I have a question to ask?

Why is 343i nerfing Active Camo to the ground. I admire the AL nerf, but why Active Camo. Don’t you think it is bad enough with the radar jammer and the slight visibility whenever you move. I mean seriously, it drains fast enough as it is whenever you take a stride in Hemmorhage.

Leave your thoughts on this.

They are nerfing it to reduce the over-effectiveness of camo-sniping at range.

Camo should never have been an Armour Ability anyway?

It’s a ridiculous asset to have, it needs more serious penalties than just the jammer.

> Camo should never have been an Armour Ability anyway?
>
> It’s a ridiculous asset to have, it needs more serious penalties than just the jammer.

Someone give this guy a cookie! I personally think camo should stick to being a pickup.

I think they should’ve nerfed AC like AL.

Make full invis for movement maybe but, shooting lowers your AC completely.

> Camo should never have been an Armour Ability anyway?
>
> It’s a ridiculous asset to have, it needs more serious penalties than just the jammer.

Just the jammer?

You move, it significantly decreases your use and you become more visible.

The sound deafens so you can’t hear people sneaking up on YOU.

I’ve listed a bunch of other Pro’s AND Con’s for every ability that people love to overlook. Learn to adapt people. That’s the point of playing. This is just the start to where if people don’t like certain things, all they have to do is complain in bulk and THEY get their way not counting the people who have adapted and now have to change their style up to meet your lack of adaptation.

You can take that as an insult but it’s true. The game was made, you had time with the Beta for these complaints and now a year later, let’s just put training wheels on everything.

Just my thought and I will adapt as the TU comes along but I still consider this a sad turn of events. I’m not saying most things in game aren’t annoying but it really comes down to how the player uses the abilities. Few bad apples abuse takes a toll on everyone.

> > Camo should never have been an Armour Ability anyway?
> >
> > It’s a ridiculous asset to have, it needs more serious penalties than just the jammer.
>
> Just the jammer?
>
> You move, it significantly decreases your use and you become more visible.
>
> The sound deafens so you can’t hear people sneaking up on YOU.
>
> I’ve listed a bunch of other Pro’s AND Con’s for every ability that people love to overlook. Learn to adapt people. That’s the point of playing. This is just the start to where if people don’t like certain things, all they have to do is complain in bulk and THEY get their way not counting the people who have adapted and now have to change their style up to meet your lack of adaptation.
>
> You can take that as an insult but it’s true. The game was made, you had time with the Beta for these complaints and now a year later, let’s just put training wheels on everything.
>
> Just my thought and I will adapt as the TU comes along but I still consider this a sad turn of events. I’m not saying most things in game aren’t annoying but it really comes down to how the player uses the abilities. Few bad apples abuse takes a toll on everyone.

The adapt argument is highly flawed. It’s effectivly suggesting that the developers should do what the hell they want and we should just accept it. I can adapt to armourlock. It just makes the game boring as hell. I can adapt to bloom (to a point, though you can’t actually adapt to a random game mechanic), it’s just boring as hell. I can adapt to the reducd movement speed, it just makes the game as boring as hell.

Seriously not being a jerk but it sucks to be you then. I’m not saying everything will work out fine and if not, there’s still always another way if you look for it.

Not exactly whatever the hell they want but whose game is it? Ours or theirs? Granted they take feedback and ideas but that’s nothing set in stone. They started by making Halo CEA which none of us had any word for or about and we all loved it. The game was eventually going to evolve, that’s how just about everything goes whether it’s a small tweak to a drastic 180 turn. I’m just one to say stick to your guns and (as much as I hate the quoter) don’t change horses midstream which is what’s happening. But like I said, “I” will adapt. I was very miffed upon hearing the info but I can’t fight it so I won’t.

Someone argued with me that the feedback and people who wanted this should get their way. Hypothetically, What if it went 180 from there? What if people like me wrote enough and got enough support to keep things as they are, nerf-wise. Doing exactly the same thing that the “Nerfers” did, we would be looked at as the babies.

I’ve found many ways to counter abilities and annoyances with little to no boredom involved. It’s a game and I just want to have fun. Nitpicking it to death will ruin it.

It’s another thing I love to bring up - You’ll never know what a Dev goes through until YOU decide to put the time, effort and money into creating a game only to have it scrutinized, picked apart and criticized by any future versions of ourselves.

It’s their baby, let them raise it. Not us.

But again, this is just my opinion. I learn to adapt to things b/c that’s mainly how I was taught.

> > > Camo should never have been an Armour Ability anyway?
> > >
> > > It’s a ridiculous asset to have, it needs more serious penalties than just the jammer.
> >
> > Just the jammer?
> >
> > You move, it significantly decreases your use and you become more visible.
> >
> > The sound deafens so you can’t hear people sneaking up on YOU.
> >
> > I’ve listed a bunch of other Pro’s AND Con’s for every ability that people love to overlook. Learn to adapt people. That’s the point of playing. This is just the start to where if people don’t like certain things, all they have to do is complain in bulk and THEY get their way not counting the people who have adapted and now have to change their style up to meet your lack of adaptation.
> >
> > You can take that as an insult but it’s true. The game was made, you had time with the Beta for these complaints and now a year later, let’s just put training wheels on everything.
> >
> > Just my thought and I will adapt as the TU comes along but I still consider this a sad turn of events. I’m not saying most things in game aren’t annoying but it really comes down to how the player uses the abilities. Few bad apples abuse takes a toll on everyone.
>
> The adapt argument is highly flawed. It’s effectivly suggesting that the developers should do what the hell they want and we should just accept it. I can adapt to armourlock. It just makes the game boring as hell. I can adapt to bloom (to a point, though you can’t actually adapt to a random game mechanic), it’s just boring as hell. I can adapt to the reducd movement speed, it just makes the game as boring as hell.

Of course the developers should do what they want. They are the ones making the game. Not me or you. Whether you or I like it is completely different. But, I’m really getting sick of this whole entitlement thing here. People seem to think that developers, or creative artists in general, should bend to their every whim. I remember days when a game would release, and that would be that. Glitches, bugs, broken games. All of that. Everyone should be thankful we are even getting a TU. 343 could easily say ‘screw it’, and focus only on Halo 4.

> > > > Camo should never have been an Armour Ability anyway?
> > > >
> > > > It’s a ridiculous asset to have, it needs more serious penalties than just the jammer.
> > >
> > > Just the jammer?
> > >
> > > You move, it significantly decreases your use and you become more visible.
> > >
> > > The sound deafens so you can’t hear people sneaking up on YOU.
> > >
> > > I’ve listed a bunch of other Pro’s AND Con’s for every ability that people love to overlook. Learn to adapt people. That’s the point of playing. This is just the start to where if people don’t like certain things, all they have to do is complain in bulk and THEY get their way not counting the people who have adapted and now have to change their style up to meet your lack of adaptation.
> > >
> > > You can take that as an insult but it’s true. The game was made, you had time with the Beta for these complaints and now a year later, let’s just put training wheels on everything.
> > >
> > > Just my thought and I will adapt as the TU comes along but I still consider this a sad turn of events. I’m not saying most things in game aren’t annoying but it really comes down to how the player uses the abilities. Few bad apples abuse takes a toll on everyone.
> >
> > The adapt argument is highly flawed. It’s effectivly suggesting that the developers should do what the hell they want and we should just accept it. I can adapt to armourlock. It just makes the game boring as hell. I can adapt to bloom (to a point, though you can’t actually adapt to a random game mechanic), it’s just boring as hell. I can adapt to the reducd movement speed, it just makes the game as boring as hell.
>
> Of course the developers should do what they want. They are the ones making the game. Not me or you. Whether you or I like it is completely different. But, I’m really getting sick of this whole entitlement thing here. People seem to think that developers, or creative artists in general, should bend to their every whim. I remember days when a game would release, and that would be that. Glitches, bugs, broken games. All of that. Everyone should be thankful we are even getting a TU. 343 could easily say ‘screw it’, and focus only on Halo 4.

You just completly missed the entire point of my argument and focussed on one sentence and then chose to interpret it in the complete wrong way. Yes they are making the game, however if a game is boring and repetetive people just won’t bother playing it. And your talking about remembering older games which lacked the technology to improve after release? Really? Community feedback is a good thing. It gives developers an edge as they know what people want in future games. And where did you get the impression that people are not thankfull for the TU? How in any way is somebody saying the adapt argument is flawed suggest they are not thankfull? What does that even have to do with anything?

It seems to me that people have forgotten why there are forums to begin with. Is it so we can socialize? Sure. To meet new players? Sure. However it is mostly for feedback. Yes, the devs can do what they want, but from a business view that’s a bad move. We are consumers, we consume. We are consuming this product. 343 wants to know what we think about the game, good or bad so that way the NEXT product will be better and the consumer will gain satisfaction from yet another golden title. It’s called repeat customer business, and you don’t get it if you don’t cater to the customer.

However, this does NOT mean that they should bend to our every whim. After all this is still an art, expression of a designer (or group of designers). They do not depend on us for a good story line or amazing graphical advice. They depend on us to tell them how we have fun with their product, and if it is actually fun.

And OUR input is the most valuable not because I am Narcissistic, but you must understand that at this point we have invested YEARS of man hours in this game. They do not have the time to go through this game and find all of the tiny bugs or nuances that could potentially break the experience.

If this can be considered a work of “Art” or entertainment, then anyone who dares call themselves an artist knows it is plagued by two things:

  1. Perfection with their creation (It needs to be the best without blemish)
  2. Constant dissatisfaction with their creation (because perfection is technically impossible)

> It seems to me that people have forgotten why there are forums to begin with. Is it so we can socialize? Sure. To meet new players? Sure. However it is mostly for feedback. Yes, the devs can do what they want, but from a business view that’s a bad move. We are consumers, we consume. We are consuming this product. 343 wants to know what we think about the game, good or bad so that way the NEXT product will be better and the consumer will gain satisfaction from yet another golden title. It’s called repeat customer business, and you don’t get it if you don’t cater to the customer.
>
> However, this does NOT mean that they should bend to our every whim. After all this is still an art, expression of a designer (or group of designers). They do not depend on us for a good story line or amazing graphical advice. They depend on us to tell them how we have fun with their product, and if it is actually fun.
>
> And OUR input is the most valuable not because I am Narcissistic, but you must understand that at this point we have invested YEARS of man hours in this game. They do not have the time to go through this game and find all of the tiny bugs or nuances that could potentially break the experience.
>
> If this can be considered a work of “Art” or entertainment, then anyone who dares call themselves an artist knows it is plagued by two things:
> 1) Perfection with their creation (It needs to be the best without blemish)
> 2) Constant dissatisfaction with their creation (because perfection is technically impossible)

THANK YOU!

AL got what was coming to it and 343i wisely chose to modify AC to have less time.

It’s ridiculous people running around half invisible 90% of the time … it shouldn’t’ve been an AA in the 1st place just like AL but if it is gonna be then it needs to be restricted to limited use…

> > Camo should never have been an Armour Ability anyway?
> >
> > It’s a ridiculous asset to have, it needs more serious penalties than just the jammer.
>
> Just the jammer?
>
> You move, it significantly decreases your use and you become more visible.
>
> The sound deafens so you can’t hear people sneaking up on YOU.
>
> I’ve listed a bunch of other Pro’s AND Con’s for every ability that people love to overlook.

I’m sorry, let me go back for a second.

  1. The jammer is the most annoying con, because Camo is an offensive ability and it reduces your ability to locate and eliminate someone.

  2. You get exactly how much time in Camo? Losing some of that time is by no means crippling whatsoever. I am not sure whether you lose any effectiveness when you move, but I doubt it’s a lot. Someone else will have to clarify this for me though, I can’t say for certain.

  3. You can’t hear people, which is crippling because… They will definitely be sneaking up on your invisible self? You might have to look around rather than listening?

Camo is a ridiculous ability. Armour Lock is annoying and out of place, but Camo is insane.

> > > Camo should never have been an Armour Ability anyway?
> > >
> > > It’s a ridiculous asset to have, it needs more serious penalties than just the jammer.
> >
> > Just the jammer?
> >
> > You move, it significantly decreases your use and you become more visible.
> >
> > The sound deafens so you can’t hear people sneaking up on YOU.
> >
> > I’ve listed a bunch of other Pro’s AND Con’s for every ability that people love to overlook.
>
> I’m sorry, let me go back for a second.
>
> 1) The jammer is the most annoying con, because Camo is an offensive ability and it reduces your ability to locate and eliminate someone.
>
> 2) You get exactly how much time in Camo? Losing some of that time is by no means crippling whatsoever. I am not sure whether you lose any effectiveness when you move, but I doubt it’s a lot. Someone else will have to clarify this for me though, I can’t say for certain.
>
> 3) You can’t hear people, which is crippling because… They will definitely be sneaking up on your invisible self? You might have to look around rather than listening?
>
> Camo is a ridiculous ability. Armour Lock is annoying and out of place, but Camo is insane.

Regardless of if you like Camo as an AA, you can probably agree that nerfing the time will not be disagreeable. If you believe that it is not enough then look at it like this.
Standing still, a player can be in Camo for up to 1 minute. Ok, so they nerf the time by 25%, or 15 seconds.
Now you can only use it for 45 seconds.
If you are moving (the whole time) that knocks off another 33% (15 seconds) so your total time goes down to 30 seconds max.
This idea effectively kills camping in the long term sense.