Implementation of the Assault Rifle into post-TU playlists

Games Other Halo
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Alright, so I posted a long, well-thought-out opinion to a thread titled “Automatic weapons need buffing”. I found that my post in itself could be a good topic of discussion amongst the increasing presence of “I hate bloom”, “I hate armor lock” and “I hate active camo” among the forums. So I hope that my opinion on the topic of the assault rifle in matchmaking is a good break for the forum-users who would enjoy a good discussion on Halo’s most iconic weapon.

In its current implementation, the automatic weapons (Assault Rifle and Plasma Repeater) are now weak / useless compared to its buffed up precision counterparts. From my view, I see the that the purpose of the TU playlist is to look for feedback, and is not final. So hopefully the stuff I mention below will / will not come into fruition. Perhaps other bloom settings other than zero or 85% might appear in playlists.

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In vanilla Reach, the assault rifle was an okay weapon in my opinion. It was perfect in medium-close range where the user could safely spray the assault rifle, and have about 80-90% of bullets hit the target. It loses to shotgun sword gravity hammer in close range obviously, but was a definite win in AR VS DMR fights [in close range]. In medium range, the assault rifle loses out to the dmr and its equivalent, but is still capable of defeating the DMR/pistol user if the DMR user was spamming. I have plenty of medium range kills with the assault rifle in my bag, attributed to me carefully feathering my shots, against people who were spamming the DMR at medium range. What I usually did in an AR VS DMR engagement was to see if the opponent was spamming, stay at medium range and continue feathering. If he was not, move in to close range, switching to spraying when rational, and go for the melee the instant shields drop. If the opponent was pacing his shots wisely, killing me would be the expected outcome and I have nothing against losing to a DMR user in medium range.

In the current TU update though, there are now two circumstances:

ZERO BLOOM:

The assault rifle is useless, period. It loses out to the pistol in close-medium range encounters which were previously its most effective range as I stated above. Just the issue of pistol vs DMR is a extremely debated issue and I will not touch on it in this thread.

From my perspective, the purpose of zero bloom gametypes are for competitive players to enjoy playing the game on the basis of skill. Thus headshot weapons, barring power weapons, like the DMR, pistol and NR are the main focus of the game, and the AR will hopefully not be making a debut here. From my knowledge of what the TU allows in terms of modifications, weapon damage is not an option for tweaking (except for the anniversary pistol, which is an entirely different matter). So it is safe to say that the Assault rifle will not be making an appearance here.

85% BLOOM:

Disregarding the fact that I would prefer the incrementation of bloom rather than its deduction, the assault rifle implementation into 85% bloom gametypes is negatively affected as well, though to a lesser extent.

Firstly, with 85% bloom, precision weapons now have shorter killtimes (which applies, and is good, to ZB). What this means is that the feathering method I mentioned above is now less effective in medium range engagements. The precision weapon user will be able to dispatch me before I can do, him; whereas previously the winner of the engagement was based on skill of the particular weapon (feathering of AR vs spamming of DMR).

Secondly, with 85% bloom, spamming is now more effective. I refer to “spamming” as the implementation speed of it in vanilla reach. What this means is that while spamming at the same speed you used to in vanilla Reach, more shots will hit the target as compared to missed shots. This further devalues the use of the assault rifle in medium range engagements, as the chance of a feathering AR user overpowering the spamming DMR/pistol/NR user is reduced. This results in the weapon selection of a player being more crucial to a player’s skill, which is counterproductive.

CONCLUSION:

The assault rifle is weak compared to other weapons in the sandbox, in the current TU stages. But upon close inspection and analysis, it is made weak not because of it being nerfed, but because of the buffing of precision weapons. A proposed solution is to actually NERF the precision weapons, not buff them (i.e. increasing bloom). The advantages/disadvantages of it could be discussed in another thread, however.

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So what do you guys think? What are your experiences with the assault rifle in both vanilla Reach and in the TU playlist? Are my points inconsistent with your experiences in any way? What are your views of the assault rifle? What are your suggestions in which to balance the automatic weapons, with the precision weapons buffed through the dediction of bloom?

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> CONCLUSION:
>
> The assault rifle is weak compared to other weapons in the sandbox, in the current TU stages. But upon close inspection and analysis, it is made weak not because of it being nerfed, but because of the buffing of precision weapons. A proposed solution is to actually NERF the precision weapons, not buff them (i.e. increasing bloom). The advantages/disadvantages of it could be discussed in another thread, however.
>
> "
>
> So what do you guys think? What are your experiences with the assault rifle in both vanilla Reach and in the TU playlist? Are my points inconsistent with your experiences in any way? What are your views of the assault rifle? What are your suggestions in which to balance the automatic weapons, with the precision weapons buffed through the dediction of bloom?
>
> Please keep discussion civil. Use rational thinking and look to both sides of the argument. I do not hope my thread to end up like all the others.

Ok, so my missus is an AR user (alongside shotgun, sword armour lock etc) so I can see exactly what you are getting at. The problem with zero bloom is painfully obvious (at least in my opinion) as even the trusty shotgun/sniper rifle become near enough useless in comparison to the magnum/DMR.

In vanilla reach you have the scenarios where you come around a corner and that person shooting you gets the first hit, so you lay some into that chap whilst carefully planning your “perfect exit” to allow your sheild to recharge, maybe even outshooting the guy before you do it. In vanilla reach team shooting lowers this time substantially but most of the time there is at least the “opportunity” to escape. Now I dont like the ZB settings purely because this “escape time” is near enough obliterated, it entices camping in specific areas, poking your head out, much to a similar way of call of duty or other "see-first FPS’ "…and with team shooting the scenario becomes “walk around corner - oh! - im dead”.

I much prefer the 85% bloom setting because the pistol seems more evenly balanced in comparison to other precision weapons. It has a smaller clip, a larger reticule, but a slightly faster ROF than the DMR; thus preventing the DMR from being the “best weapon in the game”… what can I say - i was the guy using the carbine in H3 and im the guy who prefers the pistol over DMR in Reach. You are right about the sandbox though and, forgive me if this is a stupid idea, but has 343 considered giving the automatic weapons no bloom alongside the precision weapons with “lowered bloom” (as to which percentage im not sure which would be best but i suppose it needs to be tried in an effort to close the effectiveness between weapons).

I can understand my opinion may not be agreed with by all as giving auto weapons better accuracy basically makes those people who are not very good the opportunity to beat those who are clearly better, but if a “headshot every time pro” confronts a “spammer casual” I’d like to think the win would be more related to the tactics of the precision user against the improved accuracy of the casual…then of course the pros would carry an assault rifle more often too…

Personally ZB is boring, there is a lack of effective weapons and some very dull tactics going on…I would like more weapons to be on an equal stand in most scenarios but obviously better in others (ie shotgun close range)…this way the game is more fun for everyone.

please dont flame me
An opinion is never right or wrong. If you disagree please say why.

Nice post OP

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@Spantangular
Well I do agree with most of your points.

  1. I believe that the quick kill times is the sole purpose of zero bloom in the first place. In my experience, I enjoyed zero bloom immensely because the kill times were quick, there were less randomness, and every kill or being killed was due to skill and nor random factors like bloom; Plus you still have enough time to retreat instead of instant death like SWAT. But you had to play the gametype with the mentality you do when playing SWAT, and not regular slayer. So I’m pretty sure this will only be implemented into certain playlists, and people who do enjoy it, including me, will get to enjoy it there.

  2. I am also one of the guys who preferred the carbine over the battle rifle, because of the fact that I like the expressions on peoples’ faces when I kill them quicker with the carbine. Because believe it or not, the carbine has a faster kill time than the BR, and is arguably the more ‘skillful’ weapon. But it was just so much harder to use, and was only slightly superior to the BR, which was why the BR is so infamous even to today.

  3. Zero bloom on the AR: At first glance that might seem to be the best choice to give AR more effectiveness in a zero bloom environment, but in reality it would not. It would just make everyone spam the AR everywhere simply because it has a higher damage output than the DMR/magnum, and with the same accuracy as ‘precision’ weapons. So it would make no sense.

Trust me, I’ve modded Halo Custom Edition for the lulz to give it a more COD feel, by giving the Halo 1 AR zero bullet spread. And even while playing on legendary, with the enemy AI modded to having unlimited range and immediately knowing of your presence, the AR was overpowered simply because of its high damage output and it ability to SNIPE, due to zero bloom, which is completely unfitting for it.

So yea, thanks for the post!

Still, I guess it is kinda inevitable seeing 343’s current changes to multiplayer, that automatic weapons are getting useless adt medium range. A good thing though, is that I like to troll people who do not know of the bleedthrough mechanic by going into shotgun range, pumping three bullets, and pummeling them with a melee. I guess that’s one good thing that has arised. Or maybe this was intentional? O.O

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I made a thread about this it had some discussion going but…anyway I agree however, the Plasma Repeater needs more of a buff then the AR. The Plamsa Repeater is the WORST weapon in Halo History.

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I AGREE.

The plasma repeater is found as pickups on maps.

The assault rifle is a starting weapon.

So… by logic the plasma repeater > AR.

And plus the plasma repeater is found on gametypes with DMR starts.

So also by logic the plasma repeater > DMR in close quarters or at least some circumstances.

But do we have that in Reach?

At least 343 is going a step forward by having the PLASMA RIFLE in Anniversary maps instead, which is actually useful in taking down shields!

But alas, that is not the point to this thread. At least it is pretty obvious the plasma rifle will have SOME use in reduced bloom environments, in close quarters while still losing to shotgun at least.

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i’ve always thought of my AR as my “oh -Yoink-” weapon if my clip runs out in my pistol/br/dmr. and yes the plasma repeater should be stronger than the AR, but not as strong as the shoutgun or sword since it’s not a power weapon. IMO the AR is fine where it is, its way too easy to use and therefore should be weak when compared to the guns that take more skill to use effectively.

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> i’ve always thought of my AR as my “oh Yoink!” weapon if my clip runs out in my pistol/br/dmr. and yes the plasma repeater should be stronger than the AR, but not as strong as the shoutgun or sword since it’s not a power weapon. IMO the AR is fine where it is, its way too easy to use and therefore should be weak when compared to the guns that take more skill to use effectively.

In vanilla Reach it is fine. But the sad thing is there’a a high chance that 85% bloom will be applied to new anniversary playlists not utilizing zero bloom. And as I explained it devalues the AR even more (especially with that god pistol. OMG what’s the point of the AR if you spawn with the GOD PISTOL?).

And you should try utilizing the AR a bit more often in vanilla slayer. It is actually a very good weapon, that utilizes skill (a la feathering). Pray and Spray AR does not require skill, so as expected it isn’t effective. Feathering requires skill, so it is effective (no longer in 85% D: )

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sorry bro but i’m NEVER playing anything vanilla reach after this TU is applied. this TU makes me feel like i’m playing halo again.

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Make the AR harder to use and I don’t have a problem with it being buffed. But the fact that the Reticule is more than 4 Times the size of the DMR and that the bullet magnetism works when there is ANY of the reticule over your opponent literally causes it to be near impossible to miss. Unless they change that, use the DMR if you want to win.

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I would say the solution to the AR in a zero bloom environment is make its maximum bloom much smaller, more like the Halo 3 AR reticle size or even smaller to make up for its low damage. That or make its damage per shot much higher to make up for its low rate of fire and horrible accuracy.

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> Make the AR harder to use and I don’t have a problem with it being buffed. But the fact that the Reticule is more than 4 Times the size of the DMR and that the bullet magnetism works when there is ANY of the reticule over your opponent literally causes it to be near impossible to miss. Unless they change that, use the DMR if you want to win.

My thoughts exactly

http://www.bungie.net/Stats/Reach/FileDetails.aspx?fid=24211870&player=x%20F%20equals%20MA%20x

tone the magnetism WAAAAYY down. then the ARs bloom can be assessed.

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> Make the AR harder to use and I don’t have a problem with it being buffed. But the fact that the Reticule is more than 4 Times the size of the DMR and that the bullet magnetism works when there is ANY of the reticule over your opponent literally causes it to be near impossible to miss. Unless they change that, use the DMR if you want to win.

I agree to some extent, but I think people overplay the bullet magnetism card, but you still have a point. IMO, the AR should have no bullet magnetism at all, bullets will move in a completly random fashion this way. But in return, max bloom should be reduced to 90% of the radius it is currently (reducing the area of the circle created 81% on any given point in the z- axis, meaning you are 19% more accurate at max bloom) and bloom expansion should be reduced to 75-80%, this way the AR actually take some skill to use. The argument people always make is that the AR takes no skill to use, but isn’t very good, and its opposite, the DMR, is very good, verging on overpowered, but takes skill to use (yes belive it or not, this is a case where the better weapon is actually harder to use) so the obvious solution is to make the AR better, but harder to use. Under these parameters at close range, it should be used on full-auto and it will be even better than it is now, but at close-mid, and mid range the Ar would prefrom substncially worse if just sprayed, but if players pace out 4-5 shots at a time, they will do substncially better, then they would with the current AR.

Thus making the AR a weapon that takes skill to use, and no longer will it be subjected to the constant raging on its bullet magnetism.

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^ This is a good solution actually. Make the AR have less bullet magnetism, and giving it the 85% bloom treatment.