How much innovation is too much for Halo 4

Games Other Halo
1

Ive sat and watched nearly all of the threads on here at some stage.
(University holidays are too long sometimes)

And i believe single biggest argument for Halo 4 has come down to ‘innovation’.
So how much is too much? Do we innovate until we start to change the core mechanics to appease a larger audience. OR do we change very little, and almost produce a cut and paste of the last big title?

(For some reason i haven’t seen many people comprehend a middle area where innovation meets legacy. But if you truly believe in that, than post your thoughts)

Some things to think about:
Do you want a cut and copy of Halo 3, for Halo 4?
-1-50 Ranking system
-No bloom
-No Armour abilities

Or do you want 343i to innovate and bring some new ideas to the game?
-A new 1-50, or arena style system
-Maybe loadout’s that include one use equipment instead of rechargeable ones
-A better and balanced bloom system.

2

the only things i see on these forums are (in percentage):

40%- Halo 3 remake ideas for Halo 4

19%- Reach hating

40%- Gimmicky, and stupid ideas

1%- good, plausible ideas

seriously?

3

Could you give an example of each?

4

> Could you give an example of each?

How can you need an example of each?

5

> Could you give an example of each?

i’ll try, i’m not great at examples though

Halo 3 copying,
things like bringing back older maps, the BR, and 1-50 system

not saying that any of those are bad things to bring back (i’m still shaky on remade maps)
but being anew trilogy, you’d think that there should be some new things, ALONG WITH the old ones
the way people are talking is that all they want is a graphics overhaul on H3, and then for 343 to slap HALO 4 on the cover.

Reach hating,

people constantly complain how reach was a total failure, Bloom, AA’s, TU updates, Infection etc.
and then they go on that if Halo 4 follows Reach in any way, it too, will be a failure
but we already established the fact that Reach had more flaws than previous halo games ( i like reach, don’t get me wrong) but, we need to talk about the fture of halo, not dwell on the past

Gimmicky ideas

sarcastic or not, people try to influence ideas that are too similar to other shooter games, like CoD being a good example, suggesting that you unlock weapon add-ons, coustimisable emblems, and killstreaks
not that CoD is bad ( i don’t like it that much) but Halo needs to stay as much “Halo” as possible, and not add anything that would take away from that classic “everyone is equal” setting

Bad ideas

also, sarcastic or not, people come up with the most CRAZY ideas, a lightning gun, bringing back AK-47’s, having rocket suits that blow-up as a primary attack, things like that, the as sure as hell won’t be added, because some would be overpowered for one thing, and also they wouldn’t be useful, or halo-related, or practical. and people flood our forums with ideas that won’t even be considered

good ideas

i’ve seen quite a few good ideas, everyone has
those ideas that you’re like “wow, if this were added into halo, it’d be AWESOME”
things that promote the classic HALO, while adding something new

yeah…

6

> > Could you give an example of each?
>
> How can you need an example of each?

Alternative motive my friend…
Im creating discussion.

@ twzzsted:
So would it be safe to say that you would prefer a more original Halo feel than something too innovative?

They’re good examples. And many ive seen before. Which is why i bothered with this thread, so people can get their ideas out.

7

> @ twzzsted:
> So would it be safe to say that you would prefer a more original Halo feel than something too innovative?
>
> They’re good examples. And many ive seen before. Which is why i bothered with this thread, so people can get their ideas out.

not necessarily,
i’m all in for new ideas, just not redundant ideas

i browse these fourms for Halo 4 info (IKR?) and those “wow” ideas
i also make a few of those ideas, i try to make something that would be cool, without having anything from other games included

(if you want one of my ideas, u can ask, honestly, it’s nothing much, poeple like my ideas, but i don;t get very popular with them)

but yes, i would like Halo to stay as it should be
i don’t want halo to turn out where some try-hard who pre-ordered it, and played non-stop for half a year to have a higher chance of winning, than a person who got the game for their birthday or Christmas, 5 months later
for equal balance, like not having a “utility” weapon, that is effective against all targets (i.e Reach DMR and Sniper) or bad map design

-__-
i usually write less that this as a comment to someone…but hey

8

I’m voting for innovation myself.
I’ve loved halo since the launch of the Xbox a nearing a decade ago, but, to me at least, playing it safe by just releasing an old system over and over again just isn’t fun. I enjoyed Halo Reach very much for the single fact that they tried something new with the system, in my opinion it turned out great for the most part.

9

As long as halo 4 feels that it was designed for HALO FANS ONLY and not for anyone else then there can be as much innovation as 343 can put on the disk but the true formula to innovation is, new crap=/=innovation so a healthy balance is what we need and super big changes to soon is the worst thing someone could do with hhalo

10

> > @ twzzsted:
> > So would it be safe to say that you would prefer a more original Halo feel than something too innovative?
> >
> > They’re good examples. And many ive seen before. Which is why i bothered with this thread, so people can get their ideas out.
>
> not necessarily,
> i’m all in for new ideas, just not redundant ideas
>
> i browse these fourms for Halo 4 info (IKR?) and those “wow” ideas
> i also make a few of those ideas, i try to make something that would be cool, without having anything from other games included
>
> (if you want one of my ideas, u can ask, honestly, it’s nothing much, poeple like my ideas, but i don;t get very popular with them)
>
>
>
> but yes, i would like Halo to stay as it should be
> i don’t want halo to turn out where some try-hard who pre-ordered it, and played non-stop for half a year to have a higher chance of winning, than a person who got the game for their birthday or Christmas, 5 months later
> for equal balance, like not having a “utility” weapon, that is effective against all targets (i.e Reach DMR and Sniper) or bad map design
>
> -__-
> i usually write less that this as a comment to someone…but hey

I like to complement people for their efforts.

But the point you make about the utility weapon is something i share. I really don’t want to start seeing every weapon in the game having some special attachment, that you have to earn, which makes it better than base weapons and easier for those who got the game on day 1.

Personally i want a mix. I don’t want a cut and paste version of a game that ive already got. But at the same time i want the feel of Halo. That is what sets it apart from the other FPS games in my books.

Ok i just ruined my objective stance in this forum but hey, im here to share.

11

depends on who you ask. I like change, it gives you an option about which game to play, because they all are different.

12

I like to make the allusion to the Resident Evil franchise. For those of you not familiar, the original Resident Evil is something of a classic in survival horror. It featured fixed camera angles, slow and tank-like movement speed, very limited inventory management, and quite a few jumpy moments. This formula stuck for a while, too. There were, in the end (if I recall correctly), five installments of Resident Evil modeled around this playstyle. Each game expanded on it, adding new features, but nothing truly changed how the game played.

Then Resident Evil 4 came along. Suddenly the game was more action-oriented. It still had its dark and brooding locales and characters, but the camera was no longer fixed - it followed over the player’s shoulder for much faster and more intuitive movement. The player now had a much more expanded inventory. The game no longer consisted of intricate puzzles, but linearity and set pieces. The thing that sealed this playstyle as a success was ultimately the pacing and the polish, though. While the ideas were risky, they were executed beyond well. Toss the same changes into a poorly-paced game and you’d get a worse result. Pacing and polish cemented this game as a modern classic.

So it’s really not necessarily how much you change, but how you implement the changes. It needs to be revolutionary, but it needs to retain a hook for gameplay. Resident Evil 4 has proven that franchises can transform in more ways than just adding features. I am really hoping Halo 4 can manage this.

13

I like change, but it doesn’t mean I want to see Halo completely ditch its roots and go for something completely different!

14

> As long as halo 4 feels that it was designed for HALO FANS ONLY and not for anyone else then there can be as much innovation as 343 can put on the disk but the true formula to innovation is, new crap=/=innovation so a healthy balance is what we need and super big changes to soon is the worst thing someone could do with halo

depends on your qualifications for halo fans. Super big changes can save franchises, but Halo only needs to make small ones. If the people on waypoint are “halo fans”, then you and me are minority, and, as much influence as we have, they try to sell to All who play halo.

15

> As long as halo 4 feels that it was designed for <mark>HALO FANS ONLY</mark> and not for anyone else then there can be as much innovation as 343 can put on the disk but the true formula to innovation is, new crap=/=innovation so a healthy balance is what we need and super big changes to soon is the worst thing someone could do with hhalo

Now how are us halo fans going to get ourselves back at the top of shooters list with a attitude like that? New fans = more people to play, More money for the producers and more fun towards stupid CoD fans.

16

I don’t see why it has to be so black and white.

There are plenty of ways to innovate without changing the core formula that made Halo great. Aside from the basics of new weapons and improved background mechanics (Netcode, aim-assist, etc.), there’s always ways to push the envelope…It just takes some deeper thinking.

Bungie really didn’t think hard when they made Bloom and AAs. They thought “Well this is new, so it must be innovative.” Totally untrue. Innovation and New Things are not the same at all. Innovation builds on previous building blocks and make those building blocks better and more efficient.

Things that would be truly innovative are things like a terrain editor, Forge for Firefight, AI in Forge for Multiplayer, even a refinement of Armor Abilities so they can exist off-spawn and not throw off the balance of the game. The core gameplay of Halo has been refined enough. There doesn’t need to be any changes to the way the player aims, shoots, and moves. That’s done.

What 343 can do is give us more gametypes to play with. They can give us even more control of our own game experiences, like individual weapon traits and a terrain editor. The next step with Halo is transferring the power that the developers have into OUR hands, so that we as a community can start innovating on our own.

The Halo formula is done. It is simple, and good. Now, it is OUR time.

17

> I don’t see why it has to be so black and white.
>
> There are plenty of ways to innovate without changing the core formula that made Halo great. Aside from the basics of new weapons and improved background mechanics (Netcode, aim-assist, etc.), there’s always ways to push the envelope…It just takes some deeper thinking.
>
> Bungie really didn’t think hard when they made Bloom and AAs. They thought “Well this is new, so it must be innovative.” Totally untrue. Innovation and New Things are not the same at all. Innovation builds on previous building blocks and make those building blocks better and more efficient.
>
> Things that would be truly innovative are things like a terrain editor, Forge for Firefight, AI in Forge for Multiplayer, even a refinement of Armor Abilities so they can exist off-spawn and not throw off the balance of the game. The core gameplay of Halo has been refined enough. There doesn’t need to be any changes to the way the player aims, shoots, and moves. That’s done.
>
> What 343 can do is give us more gametypes to play with. They can give us even more control of our own game experiences, like individual weapon traits and a terrain editor. The next step with Halo is transferring the power that the developers have into OUR hands, so that we as a community can start innovating on our own.
>
> The Halo formula is done. It is simple, and good. Now, it is OUR time.

No one said it has to be that way. Its just a common conception on the forums.
I personally would like to see a mix of innovation and imitation.

Your point on the gametypes interests me. Id love to see some new ideas, but at the same time will it split the population further having too many gametypes?

Firefight forge would be fantastic! with the ability to choose you’re enemy. eg. flood, covenant or maybe even forerunner.