I don't like the way 343 snubs Halo Community

Games Other Halo
88

> > > Well, when they get replies like this, I can’t say i blame them for not posting more or being more forthcoming.
> >
> > With all honesty, why would anyone reply to a serious question with, “I don’t know why” when people are already upset?
> >
> > That’s just asking for trouble.
>
> Um… lets see, maybe because “I don’t know why” was the correct reply to be given by someone who isn’t a part of that decision making? That’s kind of like asking the Janitor of a Microsoft factory why the guys in charge of designing Windows thought it was a good idea to do away with the old Start menu and not leave an option to opt for the older versions of the start menu.
> There are very few forum staff who even work in the same building as the design team, so few, I bet you can count them on one hand.

So, this is all a result of a problem in communication. That doesn’t make the situation any better. If the company isn’t working together then how can they make a game together?

89

that is why we need to all

Stop

Collaborate

and

Listen

90

Reach’s Division system worked far better as an indicator of skill than 3’s 1-50 did.

I think there should be a CSR system. But it should dynamically compare you to everyone else rather than being a static variable that only changes if you play. Have it take some kind of average score ranking between all your games in the last month or so, and compare it to everyone else’s ranking so that you’re actually being ranked against your other players rather than some arbitrary value.

that means a) having a high rank actually means something in regards to other players, and b) kills boosting and selling accounts because there’s no way to maintain a rank without working for it.

91

>

Halo does not belong to you.

Suggest away. It is healthy. But what is not healthy is this idiotic idea that 343i needs to listen to you, and your fictional 95%.

[/quote]
Be careful of the word “US”. Last time I checked HALO was made for “US”. It’s not made for the employees of MS or 343i for their personal is it? If it was it wouldn’t be placed on the shelves in a store.

It’s made for “US” the Customer. This is no different than waiting in line at any box store for customer service to return an item that “WE” or (US) are dissatisfied with. Does 343i have a line for “US” to stand in?. Is there a phone number to call?. Best place to complain? right here on this forum. Because maybe others agree with the OP.

As for the 95%? Highly doubtful

Every person has a right to complain about a product they are not happy with.

And YES 343i should listen to every complaint.

So your complaint about being IDIOTIC is uncalled for.

[/quote]
Halo is made for US - Agreed. It is also made for make money. It is also an artistic work.

Halo belongs to US - No, it does not.

I suggest that you reread all of my posts on this thread. There is nothing wrong with complaining.

It is just highly naive to think that every complaint is going to be addressed to the satisfaction of every complainer.

That is a standard expectation of every consumer product. However, somehow the expectation is that 343i should do our bidding and make the game that every individual that purchased the game wants…

I am not saying that all complaint follow this reasoning. But the OP is talking about a collective of complaints being snubbed…

Do you agree that there is a point where 343i should maintain their artistic and creative vision? Because it seems to me that if you try to make Halo everything or everyone, we are going to be left with a mess.

You are right, the us of the pronoun We is problematic…

92

> > > I don’t want a visible Rank because it promotes Boosters and people measuring their E--Yoink!-… it was very annoying in the H2, and H3 days… CE didn’t have that problem people just played CE for fun, and I like that.
> >
> > then play social, problem solved
>
> You would think it would be that simple but nooo.

Kinda hard for them to do so when the population is lacking people needed for a rank and social system to exist.

Not enough players in both would be bad for everyone. They might as well keep it in one setting instead of possibly create scenarios that happened in Reach where players fight players that they shouldn’t be playing against.

93

> > > > > > ^
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I never said they never listen or that they don’t make changes, but when they get a suggestion that they don’t agree with, they snub it.
> > > > >
> > > > > Halo does not belong to you.
> > > > >
> > > > > The sooner you understand that, the quicker you can get away from this utterly silly statement that you wrote.
> > > > >
> > > > > So when 343i, who are in charge of the IP, get a suggestion from you, who does not own the IP, they are compelled to do as you wish?
> > > > >
> > > > > So that means that other people can tell you what to do, and you have no right to snub those suggestions?
> > > >
> > > > This comment you made above is beyond dumb - let’s spell it out for you. When a companies sales, which is based on customer satisfaction, is not satisfying the customers…and 95% of those customers want something that can easily be added to the game to improve the quality…and 343 ignores it, then yes people have the right to complain. I cna’t help but think that people with logic such as yourself are the ones that made such idiotic changes to halo in what is called HALO 4.
> > >
> > > So are you saying that Halo belongs to you?
> > >
> > > Because nothing that you have wrote, as true as it may be, counters the truth that I wrote.
> > >
> > > What is beyond dumb is making up number like 95% buyer dissatisfaction to feebly bolster your opinion.
> > >
> > > Whether you believe that you are a better game designer than 343i, or that your golden suggestions will make Halo 4 better, is utterly and completely immaterial.
> > >
> > > Why?
> > >
> > > Because Halo does not belong to you. And that is a massive problem for chimps like you. You don’t get it still… You still feel that somehow you own a piece of Halo.
> > >
> > > Halo may very well die. It is MS’s and 343i to kill though.
> > >
> > > Suggest away. It is healthy. But what is not healthy is this idiotic idea that 343i needs to listen to you, and your fictional 95%.
> >
> > All your points so far are fueled my things made up in your own head. When someone stats that during their research they’ve seen that between 90-95% want to have visual ratings shown in game, then you must assume that is a fact based on their studies. Now if you have proof to disprove that claim, then go right on ahead. At this point, I’ve seen the same thing. For every 10-20 people I encounter, 1-2 people say that visual ratings would ruin the game.
> >
> > Now you can sit there like a fool and repeat things like “it’s not your game” and “you’re not he designer” but in the end that’s just a pointless thing to mention as it serves no purpose whatsoever.
> >
> > In a very simple form for you to understand…Halo is a product intended to satisfy the customers. When customers are not satisfied, then they express their angst in order to have something change about it. This is the point where the company that made the product makes changes in order to satisfy the customer.
> >
> > For some reason you’re getting this twisted view that people feel like they have the right to the changes opossed to people “expecting the changes”. Halo is a great franchise and fans expect the new game makers to make appropriate changes to the game to better the product. That’s sort of how online games like Halo and COD work…
> >
> > Again, you sit there and make ignorant posts and silly comments all you want…but I guess you’re where that 5%-105 comes from.
>
> You’re talking out of your -Yoink!-, and making up numbers once more. 95 out of a 100 players wanting CSR is a myth. Repeating it over, and saying someone’s uncle did research to get that number is a myth. You truly have no clue how research operates because the onus is one those bandying the numbers to prove their research with hard numbers.
>
> MS pays millions to professionals to do proper research. 343i do not need to listen to clown like yourself that arbitrarily assign numbers to suit their purposes. Another case in point is this 5-10% category that are you so intend to put me into! :slight_smile: This forum is not a proper sampling. Those that are happy with the game are playing. This is what 343i understands. Those that threaten to quit and write Dear John letters are the ones creating new threads on the same subjects over and over again.
>
> You are right: MS needs to listen to the majority of the Halo players if they are to sell more copies of future titles. People caring about CSR may or may not constitute any number that MS needs to care about.
>
> Leave the numbers to the pros please.

You’re questioning the validity of a study that you have zero knowledge of and how it was conducted…interesting. Do you know anything about sample sizes? Do you know anything about proabilities based on the sample sizes? Do you know anything about statistics that would lead you to be able and disprove the claim that 90-95% people either would want CSRing’s back or do not mind if they come back?

You don’t even have the numbers to even be a judge. The only myth here is the notion that you know what you’re talking about…and the fact is…you yourself don’t know whether the 90-95% figure is accurate because you have not conducted a study. Furthermore, you have not actually disproved anything but rather proved your ignorance.

I’m done with you now. Thanks for posting.

94

> > > > > > > ^
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I never said they never listen or that they don’t make changes, but when they get a suggestion that they don’t agree with, they snub it.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Halo does not belong to you.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The sooner you understand that, the quicker you can get away from this utterly silly statement that you wrote.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So when 343i, who are in charge of the IP, get a suggestion from you, who does not own the IP, they are compelled to do as you wish?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So that means that other people can tell you what to do, and you have no right to snub those suggestions?
> > > > >
> > > > > This comment you made above is beyond dumb - let’s spell it out for you. When a companies sales, which is based on customer satisfaction, is not satisfying the customers…and 95% of those customers want something that can easily be added to the game to improve the quality…and 343 ignores it, then yes people have the right to complain. I cna’t help but think that people with logic such as yourself are the ones that made such idiotic changes to halo in what is called HALO 4.
> > > >
> > > > So are you saying that Halo belongs to you?
> > > >
> > > > Because nothing that you have wrote, as true as it may be, counters the truth that I wrote.
> > > >
> > > > What is beyond dumb is making up number like 95% buyer dissatisfaction to feebly bolster your opinion.
> > > >
> > > > Whether you believe that you are a better game designer than 343i, or that your golden suggestions will make Halo 4 better, is utterly and completely immaterial.
> > > >
> > > > Why?
> > > >
> > > > Because Halo does not belong to you. And that is a massive problem for chimps like you. You don’t get it still… You still feel that somehow you own a piece of Halo.
> > > >
> > > > Halo may very well die. It is MS’s and 343i to kill though.
> > > >
> > > > Suggest away. It is healthy. But what is not healthy is this idiotic idea that 343i needs to listen to you, and your fictional 95%.
> > >
> > > All your points so far are fueled my things made up in your own head. When someone stats that during their research they’ve seen that between 90-95% want to have visual ratings shown in game, then you must assume that is a fact based on their studies. Now if you have proof to disprove that claim, then go right on ahead. At this point, I’ve seen the same thing. For every 10-20 people I encounter, 1-2 people say that visual ratings would ruin the game.
> > >
> > > Now you can sit there like a fool and repeat things like “it’s not your game” and “you’re not he designer” but in the end that’s just a pointless thing to mention as it serves no purpose whatsoever.
> > >
> > > In a very simple form for you to understand…Halo is a product intended to satisfy the customers. When customers are not satisfied, then they express their angst in order to have something change about it. This is the point where the company that made the product makes changes in order to satisfy the customer.
> > >
> > > For some reason you’re getting this twisted view that people feel like they have the right to the changes opossed to people “expecting the changes”. Halo is a great franchise and fans expect the new game makers to make appropriate changes to the game to better the product. That’s sort of how online games like Halo and COD work…
> > >
> > > Again, you sit there and make ignorant posts and silly comments all you want…but I guess you’re where that 5%-105 comes from.
> >
> > You’re talking out of your -Yoink!-, and making up numbers once more. 95 out of a 100 players wanting CSR is a myth. Repeating it over, and saying someone’s uncle did research to get that number is a myth. You truly have no clue how research operates because the onus is one those bandying the numbers to prove their research with hard numbers.
> >
> > MS pays millions to professionals to do proper research. 343i do not need to listen to clown like yourself that arbitrarily assign numbers to suit their purposes. Another case in point is this 5-10% category that are you so intend to put me into! :slight_smile: This forum is not a proper sampling. Those that are happy with the game are playing. This is what 343i understands. Those that threaten to quit and write Dear John letters are the ones creating new threads on the same subjects over and over again.
> >
> > You are right: MS needs to listen to the majority of the Halo players if they are to sell more copies of future titles. People caring about CSR may or may not constitute any number that MS needs to care about.
> >
> > Leave the numbers to the pros please.
>
> You’re questioning the validity of a study that you have zero knowledge of and how it was conducted…interesting. Do you know anything about sample sizes? Do you know anything about proabilities based on the sample sizes? Do you know anything about statistics that would lead you to be able and disprove the claim that 90-95% people either would want CSRing’s back or do not mind if they come back?
>
> You don’t even have the numbers to even be a judge. The only myth here is the notion that you know what you’re talking about…and the fact is…you yourself don’t know whether the 90-95% figure is accurate because you have not conducted a study. Furthermore, you have not actually disproved anything but rather proved your ignorance.
>
> I’m done with you now. Thanks for posting.

Show me the pdf then? Share the knowledge then. Instead of the rhetorical questions and the feeble strawman arguments, share this data that you hold sacrosanct :slight_smile:

I am arguing that MS and 343i have better analytics and pools of data than your mythic study, that you don’t want to share, but want me to believe in.

I am arguing that if the data is clear and this 95% number is true, then it would be a no-brainer for MS to implement the changes.

But things are not happening the way that you and the alleged 95%ers want.

So, something is amiss…

Once again, please direct me to the study.

I will fight for in-game visual CSR tooth and nail if you can show me a scientific study that can bear academic scrutiny. I say that an individual who is a teacher and holds a Grad degree, perhaps like yourself :slight_smile:

95

> The reason I write 95% is because whenever I see polls for ranking systems, around 90-95% are in favour of the ranking system.

Is this is your study?

96

> > > > > > > > ^
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I never said they never listen or that they don’t make changes, but when they get a suggestion that they don’t agree with, they snub it.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Halo does not belong to you.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The sooner you understand that, the quicker you can get away from this utterly silly statement that you wrote.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > So when 343i, who are in charge of the IP, get a suggestion from you, who does not own the IP, they are compelled to do as you wish?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > So that means that other people can tell you what to do, and you have no right to snub those suggestions?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > This comment you made above is beyond dumb - let’s spell it out for you. When a companies sales, which is based on customer satisfaction, is not satisfying the customers…and 95% of those customers want something that can easily be added to the game to improve the quality…and 343 ignores it, then yes people have the right to complain. I cna’t help but think that people with logic such as yourself are the ones that made such idiotic changes to halo in what is called HALO 4.
> > > > >
> > > > > So are you saying that Halo belongs to you?
> > > > >
> > > > > Because nothing that you have wrote, as true as it may be, counters the truth that I wrote.
> > > > >
> > > > > What is beyond dumb is making up number like 95% buyer dissatisfaction to feebly bolster your opinion.
> > > > >
> > > > > Whether you believe that you are a better game designer than 343i, or that your golden suggestions will make Halo 4 better, is utterly and completely immaterial.
> > > > >
> > > > > Why?
> > > > >
> > > > > Because Halo does not belong to you. And that is a massive problem for chimps like you. You don’t get it still… You still feel that somehow you own a piece of Halo.
> > > > >
> > > > > Halo may very well die. It is MS’s and 343i to kill though.
> > > > >
> > > > > Suggest away. It is healthy. But what is not healthy is this idiotic idea that 343i needs to listen to you, and your fictional 95%.
> > > >
> > > > All your points so far are fueled my things made up in your own head. When someone stats that during their research they’ve seen that between 90-95% want to have visual ratings shown in game, then you must assume that is a fact based on their studies. Now if you have proof to disprove that claim, then go right on ahead. At this point, I’ve seen the same thing. For every 10-20 people I encounter, 1-2 people say that visual ratings would ruin the game.
> > > >
> > > > Now you can sit there like a fool and repeat things like “it’s not your game” and “you’re not he designer” but in the end that’s just a pointless thing to mention as it serves no purpose whatsoever.
> > > >
> > > > In a very simple form for you to understand…Halo is a product intended to satisfy the customers. When customers are not satisfied, then they express their angst in order to have something change about it. This is the point where the company that made the product makes changes in order to satisfy the customer.
> > > >
> > > > For some reason you’re getting this twisted view that people feel like they have the right to the changes opossed to people “expecting the changes”. Halo is a great franchise and fans expect the new game makers to make appropriate changes to the game to better the product. That’s sort of how online games like Halo and COD work…
> > > >
> > > > Again, you sit there and make ignorant posts and silly comments all you want…but I guess you’re where that 5%-105 comes from.
> > >
> > > You’re talking out of your -Yoink!-, and making up numbers once more. 95 out of a 100 players wanting CSR is a myth. Repeating it over, and saying someone’s uncle did research to get that number is a myth. You truly have no clue how research operates because the onus is one those bandying the numbers to prove their research with hard numbers.
> > >
> > > MS pays millions to professionals to do proper research. 343i do not need to listen to clown like yourself that arbitrarily assign numbers to suit their purposes. Another case in point is this 5-10% category that are you so intend to put me into! :slight_smile: This forum is not a proper sampling. Those that are happy with the game are playing. This is what 343i understands. Those that threaten to quit and write Dear John letters are the ones creating new threads on the same subjects over and over again.
> > >
> > > You are right: MS needs to listen to the majority of the Halo players if they are to sell more copies of future titles. People caring about CSR may or may not constitute any number that MS needs to care about.
> > >
> > > Leave the numbers to the pros please.
> >
> > You’re questioning the validity of a study that you have zero knowledge of and how it was conducted…interesting. Do you know anything about sample sizes? Do you know anything about proabilities based on the sample sizes? Do you know anything about statistics that would lead you to be able and disprove the claim that 90-95% people either would want CSRing’s back or do not mind if they come back?
> >
> > You don’t even have the numbers to even be a judge. The only myth here is the notion that you know what you’re talking about…and the fact is…you yourself don’t know whether the 90-95% figure is accurate because you have not conducted a study. Furthermore, you have not actually disproved anything but rather proved your ignorance.
> >
> > I’m done with you now. Thanks for posting.
>
> Show me the pdf then? Share the knowledge then. Instead of the rhetorical questions and the feeble strawman arguments, share this data that you hold sacrosanct :slight_smile:
>
> I am arguing that MS and 343i have better analytics and pools of data than your mythic study, that you don’t want to share, but want me to believe in.
>
> I am arguing that if the data is clear and this 95% number is true, then it would be a no-brainer for MS to implement the changes.
>
> But things are not happening the way that you and the alleged 95%ers want.
>
> So, something is amiss…
>
> Once again, please direct me to the study.
>
> I will fight for in-game visual CSR tooth and nail if you can show me a scientific study that can bear academic scrutiny. I say that an individual who is a teacher and holds a Grad degree, perhaps like yourself :slight_smile:

People wanting visible ranking has bee widely suggested for a long time. You saw the thread poll asking the community if they’d want “this” or “that.” X’s aren’t the only thing the got a high percentage rating. It showed the majority wanting visible ranking. I’, not going into whether it has to be 95% or not, but just clearly the majority. The poll is legit and has been taken to multiple forums communities. I believe that even if people that don’t go to forums were to cash in as well, they results would be more or less the same (majority). X’s may not have had everyone beyond the forums, but it still got 343’s attention and changed…

97

>

People wanting visible ranking has bee widely suggested for a long time. You saw the thread poll asking the community if they’d want “this” or “that.” X’s aren’t the only thing the got a high percentage rating. It showed the majority wanting visible ranking. I’, not going into whether it has to be 95% or not, but just clearly the majority. The poll is legit and has been taken to multiple forums communities. I believe that even if people that don’t go to forums were to cash in as well, they results would be more or less the same (majority). X’s may not have had everyone beyond the forums, but it still got 343’s attention and changed…
[/quote]
The outlying question is whether Halo is a democracy?

Is 343i compelled to do what the alleged majority desire? I understand that you have to keep your customers happy. But as an artistic enterprise, should not the artist maintain control? Isn’t Halo now the vision of 343i? Or is it communal?

The movement for visual CSR is strong. But I completed the questionnaire from a couple of weeks back, and I found the questions to be loaded.

That is just me. I am perfectly fine with social and ranked playlists.

I am not fine with numbers being pulled out of the air like 95% of ALL players wanting CSR.

And then using this mythic number to show that 343i is treating their customers like -Yoink-…

98

> > The reason I write 95% is because whenever I see polls for ranking systems, around 90-95% are in favour of the ranking system.
>
> Is this is your study?

I’m not the OP…

99

> > > The reason I write 95% is because whenever I see polls for ranking systems, around 90-95% are in favour of the ranking system.
> >
> > Is this is your study?
>
> I’m not the OP…

:slight_smile:

And the OP used anecdotal observation for the basis of this mythic 95% number.

I am glad that we agree :slight_smile:

100

[/quote]
You’re questioning the validity of a study that you have zero knowledge of and how it was conducted…interesting. Do you know anything about sample sizes? Do you know anything about proabilities based on the sample sizes? Do you know anything about statistics that would lead you to be able and disprove the claim that 90-95% people either would want CSRing’s back or do not mind if they come back?

You don’t even have the numbers to even be a judge. The only myth here is the notion that you know what you’re talking about…and the fact is…you yourself don’t know whether the 90-95% figure is accurate because you have not conducted a study. Furthermore, you have not actually disproved anything but rather proved your ignorance.

I’m done with you now. Thanks for posting.

[/quote]
Show me the pdf then? Share the knowledge then. Instead of the rhetorical questions and the feeble strawman arguments, share this data that you hold sacrosanct :slight_smile:

I am arguing that MS and 343i have better analytics and pools of data than your mythic study, that you don’t want to share, but want me to believe in.

I am arguing that if the data is clear and this 95% number is true, then it would be a no-brainer for MS to implement the changes.

But things are not happening the way that you and the alleged 95%ers want.

So, something is amiss…

Once again, please direct me to the study.

I will fight for in-game visual CSR tooth and nail if you can show me a scientific study that can bear academic scrutiny. I say that an individual who is a teacher and holds a Grad degree, perhaps like yourself :slight_smile:

[/quote]
Here are some things I want to point out in relation to your post.

  1. No one’s asked me to share any data before but the data itself would do just as much good as me telling you the results. The data and conclusion is only as good as the source that claims that data is accurate. You can choose to believe what I’m telling you or you can ignore it and write it off as you have. Perhaps you may choose to do your own study to ensure it’s credibility? Anyways, I’m not sure that you can post files on a blog…and I don’t really know how to create a website nor do I have the desire to do so for the sake of proving a point with hard data that can just as easily be disputted as my conclusion that I’ve posted on this website.

  2. “Mythic” implies that you know it didn’t happen…which I know is not possible. Also, I never asked you to believe them…but if you are going to dispute them then perhaps you should do your own study.

  3. Your argument is based on assumptions…one of which being that Microsoft and 343 have even doing a study on CSR’s. You give companies far too much credit. Most companies are not run as efficiently as possible…even successful (in terms of profit) ones. There is a term that I cannot recall at this time that stands to explain the idea that “listening to logic and common sense or a hunch for a certain business decisions far out weighs the benefit of conducting a study to know for sure whether that choice is the right one. Such studies costs thousands of dollars and time”. If they going to do a study on CSR, then you’d presume one on competitive game play, map quality, etc. I feel safe in assuming that they are not doing all these full proof studies.

So in the end here, don’t trust that MS and 343 even knows that 90%-95% of the Halo base want CSRings back. To be honest, my sample size is not large enough to say for sure that’s what the population once…but it certinaly indicates it. If you couple that with the many complaints on this forum, and the idea that adding CSR’s would only increase the player experience overall…then it’s a no brainer and I don’t see why we’re hear arguing about 90-95%. Even if the % was less it would still benefit the game as a whole.

  1. I’m proud that you’re a graduated from Grad School, kudos. How old are you? I’m curious to know how old everyone is that’s still interested in Halo. I’m personally 28, with a family, etc, and I still play the game alot…Halo Reach that is, lol.
101

This is the reason why I refer to them as 343 Ignorance rather than 343 Industries now.

102

> > > > The reason I write 95% is because whenever I see polls for ranking systems, around 90-95% are in favour of the ranking system.
> > >
> > > Is this is your study?
> >
> > I’m not the OP…
>
> :slight_smile:
>
> And the OP used anecdotal observation for the basis of this mythic 95% number.
>
> I am glad that we agree :slight_smile:

Not the best way to gather results but his conclusion isn’t far from the truth is it?

103

>

You’re questioning the validity of a study that you have zero knowledge of and how it was conducted…interesting. Do you know anything about sample sizes? Do you know anything about proabilities based on the sample sizes? Do you know anything about statistics that would lead you to be able and disprove the claim that 90-95% people either would want CSRing’s back or do not mind if they come back?

You don’t even have the numbers to even be a judge. The only myth here is the notion that you know what you’re talking about…and the fact is…you yourself don’t know whether the 90-95% figure is accurate because you have not conducted a study. Furthermore, you have not actually disproved anything but rather proved your ignorance.

I’m done with you now. Thanks for posting.

[/quote]
Show me the pdf then? Share the knowledge then. Instead of the rhetorical questions and the feeble strawman arguments, share this data that you hold sacrosanct :slight_smile:

I am arguing that MS and 343i have better analytics and pools of data than your mythic study, that you don’t want to share, but want me to believe in.

I am arguing that if the data is clear and this 95% number is true, then it would be a no-brainer for MS to implement the changes.

But things are not happening the way that you and the alleged 95%ers want.

So, something is amiss…

Once again, please direct me to the study.

I will fight for in-game visual CSR tooth and nail if you can show me a scientific study that can bear academic scrutiny. I say that an individual who is a teacher and holds a Grad degree, perhaps like yourself :slight_smile:

[/quote]
Here are some things I want to point out in relation to your post.

  1. No one’s asked me to share any data before but the data itself would do just as much good as me telling you the results. The data and conclusion is only as good as the source that claims that data is accurate. You can choose to believe what I’m telling you or you can ignore it and write it off as you have. Perhaps you may choose to do your own study to ensure it’s credibility? Anyways, I’m not sure that you can post files on a blog…and I don’t really know how to create a website nor do I have the desire to do so for the sake of proving a point with hard data that can just as easily be disputted as my conclusion that I’ve posted on this website.

  2. “Mythic” implies that you know it didn’t happen…which I know is not possible. Also, I never asked you to believe them…but if you are going to dispute them then perhaps you should do your own study.

  3. Your argument is based on assumptions…one of which being that Microsoft and 343 have even doing a study on CSR’s. You give companies far too much credit. Most companies are not run as efficiently as possible…even successful (in terms of profit) ones. There is a term that I cannot recall at this time that stands to explain the idea that “listening to logic and common sense or a hunch for a certain business decisions far out weighs the benefit of conducting a study to know for sure whether that choice is the right one. Such studies costs thousands of dollars and time”. If they going to do a study on CSR, then you’d presume one on competitive game play, map quality, etc. I feel safe in assuming that they are not doing all these full proof studies.

So in the end here, don’t trust that MS and 343 even knows that 90%-95% of the Halo base want CSRings back. To be honest, my sample size is not large enough to say for sure that’s what the population once…but it certinaly indicates it. If you couple that with the many complaints on this forum, and the idea that adding CSR’s would only increase the player experience overall…then it’s a no brainer and I don’t see why we’re hear arguing about 90-95%. Even if the % was less it would still benefit the game as a whole.

  1. I’m proud that you’re a graduated from Grad School, kudos. How old are you? I’m curious to know how old everyone is that’s still interested in Halo. I’m personally 28, with a family, etc, and I still play the game alot…Halo Reach that is, lol.
    [/quote]
    lol,

I am a old man, 38… I am at a time where I need to pick the games that I play due to family responsibilities.

There are a ton of solid games that I do not have time to play due to time limitations… Oh well…

Best regards :slight_smile:

104

> >
>
> You’re questioning the validity of a study that you have zero knowledge of and how it was conducted…interesting. Do you know anything about sample sizes? Do you know anything about proabilities based on the sample sizes? Do you know anything about statistics that would lead you to be able and disprove the claim that 90-95% people either would want CSRing’s back or do not mind if they come back?
>
> You don’t even have the numbers to even be a judge. The only myth here is the notion that you know what you’re talking about…and the fact is…you yourself don’t know whether the 90-95% figure is accurate because you have not conducted a study. Furthermore, you have not actually disproved anything but rather proved your ignorance.
>
> I’m done with you now. Thanks for posting.

Show me the pdf then? Share the knowledge then. Instead of the rhetorical questions and the feeble strawman arguments, share this data that you hold sacrosanct :slight_smile:

I am arguing that MS and 343i have better analytics and pools of data than your mythic study, that you don’t want to share, but want me to believe in.

I am arguing that if the data is clear and this 95% number is true, then it would be a no-brainer for MS to implement the changes.

But things are not happening the way that you and the alleged 95%ers want.

So, something is amiss…

Once again, please direct me to the study.

I will fight for in-game visual CSR tooth and nail if you can show me a scientific study that can bear academic scrutiny. I say that an individual who is a teacher and holds a Grad degree, perhaps like yourself :slight_smile:

[/quote]
Here are some things I want to point out in relation to your post.

  1. No one’s asked me to share any data before but the data itself would do just as much good as me telling you the results. The data and conclusion is only as good as the source that claims that data is accurate. You can choose to believe what I’m telling you or you can ignore it and write it off as you have. Perhaps you may choose to do your own study to ensure it’s credibility? Anyways, I’m not sure that you can post files on a blog…and I don’t really know how to create a website nor do I have the desire to do so for the sake of proving a point with hard data that can just as easily be disputted as my conclusion that I’ve posted on this website.

  2. “Mythic” implies that you know it didn’t happen…which I know is not possible. Also, I never asked you to believe them…but if you are going to dispute them then perhaps you should do your own study.

  3. Your argument is based on assumptions…one of which being that Microsoft and 343 have even doing a study on CSR’s. You give companies far too much credit. Most companies are not run as efficiently as possible…even successful (in terms of profit) ones. There is a term that I cannot recall at this time that stands to explain the idea that “listening to logic and common sense or a hunch for a certain business decisions far out weighs the benefit of conducting a study to know for sure whether that choice is the right one. Such studies costs thousands of dollars and time”. If they going to do a study on CSR, then you’d presume one on competitive game play, map quality, etc. I feel safe in assuming that they are not doing all these full proof studies.

So in the end here, don’t trust that MS and 343 even knows that 90%-95% of the Halo base want CSRings back. To be honest, my sample size is not large enough to say for sure that’s what the population once…but it certinaly indicates it. If you couple that with the many complaints on this forum, and the idea that adding CSR’s would only increase the player experience overall…then it’s a no brainer and I don’t see why we’re hear arguing about 90-95%. Even if the % was less it would still benefit the game as a whole.

  1. I’m proud that you’re a graduated from Grad School, kudos. How old are you? I’m curious to know how old everyone is that’s still interested in Halo. I’m personally 28, with a family, etc, and I still play the game alot…Halo Reach that is, lol.
    [/quote]
    lol,

I am a old man, 38… I am at a time where I need to pick the games that I play due to family responsibilities.

There are a ton of solid games that I do not have time to play due to time limitations… Oh well…

Best regards :slight_smile:
[/quote]
My sentiments go out to you - I actually sold my xbox for a brief time in order to put my priorities in order. That lasted for only a year once I realized that there is only a small sliver of time that I can play this game like crazy before the kids are too old to be watching it…altough I have girls so they probably wouldn’t even watch me play…

105

> > I don’t want a visible rank.
> > I don’t want a Halo 3 style game.
> > I don’t want the BR to be king again.
> > I don’t want AA’s out of the game.
> > I don’t want loadouts taken out.
> >
> > You are not the only one in the community, and you don’t speak for me.
>
> That’s why there would be a separate playlist for people such as yourself. (newbies or people that are not that good at halo). What do you have a problem with that?
>
> Or are you actually saying that you deserve the entire game to be exactly how you want it?

Wow… That’s why there is such a divide. Most of the “competitive” players come off as jerks to me. By the by, because people don’t want what you do does not mean they are newbies or not that good at halo. Wow… Just wow…

106

Either way I don’t think anyone can argue against the fact the current gameplay is bad enough that the population has dwindled drastically, probably quicker than any other Halo title. Obviously 343 didn’t do something right and they are not making any efforts to change it. So I guess we all know which way the game is headed, if you don’t like it don’t play it, there are plenty of other developers that do listen to their community. I won’t be buying any more 343 games.

I wonder how long it will take 343 to realize when they turn their back on the community we will return the favor. Halo 5 sales should be amusing.

107

> Either way I don’t think anyone can argue against the fact the current gameplay is bad enough that the population has dwindled drastically, probably quicker than any other Halo title. Obviously 343 didn’t do something right and they are not making any efforts to change it. So I guess we all know which way the game is headed, if you don’t like it don’t play it, there are plenty of other developers that do listen to their community. I won’t be buying any more 343 games.
>
>
> I wonder how long it will take 343 to realize when they turn their back on the community we will return the favor. Halo 5 sales should be amusing.

Every time I see people compare Halo 4’s population to Halo 3’s, I honestly think about digging up this 2000 worded arguement I put forward about why this was. But then, I remember that no one even bothered responding to it. And the same would happen here. So, I’ll try this in a shorter way.

HALO 3 was BEFORE the big boom of CoD and Fifa and several other popular franchises.

Halo 4 is AFTER and now is struggling against games are extremely popular and have most of the Halo fans who left. If Halo 4 was like Halo 3, it would be far worse.

The market DOESN’T WANT Arena Shooters anymore.
Ok? Got it?

Oh what am I saying, of course not.