there isn’t anything cool to unlock unless you open your wallet, that’s why. They’re selling name plates. Like bruh Fall Guys has a more meaningful F2P progression.
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Spicy drives conversation, I’m all for it. The spicier the better.
While certain sub genres certainly displace other sub genres within the gaming industry, it doesn’t necessarily mean these subgenres are “killed”, nor should players move on from something they may be enjoying.
The “Sim/Tac” shooter never died, nor was it ever really a ubiquitous subgenre like “Arena” or “Twitch” shooter. It’s a bit unfair to paint it as “killed” when it coexisted with Arena shooters at the time, and held on surprisingly well considering 2 of the 3 big names in the class (CS and R6) are pretty popular nowadays with their original core gameplay relatively intact.
Likewise, Halo (Bungie’s Version) was prominently played well into the “Twitch” shooter boom (MW3 released within Reach’s optimal lifespan). Halo really didn’t start to see massive decline until Halo 4’s steep population drop off a few months after launch, which coincides with the difference in conceptual vision of the game’s direction to mimic “Twitch” shooters like CoD (which was dominant at the time time).
We’re also forgetting “Survival” which is relatively prominent as well, yet coexisting successfully.
Well whatever it is, it’ll merely be displaced and live, not killed, as was the case arena, tactical, hero, etc shooters which are still around and successful.
Warzone runs like instant pudding mixed with a q-tip, but it’s still played prominently. Performance is a major draw in most cases, but it isn’t the primary reason players choose to slave away in that particular title when there’s a catalog of other titles that function similarly.
The skill floor is not low at all, as CS is mechanic heavy rather than streamlined. It’s anecdotal, but TheRussianBadger is a good example of a casual someone who is low-pro in several other titles, yet struggled to grasp some of the really basic mechanics of the title. Players choose to play the game because it’s highly competitive and showcases teamwork, skill and strategy over solo highlights, crazy bodycounts and action plays.
However, the various casual gamemodes do provide a safe and simple way to get the feel for the mechanics and learn some of the tropes of them. But simply suggesting you can drop someone in with no experience and they’ll pick it right up is ludicrous, even my own experience in basic deathmatch modes was kinda frustrating until someone introduced me to the mechanics a few months after playing around.
This highlights CS’s versatility more than it does the “skill floor”. And quite honestly, it’s also what made Halo such a unique and inviting experience as well.
- welcoming to new players; fun enough for regulars; challenging enough for sweats
- options for gameplay preferences
- mixes casual, intermediate, and competitive players within the same match well without becoming overbearing to group (in a causal match)
It’s something that Halo has actually lost with weapon balance/trait redistribution, SBMM, and lack of gameplay options.
Idiotic concept, because if ANY of it was true Elden Ring would have only sold a single copy, being regarded as one of the most excruciatingly hard games ever made.
Elden Ring is an abundant treasure trove of content that rewards its challenge at every angle. Halo Infinites challenge system seeks to pad the rice fields of a lush, barren wasteland tended by abused workers.
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You’re comparing Elden Ring, another in From Software’s lineup of “difficult-on-purpose action RPG fantasy” genre of games . . . to Halo, an “First-Person-Shooter Sci-Fi Arena-Shooter” game.
You aren’t comparing Apples to Oranges.
You’re comparing Apples to Lobster.
Both are edible, but of ENTIRELY separate taste, origin, and expectations.
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I wouldn’t call BR games full of content…it’s why I abandoned them since they feel lazy. I used to play past Halo’s daily because they usually had plenty of content but sadly Infinite does not. Some people claim a Battle Royale would save it but based on past experience that just feels like an excuse to make even less content and for me adding that mode would be the final nail for the game for me since it shows they have no faith in the IP.
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Its a comment on the quality of the product, mixed with content. Elden Ring has lots of content to enjoy and pretty much all of it is high quality. Halo Infinite has very little content, and very little of that content is of high quality, especially seeing as it breaks often.
Obviously they’re not in the same genre, but it points to the idea that gamers want good content thats fun to play. Elden Ring has a strong $60 price tag and it has a reputation for difficulty. Infinite is free and is an FPS that are generally easier to play. Elden Ring still destroyed Halo Infinite on the Steam Charts. It was like an ant going up against a mastiff.
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This is true.
Elden Ring had a much more unified direction with development however.
Halo Infinite meanwhile had four separate builds made before settling on Build No.4, and then development for the game was slowed further by the pandemic. All while having to rebuild the engine they were using to be “more” than Blam! 6.0.
This video helps provide some information on Infinite’s development.
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CH6D_MEY5TE
Certainly would be nicer to have a more complete package at launch, less broken-ness, and such.
But then again, they were doing more than just upgrading and tuning the Blam! Engine, they were rebuilding it enough from the foundation to become the Slipspace Engine.
And, well, last time the engine received that serious of an overhaul; Halo 2 was being the development focus and THAT game had hell for development.
Heck, the entire third act had to be cut and, with slight edits to the story to make it longer, was given to us in 2007 as Halo 3.
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And ill add that basically everyone i know that could downloaded infinite to try it hoping 343 finally made a good halo game
My own friends and family had our own btb team going.
The problems were pretty evident.
We couldnt keep the party together, somebody or multiple somebodies would drop out.
Making it even worse was that Btb was broken, and 343 didnt acknowledge or try to fix it for a month.
Ill quote my brother
“What do they mean the user interface doesnt support team slayer?!”
Thats 50 players in just my close group who just bailed because 343 again pooped the bed
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You can say you don’t think they have a lot of content, but the most popular battle royals have ACTUAL game changing events. They have meaningful progression with excellent content in their battle passes. Their maps are HUGE with hundreds of way to have a fight at each part of their huge maps.
In Halo Infinite, we have a crappy Battle Pass where 90% of the content is filler and transfered into the store (reach armor not in the battle pass and instead in the store.) Instead, Halo Infinite has barely any maps that all feel exactly the same to play on with all the exact same limited weapons on them.
Bottom line is that, somehow, games with one featured game mode seem to have much more content and replayability that Halo Infinite.
That’s an issue. That, and desync makes the multiplayer experience horrid.
On the latter point: far more crowded marketplace now, far more emphasis on streaming and game speed now, different generations of gamers, etc etc.
On the former point: F2P lowers the barrier to entry, but also lowers the barrier to exit. When you’ve bought a game you’re more invested
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I’d hardly call small season events at the end…‘healthy’ amount of content. I find BR games like that a complete waste of my time since most of the time the game it lacks actual content and it feels pointless playing due to them having plenty of predatory intrusive BP nonsense. They generally have ‘1’ map and not several big maps and that feels ‘lazy’.
In Halo Infinite we have a ‘crappy’ battle pass just like every other games with BP and that killed my interest in playing. “Bottom line” is no game with just 1 mode has plenty of content or replayability hence why I have zero cares about crap games like Fornite and is to blame for the decline of AAA games.
Heck it’s reasons like this that make me feel like if 343i did this then it would feel like the final nail for this game and it shows they have no faith in the future of this IP. It’s already bad enough that they lied about the progression system but to continue to push this stupid BP nonsense is hurting the game in the long term.
It’s a F2P and it’s already doing worse than a paid game like BF2042 and says a lot about the game when EA originally tried to blame Halo Infinite for BF2042’s decline.
Yet, games like Elden Ring, which go against the norm, do vastly better than their crowed marketplace contenders.
Sure, you can bring up the fact that there are trends in gaming, but being trendy doesn’t make the game good. Most games that come out after the trend has been set, die. Games get popular and set trends when they are simply good and better than the rest. The idea of a trend is a red herring that too many devs and companies fail to recognize.
If Halo played to it’s strengths and releases on par with Halo 3-reach, then we’d have another hit that millions would currently be playing. But no, we’re still dealing with a slow drip-feed of features that games 15 years ago used to release with. The game’s dead.
Millions of people didn’t care about spending $60 to play dozens of games 15 years ago, so why is it all of a sudden thought to be the killer of a large playerbase cough Elden Ring cough.
I suspect it’s a lie spun by gaming companies as an excuse to make a F2P model that’s ultimately designed to make more money than a full price game ever could. Even if the playerbase is 5% what it could be, it’s still profitable.
Yeah no. I have no idea what people think they are accomplishing when they make these kinds of arguments.
You are at once playing defense for 343’s bad management and deeply flawed output while effectively arguing in favor of retiring the franchise entirely.
Its been a common thread between people who try to excuse 343’s inability to attract and retain an audience as “well people just don’t like Halo/arena shooters anymore.”
Its not the barren, buggy releases or radical changes to gameplay or aesthetics or bad campaigns and design. No actually just don’t like Halo.
There is nothing actionable in these types of posts, it only serves to maintain the status quo and shut down criticism. the alternate title for OP’s post being “Better things aren’t possible”
If you want an actual hot take, I would argue that the only reason a game as mediocre and derivative as Halo Infinite got as much hype as it did, is that it looked more like a Halo game should. This game shares all the same flaws as previous 343 entries from the lack of content to bugs, to the flawed design, but because it looked more like a Halo game compared to 4 or 5, people have given it a pass for far longer than they otherwise would have even while huffing the “bb but the core gameplay is good” cope.
But now that the dust has settled and the honeymoon is over we are back to 343’s usual ghost town and once again its entirely of their own making. Things have gotten so dire even BF 2042 has managed to pull ahead sometimes and that game effectively took the remaining good will of the Battlefield community and lit it on fire while still being a $60 purchase to Infinite’s starting price of $0.
Are we really still going to argue that there was nothing 343 could have done differently to change these circumstances? Really?
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What norm?
Elden Ring is like pretty much every other From Software game.
You are little guy and you will fight uphill battles against hulking monstrosities and giants that can literally one-shot you on easy mode.
They are successful because people like that AND they kept it mostly consistent throughout with only slight tweaks between games.
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I agree with this. That is the very reason why I loathe the idea that I should care about the player base beyond it serving a functional matchmaking experience.
I don’t care if Halo is the hot new -Yoink!- or if it’s popular or modern. I care if Halo is fun according to my likes and dislikes.
Halo is not dead. It’s just not what every kid wants to play. That’s fine. I kind of prefer it that way.
The norm for modern RPG’s, even JRPGS.
Effectively, its the equivalent of what 343 should have done, that instead of following shooter trends, it should have just made a Halo game. 343’s job is to make a Bungie game effectively, just as FromSoft’s is to make a FromSoft game.
Well, i find it funny that as an apple person (Halo), and someone who’s tried Lobster (DS) and didn’t like it, I am of the opposite opinion now that apples are bad and lobsters are great.
Both HI and ER however are open world games focused on boss killing, that had a similar dev cycle. One made this formula shine, and the other is Halo Infinite.
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Because the norm is whatever Ubisoft is doing. Horizon Forbidden West, despite it allegedly being good, is similar to how Ubisoft formats their open world games. Same can be seen with Dying Light, Shadow of Wardor, and a litany of other open world RPG games. Despite liking some of those open world games, you can’t deny they’ve become more generic out of design so they can appeal to the largest group of consumers possible, while also being increasingly hand-holdy so that you don’t miss any of the content they have on display.
Elden Ring is different. It’s hard, it wants you to commit to your stats, it wants you to explore rather than being lead. It’s a true and blue open-world RPG. The only places you see similar levels of “different” are from developers like Larian Studios. Elden Ring, and by extension the Divinity games, are similar in style to themselves, but they go against the grain of what most other developers and publishers are doing - and that’s a good thing. I don’t think it’s unfair to say that the vast majority of open world games on the market are more like Ubisoft’s last “Assassin’s” Creed: The Quest for More Money than distinct from one another.
When applied to Halo, Halo tried really hard to be homogenous under 343. Despite having a winning formula with what Bungie iterated on from 1-3, 343 instead tried to reinvent the wheel into an oval. Halo 4 was like Call of Duty. Halo 5 was like Titanfall and Call of Duty without the loadouts. Infinite is like Apex Legends with equipment, and like Call of Duty with movement. These changes, like the addition of Sprint, Clamber and Slide, were not made for the health of the game or combat enhancement (remember, Halo had a winning formula). It was made so that Halo could be as homogenous as possible, and to be a game for everyone rather than the fans of the franchise, who would pull in other like-minded individuals. Halo under the mismanagement of 343 has slotted itself comfortably into the doughy folds of mediocrity because mediocrity sells and is safe.
From Soft games aren’t the norm, you damn donut. That’s the point. From Soft games have ALWAYS been niche. Elden Ring is especially unique when compared to other from soft games.
Also, I said it was against the norm of other open world games. That was my clear and obvious implication. It’s against the norm and yet it’s playerbase increased substantially. That’s my message.
halo in it of it self is amazing but they just crapped on the quality control and pushed full throttle for profits not caring about how crap the game would turn out.
halo has just entered the wasteland stage of its life
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are we making excuses for the 500 milly mega corporation budget game?
get people that can do the job or don’t do the job. This games a tragedy at this point.
“Halo: Infinite, what could have been”
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