Lag Compensation Fix - Please Read

Games Other Halo
1

Hello Community,

I created a similar topic, in the general thread but feel that this thread for matchmaking is the better thread for a topic like this, seeing as this heavily involves the matchmaking system, etc.

I want to first start out by saying that the lag compensation in the game right now is kind of game breaking. At times you feel like a boss out DMR-ing people, etc. and at other times you get the “WTF” just happened moment when the person out DMRs you and in the kill cam he is looking at the wall.

I have an immense amount of experience in First Person Shooter games ranging from the (arguably most competititve) CounterStrike to the fun but still awesome BF3. I have been a fan of Halo for years and played at high levels in H2 (level 46 slayer legit) , H3 (multiple level 50s) and Reach (Onyx ranks). (The only reason I stated this was to give a foundation so that I do not get laughed out of the forum for being “bad” or “you just cannot aim”, etc.

Right now, we have something called lag compensation in the Halo 4 matchmaking system. This is a good mechanic. It needs to be in any modern game, it has been in games for years now and even other competititve shooters, such as, Counterstrike have come to develop the lag compensation system. Games that have succeeded in the implementation of this system allow for the user to “Damper” the lag compensation to meet the connection strength of the user. Games that have utterly failed in the lag compensation system are games, such as, MW3 that did not do this.

A simple change is needed, and it would cost 343 next to nothing to implement. A damper system should be put in place for lag compensation. Why? It would give people who have good connections the ability to turn down the compensation and people with not so good internet connections the ability to turn it up.

A system such as this would work:

In the options menu, 343 could add something that deals with connection (duh). The menu would have three options:

  1. Low (for higher connections)
  2. Medium (For mid-grade connections)
  3. High (for connection speeds that are considerably slower)

Now I do not have numbers in front of me on connection speeds that would fit each category but for the purposes of this suggestion we could assume connections with a:

  1. Low (connections with a rating of A to B )
  2. Medium (connections with a rating of C)
    3 High (connections with a rating of D to F)

These ratings could be obtained from speedtest.net and would allow 343 to implement a system that could suggest a damper for the user to select based on the following ratings or speeds. This would create a highly competitive and FAIR environment. The current lag compensation is not good, plain and simple. It catters to connections with lower connection speeds while punishing higher connection speeds. I am not the one to brag, but I have a B+ grade connection and I am lagging horribly during BR / DMR fights and this needs to stop. I have had instances where I get shot once, then the guy appears on my screen (well, lets do the math 1 second makes a difference in competitive play. You get one or two shotted before you can react you lose). I have read several posts that pertained to the kill cam showing people getting shot when they are not even being aimed at (this pertains to lag compensation).

Community, let us vote on the ADDITION of a damper/buff system for lag compensation which would establish a fair and consistent environment for online competititve play. 343 has done many things right, and I feel that this is the big one they need to NAIL.

Please keep the negative comments to the minimum and vote. We also do not need people crying out imbalances, flaming, or acting like a troll. Read this and understand this before you post to avoid negativity. We are all in this in the long run and 343 has had an extensive track record for listening to the community (i.e. Halo Anni. and Reach).

If you think there could be a better way to add something like this to the game, please share your insight.

Thank you community and happy gaming!
-UnSeEnz

EDIT: I forgot to add something, completely removing the lag compensation system is a NO. It needs to be in multiplayer gaming now to create more fair environments and having none is just… no. Plus it would be like reworking the ENTIRE network code and that is A)costly and B) like creating a whole new game. SO before you suggest “Remove l4g c0mpens4tion GRR” remember this. Plus, adding a dedicative server list is expensive, this is a less expensive awesome addition.

EDIT EDIT: I just realized how innovative Halo online play actually is comparably to most games, would it not be absolutely electrifying if they were to develop a system for lag compensation settings for consoles? I shiver at how awesome this could be. The best way to get 343 to listen is to vote and keep this thread alive.

EDIT EDIT EDIT:

Halo 3 did have lag compensation but it was never this bad. Let’s put it this way. Most modern games have lag compensation and it will never change, it cannot. It is not fair to people who may not be financially capable of purchasing better internet and it helps when people from other countries play with each other.

Now, what you are experiencing could quite possibly be lag. I do not know your skill level, nor do I want to “guess” what skill level you are but for the purposes of this discussion and suggestion I will give some light to it, using myself as an example.

For an example, I right now, have roughly a 2.0 KD (I think it is like 1.98) and I am a SR 42. I run into issues sporadically with the gameplay, namely when I play objective game types where a lot of things are going on. I notice, that sometimes when I am in games I am completely dominating people at a similar SR rank (I know SR rank does not = skill but w.e.) I then play games where it seems a little jittery and I am being out DMR’d by lower SR rank people. This is fine because some people have bad games, w.e. However, a trend arose from these types of games where I do statistically bad. The kill cam in these games are horrid. I watch myself get shot through walls, the guy/gal might be looking down on the ground and I just magically die, or it shows the person aiming up in the air and I just fall down on the ground.

This ladies and gentlemen, is lag compensation kicking in. Most games, I have no problem with the kill cam (the games I do well in) and the games I do horrid in show a 1 to 2 second delay of DMR shooting or firing (this could be br, ar, etc.)

I cannot express it enough that I am not whining or am displeased with the game. I love H4 but this is definitely game breaking. 1 to 2 seconds of lag compensation on someone with a good connection, means that someone with a bad connection is 1 or 2 seconds ahead of me, regardless of how I play I will die against any competent player.

Hope that brought some light to your concerns,
UnSeEnZ

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I recreated this, via a member telling me “Petitions” are not allowed in the title. Read carefully. thank you community.

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Lag compensation NEVER helps online competitive play…

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> Lag compensation NEVER helps online competitive play…

Okay. It helps to balance, online competitive play. I only propose a system to change what we have without reworking the entire game. The rest of the post (I hope you read thoroughly) will give you a better sense of where I am coming from. Please understand that lag compensation is in every modern game and it is not going anywhere…

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Lag compensation is the system that attempts to balance a player with a good connection with a player who has a terrible connection.

The end result is a player being able to “eat” many times the numbers of shots they should which just breaks the game. So no, lag compensation is not good for competitive play.

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What do you mean by lag compensation? Is it client-side hit detection?

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> What do you mean by lag compensation? Is it client-side hit detection?

Yes, lag compensation is something that was introduced (well more profoundly talked about) in CounterStrike Source. Read up on some articles about it and you will see what type of scrutiny Valve got into because of it. HOWEVER, Valve made it clear that users could CHANGE their compensation filter using their command prompt in game.

ALL i am asking for is the ability to do this. It would A) reduce stupid “lag”, B)it would provide fair gameplay at times when it is not and C) it would cost them nothing to do something like this, rather than changing the entire net code.

Client-side hit detection = You are being effected by lag compensation.

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I think they need to have a matchmaking system based on ping. priority to connections that match yours. I think a damper system that you choose for your own connection could be abused.

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CSHD is the only way to go:

  1. SSHD is good only for host. Even with good connection and little lag you’ll have to lead your shots because of the bullet lag. Remember almost unplayable pre-TU6 Gears of War 2?
  2. What’s the point of turning it down if other players will still have it? They’ll still be able to kill you “behind” the corner.
  3. Your connection doesn’t really matter. If you connect to a distant host, you’ll still lag no matter how good your connection is. Halo 4 has a poor region filtering.

Also, I don’t quite understand what “lowering” lag compensation means.

> I think they need to have a <mark>matchmaking system based on ping</mark>. priority to connections that match yours. I think a damper system that you choose for your own connection could be abused.

Agree. CSHD + ping limit.

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> I think they need to have a matchmaking system based on ping. priority to connections that match yours. I think a damper system that you choose for your own connection could be abused.

Lol, no it would not / could not be abused. Tell me why games that allow people to successfully choose their lag compensation are successful? Counter Strike is a prime example and no one one there complains about it being abused but more or less complains about it being there.

I on the other hand agree to keep it, because it is needed. Do you understand what lag compensation is? It only would hurt you if you did not damper it based on your connection speed. This is a must add for any competitive game that uses it. If not, expect Halo 4 to lose a lot of people soon (just take a look at what happened to MW3 with the horrible lag compensation never being addressed, it dropped to astronomically low population for a call of duty game.) You want proof? Look it up for yourself.

EDIT: I am only trying to think of ways that 343 could do this with little to no effort, completely reworking the ping system will take absolutely forever and may cost them more money. Just trying to help out…

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> EDIT: I am only trying to think of ways that 343 could do this with little to no effort, completely reworking the ping system will take absolutely forever and may cost them more money. Just trying to help out…

Just better match-making IMO. It’s not OK when it puts two people with 1s mutual ping in one match.

P.S. What we really need is lag compensation for SO and coop campaign.

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> > EDIT: I am only trying to think of ways that 343 could do this with little to no effort, completely reworking the ping system will take absolutely forever and may cost them more money. Just trying to help out…
>
> Just better match-making IMO. It’s not OK when it puts two people with 1s mutual ping in one match.
>
> P.S. What we really need is lag compensation for SO and coop campaign.

I agree, I would rather a system just be balanced for what we have currently. This is not rocket science ladies and gentlemen. Lag compensation is a real thing and it is being used by Halo 4, let us keep this going for 343 to notice and hopefully make some kind of a difference with the online competitive play.

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Lag compensation was discussed before the release of Halo 4. Players were begging 343i to not make the same mistake that occurred with MW3.

What makes you think that they would implement a change to the networking, that they refused to implement while creating the game?

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It would be better if this could be done passively on 343’s side. Your connection speeds may change depending on your provider over the course of an hour. When determining a host for each multiplayer match, the connection speeds should be determined, and the proper compensation would be allocated for the match.

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> It would be better if this could be done passively on 343’s side. Your connection speeds may change depending on your provider over the course of an hour. When determining a host for each multiplayer match, the connection speeds should be determined, and the proper compensation would be allocated for the match.

THANK YOU! This is a very good suggestion, something like this would also NOT be game breaking. Right now, I am so tired of the laggy games that I just cannot play Halo 4 for more than 4 games, it is frustrating and the lag is not balanced when playing with bad hosts, etc. Halo 3 did an EXCELLENT job of relocalizing the host if the connection was terrible, unfortunately Halo 4 does not do this.

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BUMP :slight_smile:

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What a great post . You hit the nail on the head . The lag issue is ruining this great game . I live in Germany and when I join American games its got lag just in the way you describe . Every game i join is like this , I don’t know much about servers or how they work and don’t care how they work but it would be nice that they could sort it out so I can enjoy a fair online experience . I might just take the game back and trade it in for call of duty . I don’t have lag issues with that just mouthy children and campers but no lag ! I hope they can sort this issue sooner than later coz I won’t be coming back again .

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client side hit detection is what’s making BF3 almost unbearable to play now.

It was okay at first, but they kept patching the game effectively making it worse.

I feel like it would be even worse on Halo. I know it was TERRIBLE on Mw3.

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CSHD for BF3 was terrible. Foreign clients wreck havoc on local servers making taking cover next to pointless because you would die anyway because you’re still on their screen.

There needs to be better region filtering since they do not have a server browser. The midwest IS NOT close to New England, neither is Mexico or the west coast of Canada. I popped in Halo Reach for old times sake, and wow the difference that I didn’t appreciate before, shots hit and there weren’t as many wtf moments. Even on a lagging 3/4ths the game felt more responsive than Halo 4.

Or they could implement a server browser, not sure how practical that would be but it would be nice.

And one more thing… VISIBLE PING FOR THE LOVE OF GOD…I’m tired of each match being a lottery and destroying one match and getting destroyed the next. Ranks and KD’s mean nothing, its literally the luck of the draw. I don’t mind being outplayed but not by some moron who barely knows how to tie his shoes and only got away with it because he’s a time traveling bullet sponge.

I dont pretend to know anything about lag compensation. Maybe its more aggressive in general in new games, but I have no proof…mostly because of NO VISIBLE PING.

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Excellent post, I have been complaining about the lag compensation for days & all I got back from here was “Your connection just sucks” (A+ speed net btw) but hell yes I couldn’t agree more 343i needs to implant this immediately or this game will turn into MW3 but worse cause unlike CoD the community won’t stick around through the bs lag. Also the fact that the bad lag compensation in a game taking multiple shots/seconds to kill is much worse than the millisecond it takes to kill in a game like MW3.

PLEASE FIX NOW 343i I love Halo but can’t take much more of this -Yoink- netcode