> > > If a drop pod took eight times the amount of material used in GEN2 MJOLNIR, that doesn’t make necessarily more expensive, even if it does accumulate.
> > >
> > > Guaranteed there’s more to them than just metal but a simple cost comparison would be, I can buy a tonne of steel for $400-500, yet it costs me 1.5k+ for a mere laptop. This is a pretty raw compasiron between drop pods and MJOLNIR, but the point to be made that the sophistication and leap in technology in developing a Spartan is much more and would stand to reason that it costs much more.
> > The problems with your argument are that you…
> > 1.Take my argument of substance vs substance and counter argue with substance vs product.
> > 2. Argue with current economy and marketing when we’re talking about the economy and marketing of the future. 550 years in the future.
> > 3. Say “substance” when I was talking about metal.
> > To elaborate…
> > 1. I compare the metal used in a single drop pod to the metal used in MJOLNIR. You compare metal to a laptop. That’s like comparing MJOLNIR to the pure lead and titanium; not an equal argument. And of course a single suit of MJOLNIR costs more than a single drop pod, MJOLNIR has energy shield tech and nuclear reactors. Take that away from it though, and you have the drop pod costing more. You can read why in my previous comment to Luke.
> > Now what I AM arguing is that the amount of drop pods used during the war costs more than the SIV program. And that makes sense according to the logic I am arguing with. With better versions comes cheaper costs. Especially when you’re producing stuff for the military. Think about it, there were more ODSTs than SIVs, those ODSTs probably have gone on more than five orbital drops on average, those drop pods get destroyed, damaged and need repair, etc., new pods need to be made, new gens are installed throughout the war, more materials are used, more repairs are made, etc. I’m pretty assured that the total cost of all the drop pods used during the war exceeds the costs for all GEN2 armors for the SIVs.
> 1. The point to be made, which you obviously missed, was comparing bulk metal (the “accumulation of titanium and steel”) to MJOLNIR. The amount of metal used in MJOLNIR vs a drop pod is irrelevant. It is, just as you conceded, far more expensive. It doesn’t matter what makes the MJOLNIR so expensive, it just is. If a drop pod, as you theoretically proposed, takes 8 times the metal yet is still cheaper what kind of conclusion to metal’s relative worth can we draw from that?
Wait, you’re telling me my initial point comparing the metals is irrelevant because you’re changing the argument to a semi new topic? That’s not really arguing against my point and doesn’t make much sense. Saying something is expensive “just cuz” isn’t much elaboration. I simply stated what was the most expensive parts of MJOLNIR.
And if anyone’s missed a point, you have:
> If a drop pod, as you theoretically proposed, takes 8 times the metal yet is still cheaper what kind of conclusion to metal’s relative worth can we draw from that?
You completely rule out the product vs product argument, exactly like how you did with substance vs substance. We both know that more metal means more money and we both know why MJOLNIR costs more than a drop pod. But you have mixed the fact for the metal of a drop pod costing more with the fact that MJOLNIR as a product costing more. So to answer your question, we can’t draw anything because whatever logic you pulled together there doesn’t make sense and it’s certainly not my argument.
My original argument with Delko was that the amount of metal for drop pods used during the war was far more expensive than the metal used to make GEN2. I then expanded that argument from substance vs substance to product vs product by arguing that all the drop pods used during the war, in total, cost more than the money invested into GEN2.
> Taking away its tech and reactors to make a case for a drop pod’s cost does nothing to your argument as you’re not comparing two complete products you’re comparing a product to that of a partial one.
I quote myself.
> And of course a single suit of MJOLNIR costs more than a single drop pod, MJOLNIR has energy shield tech and nuclear reactors. Take that away from it though, and you have the drop pod costing more.
You’ll see that I’m not even using that as a main argument by saying “of course a single suit of MJOLNIR costs more…”, but rather as a side point to identify what makes MJOLNIR so expensive.
> The rest of your argument is pure assumption based on absolutely zero ground and can be refuted by simply saying so.
So what do you mean by this? That my argument justifying that drop pods used during the war, in total, cost more than the GEN2s used by SIVs is pure assumption? That the average ODST hasn’t gone on five drops minimum? Yet you think your argument against it actually stands without assumption. In truth, we’re both assuming here. I’m assuming with estimates and practicality, and you’re assuming I’m wrong. If you want to prove me wrong, by all means, go and find sources to counter argue me.
> Also, you can deploy an ODST without a SIV (the use of which are highly contextual anyway…), but you can’t deploy a Spartan without MJOLNIR. Besides, how many Spartans died (or were missing in action…), taking their MJOLNIR with them?
Well in the SIVs, not many. You are arguing against my point that drop pods used during the war cost more than the GEN2 MJOLNIR used with the SIVs. GEN1 doesn’t have much relevancy to this argument. However, yeah, they do die taking their armor with them, but I remind you that you can still salvage damaged pods and make new ones/fix it, but you can’t salvage body parts and make a new human. Plus how many spartans were there in GEN1 that wore MJOLNIR? Under 200 actually wore MJOLNIR and most of those spartans were killed and their armor obviously not replaced.
> 2. My use of the current economy was just to make a raw point. I don’t know the economy 500+ years from now, but the principle of bulk material vs highly sophisticated manufacturing and technology still stands. For all you know interplanetary mining could have made metal more abundant and cheaper.
Alrighty, then it’s obvious the metal needed to make a laptop takes less than the metal to make a ton of steel. I’m pretty sure it’s obvious that the metal needed to make MJOLNIR takes less than the metal needed to make a drop pod. After all that was my initial comparison, right? Substance vs substance/metal vs metal, not substance vs product/metal vs laptop.
> 3. What are you on about?
To correct myself, you said “material”, not substance. And what I was getting at was that using “material” in that way describes all the components of MJOLNIR, not just the metal, as I was arguing.