Looks like BR starts is getting phased out

“We took the starting load out seriously,” DelHoyo says. “We didn’t want people to start out with something lame so they couldn’t defend themselves, but we didn’t want them to be super powerful either. The assault rifle and magnum have been especially scrutinized. Our magnum has received a buff since the beta. The rate of fire has gone down, but the damage has gone up. If you miss a shot, you’re penalized a little bit, so we’re hoping that it will appeal to the skilled crowd. Meanwhile, the assault rifle has been given four extra rounds to each magazine, and those four bullets make a big difference in getting kills. So those two weapons have been super-tuned, and we feel like we have a load out that will be used by both the pro scene and the casual player.”

Thank God. This is something that I saw Halo 5 leaning heavily towards - weapon balancing and eliminating the need for BR starts. I couldn’t be any happier about this change. Although I can accept that for some people, BR starts is what they love about Halo. It would be nice if they could keep a BR playlist for those who would still prefer it, it was a staple of the series after all and losing BR starts might be jarring to people who haven’t played many other settings. It should always have a place in Halo but for the most part, AR/Pistol should be the default loadout for Arena and I’m happy to see that 343 has fixed the weapon sandbox!

> 2533274833600810;1:
> “We took the starting load out seriously,” DelHoyo says. “We didn’t want people to start out with something lame so they couldn’t defend themselves, but we didn’t want them to be super powerful either. The assault rifle and magnum have been especially scrutinized. Our magnum has received a buff since the beta. The rate of fire has gone down, but the damage has gone up. If you miss a shot, you’re penalized a little bit, so we’re hoping that it will appeal to the skilled crowd. Meanwhile, the assault rifle has been given four extra rounds to each magazine, and those four bullets make a big difference in getting kills. So those two weapons have been super-tuned, and we feel like we have a load out that will be used by both the pro scene and the casual player.”
>
> Thank God. This is something that I saw Halo 5 leaning heavily towards - weapon balancing and eliminating the need for BR starts. I couldn’t be any happier about this change. It would be cool if they could keep a BR playlist for those who would still prefer it, it was a staple of the series after all and losing BR starts might be jarring to people who haven’t played many other settings. But for the most part, AR/Pistol should be the default loadout for Arena and I’m happy to see that 343 has fixed the weapon sandbox!

Yeah, I definitely had more fun playing AR Starts than BR Starts. When you’re able to pick up a BR and SMG in AR Starts then you’re unstoppable.

Cool. Just hope that the map pick-ups for the BR and DMR are good. Truth/ Regret is pretty much the perfect Halo map at this point.
It’s also worth mentioning that all those clamoring for Halo: CE/ Halo 2 V-6.0 can now stop.

> 2533274836465274;3:
> Cool. Just hope that the map pick-ups for the BR and DMR are good. Truth/ Regret is pretty much the perfect Halo map at this point.

We’ll see once we get to play the whole game but yeah Truth is probably gonna be up there with my favorite Arena maps.

> 2533274833600810;4:
> > 2533274836465274;3:
> > Cool. Just hope that the map pick-ups for the BR and DMR are good. Truth/ Regret is pretty much the perfect Halo map at this point.
>
>
> We’ll see once we get to play the whole game but yeah Truth is probably gonna be up there with my favorite Arena maps.

Yeah, totally. But just speaking on the BETA version alone, I really couldn’t fault Truth. Probably the most arena-based fun to be had, for me anyway.

Thats awful to hear and lowers my anticipation a lot.

One step forward, two steps back.

> 2533274836465274;5:
> > 2533274833600810;4:
> > > 2533274836465274;3:
> > > Cool. Just hope that the map pick-ups for the BR and DMR are good. Truth/ Regret is pretty much the perfect Halo map at this point.
> >
> >
> > We’ll see once we get to play the whole game but yeah Truth is probably gonna be up there with my favorite Arena maps.
>
>
> Yeah, totally. But just speaking on the BETA version alone, I really couldn’t fault Truth. Probably the most arena-based fun to be had, for me anyway.

Yeah it was great, I probably would have liked Eden more if it was AR starts as well.

> 2533274818521550;6:
> Thats awful to hear and lowers my anticipation a lot.

To each their own. I always enjoy Halo more when there’s progression involved (BR pick-ups instead of loadouts) rather than starting at eleven ― it makes for a more skill-based game, too (gotta know those spawns and how to hold 'em).

> 2533274836465274;8:
> > 2533274818521550;6:
> > Thats awful to hear and lowers my anticipation a lot.
>
>
> To each their own. I always enjoy Halo more when there’s progression involved (BR pick-ups instead of loadouts) rather than starting at 11. It makes for a more skill-based game, too (gotta know those spawns and how to hold 'em).

I’m not convinced memorizing spawn points makes a game more skillful, more tactical and just needs an ability to remember things maybe which yes is a skill but it’s not the only skill that makes a game skillful

That’s a lot of skill

Alrighty. Don’t see why they would nerf the AR’s range if they were just going to give us AR starts anyway. With how fast-paced everything is in Halo 5, there should probably be a viable way to combat the constant changes in enemy range without swapping out the AR.

sigh I’m tired…

> 2533274906745123;9:
> > 2533274836465274;8:
> > > 2533274818521550;6:
> > > Thats awful to hear and lowers my anticipation a lot.
> >
> >
> > To each their own. I always enjoy Halo more when there’s progression involved (BR pick-ups instead of loadouts) rather than starting at 11. It makes for a more skill-based game, too (gotta know those spawns and how to hold 'em).
>
>
> I’m not convinced memorizing spawn points makes a game more skillful, more tactical maybe which yes is a skill but it’s not the only skill that makes a game skillful
>
> That’s a lot of skill

I think that is just a small part of the whole picture but an important part nonetheless. AR starts also leads to better map flow and more interesting matches as players move more freely and experiment with different weapons. It makes the game a more variable experience overall and less punishing for players that stick their toes out of cover.

Also I want to point this out:

"each side is labeled with giant letters to help teams communicate with each other"

and…

“We didn’t like old classic Halo, where you would spawn with an SMG – and the old SMG wasn’t very good – so you’d have to go on a scavenger hunt for maybe 30 seconds to find another weapon before you could fight anyone,”

Cool story DelHoyo, could you please explain to me why the MCC is filled with stupid AR/SMG starts all over the place? In the Halo 3 playlist for example you have the first voting spot being objective. I love objective, but nobody ever votes for it because its unplayable with ARs. And in the last voting spot we have ARs again which nobody votes for. Make objective at least BR starts like it should be!

> 2533274818521550;12:
> Also I want to point this out:
>
> "each side is labeled with giant letters to help teams communicate with each other"
>
> and…
>
> “We didn’t like old classic Halo, where you would spawn with an SMG – and the old SMG wasn’t very good – so you’d have to go on a scavenger hunt for maybe 30 seconds to find another weapon before you could fight anyone,”
>
> Cool story DelHoyo, could you please explain to me why the MCC is filled with stupid AR/SMG starts all over the place? In the Halo 3 playlist for example you have the first voting spot being objective. I love objective, but nobody ever votes for it because its unplayable with ARs. And in the last voting spot we have ARs again which nobody votes for. Make objective at least BR starts like it should be!

I’m guessing he didn’t work on MCC because he’s been wrapped up in Halo 5, seeing as he is the lead multiplayer designer.

I don’t believe that communicating where you are on the map should be an ordeal. Maps like Midship were praised (for many reasons) because they had easy callouts that didn’t take long to learn, you could actually focus on the match itself.

I’m a bit torn on this.

It could theoritically work for me IF and only IF the magnum is really strong and challenging. If the balance is broken, even just slighlty, it may play as pure crap just like SMG/AR starts are in H4/H5*.

I’ll wait until I play and see for a knowledgeable judgement.

*EDIT : I meant H2/H3, not H4/H5.

> 2533274940426117;14:
> I’m a bit torn on this.
>
> It could theoritically work for me IF and only IF the magnum is really strong and challenging. If the balance is slighty broken, it may play as pure crap just like SMG/AR starts are in H4/H5.
>
> I’ll wait until I play and see for a knowledgeable judgement.

It doesnt matter for me. AR starts slow the game down on a higher level gameplay. If someone is standing P2 and Carbine with a BR or DMR you will have no chance to fight back till you get one by yourself. So you have your team trapped in the base until those weapons spawn.
Yes it will work for casual gameplay where everyone sprints around and sprays each other down, but I dont see a reason why it has to be AR starts everywhere because of this people.

You will also, again, not be able to teamshot when you spawn. I hate not being able to help my friends because I have to find a BR first.

-yoink- AR starts. Why force everyone to play this way? Im really frustrated now.

> 2533274818521550;15:
> > 2533274940426117;14:
> > I’m a bit torn on this.
> >
> > It could theoritically work for me IF and only IF the magnum is really strong and challenging. If the balance is slighty broken, it may play as pure crap just like SMG/AR starts are in H4/H5.
> >
> > I’ll wait until I play and see for a knowledgeable judgement.
>
>
> It doesnt matter for me. AR starts slow the game down on a higher level gameplay. If someone is standing P2 and Carbine with a BR or DMR you will have no chance to fight back till you get one by yourself. So you have your team trapped in the base until those weapons spawn.
> Yes it will work for casual gameplay where everyone sprints around and sprays each other down, but I dont see a reason why it has to be AR starts everywhere because of this people.
>
> You will also, again, not be able to teamshot when you spawn. I hate not being able to help my friends because I have to find a BR first.
>
> -yoink- AR starts. Why force everyone to play this way? Im really frustrated now.

You can clean up kills with the pistol, it still kills players with 1 headshot if their shields are down. I disagree about having to wait to get weapons to have a fighting chance in Halo 5. The AR is a formidable starting weapon and while it might not outperform a BR at mid-range under completely equal circumstances, it does give you a hell of a fighting chance and is nowhere near the beating that you’d take with the same situation in classic Halo.

There will probably also be a BR playlist at launch for people who prefer it.

I was surprised how much more fun ar/magnum starts were once they switched to br starts. It totally plays different, I worked more with my team to move around the map to get the br/dmr vs starting with br and posting up and playing long game.
I’m pleased with the new ar and pistol, I do feel like I have a fighting chance when starting with those. Not in previous halo’s (halo 2 smg starts were the worst). I think all the weapons in h5 are good, the only bad thing I would say is I’m not a fan of the pistols reticle when zoomed in.

> 2533274818521550;15:
> > 2533274940426117;14:
> > I’m a bit torn on this.
> > It could theoritically work for me IF and only IF the magnum is really strong and challenging. If the balance is slighty broken, it may play as pure crap just like SMG/AR starts are in H4/H5.
> > I’ll wait until I play and see for a knowledgeable judgement.
>
>
> It doesnt matter for me. AR starts slow the game down on a higher level gameplay. If someone is standing P2 and Carbine with a BR or DMR you will have no chance to fight back till you get one by yourself. So you have your team trapped in the base until those weapons spawn.
> Yes it will work for casual gameplay where everyone sprints around and sprays each other down, but I dont see a reason why it has to be AR starts everywhere because of this people.
> You will also, again, not be able to teamshot when you spawn. I hate not being able to help my friends because I have to find a BR first.
> -yoink- AR starts. Why force everyone to play this way? Im really frustrated now.

Don’t get me wrong, I can pretty safely claim that I certainly despise AR starts as much as you are, these gametypes drive me crazy.

I wish we could have BR starts in the map selection lobby just as we have now (provided that the map selection works similarly). I’m highly skeptical on how this new H5 AR start would work in practice, and even more with high-level players. However, I think that AR starts could be much more viable if the magnum is a powerful close to mid-range weapon, which still has to be seen at this point.

How the magnum will compete with BR-DMR-Carbines-Light rifles is the key. If it is useless as mid-range, then AR starts will be just as pointless as it was in previous titles. That’s why I said I’m skeptical and that the balance has to be pure crystal. Otherwise: crap.

> 2533274818521550;12:
> Also I want to point this out:
>
> "each side is labeled with giant letters to help teams communicate with each other"
>
> and…
>
> “We didn’t like old classic Halo, where you would spawn with an SMG – and the old SMG wasn’t very good – so you’d have to go on a scavenger hunt for maybe 30 seconds to find another weapon before you could fight anyone,”
>
> Cool story DelHoyo, could you please explain to me why the MCC is filled with stupid AR/SMG starts all over the place? In the Halo 3 playlist for example you have the first voting spot being objective. I love objective, but nobody ever votes for it because its unplayable with ARs. And in the last voting spot we have ARs again which nobody votes for. Make objective at least BR starts like it should be!

Because he doesn’t have anything to do with MCC and god forbid people like variety rather than spawning with the most versatile gun in the game and using only that.

By the way, Bungie agrees with him. SMG starts, bad idea they said.

> 2533274950614657;19:
> > 2533274818521550;12:
> > Also I want to point this out:
> >
> > "each side is labeled with giant letters to help teams communicate with each other"
> >
> > and…
> >
> > “We didn’t like old classic Halo, where you would spawn with an SMG – and the old SMG wasn’t very good – so you’d have to go on a scavenger hunt for maybe 30 seconds to find another weapon before you could fight anyone,”
> >
> > Cool story DelHoyo, could you please explain to me why the MCC is filled with stupid AR/SMG starts all over the place? In the Halo 3 playlist for example you have the first voting spot being objective. I love objective, but nobody ever votes for it because its unplayable with ARs. And in the last voting spot we have ARs again which nobody votes for. Make objective at least BR starts like it should be!
>
>
> Because he doesn’t have anything to do with MCC and god forbid people like variety rather than spawning with the most versatile gun in the game.

He says we, WE 343, the people that make the Halo games or not? Of course Im sure that he doesnt make those decisions and I dont expect a response from him. But the MCC is currently floated with SMG/AR starts and its ironic to hear such a statement then.

God forbit people want to play a balanced and skilled game rather than getting spawnyoinked with a useless weapon. I also didnt say they should remove it, but definitly tune down the amount of it in ranked playlists. If people want to play it they vote for it, but nobody is doing that at least in ranked, so I dont see why we have to waste 2 of 3 voting slots with it.

(by the way, I agree with him and Bungie aswell, so why are we forced to play it that much?)