I see why there are no in game rankings

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

So tonight I’m enjoying social slayer in Halo 3 like usual, when we get a match on Valhalla. One guy hogs the sniper the entire game, waiting at the spawn to make sure he gets the ammo. The game ends and he has 4 kills and 0 head shots. I decide to send him a message stating that if he’s going to hog the sniper all game at least do some work with it (he only had 3 assists as well). What is the first thing he says to me? “Get over a 45 and we’ll talk noob”…Really? me and the rank 22 that did better than you aren’t good enough to talk to you? Anyways he continued to trash talk the fact I’m only a 43 even though he clearly has been boosted

Morale of this rant is that this is the first time someone has acted like this to me before, and I sort of understand why in game ranks were taken out of matchmaking. However, although this experience was an unpleasant and annoying one, I do hope that they reverse this decision in the next Halo, as I feel the positives out weigh the negatives.

End of rant :slight_smile:

What’re you’re thoughts?

2

If they can fix the boosting then visible ranks should definitely return. But for those people like who you encountered OP, just ignore him hopefully he’ll get moved down to the correct skill level that he can attain.

They should be visible so people get an idea of what they’re up against. Not that it would be much of a difference in the lobby since they may range from say 43-46 but it gets a general idea.

3

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4

If this is the first time someone has talked to you like this before and you are a level 43 with thousands of games. I don’t see the problem?

5

> If this is the first time someone has talked to you like this before and you are a level 43 with thousands of games. I don’t see the problem?

The issue is that boosters are a really annoying thing and this might of been the OP’s first game but thousands maybe millions have had the issue. I know back in Halo 3 i was sort of like that until i realized rank means nothing. I could beat 50’s without much issue most of the time and rarely where they actually 50’s. I can say for sure that all the 50’s that got mad and we lvl only this guy beat me and he was an -Yoink- about the whole thing.

So i do what i normally do whenever i when someone beats me in vs i sent him a friend request saying I would like to learn from you and yet again he said if your not MLG you’re -Yoink-. I’ve never ran into these guys and Reach and 4. There was one group of people in Reach who where all Inheritors that i ran into a bunch of times but they never trashed talked like what people did in Halo 2 and 3. So the system they were going for worked.

Little to no trash talking.

6

The game has a mature rating and thus people should be able to handle things like
trash talk accordingly. There is a mute and block option for users is there not?

Ranks are a huge part of what made Halo great for so many people.

Another thing to consider. If there was simply a ranked / social playlist much
of that hardcore attitude is left in the ranked playlist.

I don’t see how people think such a big part of the game should be removed
because that cannot deal with words.

Its not like there is none of that in H4 anyways its just now about K/D.
People will always try and cheat and people will always talk S***.

/thread

7

> The game has a mature rating and thus people should be able to handle things like
> trash talk accordingly. There is a mute and block option for users is there not?

Firstly, just because the game is rated mature doesn’t mean the players have to act like immature kids.
Secondly, trash talk is not needed, AT ALL, nor is it “mature”, trash talkers tend to give gamers a bad rep.

I have two videos that outline this.
Toxity Which outlines the harm of trash talking, and the causes, video by Extra Credits.
Harassment Which outlines harassment in general in gaming, another video by Extra Credits.

> Ranks are a huge part of what made Halo great for so many people.

This is true to a degree, but that does not give them the free pass to force ranks on everyone else, and treat them less for their rank not being good.

> I don’t see how people think such a big part of the game should be removed because that cannot deal with words.

Again, it’s not because people can’t deal with words, it’s because the people dishing out the words.

Like most developers, and publishers, 343i/microsoft wants to get as many sells as they can, and guess what, getting a game released that friendly to new players, makes that happen, but trash talk over ranks and game skills tends to turn people away.

> Its not like there is none of that in H4 anyways its just now about K/D. People will always try and cheat and people will always talk S***.

You’re right, those kind of people have been around since Halo 2, and what was added to Halo 2, that Halo CE didn’t have, other than Online MP, since Halo PC/Custom Edition has Online MP. RANKS, ranks are what has enticed these trash talkers into Halo, and what has them staying to trash talk K/D.

Now, tho what OP is slightly correct, the reason he gives isn’t the WHOLE truth, the other half of the truth is in fact the game engine’s limitations for changes post release. There are some aspects of the game that just can not be changed post launch, and adding in game ranks, is one of them.

8

There is a mute and block feature for xbox live is there not?

How can ranks be forced on people with a split social and ranked playlist?
It does seems that people who don’t want ranks want to force the people who do
want them to go without. Hmmmm seems fair.

9

> If they can fix the boosting then visible ranks should definitely return. But for those people like who you encountered OP, just ignore him hopefully he’ll get moved down to the correct skill level that he can attain.
>
> They should be visible so people get an idea of what they’re up against. Not that it would be much of a difference in the lobby since they may range from say 43-46 but it gets a general idea.

If you base Ranks solely off win/loss like often suggested boosting is inevitable. Hence why I always suggest a system that incorporates both individual performance and W/L.

10

> <mark>There is a mute and block feature for xbox live is there not?</mark>
>
> How can ranks be forced on people with a split social and ranked playlist?
> It does seems that people who don’t want ranks want to force the people who do
> want them to go without. Hmmmm seems fair.

So i should just block comms with everyone i meet online because they are all -Yoink- people. Thats basically what you just said and not to mention i don’t think anyone knows right off the bat if some random person they know nothing about is probably the biggest -Yoink- ever.

But you don’t understand the point or ranks is purely for bragging rights. LIke i said before Rank is just as useless as the system we have now what the ranking system should be is Medals.

Players are ranked by the type of medals they mostly get, their rarest medal( by highest number) and their most unique medal (by highest number).

Such as a Heatshot, Perfection, Magic Hands. Not only does this really show the players skill but destroys the illusion of i’m a 32 and you’re a 32 i’m better. IT would also be playlist restricted and not some person who got a killionaire in Grifball bragging about his feats i Team Slayer.

11

Of course you don’t have to block everyone I mean how much time do you really have to endure with them at any given time any way? Interesting you say most of US are -Yoinks!-? I wonder if ranks and bragging rights are really the issue with people like you.

It’s terrible how a few try so hard to keep ranks out of the game screwing over a huge portion of the fan base because you can’t handle competitive game play and a little bit if trash talk.

Why do you want to ruin the game for other people when we can have both ranked and social playlists?

So weak dude.

12

Well if youre having this problem it may be due to you playing social slayer instead of Ranked. Hint Hint ;) dont be a try hard in a social area go prove how good you are in Ranked. Theyre their for a reason. Besides if you take out to much of the freedom and cheating you make a game to strict and may lead to the disaster Halo ranking was. Most people actually want Halo 3 ranking back.

13

> > <mark>There is a mute and block feature for xbox live is there not?</mark>
> >
> > How can ranks be forced on people with a split social and ranked playlist?
> > It does seems that people who don’t want ranks want to force the people who do
> > want them to go without. Hmmmm seems fair.
>
> So i should just block comms with everyone i meet online because they are all Yoink! people. Thats basically what you just said and not to mention i don’t think anyone knows right off the bat if some random person they know nothing about is probably the biggest -Yoink!- ever.
>
> But you don’t understand the point or ranks is purely for bragging rights. LIke i said before Rank is just as useless as the system we have now what the ranking system should be is Medals.
>
> <mark>Players are ranked by the type of medals they mostly get, their rarest medal( by highest number) and their most unique medal (by highest number).</mark>
>
> Such as a Heatshot, Perfection, Magic Hands. Not only does this really show the players skill but destroys the illusion of i’m a 32 and you’re a 32 i’m better. IT would also be playlist restricted and not some person who got a killionaire in Grifball bragging about his feats i Team Slayer.

The the best ranking system at the moment is strictly win/loss.

A medal ranking system? You are implying that the best medals in the game makes the best player, which it does not.

And how is this ranking system gonna work? When good players play against good players there will be no good medals, and when bad players play against bad players there will be no good medals.

14

> LIke i said before Rank is just as useless as the system we have now what the ranking system should be is Medals.
>
> Players are ranked by the type of medals they mostly get, their rarest medal( by highest number) and their most unique medal (by highest number).
>
> Such as a Heatshot, Perfection, Magic Hands. Not only does this really show the players skill but destroys the illusion of i’m a 32 and you’re a 32 i’m better.

Um…what???

I’m sorry, and I don’t mean to be a jerk, but how in Gods name could you think, not only that medals really show a persons skill, but also that it would make a good ranking system?

I mean what if one person grabs rockets and gets an overkill extermination but goes negative overall, and another player on his team doesn’t get any flashy medals but goes positive 10. How can you possibly decide who deserves to rank up off medals in that situation. Going off stats is one thing, but medals???

15

If there is a RANK there will always be some way to BOOST. Why don’t people just play the darn game the way it was meant to be played?

16

-Negative atmosphere (like your example)

-Boosting

-Buying accounts

-The fabled “rank locking”

Those were all real reasons 343 said for the removal of the former rank based system. Personally i enjoy CSR and the way it functions. Put it in the next game and make it visible and i think people would be pleased.

17

i dont see why people hate people that boost as they dont unlock anything that has an advantage over you and its there loose missing out the experience of properly earning there rank.

18

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19

> -Negative atmosphere (like your example)
>
> -Boosting
>
> -Buying accounts
>
> -The fabled “rank locking”
>
> Those were all real reasons 343 said for the removal of the former rank based system. Personally i enjoy CSR and the way it functions. Put it in the next game and make it visible and i think people would be pleased.

-<mark>Boosting</mark> = Happened in Reach normal MM / also happened in Halo 4 before CSR even came out

-<mark>Buying Accounts</mark> = Happened in Reach also in the first few months of Halo 4 a account sold for $400 NO CSR / people will always what what they cant have / Ranks / xp / kd / W/L % / Gamerscore / Friends List - almost anything can make an accout worth money

-<mark>The fabled “rank locking”</mark> = Was not a real thing / people just didn’t like the number they were given (you had to win a good number of games )

20

> Moral of this rant is that this is the first time someone has acted like this to me before, and I sort of understand why in game ranks were taken out of matchmaking. However, although this experience was an unpleasant and annoying one, I do hope that they reverse this decision in the next Halo, as I feel the positives out weigh the negatives.

You’ve more or less hit upon the point of why video game ranking systems are terrible. You look at a given player, you see what he does in game. Given that you are human you can evaluate the worth of his behavior and come up with a cursory judgement about how good he is which might allow you to guess how well he’ll do in other situations. But a computer can’t do that, it can only track a player’s statistics without the ability to put those into a predictive framework that can be used in some other context (ie. a different match than one the player has already been in.) So the number it gives out is non-representative to quality, its merely a summarized statement of what you have played (particular matches against particular people leading you to advance so far within a simple numerical system.)

HOWEVER, because the system is branded as rank some foolish people take it as being anything but limited. They see each other in terms of 50’s, their games as means to further progression. In short, they have a very distorted view of the significance of their games because they are using a faulty system as a standard of comparison. Thus you have a few of those poor fools going so far as to judge the worth of other humans according to their lifetime score in a video game. Had George Orwell foreseen Xbox Live you can be sure it would have put this somewhere into 1984…

Anyway its better to shortcut this nonsense simply by cutting out the pretense of a ranking system. It won’t ever work, and thus shouldn’t even be attempted for it can only mislead people.