How to fix BR vs AR starts in BTB, just add loadouts back for BTB

EDIT: I have been given a lot of good reasons this will not work, thanks for the feedback, will try to think of something else as it might not be possible to make both sides happy.

This would be a simple loadout system which each player can pick from 4 starting set ups. which vary their T1 weapons.

Note two weapons are suggested in this post, SMG, and plasma repeater (halo reach)

load out one: rifleman

PRimary: AR
secondary: side kick

Load out two: Marksman
Primary: BR
secondary: SMG

Load out three: Commando
Primary: Commando
Secondary: SMG

Load out three: Plasma hound
Primary: plasma repeater
Secondary: sidekick



The SMG is a tier 1 pistol which takes the bullet hose path, haivng 60 rounds and a high fire rate it does 25% less damage to shields and has no headshot bonus (almost all weapons have atleast a 1.2x headshot bonus in infinite)

role in the sandbox: more a PvE mop up weapon, in comp it is just a back up like the sidekick.


the Plasma repeater is a fully automatic plasma weapon that acts like the AR in almost every way though it deals 1.25% damage to shields but 25% less damage to flesh meaning its TTK is the same as the AR. requires a vent after 32 rounds can be charged from plasma repeaters and carbines.


Twenty characters.


But why? I mean what reason would it not work?

Well other then the two new weapons but those can be taken out of the idea.

They should just do Commando starts in BtB.

Commandos offer solid mid-range performance, without being oppressive at long range like the BR is.

Then pick some of the precision weapon racks and change them to AR racks, while making the others guaranteed BR racks.

As much as BR starts seems to be the community pick, in BtB I can’t stand it when range isn’t an effective form of protection. This problem really started in Reach with the DMR but has persisted throughout Halo since then, where the BtB spawn weapon can just cross map without any real issue.

But having a weapon that can’t be used across the map, is different than having a weapon that isn’t optimal across the map. Which is why Commandos are perfect. They can be used at very long ranges, but are far from optimal for it. Like the CE Magnum and Halo 3 BR.


Really it started in 3 when they started doing BR starts. That’s when we saw the issues of spawning with the BR because they made BR start games. We saw that when people spawn with the BR they aren’t incentivized to go find better weapons. They will switch out whatever their second weapon is, but keep the BR always. By doing BR starts it removes one of the core functions of Halo gunplay and movement. Always scavenge for better weapons on the battlefield. If you start with one of the most effective All purpose weapons in the game then you’re not going to be interested in replacing it. Spawning with the BR also opens up the issue of constantly being shot from afar as soon as you spawn. And absolutely nobody wants to die, spawn and immediately get shot and killed again. That is a very likely scenario when you have BR starts.

Maintaining AR and Pistol starts is probably one of the better if not best option. Maybe making it AR Commando starts for btb, but BR starts would only ever be a terrible terrible decision.

This game was not designed with loadouts in mind. It has been designed in the classic Halo style of fair starts meanig you spawn with this weapon set and you have to scavenge the map for better weapons. 343 would have to put in a massive amount of work in order to make loadouts a thing in Infinite.

And we have all been made vastly aware of how much effort they’re willing to put in and this would be far too much effort. Which to be fair is part of game development. Development time and cost is always a big part of how a game is made. If it takes too long to make something then it probably won’t happen. If your current system works and to make it substantially better would require a whole new system or complete rework / overhaul of the current one then that is probably never going to happen because it wouldn’t be cost or time effective.

The reason it wont work is because the BR outclasses basically everything, thats why its fine as a map weapon but not fun as a spawn weapon.


Its Halo not COD my guy.
No… just no.

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The commando loadout would never be picked any way and the plasma what’cha call it is just default starts. So that a long range and a mid range and the long range has a smg wich pairs realy well with br from what you described.

Considering how so many people always want to ridicule and criticize Halo 4 for loadouts (even if Reach had them first), I don’t expect such a thing to occur.

And, honestly, I wouldn’t want them anyway.

Simplest solution and one that I’d like to see eventually is just people having the option to choose whether or not they want to play BR Starts or AR Starts. I’d stick with my AR Starts though :stuck_out_tongue:


Reach had equipment loadouts not weapon loadouts, also they were not hard to deal with and there was no true meta/good one.

It was both with more like a class-oriented loadout rather than the customizable one like Halo 4 - although the variety and selection would vary based on game modes such as if you were doing regular Slayer, Firefight, Invasion, etc.

Either way, I doubt there’s many people who want loadouts to come back.

I seem to remember loadouts ruining H4…
hard pass sir

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AR is fine. No need to turn this into a Laserfest.

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Loudouts I’ve always been fine with in customs, but as for matchmaking, keep them out of it. This also wouldn’t work.because why would anyone pick anything besides the BR? It is and always been the top weapon to have, and this is why I’ve always hated BR starts. Put it this way, if you started with any of these options, would you swap it on the field for one of the other options if you found it? I’d never swap a BR for any of these other options.

Well from the feedback here I can tell it was a bad idea. Eh it was an attempt.

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Oh not at all Warbrand, not at all.

Part of the reason Infinite is struggling so bad is because we don’t have player-friendly options like this.

There is an awful lot of skill added to the game when players are allowed to pick a loadout that suits their style.

It’s been discussed time and time again why Loadouts in Halo should never be a thing:

1. Loadouts with specific weapons reduce the desire to scavenge

2. Pointless because there will always be one BEST loadout

In your given examples, it’s pretty damn clear that Loadout 2 is gonna be used by everyone by default since it covers both close and long range combat perfectly. It’s not even a stretch to say it will 100% beat out every single other loadout option.

Honestly? Just start everyone with Commandos and AR. Gives everyone decent crossmapping potential off the bat, but Commando isn’t nearly as powerful as BR when it comes to crossmapping due to damage per shot.


Nah son not like 4. 4 let you customize everything before ranked or social games. mode specific loadouts were for grifball swat team snipers and infection. Everything else was a(n) ar magnum combo and the different armor abilities. 4 also had abilities like promethian vision which allowed you to see enemies right through walls (it was the only one i used for the short period i played while they were giving away a ford raptor) im not sure of the other abilities but in my hands that was broken as could be i can only imagine how someone better played. Halo 4 went the cod route they even admitted it back in the day. They wont now but they did then heck im sure the tweet still exists

Nope, pretty sure the general population does not desire loadouts.