343i should focus on creating proper infrastructure for extraneous gametypes to pop up organically.
The Halo community has always been known for creativity when it comes to custom games and forge worlds. Trust your player base, 343i. If the player-base wants a game mode like BR then I have 0 doubt that you will see players creating BR game modes and maps organically and from which you can later add to multiplayer like Flood and Griffball.
I feel if they do delve in BR, there needs to be at least 1 dev made map, just to give us something while everyone else is forging maps.
> 2533275032862638;2:
> I feel if they do delve in BR, there needs to be at least 1 dev made map, just to give us something while everyone else is forging maps.
Not if forge mode is good enough
> 2533275032862638;2:
> I feel if they do delve in BR, there needs to be at least 1 dev made map, just to give us something while everyone else is forging maps.
There’s no need for any Dev resources to go towards battle royale at all. Neither Bungie, or 343i bothered to
recreate classic custom modes like Duck Hunt, Splatter Monkey, Speed Halo, etc. Yet forgers have always recreated them, and built newer versions of them.
You might need to wait a little bit for people to create them, and if that’s not fast enough you’d have the tools to create it yourself through Forge. Alternatively there’s dozens of other battle royale copy cats out there like that CoD Fort Night clone among many others.
Not to shoot you down too hard, but the battle royale/ hunger games knock offs have been done to death. The dead horse has been beaten enough.
They have literally said that BR wont be coming to Infinite like 2 or 3 times by now, why are people still scared about it?? Even in they make one, what damage will it do to the game?? Is just another gamemode
> 2535424229992654;5:
> They have literally said that BR wont be coming to Infinite like 2 or 3 times by now, why are people still scared about it?? Even in they make one, what damage will it do to the game?? Is just another gamemode
It will most likely take away development time and having to cater updates just to that gametype alone which takes away from infinite in general, if the general population of infinite wants a battle royale they can make their own with the forge tools which is what makes Halo unique in that manner is that it allows the player base to make their own unique gametypes that might become popular and be added onto by other forgers
> 2535424229992654;5:
> They have literally said that BR wont be coming to Infinite like 2 or 3 times by now, why are people still scared about it?? Even in they make one, what damage will it do to the game?? Is just another gamemode
You’re severely undercutting the amount of work that gets put into creating a battle royale. It is by no means “just another gamemode” just as Warzone in Halo 5 is not “just another gamemode”
And no, I don’t think Halo Infinite needs a BR. We’ve seen the large bombastic gamemode from 343, it was warzone, it ate up an incredible amount of assets and development time, and every game plays the same on the few selection of maps we have.
> 2533274975565198;4:
> > 2533275032862638;2:
> > I feel if they do delve in BR, there needs to be at least 1 dev made map, just to give us something while everyone else is forging maps.
>
> There’s no need for any Dev resources to go towards battle royale at all. Neither Bungie, or 343i bothered to
> recreate classic custom modes like Duck Hunt, Splatter Monkey, Speed Halo, etc. Yet forgers have always recreated them, and built newer versions of them.
>
> You might need to wait a little bit for people to create them, and if that’s not fast enough you’d have the tools to create it yourself through Forge. Alternatively there’s dozens of other battle royale copy cats out there like that CoD Fort Night clone among many others.
>
> Not to shoot you down too hard, but the battle royale/ hunger games knock offs have been done to death. The dead horse has been beaten enough.
A battle royale is honestly way more complex than any of your custom game examples. A community forged BR will neither satisfy the players who want it nor would it attract new players from dedicated AAA counterparts.
It clearly isn’t a “dead horse.” CoD (Warzone), Apex, and Fortnite are consistently in the top 10 on Twitch and are the only FPS games that make it up there (aside from Valorant and CSGO when they have pro matches). None of these are arena shooters.
It depends on what tools the (very talented) forgers have at their disposal.
A next-gen forge (built into the engine this time) plus better scripting… and I wouldn’t be surprised what they could do.
Eh I wouldn’t hate it if sometime down the road they put in a BR but I think a brand new large scale game mode would be better. BRs aren’t going away anytime soon but people are definitely starting to get a little bored of them. They’ve dominated the multiplayer gaming space for a couple years now and I think as a whole the gaming community is ready for the next big thing to make a splash. No idea if Infinite will have a mode to scratch that itch, but if it does we could potentially see a massive population boost to the game if it lands well.
> 2535431933064458;8:
> > 2533274975565198;4:
> > > 2533275032862638;2:
> > > I feel if they do delve in BR, there needs to be at least 1 dev made map, just to give us something while everyone else is forging maps.
> >
> > There’s no need for any Dev resources to go towards battle royale at all. Neither Bungie, or 343i bothered to
> > recreate classic custom modes like Duck Hunt, Splatter Monkey, Speed Halo, etc. Yet forgers have always recreated them, and built newer versions of them.
> >
> > You might need to wait a little bit for people to create them, and if that’s not fast enough you’d have the tools to create it yourself through Forge. Alternatively there’s dozens of other battle royale copy cats out there like that CoD Fort Night clone among many others.
> >
> > Not to shoot you down too hard, but the battle royale/ hunger games knock offs have been done to death. The dead horse has been beaten enough.
>
> A battle royale is honestly way more complex than any of your custom game examples. A community forged BR will neither satisfy the players who want it nor would it attract new players from dedicated AAA counterparts.
>
> It clearly isn’t a “dead horse.” CoD (Warzone), Apex, and Fortnite are consistently in the top 10 on Twitch and are the only FPS games that make it up there (aside from Valorant and CSGO when they have pro matches). None of these are arena shooters.
A battle royale is straight up just hunger games with a trendy name. The only thing these new copy cats are doing is providing an animation heavy match start where you drop in randomly on the map instead of starting out in a circular formation of pods to rush to weapon stockpile.
The counter argument regarding the dead horse only proves it’s a dead horse, that’s three different games you mentioned that are all the same game exploring the same concept but with a different name. And I know there’s still more hunger games knock offs that weren’t listed like Fort Night, Player Unknown’s, and that one that looks like DayZ that came out like a year ago among many more.
I’ve seen the games that are for all intensive purposes locked at the top of Twitch. Simply put Twitch likes watching paint dry. I do not understand those people, but to each their own. They aren’t a good example unless you’re pitching mobile games or something of that realm.
I can’t fathom why the pile of hunger games knock offs that have already been fully developed and still actively updated aren’t enough. Why does Halo a game that has already defined itself as not a hunger games knock off need to suddenly jump ship and become a hunger games knock off? Why should a ridiculous amount of resources be committed to something that has been done to death?
Step back and take a look at how resource heavy a BR actually is. Heavy animation intros sapping available memory, a second forge mode that can only be used for one mode, another open world map tailored specifically for hunger games.
Wouldn’t you rather see more maps, game modes, weapons, vehicles, and enemies instead of one fat mode? Those resources could go towards so many other things and allow for a ton of smaller things to make cut for Infinite.
Have you seen the size of some of the wishlist threads? The resources that would go into a battle royale could at least fullfil some of that instead of just dumping a large chunk into one project that again can be found elsewhere.
I agree. the community will figure out how to make a Battle Royale as long as the forge is great. leave that mode for custom games.
> 2533274975565198;11:
> > 2535431933064458;8:
> > > 2533274975565198;4:
> > > > 2533275032862638;2:
> > > > I feel if they do delve in BR, there needs to be at least 1 dev made map, just to give us something while everyone else is forging maps.
> > >
> > > There’s no need for any Dev resources to go towards battle royale at all. Neither Bungie, or 343i bothered to
> > > recreate classic custom modes like Duck Hunt, Splatter Monkey, Speed Halo, etc. Yet forgers have always recreated them, and built newer versions of them.
> > >
> > > You might need to wait a little bit for people to create them, and if that’s not fast enough you’d have the tools to create it yourself through Forge. Alternatively there’s dozens of other battle royale copy cats out there like that CoD Fort Night clone among many others.
> > >
> > > Not to shoot you down too hard, but the battle royale/ hunger games knock offs have been done to death. The dead horse has been beaten enough.
> >
> > A battle royale is honestly way more complex than any of your custom game examples. A community forged BR will neither satisfy the players who want it nor would it attract new players from dedicated AAA counterparts.
> >
> > It clearly isn’t a “dead horse.” CoD (Warzone), Apex, and Fortnite are consistently in the top 10 on Twitch and are the only FPS games that make it up there (aside from Valorant and CSGO when they have pro matches). None of these are arena shooters.
>
> A battle royale is straight up just hunger games with a trendy name. The only thing these new copy cats are doing is providing an animation heavy match start where you drop in randomly on the map instead of starting out in a circular formation of pods to rush to weapon stockpile.
>
> The counter argument regarding the dead horse only proves it’s a dead horse, that’s three different games you mentioned that are all the same game exploring the same concept but with a different name. And I know there’s still more hunger games knock offs that weren’t listed like Fort Night, Player Unknown’s, and that one that looks like DayZ that came out like a year ago among many more.
>
> I’ve seen the games that are for all intensive purposes locked at the top of Twitch. Simply put Twitch likes watching paint dry. I do not understand those people, but to each their own. They aren’t a good example unless you’re pitching mobile games or something of that realm.
>
> I can’t fathom why the pile of hunger games knock offs that have already been fully developed and still actively updated aren’t enough. Why does Halo a game that has already defined itself as not a hunger games knock off need to suddenly jump ship and become a hunger games knock off? Why should a ridiculous amount of resources be committed to something that has been done to death?
>
> Step back and take a look at how resource heavy a BR actually is. Heavy animation intros sapping available memory, a second forge mode that can only be used for one mode, another open world map tailored specifically for hunger games.
>
> Wouldn’t you rather see more maps, game modes, weapons, vehicles, and enemies instead of one fat mode? Those resources could go towards so many other things and allow for a ton of smaller things to make cut for Infinite.
>
> Have you seen the size of some of the wishlist threads? The resources that would go into a battle royale could at least fullfil some of that instead of just dumping a large chunk into one project that again can be found elsewhere.
I only mentioned Twitch data as a loose gauge of interest. It doesn’t matter that you or I think those games are boring, the reality is that hundreds of thousands of people are actively interested in BRs (and even more playing) at any given time. Arena shooters are nowhere to be found. People get excited if a Halo stream can get 1000 viewers at one time.
Sure, I would rather have a deeper core MP experience over a BR but first I think Halo needs to draw in as many players as possible upon launch. Investing in growing the playerbase has the potential to pay dividends while investing in “maps, game modes, weapons, vehicles, and enemies” is good for existing players but has little impact on creating a “buzz” in the gaming community.
I think Infinite will garner massive interest at the beginning regardless of a BR, but I do think its presence (or lack thereof) will affect the player retention. Whatever kind of mode 343 banks on, if it brings in lots of players and keeps them coming back it will carry over into benefits for the classic arena community.
As an arena shooter player, I’m just saying that doubling down on arena when there is little interest is somewhat shortsighted.
> 2535431933064458;13:
> > 2533274975565198;11:
> > > 2535431933064458;8:
> > > > 2533274975565198;4:
> > > > > 2533275032862638;2:
> > > > > I feel if they do delve in BR, there needs to be at least 1 dev made map, just to give us something while everyone else is forging maps.
> > > >
> > > > There’s no need for any Dev resources to go towards battle royale at all. Neither Bungie, or 343i bothered to
> > > > recreate classic custom modes like Duck Hunt, Splatter Monkey, Speed Halo, etc. Yet forgers have always recreated them, and built newer versions of them.
> > > >
> > > > You might need to wait a little bit for people to create them, and if that’s not fast enough you’d have the tools to create it yourself through Forge. Alternatively there’s dozens of other battle royale copy cats out there like that CoD Fort Night clone among many others.
> > > >
> > > > Not to shoot you down too hard, but the battle royale/ hunger games knock offs have been done to death. The dead horse has been beaten enough.
> > >
> > > -snip-
>
> I only mentioned Twitch data as a loose gauge of interest. It doesn’t matter that you or I think those games are boring, the reality is that hundreds of thousands of people are actively interested in BRs (and even more playing) at any given time. Arena shooters are nowhere to be found. People get excited if a Halo stream can get 1000 viewers at one time.
>
> Sure, I would rather have a deeper core MP experience over a BR but first I think Halo needs to draw in as many players as possible upon launch. Investing in growing the playerbase has the potential to pay dividends while investing in “maps, game modes, weapons, vehicles, and enemies” is good for existing players but has little impact on creating a “buzz” in the gaming community.
>
> I think Infinite will garner massive interest at the beginning regardless of a BR, but I do think its presence (or lack thereof) will affect the player retention. Whatever kind of mode 343 banks on, if it brings in lots of players and keeps them coming back it will carry over into benefits for the classic arena community.
>
> As an arena shooter player, I’m just saying that doubling down on arena when there is little interest is somewhat shortsighted.
You might have had a point if the trend was just kicking off, but now we’re a few years into the trend and the genre is overly saturated. What about a Halo skinned hunger games is going to make this supposedly large audience push every other hunger games knock off to the side and play this one over all the others? What can be done differently? I don’t see the point in jumping onto a dying trend just to attempt to maybe increase the games audience reach.
When a game has already defined itself and it decides to opt to reach for mass appeal while ignoring it’s original fan base you get Dead Space 3. Not only did Dead Space 3 neglect it’s original fan base it didn’t meet sales quotas and the franchise was terminated. Sounds like a great success.
I’d assume the reason Halo isn’t at the top of Twitch is because the most recent installment of the franchise listened exclusively to streamers/ sweats on how to design the multiplayer. Now 6 years later there’s almost exclusively sweats left in matchmaking and a streamer can’t dunk on average players and children constantly to make themselves look better at the game than they really are. We’ve seen the maturity level of some of these streamers like Ninja something or other screeching at children over them beating him and using his influence to get them banned from the game with an accusation of “cheating”.
You’re acting like this isn’t a triple A franchise. You don’t see DOOM all over Twitch yet it made a ridiculous amount of money only through initial sales. Just because the audience of one website would rather watch paint dry, or a man beat up on casuals and children to fuel his ego doesn’t mean everything else must abide by their standards.
> 2533274975565198;14:
> > 2535431933064458;13:
> > > 2533274975565198;11:
> > > > 2535431933064458;8:
> > > > > 2533274975565198;4:
> > > > > > 2533275032862638;2:
> > > > > > I feel if they do delve in BR, there needs to be at least 1 dev made map, just to give us something while everyone else is forging maps.
> > > > >
> > > > > There’s no need for any Dev resources to go towards battle royale at all. Neither Bungie, or 343i bothered to
> > > > > recreate classic custom modes like Duck Hunt, Splatter Monkey, Speed Halo, etc. Yet forgers have always recreated them, and built newer versions of them.
> > > > >
> > > > > You might need to wait a little bit for people to create them, and if that’s not fast enough you’d have the tools to create it yourself through Forge. Alternatively there’s dozens of other battle royale copy cats out there like that CoD Fort Night clone among many others.
> > > > >
> > > > > Not to shoot you down too hard, but the battle royale/ hunger games knock offs have been done to death. The dead horse has been beaten enough.
> > > >
> > > > -snip-
> >
> > I only mentioned Twitch data as a loose gauge of interest. It doesn’t matter that you or I think those games are boring, the reality is that hundreds of thousands of people are actively interested in BRs (and even more playing) at any given time. Arena shooters are nowhere to be found. People get excited if a Halo stream can get 1000 viewers at one time.
> >
> > Sure, I would rather have a deeper core MP experience over a BR but first I think Halo needs to draw in as many players as possible upon launch. Investing in growing the playerbase has the potential to pay dividends while investing in “maps, game modes, weapons, vehicles, and enemies” is good for existing players but has little impact on creating a “buzz” in the gaming community.
> >
> > I think Infinite will garner massive interest at the beginning regardless of a BR, but I do think its presence (or lack thereof) will affect the player retention. Whatever kind of mode 343 banks on, if it brings in lots of players and keeps them coming back it will carry over into benefits for the classic arena community.
> >
> > As an arena shooter player, I’m just saying that doubling down on arena when there is little interest is somewhat shortsighted.
>
> You might have had a point if the trend was just kicking off, but now we’re a few years into the trend and the genre is overly saturated. What about a Halo skinned hunger games is going to make this supposedly large audience push every other hunger games knock off to the side and play this one over all the others? What can be done differently? I don’t see the point in jumping onto a dying trend just to attempt to maybe increase the games audience reach.
>
> When a game has already defined itself and it decides to opt to reach for mass appeal while ignoring it’s original fan base you get Dead Space 3. Not only did Dead Space 3 neglect it’s original fan base it didn’t meet sales quotas and the franchise was terminated. Sounds like a great success.
>
> I’d assume the reason Halo isn’t at the top of Twitch is because the most recent installment of the franchise listened exclusively to streamers/ sweats on how to design the multiplayer. Now 6 years later there’s almost exclusively sweats left in matchmaking and a streamer can’t dunk on average players and children constantly to make themselves look better at the game than they really are. We’ve seen the maturity level of some of these streamers like Ninja something or other screeching at children over them beating him and using his influence to get them banned from the game with an accusation of “cheating”.
>
> You’re acting like this isn’t a triple A franchise. You don’t see DOOM all over Twitch yet it made a ridiculous amount of money only through initial sales. Just because the audience of one website would rather watch paint dry, or a man beat up on casuals and children to fuel his ego doesn’t mean everything else must abide by their standards.
Well Warzone is plagued by cheating, Fortnite and PUBG are fairly old, and the Apex formula is close to Halo minus the abilities. I’ll admit that the BR demographic is cheap, but getting them in the door is half the battle and the MP would undoubtedly reap the rewards. I still don’t know why you think it is dying when other games fail to draw the same interest.
Trying to gain mass appeal has its risks but at the same time the company doesn’t want to go down with a sinking ship because it failed to acknowledge market trends.
I think the reason is more that Halo is more fun to play than to watch, which mostly stems from the fact that each game feels inconsequential. Viewers like the “journey” or “narrative” of BRs, games like EFT, even CSGO and Valorant have lengthy matches full of tension and organized executions. Halo can feel like 10 minutes of players running around aimlessly to the casual viewer. Of course, we know that isn’t the case since we play the game, but perhaps Halo can find something to tweak in the formula that appeals to the casual viewer. There is even a thread on Waypoint asking how the Esports viewing experience can be improved for casual viewers which tells me that 343 has recognized this is an issue.
> 2535431933064458;15:
> > 2533274975565198;14:
> > > 2535431933064458;13:
> > > > 2533274975565198;11:
> > > > > 2535431933064458;8:
> > > > > > 2533274975565198;4:
> > > > > > > 2533275032862638;2:
> > > > > > > I feel if they do delve in BR, there needs to be at least 1 dev made map, just to give us something while everyone else is forging maps.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > There’s no need for any Dev resources to go towards battle royale at all. Neither Bungie, or 343i bothered to
> > > > > > recreate classic custom modes like Duck Hunt, Splatter Monkey, Speed Halo, etc. Yet forgers have always recreated them, and built newer versions of them.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You might need to wait a little bit for people to create them, and if that’s not fast enough you’d have the tools to create it yourself through Forge. Alternatively there’s dozens of other battle royale copy cats out there like that CoD Fort Night clone among many others.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Not to shoot you down too hard, but the battle royale/ hunger games knock offs have been done to death. The dead horse has been beaten enough.
> > > > >
> > > > > -snip-
> > >
> > > I only mentioned Twitch data as a loose gauge of interest. It doesn’t matter that you or I think those games are boring, the reality is that hundreds of thousands of people are actively interested in BRs (and even more playing) at any given time. Arena shooters are nowhere to be found. People get excited if a Halo stream can get 1000 viewers at one time.
> > >
> > > Sure, I would rather have a deeper core MP experience over a BR but first I think Halo needs to draw in as many players as possible upon launch. Investing in growing the playerbase has the potential to pay dividends while investing in “maps, game modes, weapons, vehicles, and enemies” is good for existing players but has little impact on creating a “buzz” in the gaming community.
> > >
> > > I think Infinite will garner massive interest at the beginning regardless of a BR, but I do think its presence (or lack thereof) will affect the player retention. Whatever kind of mode 343 banks on, if it brings in lots of players and keeps them coming back it will carry over into benefits for the classic arena community.
> > >
> > > As an arena shooter player, I’m just saying that doubling down on arena when there is little interest is somewhat shortsighted.
> >
> > You might have had a point if the trend was just kicking off, but now we’re a few years into the trend and the genre is overly saturated. What about a Halo skinned hunger games is going to make this supposedly large audience push every other hunger games knock off to the side and play this one over all the others? What can be done differently? I don’t see the point in jumping onto a dying trend just to attempt to maybe increase the games audience reach.
> >
> > When a game has already defined itself and it decides to opt to reach for mass appeal while ignoring it’s original fan base you get Dead Space 3. Not only did Dead Space 3 neglect it’s original fan base it didn’t meet sales quotas and the franchise was terminated. Sounds like a great success.
> >
> > I’d assume the reason Halo isn’t at the top of Twitch is because the most recent installment of the franchise listened exclusively to streamers/ sweats on how to design the multiplayer. Now 6 years later there’s almost exclusively sweats left in matchmaking and a streamer can’t dunk on average players and children constantly to make themselves look better at the game than they really are. We’ve seen the maturity level of some of these streamers like Ninja something or other screeching at children over them beating him and using his influence to get them banned from the game with an accusation of “cheating”.
> >
> > You’re acting like this isn’t a triple A franchise. You don’t see DOOM all over Twitch yet it made a ridiculous amount of money only through initial sales. Just because the audience of one website would rather watch paint dry, or a man beat up on casuals and children to fuel his ego doesn’t mean everything else must abide by their standards.
>
> Well Warzone is plagued by cheating, Fortnite and PUBG are fairly old, and the Apex formula is close to Halo minus the abilities. I’ll admit that the BR demographic is cheap, but getting them in the door is half the battle and the MP would undoubtedly reap the rewards. I still don’t know why you think it is dying when other games fail to draw the same interest.
>
> Trying to gain mass appeal has its risks but at the same time the company doesn’t want to go down with a sinking ship because it failed to acknowledge market trends.
>
> I think the reason is more that Halo is more fun to play than to watch, which mostly stems from the fact that each game feels inconsequential. Viewers like the “journey” or “narrative” of BRs, games like EFT, even CSGO and Valorant have lengthy matches full of tension and organized executions. Halo can feel like 10 minutes of players running around aimlessly to the casual viewer. Of course, we know that isn’t the case since we play the game, but perhaps Halo can find something to tweak in the formula that appeals to the casual viewer. There is even a thread on Waypoint asking how the Esports viewing experience can be improved for casual viewers which tells me that 343 has recognized this is an issue.
I’m amazed that 343i has noticed the issue with Halo 5’s multiplayer warding away everyone that isn’t a sweat. Maybe they’ll roll it back so it’s similar to previous installments rather than the hot mess we have now.
If a hunger games knock off is to be tried it should be it’s own standalone game and not something just ham fisted into the main line games. Take Halo Wars, the RTS demographic could never have been squeezed into previous games so they made a spin off.
I just don’t see this working out in a positive way. What could a Halo hunger games really do differently? Why would it make this supposed large audience decide to drop the mountain of other hunger games knock offs and play the Halo skinned one? I don’t see people letting go of their 60 - 70$ skins that easily. Not following a changing market is always something to consider, and again you’re acting like this isn’t a triple A franchise. DOOM Eternal made a ton of money without dipping into microtransactions, or chasing fades.
It’s all just random people running around to a viewer unless it’s an actual story driven game. Twitch will willingly watch paint dry. Slap an E-sports tag on anything trending for the moment and they’ll watch it.