gap can be.
> Reach’s netcode was amazing. H4’s will be better. Sure, non-hitscan weapons may still not work as they do on LAN, but there are definitely ways to create hitscan weapons with huge skill gaps. Throw strafe acceleration out the window. Reduce bullet magnetism and aim assist.
>
> I do agree that burst fire weapons can increase the skill gap, but a 1.0-1.2 s perfect kill time would be ideal for the H4 utility weapon. Right between CE and H2 kill times. The shorter the kill time, the greater the gap between minimum and average kill times can be, and therefore the greater the skill gap can be.
You’re totally right that netcodes are always getting better, but bullet magnetism is still a big part of games. Like when looking at Halo Reach, the bullet magnetism is huge. 1-1.2 second four shot kill would definitely be the best option for LAN, but in online conditions the average kill time wouldn’t be very different from the minimum. The difference isn’t completely tied to the time of the fastest possible time it requires to get the kill, but the amount of bullet magnetism accompanied with it and is the weapon hitscan or non-hitscan.
If Halo Reach let me pull the shots as fast as I can and had a three or four shot kill, my opponents wouldn’t stand a chance. In Halo Reach I rarely miss shots, in Halo 2 and 3 I missed single bullets, but rarely a whole shot, Halo CE is the only game in the series where I freguently miss shots. This is because of the non-hitscan nature and low bullet magnetism.
Actually, I’m waiting to see the three shot kill, bloomless Reach pistol in action to see how easy it’s to use. I’m expecting it to be very easy, leading to me pulling three shot kills very freguently, and never having to shoot more than five shots per person.
I still deem four shot kill, burst firing weapon with 1.4-1.5 second kill time as the best utility weapon for online play. It’s consistent and not super easy to use. It’s mainly good because it goes much better with hitscan.
> > > > > > The stats you suggested wouldn’t make it a good utility weapon.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I would prefer a 4sk weapon with a capped RoF.
> > > > >
> > > > > with all do respect We had 4 and 5 headshots to a kill weapons since Halo 2. How about a change in gameplay?
> > > >
> > > > Every Halo has had a utility weapon, I’m all for changing gameplay as long as the core remains the same. A 8sk with a 12 round clip just wouldn’t make the best utility weapon. I personally would go for a 3sk weapon but that wouldn’t work online.
> > >
> > > Why wouldn’t it? A reimagined 3sk magnum would be epic. I never understood the “won’t work online” excuse.
> > >
> > > Not trying to sound snarky at all, just my thinking on the matter.
> >
> > Because it was hard to hit with it in Halo CE with super low amounts of bullet magnetism and the need to lead your shots. In online conditions the pistol would be rendered useless, hitting with it would be near impossible unless you were host. When we apply bullet magnetism and hitscan to the weapon, it becomes incredibly easy to use and doesn’t have as big skill gap as it used to have, in fact, the skill gap would become very small.
> >
> > In online conditions the best weapon to guarantee skill gap is a four shot kill, burst fire weapon like the BR with 1.5 second kill time, it requires you to keep your reticle on the opponent throughout the whole burst in order to get the four shot kill, adding more skill to aiming.
>
>
> Reach’s netcode was amazing. H4’s will be better. Sure, non-hitscan weapons may still not work as they do on LAN, but there are definitely ways to create hitscan weapons with huge skill gaps. Throw strafe acceleration out the window. Reduce bullet magnetism and aim assist.
>
> I do agree that burst fire weapons can increase the skill gap, but a 1.0-1.2 s perfect kill time would be ideal for the H4 utility weapon. Right between CE and H2 kill times. The shorter the kill time, the greater the gap between minimum and average kill times can be, and therefore the greater the skill gap can be.
I like the idea of a fast firing Battle Rifle like H2 E3 demo. Can someone tell me what hitscan and bullet magnetism is, please?
Silenced weapons FTW
> > Reach’s netcode was amazing. H4’s will be better. Sure, non-hitscan weapons may still not work as they do on LAN, but there are definitely ways to create hitscan weapons with huge skill gaps. Throw strafe acceleration out the window. Reduce bullet magnetism and aim assist.
> >
> > I do agree that burst fire weapons can increase the skill gap, but a 1.0-1.2 s perfect kill time would be ideal for the H4 utility weapon. Right between CE and H2 kill times. The shorter the kill time, the greater the gap between minimum and average kill times can be, and therefore the greater the skill gap can be.
>
> You’re totally right that netcodes are always getting better, but bullet magnetism is still a big part of games. Like when looking at Halo Reach, the bullet magnetism is huge. 1-1.2 second four shot kill would definitely be the best option for LAN, but in online conditions the average kill time wouldn’t be very different from the minimum. The difference isn’t completely tied to the time of the fastest possible time it requires to get the kill, but the amount of bullet magnetism accompanied with it and is the weapon hitscan or non-hitscan.
>
> If Halo Reach let me pull the shots as fast as I can and had a three or four shot kill, my opponents wouldn’t stand a chance. In Halo Reach I rarely miss shots, in Halo 2 and 3 I missed single bullets, but rarely a whole shot, Halo CE is the only game in the series where I freguently miss shots. This is because of the non-hitscan nature and low bullet magnetism.
>
> Actually, I’m waiting to see the three shot kill, bloomless Reach pistol in action to see how easy it’s to use. I’m expecting it to be very easy, leading to me pulling three shot kills very freguently, and never having to shoot more than five shots per person.
>
> I still deem four shot kill, burst firing weapon with 1.4-1.5 second kill time as the best utility weapon for online play. It’s consistent and not super easy to use. It’s mainly good because it goes much better with hitscan.
The point I’m trying to make is why do online conditions have make aiming easy? Why does H4 have to have lots of bullet magnetism/aim assist? It doesn’t. I understand that Reach is Reach, but I’m talking Halo 4. If the netcode is at Reach’s level of better, it will allow for high weapon difficulty, which in turn will allow for faster minimum kill times.
The BR is the most popular and successful Halo weapon, not having it in Halo 4 would be blasphemy!
> > > > > > > The stats you suggested wouldn’t make it a good utility weapon.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I would prefer a 4sk weapon with a capped RoF.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > with all do respect We had 4 and 5 headshots to a kill weapons since Halo 2. How about a change in gameplay?
> > > > >
> > > > > Every Halo has had a utility weapon, I’m all for changing gameplay as long as the core remains the same. A 8sk with a 12 round clip just wouldn’t make the best utility weapon. I personally would go for a 3sk weapon but that wouldn’t work online.
> > > >
> > > > Why wouldn’t it? A reimagined 3sk magnum would be epic. I never understood the “won’t work online” excuse.
> > > >
> > > > Not trying to sound snarky at all, just my thinking on the matter.
> > >
> > > Because it was hard to hit with it in Halo CE with super low amounts of bullet magnetism and the need to lead your shots. In online conditions the pistol would be rendered useless, hitting with it would be near impossible unless you were host. When we apply bullet magnetism and hitscan to the weapon, it becomes incredibly easy to use and doesn’t have as big skill gap as it used to have, in fact, the skill gap would become very small.
> > >
> > > In online conditions the best weapon to guarantee skill gap is a four shot kill, burst fire weapon like the BR with 1.5 second kill time, it requires you to keep your reticle on the opponent throughout the whole burst in order to get the four shot kill, adding more skill to aiming.
> >
> >
> > Reach’s netcode was amazing. H4’s will be better. Sure, non-hitscan weapons may still not work as they do on LAN, but there are definitely ways to create hitscan weapons with huge skill gaps. Throw strafe acceleration out the window. Reduce bullet magnetism and aim assist.
> >
> > I do agree that burst fire weapons can increase the skill gap, but a 1.0-1.2 s perfect kill time would be ideal for the H4 utility weapon. Right between CE and H2 kill times. The shorter the kill time, the greater the gap between minimum and average kill times can be, and therefore the greater the skill gap can be.
>
> I like the idea of a fast firing Battle Rifle like H2 E3 demo. Can someone tell me what hitscan and bullet magnetism is, please?
Here. Also, hitscan is basically infinite bullet speed.
> If the ROF was super fast an eight headshot kill would work, but the clip size would need to be like 24-30, having to reload after every kill with a precision weapon doesn’t make any sense.
Agreed. I hope we get the Battle Rifle we were promised from the Halo 2 E3 demo. I think a lot of people totally dig that rifle and I would be thilled if it was in Halo4. A 25 round mag would do nicely with carbine-like ROF.
> The ODST pistol was fast firing and lethal. It had 12 rounds and could carry up to 60 rounds/ 5 magazines.
>
> Why not change up gameplay by making a fast firing, semi auto Rifle? It will have 12 rounds as well, and will take 8 headshots to kill (maybe more or less to balance)
>
> Maybe like the Battle rifle from the Halo 2 beta, where zoomed is single fire, except now even if its unzoomed its single shot fire still.
>
> thoughts?
If it took 8 headshot to get a kill the assault rifle - melee would end up the utility weapon. In conjuction with sprint and other stupid crap like that no one would ever get a kill with it. I think the plasma pistol would be > your suggested utility.
More than 4 shots to kill wont work, noone wants to put 5+ shots with a precision weapon into someone just to kill them. Your Better off with a singleshot BR, or a 4-5 shot CE pistol. I want to be able to go big again with just my precision weapon, 343i needs to let gameplay flow smoothly at an exciting pace without interruptions.
> The BR is the most popular and successful Halo weapon, not having it in Halo 4 would be blasphemy!
This.
> > > Reach’s netcode was amazing. H4’s will be better. Sure, non-hitscan weapons may still not work as they do on LAN, but there are definitely ways to create hitscan weapons with huge skill gaps. Throw strafe acceleration out the window. Reduce bullet magnetism and aim assist.
> > >
> > > I do agree that burst fire weapons can increase the skill gap, but a 1.0-1.2 s perfect kill time would be ideal for the H4 utility weapon. Right between CE and H2 kill times. The shorter the kill time, the greater the gap between minimum and average kill times can be, and therefore the greater the skill gap can be.
> >
> > You’re totally right that netcodes are always getting better, but bullet magnetism is still a big part of games. Like when looking at Halo Reach, the bullet magnetism is huge. 1-1.2 second four shot kill would definitely be the best option for LAN, but in online conditions the average kill time wouldn’t be very different from the minimum. The difference isn’t completely tied to the time of the fastest possible time it requires to get the kill, but the amount of bullet magnetism accompanied with it and is the weapon hitscan or non-hitscan.
> >
> > If Halo Reach let me pull the shots as fast as I can and had a three or four shot kill, my opponents wouldn’t stand a chance. In Halo Reach I rarely miss shots, in Halo 2 and 3 I missed single bullets, but rarely a whole shot, Halo CE is the only game in the series where I freguently miss shots. This is because of the non-hitscan nature and low bullet magnetism.
> >
> > Actually, I’m waiting to see the three shot kill, bloomless Reach pistol in action to see how easy it’s to use. I’m expecting it to be very easy, leading to me pulling three shot kills very freguently, and never having to shoot more than five shots per person.
> >
> > I still deem four shot kill, burst firing weapon with 1.4-1.5 second kill time as the best utility weapon for online play. It’s consistent and not super easy to use. It’s mainly good because it goes much better with hitscan.
>
> The point I’m trying to make is why do online conditions have make aiming easy? Why does H4 have to have lots of bullet magnetism/aim assist? It doesn’t. I understand that Reach is Reach, but I’m talking Halo 4. If the netcode is at Reach’s level of better, it will allow for high weapon difficulty, which in turn will allow for faster minimum kill times.
On the client side, lag always makes a small portion of bullet magnetism disappear. This can be noticed very well with DMR, as the host can pull kills pretty easily by spamming while the clients pretty much need at least some level of pacing. And while not completely sure, I pretty much believe that the bullet magnetism is needed in the hit detection and with too small of magnetism, some shots just wouldn’t register.
I’d really like Halo 4 to get rid of as much bullet magnetism and other assists as possible, but I still don’t want to sacrifice registeration of my shots in order to have weapons that are hard to use. Then there is hitscan which is much more important than bullet magnetism, Halo CE pistol not being hitscan also allowed it to be a more skillful weapon.
I’m still in the belief that Halo can’t do without hitscan and with as small levels of bullet magnetism as Halo CE, but maybe someday, when people have fiber optic internet connections and lag is nearly non-existant in online play.