I think I know why there's so much hate, and it's ok

Games Other Halo
1

From what I can tell, most of the people who hate Halo: Reach and are already hating Halo 4 are people within the age range of 15-25 who have been playing Halo for several years now (most since Halo 3.)
I happen to be one of these people. I am 21 years old and I have been playing Halo since Halo CE, though I didn’t get into the series until Halo 3.
Halo 2 is my favorite Halo out of the entire series. Not because of the gameplay, but because of the storyline, characters, music, etc.
In a way I grew up with Halo during my teenage years where I was maturing. I see most of the media, games, etc. from my childhood to early-mid teenage years as some of the best shows, games, etc ever. Most of the new stuff is kind of crap, and there is some good stuff every now and then. None of it though, beats nostalgia.
I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.
Essentially it feels like what you loved during your childhood, teenage years, or whatever are changing into something that doesn’t feel familiar to you. Then you don’t like this change. With a change like this it doesn’t come easy to these fans. That is why you see so much complaining over very minor things that they aren’t familiar with from their past.
I guarantee you that people that are playing Reach and eventually Halo 4 who are younger (around 10-15) will love these games and will not understand why people complained about them.
It’s kinda like www.halo2sucks.com. These people must have been around my age now and a game that they had fun with during a time that seemed more plain and simple being changed dramatically. As for me, I was younger so I was just having good ol’ fun.

So people, just go and have some good ol’ fun. 343i is not ruining Halo. Reach is not as bad as you make it out to be and Halo 4 will be great. Either way though, there will always be complaining. Just wait until Halo 4 comes out. I guarantee you that you will see posts in this forum on how 343i has ruined Halo and they’re trading in their copies to go back to Halo: Reach or Halo 3.

Now I could be completely wrong about everything I just said. At least though I’m giving a logical, and reasonable thread that is not some immature whining.

2

No one plays games for fun anymore OP. Sorry.

Haha. Having grown up with Halo, I’ve always enjoyed seeing what the sequels have to offer.

3

> I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.

If you are saying that older people like reach, its the opposite. Its the younger gamers FOR THE MOST PART that are the casual ones.
This thread is almost insulting. At least it is a coherent thread, though. Gotta give you that.
MLG gamers? tell me how many people in MLG are kids/teenagers. and they do not like vanilla reach. at ALL.

Its not about the nostalgia. Its about the core of halo. And its gone in halo reach. I am all for the new and exciting, but i want the core gameplay to still be there.

and your post is telling competitive players to be casual. which is not what we want to do, which is never what we did, all the way from halo 1 to halo 3, we played because we enjoyed being competitive.

4

> > I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.
>
> If you are saying that older people like reach, its the opposite. Its the younger gamers FOR THE MOST PART that are the casual ones.
> This thread is almost insulting. At least it is a coherent thread, though. Gotta give you that.
> MLG gamers? tell me how many people in MLG are kids/teenagers. and they do not like vanilla reach. at ALL.
>
> Its not about the nostalgia. Its about the core of halo. And its gone in halo reach. I am all for the new and exciting, but i want the core gameplay to still be there.

The core gameplay needs to be Halo. Seeing that weapon customization thread makes me sick personally.

5

> > I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.
>
> If you are saying that older people like reach, its the opposite. Its the younger gamers FOR THE MOST PART that are the casual ones.
> This thread is almost insulting. At least it is a coherent thread, though. Gotta give you that.
> MLG gamers? tell me how many people in MLG are kids/teenagers. and they do not like vanilla reach. at ALL.
>
> Its not about the nostalgia. Its about the core of halo. And its gone in halo reach. I am all for the new and exciting, but i want the core gameplay to still be there.
>
> and your post is telling competitive players to be casual. which is not what we want to do, which is never what we did, all the way from halo 1 to halo 3, we played because we enjoyed being competitive.

The core of Halo is still there, it always has been (except for Halo Wars.) The core of Halo is the way Halo: Combat Evolved mechanics and gameplay worked. Halo 2 evolved it along with the title to follow. Do you really expect Halo 4, 5 and 6 to be EXACTLY like Halo 1, 2 and 3?

6

> > > I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.
> >
> > If you are saying that older people like reach, its the opposite. Its the younger gamers FOR THE MOST PART that are the casual ones.
> > This thread is almost insulting. At least it is a coherent thread, though. Gotta give you that.
> > MLG gamers? tell me how many people in MLG are kids/teenagers. and they do not like vanilla reach. at ALL.
> >
> > Its not about the nostalgia. Its about the core of halo. And its gone in halo reach. I am all for the new and exciting, but i want the core gameplay to still be there.
> >
> > and your post is telling competitive players to be casual. which is not what we want to do, which is never what we did, all the way from halo 1 to halo 3, we played because we enjoyed being competitive.
>
> The core of Halo is still there, it always has been (except for Halo Wars.) The core of Halo is the way Halo: Combat Evolved mechanics and gameplay worked. Halo 2 evolved it along with the title to follow. Do you really expect Halo 4, 5 and 6 to be EXACTLY like Halo 1, 2 and 3?

Core gameplay went with Reach. That’s a fact.

7

> > > I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.
> >
> > If you are saying that older people like reach, its the opposite. Its the younger gamers FOR THE MOST PART that are the casual ones.
> > This thread is almost insulting. At least it is a coherent thread, though. Gotta give you that.
> > MLG gamers? tell me how many people in MLG are kids/teenagers. and they do not like vanilla reach. at ALL.
> >
> > Its not about the nostalgia. Its about the core of halo. And its gone in halo reach. I am all for the new and exciting, but i want the core gameplay to still be there.
> >
> > and your post is telling competitive players to be casual. which is not what we want to do, which is never what we did, all the way from halo 1 to halo 3, we played because we enjoyed being competitive.
>
> The core of Halo is still there, it always has been (except for Halo Wars.) The core of Halo is the way Halo: Combat Evolved mechanics and gameplay worked. Halo 2 evolved it along with the title to follow. Do you really expect Halo 4, 5 and 6 to be EXACTLY like Halo 1, 2 and 3?

read my post very well, didn’t you? the core gameplay is gone with reach, and i can give ONE reason right now out of FOUR:
everyone does not start out even.

8

> > > > I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.
> > >
> > > If you are saying that older people like reach, its the opposite. Its the younger gamers FOR THE MOST PART that are the casual ones.
> > > This thread is almost insulting. At least it is a coherent thread, though. Gotta give you that.
> > > MLG gamers? tell me how many people in MLG are kids/teenagers. and they do not like vanilla reach. at ALL.
> > >
> > > Its not about the nostalgia. Its about the core of halo. And its gone in halo reach. I am all for the new and exciting, but i want the core gameplay to still be there.
> > >
> > > and your post is telling competitive players to be casual. which is not what we want to do, which is never what we did, all the way from halo 1 to halo 3, we played because we enjoyed being competitive.
> >
> > The core of Halo is still there, it always has been (except for Halo Wars.) The core of Halo is the way Halo: Combat Evolved mechanics and gameplay worked. Halo 2 evolved it along with the title to follow. Do you really expect Halo 4, 5 and 6 to be EXACTLY like Halo 1, 2 and 3?
>
> read my post very well, didn’t you? the core gameplay is gone with reach, and i can give ONE reason right now out of FOUR:
> everyone does not start out even.

It’s not starting out even if you are asking someone who just bought the game off the shelf to be competitive. This game is changing whether some of want it or not, no amount of suggestion is going to change that. Just by the trailer we know change it coming. All these threads dont mean crap, look at your population numbers, the competitive community as a whole is under 15,000 worldwide, thats a generous number, you can see it by the playlists numbers, even halo3 at its prime, numbers never topped 50k in ranked playlists. You are grossly outnumbered by the other 500,000 casual gamers out there. If 343i loses all of you to gain 400,000 casuals, i will bet my money on pleasing the casual base, like it or not. That’s economics, make 100’s millions of dollars or make a few million to satisfy your loyal competitive base. Ask the question to yourself as a business owner. You are diluted if you think they will make something to appeal only to a small audience.

Some of you are “competitive” fans are going to have to make a really hard choice come the holidays.

9

> From what I can tell, most of the people who hate Halo: Reach and are already hating Halo 4 are people within the age range of 15-25 who have been playing Halo for several years now (most since Halo 3.)
> I happen to be one of these people. I am 21 years old and I have been playing Halo since Halo CE, though I didn’t get into the series until Halo 3.
> Halo 2 is my favorite Halo out of the entire series. Not because of the gameplay, but because of the storyline, characters, music, etc.
> In a way I grew up with Halo during my teenage years where I was maturing. I see most of the media, games, etc. from my childhood to early-mid teenage years as some of the best shows, games, etc ever. Most of the new stuff is kind of crap, and there is some good stuff every now and then. None of it though, beats nostalgia.
> I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.
> Essentially it feels like what you loved during your childhood, teenage years, or whatever are changing into something that doesn’t feel familiar to you. Then you don’t like this change. With a change like this it doesn’t come easy to these fans. That is why you see so much complaining over very minor things that they aren’t familiar with from their past.
> I guarantee you that people that are playing Reach and eventually Halo 4 who are younger (around 10-15) will love these games and will not understand why people complained about them.
> It’s kinda like www.halo2sucks.com. These people must have been around my age now and a game that they had fun with during a time that seemed more plain and simple being changed dramatically. As for me, I was younger so I was just having good ol’ fun.
>
> So people, just go and have some good ol’ fun. 343i is not ruining Halo. Reach is not as bad as you make it out to be and Halo 4 will be great. Either way though, there will always be complaining. Just wait until Halo 4 comes out. I guarantee you that you will see posts in this forum on how 343i has ruined Halo and they’re trading in their copies to go back to Halo: Reach or Halo 3.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Now I could be completely wrong about everything I just said. At least though I’m giving a logical, and reasonable thread that is not some immature whining.

i dont care about nostalgia,i want it to be fun like h2 and h3! h2 and h3 were much more fun then reach because of the gameplay! i want old gameplay back and not a mixture of every game out there right now.

10

This happens with every game release. You just have to ignore it.

11

> From what I can tell, most of the people who hate Halo: Reach and are already hating Halo 4 are people within the age range of 15-25 who have been playing Halo for several years now (most since Halo 3.)
> I happen to be one of these people. I am 21 years old and I have been playing Halo since Halo CE, though I didn’t get into the series until Halo 3.
> Halo 2 is my favorite Halo out of the entire series. Not because of the gameplay, but because of the storyline, characters, music, etc.
> In a way I grew up with Halo during my teenage years where I was maturing. I see most of the media, games, etc. from my childhood to early-mid teenage years as some of the best shows, games, etc ever. Most of the new stuff is kind of crap, and there is some good stuff every now and then. None of it though, beats nostalgia.
> I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.
> Essentially it feels like what you loved during your childhood, teenage years, or whatever are changing into something that doesn’t feel familiar to you. Then you don’t like this change. With a change like this it doesn’t come easy to these fans. That is why you see so much complaining over very minor things that they aren’t familiar with from their past.
> I guarantee you that people that are playing Reach and eventually Halo 4 who are younger (around 10-15) will love these games and will not understand why people complained about them.
> It’s kinda like www.halo2sucks.com. These people must have been around my age now and a game that they had fun with during a time that seemed more plain and simple being changed dramatically. As for me, I was younger so I was just having good ol’ fun.
>
> So people, just go and have some good ol’ fun. 343i is not ruining Halo. Reach is not as bad as you make it out to be and Halo 4 will be great. Either way though, there will always be complaining. Just wait until Halo 4 comes out. I guarantee you that you will see posts in this forum on how 343i has ruined Halo and they’re trading in their copies to go back to Halo: Reach or Halo 3.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Now I could be completely wrong about everything I just said. At least though I’m giving a logical, and reasonable thread that is not some immature whining.

Ahh no wonder you defend all the reach bs in H4, you came late to the party with H3.

ignorance is bliss. If you know nothing of good halo gameplay with CE &2 no wonder you think Reach and COD like halo 4 are cool

12

> > > > > I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.
> > > >
> > > > If you are saying that older people like reach, its the opposite. Its the younger gamers FOR THE MOST PART that are the casual ones.
> > > > This thread is almost insulting. At least it is a coherent thread, though. Gotta give you that.
> > > > MLG gamers? tell me how many people in MLG are kids/teenagers. and they do not like vanilla reach. at ALL.
> > > >
> > > > Its not about the nostalgia. Its about the core of halo. And its gone in halo reach. I am all for the new and exciting, but i want the core gameplay to still be there.
> > > >
> > > > and your post is telling competitive players to be casual. which is not what we want to do, which is never what we did, all the way from halo 1 to halo 3, we played because we enjoyed being competitive.
> > >
> > > The core of Halo is still there, it always has been (except for Halo Wars.) The core of Halo is the way Halo: Combat Evolved mechanics and gameplay worked. Halo 2 evolved it along with the title to follow. Do you really expect Halo 4, 5 and 6 to be EXACTLY like Halo 1, 2 and 3?
> >
> > read my post very well, didn’t you? the core gameplay is gone with reach, and i can give ONE reason right now out of FOUR:
> > everyone does not start out even.
>
> It’s not starting out even if you are asking someone who just bought the game off the shelf to be competitive. This game is changing whether some of want it or not, no amount of suggestion is going to change that. Just by the trailer we know change it coming. All these threads dont mean crap, look at your population numbers, the competitive community as a whole is under 15,000 worldwide, thats a generous number, you can see it by the playlists numbers, even halo3 at its prime, numbers never topped 50k in ranked playlists. You are grossly outnumbered by the other 500,000 casual gamers out there. If 343i loses all of you to gain 400,000 casuals, i will bet my money on pleasing the casual base, like it or not. That’s economics, make 100’s millions of dollars or make a few million to satisfy your loyal competitive base. Ask the question to yourself as a business owner. You are diluted if you think they will make something to appeal only to a small audience.
>
> Some of you are “competitive” fans are going to have to make a really hard choice come the holidays.

Agreed.
Also, what ever happened to this thing called “FUN”? Yeah I understand that some of you find competitive game play fun, but you guys tend to suck the fun out of the game when none competitive gamers enter the picture. ATCG, I agree with your opening post, and I do think that around Halo 4’s release we’re going to see threads that either say “I’m canceling my Preorder”, “I’m trading in my copy”, “throwing my copy away”, I’ve seen it with Crysis 2, and Halo CEA’s release, hell, we’re already starting to see people posting threads saying “If Halo 4 is like _____, I’m leaving” or “I’m -Yoinking!- leaving”.

You can’t please 100% of the general public, that’s life, and guess what, 343i’s main goal is to please as many people as they can, which means, things are going to change, if you’re in that small group of people who don’t want Halo to change, then guess what, you’re going to have to learn to live with it, or leave.

Drewdude, let me point out something, there are “kids” in MLG, there are fake MLG/MLG want-a-be’s who are kids, they may not be kids to you, but they are kids to some of us who are older, and call people younger than us kids.

13

Reach was an insult to many people and so many of us came to the forums to show our displeasure. Now we are worried Halo 4 will be more of the same. Simple as that.

14

> No one plays games for fun anymore OP. Sorry.
>
> Haha. Having grown up with Halo, I’ve always enjoyed seeing what the sequels have to offer.

People don’t play campaign for.fun and curiosity? People don’t play custom games with many friends on exciting maps for fun? You’d be surprised how many peeps play a game for fun. I play halo for both fun and competitiveness. I don’t know what your talking about. Games are meant to be fun and entertaining, while some offer all that and the competitive realm.

15

> Most of the new stuff is kind of crap, and there is some good stuff every now and then. None of it though, beats nostalgia.
> I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.

Well let’s not overgeneralize here. As a representative of the “let’s just burn it down and pretend that Reach never happened” committee it isn’t fair to lump all the very good criticisms that can be leveled against that game with the unwillingness of fanatics (let’s not forget derivations, here) to grow beyond their very, very limited interests. With Reach it’s not a matter of it being different. It was simply a bad game in terms of it’s level design, pacing, writing, AI, weapon balance, and a dozen other things besides that all worked together, despite all just passing the bar of functionality, to create a crap experience once you cared to look past the facade of an over-angsty war drama about the monsters from Power Rangers finally getting theirs. If anything set Reach up most for failure it was Bungie’s unwillingness to revise the most basic elements of Halo to accommodate for their tacked-on features and those new directions that they were actually able to articulate (see SPACE!), or in other words that it didn’t change enough to support what changes they did make.

Now if they approached armor abilities and next-gen spartans with, say, something similar to Section 8 we could have had something interesting, but as it was we just received a bastardization of not only halo but the shooter genre as a whole because in going against some of Halo’s better points of fun, variety, and crazy -Yoink- happening we regressed to a point well before the first game, (which you can even argue wasn’t the most evolved FPS of the time, or at least that it’s position as such was short lived by Half Life 2 and/or Star Wars Battlefront.)

Anyway, the point is that while I do agree with “good ol’ fun” and all that I’m not going to let Reach off the hook to spare Halo 4 some whining. It deserves the flak, it deserves the scorn, it deserves to be wrapped up in a carpet, thrown off a bridge, and shot at a few times for good measure because it’s failings need to be taken into account when making this next game if we’re going to avoid the same or worse.

16

People that are introduce to reach as there first halo game might like it more then people like myself that have been playing for years…

Reach really had some good ideas but they did not work out as hoped and Reach at the start was almost unplayable-- just look what MLG has done to make it work for the pros to even want your play …

Three game being broken has nothing to do with age - BROKEN GAME IS BROKEN

THE END .

17

> > > > I hardly see any “older” people complaining about Halo: Reach or Halo 4. From this I believe I know why there is so much hate towards Reach and Halo 4.
> > >
> > > If you are saying that older people like reach, its the opposite. Its the younger gamers FOR THE MOST PART that are the casual ones.
> > > This thread is almost insulting. At least it is a coherent thread, though. Gotta give you that.
> > > MLG gamers? tell me how many people in MLG are kids/teenagers. and they do not like vanilla reach. at ALL.
> > >
> > > Its not about the nostalgia. Its about the core of halo. And its gone in halo reach. I am all for the new and exciting, but i want the core gameplay to still be there.
> > >
> > > and your post is telling competitive players to be casual. which is not what we want to do, which is never what we did, all the way from halo 1 to halo 3, we played because we enjoyed being competitive.
> >
> > The core of Halo is still there, it always has been (except for Halo Wars.) The core of Halo is the way Halo: Combat Evolved mechanics and gameplay worked. Halo 2 evolved it along with the title to follow. Do you really expect Halo 4, 5 and 6 to be EXACTLY like Halo 1, 2 and 3?
>
> read my post very well, didn’t you? the core gameplay is gone with reach, and i can give ONE reason right now out of FOUR:
> everyone does not start out even.

depends on how you define core gameplay.

18

Reach is a tribute to CE while being infested with the worst things introduced in the other Halo games (small draw distance, disappearing weapons and bodies even when you’re looking at them, severe enemy damage, friendly AI drivers, permanently invincible allies, underpowered weapons and grenades, crate climbing) in addition to it’s bad implementations.

If Reach turned out more like CE than H2+H3, then it could have had a chance imo.

19

To be honest I wasn’t that disappointed with Reach.
Sure I was hoping that it would be about Blue team and John, but I got over that and loved the storyline.
AAs were a mixture of hatred (MM) and awe (Campaign & CM) for me, but they fixed them in the TU.
I’m still not a huge fan of AAs and hope we go back to Halo 3 style gameplay with some improvements.
Or just red squares/blue triangles, lol.

I’ve been a true fan since Christmas of 2001. (is almost 20)
Nostalgia is great, and I agree people cling to the familiar, but having new things is great too.
I have no complaints about Halo 4 thus far, except for the possibility of “perks”/AAs returning.

20

The thing I find funny about all the whining is that the average age of a gamer is 35 and has been gaming for 12 years.

Makes me question the maturity of this community lol…

Then again, I don’t think I can consider most of the people in this community gamers.

But I agree with you, nostalgia can be a son of a -Yoink-.