I don't need the game to tell me I underperformed

I don’t mind the idea of showing expected kills and deaths but the terminology is very important.

People don’t want to be told they underperformed (quite rightly, we play for fun not to be insulted by the game).
It should have just been a small note where ‘underperformed’ is that says ‘expected’ followed by the relevant number. It’s the same info but it’s a nicer method of delivery, and some extra info on home much you beat or missed your expected number.

Another thought based on some of the numbers people have posted. Is it possible that they screwed up and ‘underperforming’ on deaths is actually supposed to be good? i.e. You went under the number of expected deaths.

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I’m fine with this change

It doesn’t make any sense. Just had a game with 16-4-5 kda but I was “underperforming” in deaths while being the one with the least deaths by far. Next one had nine deaths.

Isn’t that what the up/down arrows on the kills/deaths have always been?

I haven’t played yet so I’m not sure what it looks like.

Remember the comeback kill medals?

I’m already frustrated enough coming out of a tough game. Playing with medical issues that cause stress to hurt more is something I have to do carefully, so having the game tell me “hey you sucked more than I think you should have” just makes me want to quit and feel bad about it the rest of the day, not try to push myself more.

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To make you feel better you probably can’t do worse than me :wink:

Feels like something that could be useful for some people that want it in ranked or something. Don’t see the need for it in casual games.

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Just to pat myself on the back here.

Seems they really did screw it up. ‘Underperforming’ on deaths is a good thing.

https://www.reddit.com/r/halo/comments/11laja1/underperformed_makes_it_seem_like_you_did_poorly/

That’s hilarious they use “underperformed” as a label whenever you have the stat lower than expected and they forgot that that’s a good thing with deaths.

It one of those mistakes that should be surprising but sadly isn’t.

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Good to know the game is putting me in matches where it expects me to get rocked, all of mine were on games where I had one or two more deaths than kills so I didn’t think anything was up. :rofl:

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Yep. I just went 10 and 10.

“Over performed” for kills. Waypoint says I should have gotten 8.

So that works.

“Under performed” for deaths. Waypoint says I should have had 11. So I actually got one less than expected.

So they have definitely stuffed it up.

I’ll take a look. Thanks.

And I hope I didn’t come off as too aggressive. All I really mean is that your average player probably isn’t going to know what the game means when it says, you under performed in kills, etc.

So to get smoked in a game and have it tell you, “Hey, you were kinda trash that time around” has got to leave a bad taste for some. Personally, I don’t care. It’s more funny than anything. It just seems like an odd thing to add I guess.

Hmm, two thoughts come to mind…

One, the wording “underperformed” is questionable. That’s inevitably going to have a very negative connotation. Telling a player point blank they played badly. It’s a good bet it’s going to lead to player frustration. Well, for many people. A better wording would be something like above or below expected. One would think professional game developers would consider this type of stuff…

Two, I don’t see the value for players from telling them they did better or worse than expected. What exactly is the takeaway? It’s too generalized. Regardless of whether performance was above or below expected making better decisions and pressing buttons more better applies universally.

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It’s just poor communication by 343.

Again.

And to be honest - I can’t say it pans out exactly as I describe. There is just too much margin of error with the rounding up and down of the expected kills and deaths. Plus or minus 0.5 for each value.

And I don’t know over how many games they track your KPM and DPM.

There could very well be other weightings applied.

But it is clear that they definitely have different and consistent values for each game mode (which implies that they have also have different MMR for each mode). And those KPM and DPM match very closely with the expected kills and deaths on Waypoint.

Agree wholeheartedly.

Even just having a number, eg +1, or -2 would have sufficed.

And at the moment players feel it’s their performance relative to the team. When it’s not. It’s their performance relative to their own game history.

I was hoping when expected kills and deaths appeared on waypoint last season that it was a gateway for 343 to normalise the concepts of KPM and DPM.

They are very good performance stats. Far better than KD or KDA. And they are the only personal metrics used by TrueSkill.

But just telling players they “under performed” with no context is at best not helpful. At worst, as you suggest, negative.

The plus or minus performance should link naturally with KPM and DPM appearing in the more detailed stats.

And on waypoint we should be able to see our KPM and DPM for each game mode - and graphed vs opponent skill.

Then, it finally becomes a useful tool for the player.

Toggle option for us to choose maybe if we want it on or not?

Its 1th all over again. How did this get past QC? It’s a little thing, but still…

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As an example. My Season 2 KPM for KOTH was 1.55.

My last recorded game of KOTH went for 14m 57s (epic).

If you multiply 1.55 KPM by 14.95 minutes you get 23.2 kills.

And lo and behold, my expected kills for that game was 23. And just in case you were wondering I actually got 30 in that game :slight_smile:

A little bit before that I played a game of Oddball that went for 16 minutes exactly. If it was KOTH I would be expected to get 1.55 * 16.0 = 24.8 kills. But my expected kills was only 22 - which fits with my KPM for Oddball; 1.37 * 16.0 = 21.9

So it seems to fit pretty well.