Levels, quitting and the future of Halo.

A long time halo player, since 1 but really got into it in two and three. I have literally found it impossible to truly get involved with Reach.

This isn’t to say Reach is a bad game, however it has one fatal flaw that will forever ruin it. There are no levels. I could be versing a first time player and I’ve played for many years, which is ridiculous in itself but this is not the main issue. Since there are no levels and people are not working towards anything (level 45, 50 in halo 3 etc) They quit constantly without consequence. Tonight I haven’t been able to play a game without people just quitting on me which is a huge issue with objective games and just the over all gaming experience. Sometimes multiple people quit before the game has even begun and it’s a 2 on 4 match.

In order to counter this a legitimate leveling system must be introduced. I’m not talking about that type of leveling system similar to COD which is absolutely crap… A structured leveling system which people can walk towards. The 1 - 50 system needs to be reintroduced. I know not everyone down at 343 is very fond of it but you need to open your eyes. Sure it allows for people to boost and so on which isn’t great but it is much better then what Reach has right now. No one wants boosters and that’s fair, but people who consistently play and love halo I’m sure would like to be able to play competitive games against people of THEIR own skill level and not have to worry about their team mates quitting.

Another flaw the leveling has caused is its effect on communication in the game. I personally loved working with team members (when they weren’t a jerk) to beat the other team and I know many others did too because everyone would want to win to rank up. Now, you would be surprised if people even put their mic in. There’s no incentive to win as you’ll level up anyway which is a pile of crap catered towards the people who will only play during its first two weeks of release. Halo helped build MLG to what it is today, through competitive play which is being completely diminished through the lack of competition online.

Bungie created a 1 - 50 system and guess what, it worked. Every system will have small flaws yet this barley effects the impact of the game, quitting however does. I loved going for my 50 in halo 3 and going for a 32 in halo 2 which was almost most of the fun in playing, getting that sense of achievement and improvement. Reach has already put a lot of people off of the Halo series with many proclaiming it to be ‘dead’. If Halo 4 is unable to implement a ranking system that can serve the same sort of purpose that the one in h2 and 3 did, the game could flop online. For the future of halo a serious ranking system NEEDS to be brought in to satisfy halo’s fans. I know Bungie aren’t running the show anymore but they created a extremely solid blueprint for you, please stop trying to change so much about it. The game play looks nice I will admit yet you are changing the game so much what was even the point in making a halo 4? Certainly not a fan of that Promethean vision or whatever its called and the large shield, however that’s another issue.

Listen to your regular halo players, the ones who play day in and out and love how the game is. The game needs to remain a halo game and not evolve into a mix between call of duty and halo reach. Please implement a ranking system, where people can verse people of their own skill. If people want to mess about, that’s fine. They will remain a low level because of it. I know it is probabely too late to be putting a ranking system into Reach, so for the love of God please put one in halo 4. Let me know what you think, ideas, criticism, agreement etc

Play the game for the love of the game.

Have a shot of jager every time you win a match if you want a clearly defined reward system. This gets quite fun actually.

The only other thing is that you really want a virtual number with which to front online to all your buddies and ingraciously boast about to randoms, which is what turned matchmaking into a ghetto in the first place.

While that does sound fun I’m afraid I’m going to have to pass on the basis of not being an alcoholic. I don’t want the leveling system to be there so I can boast and showoff but so I can play competitive games of halo with people who aren’t going to quit and such as they want to improve their level. I do play halo because I love it but competitiveness is part of its territory due to how the previous level systems have been run.

> The only other thing is that you really want a virtual number with which to front online to all your buddies and ingraciously boast about to randoms, which is what turned matchmaking into a ghetto in the first place.

People do that with everything.

> While that does sound fun I’m afraid I’m going to have to pass on the basis of not being an alcoholic. I don’t want the leveling system to be there so I can boast and showoff but so I can play competitive games of halo with people who aren’t going to quit and such as they want to improve their level. I do play halo because I love it but competitiveness is part of its territory due to how the previous level systems have been run.

So you just want games with people who arnt going to quit? That doesnt have much to do with a ranking system. JIP will fix that.

Looks like im going to have to post it again though.

> 1-50 DRAMATICALLY increased boosting. Which in turn, decreased its relevance. This is not arguable. That said we are thinking of ways to let players understand relative skill levels without increasing abuse based on that metric.
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> The numbers were bafflingly large. People with no skill and a lot of time (and occasionally money) on their hands made your 50 a mostly personal achievement.
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> I found that late 40s was effectively meaningless - so polluted was it by boosters etc. Of course 30 seconds of gaming could disprove that on a case by case basis. Late 30s, early 40s meant I was going to get donged on.
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> There are a lot of stupid people in the world, but boosters is a place I just can’t go intellectually.
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> So let me get this straight, you will buy, steal, borrow or boost an account so that you can have a number in front of your gamertag, that you know has NO MEANING because you deliberately spent money and time to make it meaningless. And then, on top of that, a level 28 player could come in and dance on your grave.
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> This is one of those instances where you should be careful what you wish for and the law of unintended consequences.

Heres something you probably dont know too. 1-50 is in reach, but the numbers are hidden to prevent that crap.

> > The only other thing is that you really want a virtual number with which to front online to all your buddies and ingraciously boast about to randoms, which is what turned matchmaking into a ghetto in the first place.
>
> People do that with everything.

Yes they do, which is why 343i need to be very careful with H4, and throwing straight 1-50 back in would be a disaster.

No, the quitting is only part of it. Like I said originally, I want to verse people of similar skill to me. Some may have fun going 30 kills 2 deaths against people who don’t know how to play but that’s also not the case for many of us.

I also don’t agree with what was said in regards to boosting. While many people did do it matchmaking wasn’t hugely affected by it. Those people who paid or boosted to 50 stopped playing in that playlist once they got it since it was such a ‘personal achievement’. With that said to, having a few unlegit level 40s - 50s with little impact is better then a system which doesn’t damage people who quit every game. So what if the ranks hidden and its there? The fact no one has to deal with it due to being hidden is what allows people to quit out

You dont understand the system well enough to know how having so much boosting going on due to rank envy statistically messes up the entire rest of the ranking spectrum. Your desire for visible 1-50 conflicts with your desire for an actual working sill matching system.

No offence, but i think im going to take the word of a man who worked at bungie for halo 2 and 3, and moved over to 343i to work on halo 4, over your claims that the cheating wasnt a big deal.

Showing your ranks isnt the answer to the quitting problem, but having a really tight non-boosted skill matching system working away in the background probably is.

Well that may be your opinion, however I am unsatisfied as I know many others are with reaches current system. I enjoyed the system before and believe that the positives it brings outweighs the negatives. Sure you can agree with him, that’s fair but he is working for Bungie during h2 and 3, not playing matchmaking you would imagine of any worthy magnitude

Thats more to do with a decision by bungie to sacrifice skill matching accuracy for speed, its less accurate but much faster than halo 3. I know many people are dissatisfied with it, i am too. I dont even bother searching without the skill option anymore, im happy to wait longer. It will almost certainly be tighter in halo 4 again.

Its not about how much matchmaking the guy has played, thats small time. Its about the fact that as an employee he has access to the years of raw numbers from the actual system to back his points up that 1-50 failed because people were extremely envious of that fiddy and gamed the whole system to hell to get it. And i have no reason to believe he would lie about something like that.

> This isn’t to say Reach is a bad game, however it has one fatal flaw that will forever ruin it. There are no levels. I could be versing a first time player and I’ve played for many years, which is ridiculous in itself but this is not the main issue. Since there are no levels and people are not working towards anything (level 45, 50 in halo 3 etc) They quit constantly without consequence. Tonight I haven’t been able to play a game without people just quitting on me which is a huge issue with objective games and just the over all gaming experience. Sometimes multiple people quit before the game has even begun and it’s a 2 on 4 match.

I was a little confused by what you meant originally, but since your referencing the 1-50 system, here is something to know. 1-50 will not be returning, though I do agree a solid ranking structure will be needed to separate certain skill levels apart.

I definitely think some ranking structure is needed (for all we know, 343 might have one underway), to avoid having first-time players match up with veterans of the game, but I don’t think 1-50 is the answer. I’ve seen far more complaints over de-rankers and how frustrating it is to not rank up after winning several games, only to be ranked down after losing one.

> I definitely think some ranking structure is needed (for all we know, 343 might have one underway), to avoid having first-time players match up with veterans of the game, but I don’t think 1-50 is the answer. I’ve seen far more complaints over de-rankers and how frustrating it is to not rank up after winning several games, only to be ranked down after losing one.

+1 or after you play 7000 games and it takes ages to try to restart obtaining 50 o aka I legitibly got 45 with long long nights of lone wovles. if only I could have gotten to 50 I would be a 4 star general

> > I definitely think some ranking structure is needed (for all we know, 343 might have one underway), to avoid having first-time players match up with veterans of the game, but I don’t think 1-50 is the answer. I’ve seen far more complaints over de-rankers and how frustrating it is to not rank up after winning several games, only to be ranked down after losing one.
>
> +1 or after you play 7000 games and it takes ages to try to restart obtaining 50 o aka I legitibly got 45 with long long nights of lone wovles. if only I could have gotten to 50 I would be a 4 star general

Theres the problem. 1-50 is not a progression system. Its a system to lock your rank in where it thinks you should be and match you up with others close to that rank. You didnt get to 50 because you were not 50, you were 45.

So it caused problems with people complaining about being “rank-locked”, because thats exactly what was happening.