If Halo Were a Business, and You Guys Ran It.....

[IT’S A LONG READ, BUT I PROMISE A GOOD ONE]

If Halo were a business, and you guys ran it…it would fail, horribly.

Why? Because one thing all businesses know & learn is that you need to innovate & change. No matter how successful you are, you change.

There are countless examples but a recent good one is Apple’s iPod (1st Gen). It was HUGELY successful, but they changed the design, over and over and over. Why? Because they know change is not only good, but necessary to stay on top.

…What does this have to do with Halo?

You guys are handicapping the evolution of the game. Everytime Bungie/343i tries to change or add something, the “hardcore” (ie; the small community of people who actually read the forums daily) cry loudly about the changes. Meanwhile, the MILLIONS of other people (who don’t browse and follow every bit of news), pop in the game and experience the same old game, what do they do? Play those OTHER games, you know, the one with NEW features, and that other one with that NEW weapon or NEW gametype?

Well who cares about those guys right? Well, just like Apple probably irritated an (overall small) percentage of hardcore people by changing the design of the iPod, MAJORITY of people obviously loved it.

Again, what’s the point? I read all day about people going back and forth over what changes should happen and
what shouldn’t. What do we all agree on? CHANGE.

Now obviously 343i can’t please everyone, but there are some basic things that need to happen:

Friendly Fire - This should be off in every gametype except Slayer Pro, or Pro Gametypes. “Pro” can become the new way hardcore players who want a “classic” or “barebones” feel play. There’s no purpose to having Friendly Fire. Ask yourself, what purpose does it serve? What experience do you lose by not being able to kill your teammate? Everyone wins here. The game isn’t “ruined” because you can’t accidentally kill your friend. Grenade spamming won’t increase, as we still only have 2 'nades and most people throw them both at the same time anyway. Don’t say “that’s just Halo” because that’s the kind of close minded thinking that would destroy a business. Remember, change is good.

Quitters - We can all agree you can’t stop someone from leaving a game. Okay, so how does that other game handle it? When someone quits, they are replaced. Why does this need to be implemented? Because it works. And it benefits the players who stayed in the game. If this doesn’t exist, we all know what currently happens, the other team starts spawn killing and controlling the power weapons. You have no choice but to camp or if you run out like Rambo, you die EVERYTIME. What if you don’t want to join an “In Progress” game? Too bad, jump in and help the team who needs you. But what if it’s a losing cause? Well losing is losing, the difference this makes is that there isn’t just 2 of you hiding for your lives. What does this solve? You aren’t forced to quit and be penalized and you are less likely to be spawn killed.

“BUT THAT ISN’T HALO!” Really? How has the core game changed? This is another example of everybody wins.

“GO PLAY THAT GAME!” Just because it’s something one game does, doesn’t mean another game shouldn’t copy it if it works. Need proof? Cell phones were mostly flip and “slide” phones. The iPhone comes out and now EVERYONE has a touch phone. Why? Because other companies saw what worked. Need more proof? Best Buy started the whole “huge warehouse looking store with high ceilings and wide open spaces”. Now Wal*Mart, Target and EVERY other retailer has copied it. Why? Because the MAJORITY of people liked it.

In closing, (finally) you as fans of Halo, have to understand that the majority of gamers have moved on, and will continue to move on, to newer games. Halo is a business that needs gamers to play it constantly. All day. All weekend. This business is suffering because they aren’t changing to match (see: duplicate) what other games are doing right. Firefight is more boring than, COD Zombies or Gears Horde mode. Betraying for weapons makes people hate this game and the community. These are easy things that can be fixed, but you (the small percentage) wont let it.

You guys would be the company that watched Apple release the iPhone, but say to yourselves, “phones have always been this way! If they want that phone, go buy THAT phone”. Understand that if someone else is doing it right and it’s costing you a population, then you need to change, or die.

[-I’m a huge Halo fan. Played them all. Barely play COD. Barely play Gears]


EDIT: Just so it’s clear, this is not about me embracing Armor Abilities or liking Double Melee Beatdowns or wanting Bloom. This is more specifically about the people who say that things shouldn’t change because “that’s not Halo”.

Reach is Halo, just an evolved Halo, a different Halo. Better or worse is up to us. If it’s worse then it should be fixed. If it were perfect, there’d be more players. Facts are facts.

Wow they changed the iphones shape! That’s huge.

Also change is good.
But not all change. AA’s were a bad idea. Bloom was a worse idea.

gives OP a medal

Most of the people on here don’t seem to understand that change is not only necessary, but good, and that what Bungie did with reach was a step in the right direction.

> Wow they changed the iphones shape! That’s huge.
>
> Also change is good.
> But not all change. AA’s were a bad idea. Bloom was a worse idea.

Naaah bloom was good Bullet Magnetism was bad. Bloom really makes you pace urself.

> gives OP a medal
>
> Most of the people on here don’t seem to understand that change is not only necessary, but good, and that what Bungie did with reach was a step in the right direction.

agreed :smiley: and that is whys somethings have to be changed on Reach because they took a step in a new direction and some of the things may or may not have worked out.

Halo is a business.

They make lots of money.

> Halo is a business.

343i is a business; Halo is a product.

> [IT’S A LONG READ, BUT I PROMISE A GOOD ONE]
>
>
>
> If Halo were a business, and you guys ran it…it would fail, horribly.
>
>
> Why? Because one thing all businesses know & learn is that you need to innovate & change. No matter how successful you are, you change.
>
>
> There are countless examples but a recent good one is Apple’s iPod (1st Gen). It was HUGELY successful, but they changed the design, over and over and over. Why? Because they know change is not only good, but necessary to stay on top.
>
>
> …What does this have to do with Halo?
>
> You guys are handicapping the evolution of the game. Everytime Bungie/343i tries to change or add something, the “hardcore” (ie; the small community of people who actually read the forums daily) cry loudly about the changes. Meanwhile, the MILLIONS of other people (who don’t browse and follow every bit of news), pop in the game and experience the same old game, what do they do? Play those OTHER games, you know, the one with NEW features, and that other one with that NEW weapon or NEW gametype?
>
>
> Well who cares about those guys right? Well, just like Apple probably irritated an (overall small) percentage of hardcore people by changing the design of the iPod, MAJORITY of people obviously loved it.
>
>
> Again, what’s the point? I read all day about people going back and forth over what changes should happen and
> what shouldn’t. What do we all agree on? CHANGE.
>
>
> Now obviously 343i can’t please everyone, but there are some basic things that need to happen:
>
>
> Friendly Fire - This should be off in every gametype except Slayer Pro, or Pro Gametypes. “Pro” can become the new way hardcore players who want a “classic” or “barebones” feel play. There’s no purpose to having Friendly Fire. Ask yourself, what purpose does it serve? What experience do you lose by not being able to kill your teammate? Everyone wins here. The game isn’t “ruined” because you can’t accidentally kill your friend. Grenade spamming won’t increase, as we still only have 2 'nades and most people throw them both at the same time anyway. Don’t say “that’s just Halo” because that’s the kind of close minded thinking that would destroy a business. Remember, change is good.
>
>
> Quitters - We can all agree you can’t stop someone from leaving a game. Okay, so how does that other game handle it? When someone quits, they are replaced. Why does this need to be implemented? Because it works. And it benefits the players who stayed in the game. If this doesn’t exist, we all know what currently happens, the other team starts spawn killing and controlling the power weapons. You have no choice but to camp or if you run out like Rambo, you die EVERYTIME. What if you don’t want to join an “In Progress” game? Too bad, jump in and help the team who needs you. But what if it’s a losing cause? Well losing is losing, the difference this makes is that there isn’t just 2 of you hiding for your lives. What does this solve? You aren’t forced to quit and be penalized and you are less likely to be spawn killed.
>
>
> “BUT THAT ISN’T HALO!” Really? How has the core game changed? This is another example of everybody wins.
>
>
> “GO PLAY THAT GAME!” Just because it’s something one game does, doesn’t mean another game shouldn’t copy it if it works. Need proof? Cell phones were mostly flip and “slide” phones. The iPhone comes out and now EVERYONE has a touch phone. Why? Because other companies saw what worked. Need more proof? Best Buy started the whole “huge warehouse looking store with high ceilings and wide open spaces”. Now Wal*Mart, Target and EVERY other retailer has copied it. Why? Because the MAJORITY of people liked it.
>
>
> In closing, (finally) you as fans of Halo, have to understand that the majority of gamers have moved on, and will continue to move on, to newer games. Halo is a business that needs gamers to play it constantly. All day. All weekend. This business is suffering because they aren’t changing to match (see: duplicate) what other games are doing right. Firefight is more boring than, COD Zombies or Gears Horde mode. Betraying for weapons makes people hate this game and the community. These are easy things that can be fixed, but you (the small percentage) wont let it.
>
>
> You guys would be the company that watched Apple release the iPhone, but say to yourselves, “phones have always been this way! If they want that phone, go buy THAT phone”. Understand that if someone else is doing it right and it’s costing you a population, then you need to change, or die.
>
>
> [-I’m a huge Halo fan. Played them all. Barely play COD. Barely play Gears]

gata love the thought processes of the average Reach fanboy.

Your ipod analogy nulls your entire argument. Apple continuously added on to its product. One version played mp3s, the next had more storage but still played mp3, the next had a touch screen but played mp3s had lots of storage etc etc.

the point is apple kept everythign the prior versions had but just added on to them. Halo was more or less liek that ce-h3 but reach got rid of many constants, liek static reticules on precision weapons, and no AA slayer. If MS or bungie was smart liek apple every game would have just been additions to what was doen before, but instead fo rreach they got rid of what worked before and tried new things. It would be like apple goign from playing mp3s to playing n64 games, yeh it owuld be new and some would liek it but the fans who wanted to play mp3s would be dissapointed. but if it played mp3s and n64 games (just an EX) then thaty would be innovation since it did waht was done before but still did soemthing new.

Your thoughts make me laugh.

> gives OP a medal
>
> Most of the people on here don’t seem to understand that change is not only necessary, but good, and that what Bungie did with reach was a step in the right direction.

Yeh no. Chess has not change din hundreds of years and it still loved by millions. sure making chess sets out of wood,marble, plastic glass etc is cool and is a form of change but the fundamentals stay the same. Halo liek chess had the formula right in CE-2, they could have just updated the graphics, maybe add new gametypes (liek playign checkers with chess pieces), or made the sets out of metal or marbel as opposed to classic wood (new maps etc) . but instead they changed what made halo halo and ruined the formula.

lol invincibility button, even more common double beatdownss, and spamming optimal for CQB with the DMR for random results= fantastic step in the right direction LOL

silly billies i swear

> gata love the thought processes of the average Reach fanboy.
>
> Your ipod analogy nulls your entire argument. Apple continuously added on to its product. One version played mp3s, the next had more storage but still played mp3, the next had a touch screen but played mp3s had lots of storage etc etc.
>
> the point is apple kept everythign the prior versions had but just added on to them. Halo was more or less liek that ce-h3 but reach got rid of many constants, liek static reticules on precision weapons, and no AA slayer. If MS or bungie was smart liek apple every game would have just been additions to what was doen before, but instead fo rreach they got rid of what worked before and tried new things. It would be like apple goign from playing mp3s to playing n64 games, yeh it owuld be new and some would liek it but the fans who wanted to play mp3s would be dissapointed. but if it played mp3s and n64 games (just an EX) then thaty would be innovation since it did waht was done before but still did soemthing new.
>
> Your thoughts make me laugh.

The iPod has undergone great changes throughout its existence, and it will continue to evolve and become a better product.

Also, you’re horrid at making analogies.

> > gata love the thought processes of the average Reach fanboy.
> >
> > Your ipod analogy nulls your entire argument. Apple continuously added on to its product. One version played mp3s, the next had more storage but still played mp3, the next had a touch screen but played mp3s had lots of storage etc etc.
> >
> > the point is apple kept everythign the prior versions had but just added on to them. Halo was more or less liek that ce-h3 but reach got rid of many constants, liek static reticules on precision weapons, and no AA slayer. If MS or bungie was smart liek apple every game would have just been additions to what was doen before, but instead fo rreach they got rid of what worked before and tried new things. It would be like apple goign from playing mp3s to playing n64 games, yeh it owuld be new and some would liek it but the fans who wanted to play mp3s would be dissapointed. but if it played mp3s and n64 games (just an EX) then thaty would be innovation since it did waht was done before but still did soemthing new.
> >
> > Your thoughts make me laugh.
>
> The iPod has undergone great changes throughout its existence, and it will continue to evolve and become a better product.
>
> Also, you’re horrid at making analogies.

-__- i dont think adding memory or a touch screen changes anything about what people loved about the first ipod

apple will continue to add features but everythign the first ipod did will still be in the end product of the main new ipods, minis excluded.

halo reach didnt have evreythign that made CE-2 great. Understand?

Bloom was not a bad idea, it was just how they implimented it

> Yeh no. Chess has not change din hundreds of years and it still loved by millions. sure making chess sets out of wood,marble, plastic glass etc is cool and is a form of change but the fundamentals stay the same. Halo liek chess had the formula right in CE-2, they could have just updated the graphics, maybe add new gametypes (liek playign checkers with chess pieces), or made the sets out of metal or marbel as opposed to classic wood (new maps etc) . but instead they changed what made halo halo and ruined the formula.
>
>
> lol invincibility button, even more common double beatdownss, and spamming optimal for CQB with the DMR for random results= fantastic step in the right direction LOL
>
> silly billies i swear

Chess and video games are two entirely different forms of entertainment. Chess is a test of wits between two individuals, in a way that puts it above games, while most video games, such as Halo are a test of reflex and dedication, and exists to entertain. Chess doesn’t change because the way people think doesn’t change, and video games should change because what people want changes constantly.

A small group of people who don’t want to accept what is good and overall liked, because they themselves don’t like it, should find something new to entertain themselves rather fixate themselves on the past and halt progress.

Also, my name is Ayla, not Billie.

> gives OP a medal
>
> Most of the people on here don’t seem to understand that change is not only necessary, but good, and that what Bungie did with reach was a step in the right direction.

imo, it was 50/50. yes they did change things for the better (i enjoyed sprint and the new forge). yet they did screw things too (AA’s limiting maps, campagn voices, other stuff). in fact, they did what Every Game Company Does!

You know what I wont? You guy’s probaly wont read this, but still

I want play lists

like…actual playlists

You go into one of 2 playlists

Classic and Blam

Classic gives you nothing but weapons and vehicles. No bloom, armour effects, or anything. Then Blam is the new game.

Then in each you have your game sizes, Slayer or Big team. Then you have your game types.
Slayer, Objective, Other

This way, you have 12 playlists, that give you a big population, yet enough variety to cater to everyone, core and hardcore

> -__- i dont think adding memory or a touch screen changes anything about what people loved about the first ipod
>
> apple will continue to add features but everythign the first ipod did will still be in the end product of the main new ipods, minis excluded.
>
> halo reach didnt have evreythign that made CE-2 great. Understand?

Apple has significantly altered the iPod nearly every time it was re-released, as Apple is smart and knows that continuous change is good and a key to success.

And, as for your claim that “Reach doesn’t have what makes Halo, Halo,” each and every significant change made was made because Bungie listened to their community. “Melee is broken!” “The BR is over-powered!” “CoD is more realistic!”

Sound familiar? It’s what you, the communty as a whole, wanted, and it’s what you got.

> You know what I wont? You guy’s probaly wont read this, but still
>
> I want play lists
>
> like…actual playlists
>
> You go into one of 2 playlists
>
> Classic and Blam
>
> Classic gives you nothing but weapons and vehicles. No bloom, armour effects, or anything. Then Blam is the new game.
>
>
> Then in each you have your game sizes, Slayer or Big team. Then you have your game types.
> Slayer, Objective, Other
>
> This way, you have 12 playlists, that give you a big population, yet enough variety to cater to everyone, core and hardcore

They kinda are doing that when CEA comes out

> > Yeh no. Chess has not change din hundreds of years and it still loved by millions. sure making chess sets out of wood,marble, plastic glass etc is cool and is a form of change but the fundamentals stay the same. Halo liek chess had the formula right in CE-2, they could have just updated the graphics, maybe add new gametypes (liek playign checkers with chess pieces), or made the sets out of metal or marbel as opposed to classic wood (new maps etc) . but instead they changed what made halo halo and ruined the formula.
> >
> >
> > lol invincibility button, even more common double beatdownss, and spamming optimal for CQB with the DMR for random results= fantastic step in the right direction LOL
> >
> > silly billies i swear
>
> Chess and video games are two entirely different forms of entertainment. Chess is a test of wits between two individuals, in a way that puts it above games, while most video games, such as Halo are a test of reflex and dedication, and exists to entertain. Chess doesn’t change because the way people think doesn’t change, and video games should change because what people want changes constantly.
>
> A small group of people who don’t want to accept what is good and overall liked, because they themselves don’t like it, should find something new to entertain themselves rather fixate themselves on the past and halt progress.
>
> Also, my name is Ayla, not Billie.

Your “wits” and reflexes all come from the same place, your mind. Both are games played with your mind and hands. this is especially so when chess is played on a timer. oh and lol liek chess isnt about dedication…riiiiiiggghhtttt

Also if the way people think doesnt change how can what they want change? Wanting is a product of thinking. If you think something is fantastic and your thinking doesnt change why would you want anything differnt from that granted its in the same catagory of videogames. lol you make 0 sense. billy

nice way to dodge my statements about “progress”. yup invincibility button fantastic progress as is random CQB firefights, oh and mashing the melee button, why would you ever shoot in an FPS! makes no sense hahaha

you still silly billy sorry =/

I agree! But certain gameplay aspects never should have been implemented… of course, now that they have been, we know how terrible they are, and even now they are being removed! You don’t know if you don’t try :wink:

> > -__- i dont think adding memory or a touch screen changes anything about what people loved about the first ipod
> >
> > apple will continue to add features but everythign the first ipod did will still be in the end product of the main new ipods, minis excluded.
> >
> > halo reach didnt have evreythign that made CE-2 great. Understand?
>
> Apple has significantly altered the iPod nearly every time it was re-released, as Apple is smart and knows that continuous change is good and a key to success.
>
> And, as for your claim that “Reach doesn’t have what makes Halo, Halo,” each and every significant change made was made because Bungie listened to their community. “Melee is broken!” “The BR is over-powered!” “CoD is more realistic!”
>
> Sound familiar? It’s what you, the communty as a whole, wanted, and it’s what you got.

omg its like arguing with a wall! please tell me what the first ipod did other than it suser interface that the modern ipod doesnt do? please please enlighten me. Ill wait

yupp cuz the population clamored for armor lock, and camo on demand. riiiiighhttt

so melee was broken and thier solution was to make shooting in CQB pretty much pointless?

Its like someone saying ouch my right hand hurts and so the doctor chops off your right arm. Well your right hand wont hurt anymore right?

hahahahahaha. Silly. Billy.