How common would Human-Sangheili relations be?

Not necessarily sexual (Not sure how that would even work.) but how common do you think intimate relations would be between humans and Sangheili?

Given that the Elites were at the forefront of a genocidal campaign that eliminated most of the human race over the course of twenty-five years, highly uncommon. You do have select individuals, typically high ranking individuals or those in positions where they have to be diplomatic (or in the case of Jul 'Mdama, sneaky), but a normal human soldier to civilian should have nothing but a crippling hate or fear of the Elites.

Again, the Elites LED the campaign against humanity for a quarter of a century and before poorly done retcons, reduced the human population to 200 Million individuals with only Earth left, which was largely beaten and occupied by the Covenant. Even if the civilian population had largely been lied to about the severity of the war, it was still a WAR that lasted twenty-five years, killed billions and ultimately would have ended with humanity made extinct were it not for a series of technicalities that allowed us to survive (not win).

Yes I’m aware that there’s also a refugee city in South America for Covenant deserters, but it’s bad writing and world building. It shouldn’t exist and only exists because of a lack of understanding of Halo’s lore within the 343i creative team.

Due to the martial culture of the Sangheilli, I doubt any Sangheilli would have any interest in any human less combat-capable than a Spartan, and even then I’d say the difference in anatomy would preclude any sort of romantic attraction if not for the one case in Halo 5 where one Sangheilli started writing a love-poem to Palmer. Even under such a rare case, I doubt any feelings would be reciprocated by any human because of the history and the differences in anatomy (Mandibles that size would be disturbing up close, especially when eating or otherwise spending quiet time together)

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> Given that the Elites were at the forefront of a genocidal campaign that eliminated most of the human race over the course of twenty-five years, highly uncommon. You do have select individuals, typically high ranking individuals or those in positions where they have to be diplomatic (or in the case of Jul 'Mdama, sneaky), but a normal human soldier to civilian should have nothing but a crippling hate or fear of the Elites.
>
> Again, the Elites LED the campaign against humanity for a quarter of a century and before poorly done retcons, reduced the human population to 200 Million individuals with only Earth left, which was largely beaten and occupied by the Covenant. Even if the civilian population had largely been lied to about the severity of the war, it was still a WAR that lasted twenty-five years, killed billions and ultimately would have ended with humanity made extinct were it not for a series of technicalities that allowed us to survive (not win).
>
> Yes I’m aware that there’s also a refugee city in South America for Covenant deserters, but it’s bad writing and world building. It shouldn’t exist and only exists because of a lack of understanding of Halo’s lore within the 343i creative team.

Sorry for not knowing the details, but at what point were we reduced to 200 million and just Earth? I was under the impression that only parts of Africa were glassed/invaded during H3. Shouldn’t we have had much greater numbers? Or had the majority of Earth left for other planets long before that?

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> > 2533274838418174;2:
> > Stuff
>
> Sorry for not knowing the details, but at what point were we reduced to 200 million and just Earth? I was under the impression that only parts of Africa were glassed/invaded during H3. Shouldn’t we have had much greater numbers? Or had the majority of Earth left for other planets long before that?

The Beastiarum, a special book that came with the Collector’s Edition of Halo 3. It was pretty much the first source of information on the homeworlds of the various Covenant species, Flood and Humanity, explained as though we were reading a Forerunner catalog. In it were listed the populations of each species, and Humanity’s populat was listed as 200 Million [Sudden change].

Here’s he relevant part of the entry for Humanity’s status during the events of Halo 3 (emphasis on certain words mine):

_“The most important current factor in -Yoink!- Sapiens condition is its interaction with the Covenant hegemony. Human populations have been decimated by a one-sided conflict and unfortunately are approaching extinction. Only ONE planet survives with any meaningful population and that planet is, perhaps not coincidentally, their cradle world. It is also home to a [schism artifact]. Ironically it is the existence of that [artifact] that has prevented the Covenant from simply destroying their world. They wish to utilize its technology, but they seem curiously unconcerned as to why the [artifact] is located on that particular planet. This series of coincidences is notable and statistically unlikely - unless viewed in the context of the Array conflict.”_Not only that, but Lord Hood also states within Halo 3 that “Earth is all we have left”.

Before the 343i retcon (because they’ve never had anyone on their creative team that understands the franchise), Humanity was not only on the ropes, but desperately trying not to fall over the edge and into total extinction. The UNSC was BEATEN and humanity had very little hope of surviving without external factors radically destabilizing the Covenant, all of which came in the closing months of the war. To put more importance on Reach, had Noble Team not been successful in transporting Cortana’s Fragment to the Pillar of Autumn: Humanity would have been wiped out because Cortana would not have been unable to locate Alpha Halo and thus set into motion the events of the original trilogy.

So yeah, 343i apparently either didn’t like this or didn’t know how to make it interesting, so instead we get a poor retcon that inflates Humanity’s population and gives us back a few major worlds because they don’t understand that the UNSC and humanity SURVIVED the Halo Conflict, we did NOT come out of it the victors. Without the outside, accidental influence that discovering the Halo Array had and taking the Mulligan that it provided, Humanity was doomed. Even then, there’s absolutely NO reason why, a mere four years later, that the UNSC has ANY business floating around the galaxy saying “We are the giants now” and imposing their will on the Elites and other Covenant remnants. There should NOT be some mighty new fleet of advanced warships floating around, the Infinity should NOT exist (its reason for existing is little more tha PR power play and an attempt to gain respect from the audience without earning it). Humanity should be intensely focused on rebuilding and repopulating, not floating around like it is the Age of Imperialism all over again.

Needless to say, there WAS established lore to support that Humanity had lost the war, only had Earth left and was about to be rendered extinct. But when 343i took over, they basically did a huge “None of these previous reports can be substantiated and should be viewed with suspicion on the validity of their accounts”, which is basically the PR way of saying “People like this stuff so in order to avoid a massive fan backlash we’re just going to hint at it still being canon so they don’t scream at us, but otherwise consider none of it canon”. It’s what they did with the AI Assembly stuff from Reach and so much other established lore from the Bungie era, doing the bare minimum to well “Well…maybe, who knows” and do a wishy-washy hand gesture and try to change the subject.

And to stay on topic with the thread, it’s why NO human civilian or UNSC personnel would have ANYTHING to do with the Elites on a personal level (or why they’d offer up land on Earth for Covenant refugees), and the only interactions that would take place would be, at best, high level diplomacy by top UNSC and UEG officials.

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> > 2591580321307319;4:
> > > 2533274838418174;2:
> > > Stuff
> >
> > Sorry for not knowing the details, but at what point were we reduced to 200 million and just Earth? I was under the impression that only parts of Africa were glassed/invaded during H3. Shouldn’t we have had much greater numbers? Or had the majority of Earth left for other planets long before that?
>
> The Beastiarum, a special book that came with the Collector’s Edition of Halo 3. It was pretty much the first source of information on the homeworlds of the various Covenant species, Flood and Humanity, explained as though we were reading a Forerunner catalog. In it were listed the populations of each species, and Humanity’s populat was listed as 200 Million [Sudden change].
>
> Bestiarum - Halopedia, the Halo wiki
>
> Here’s he relevant part of the entry for Humanity’s status during the events of Halo 3 (emphasis on certain words mine):
>
> _“The most important current factor in -Yoink!- Sapiens condition is its interaction with the Covenant hegemony. Human populations have been decimated by a one-sided conflict and unfortunately are approaching extinction. Only ONE planet survives with any meaningful population and that planet is, perhaps not coincidentally, their cradle world. It is also home to a [schism artifact]. Ironically it is the existence of that [artifact] that has prevented the Covenant from simply destroying their world. They wish to utilize its technology, but they seem curiously unconcerned as to why the [artifact] is located on that particular planet. This series of coincidences is notable and statistically unlikely - unless viewed in the context of the Array conflict.”_Not only that, but Lord Hood also states within Halo 3 that “Earth is all we have left”.
>
> Before the 343i retcon (because they’ve never had anyone on their creative team that understands the franchise), Humanity was not only on the ropes, but desperately trying not to fall over the edge and into total extinction. The UNSC was BEATEN and humanity had very little hope of surviving without external factors radically destabilizing the Covenant, all of which came in the closing months of the war. To put more importance on Reach, had Noble Team not been successful in transporting Cortana’s Fragment to the Pillar of Autumn: Humanity would have been wiped out because Cortana would not have been unable to locate Alpha Halo and thus set into motion the events of the original trilogy.
>
> So yeah, 343i apparently either didn’t like this or didn’t know how to make it interesting, so instead we get a poor retcon that inflates Humanity’s population and gives us back a few major worlds because they don’t understand that the UNSC and humanity SURVIVED the Halo Conflict, we did NOT come out of it the victors. Without the outside, accidental influence that discovering the Halo Array had and taking the Mulligan that it provided, Humanity was doomed. Even then, there’s absolutely NO reason why, a mere four years later, that the UNSC has ANY business floating around the galaxy saying “We are the giants now” and imposing their will on the Elites and other Covenant remnants. There should NOT be some mighty new fleet of advanced warships floating around, the Infinity should NOT exist (its reason for existing is little more tha PR power play and an attempt to gain respect from the audience without earning it). Humanity should be intensely focused on rebuilding and repopulating, not floating around like it is the Age of Imperialism all over again.
>
> Needless to say, there WAS established lore to support that Humanity had lost the war, only had Earth left and was about to be rendered extinct. But when 343i took over, they basically did a huge “None of these previous reports can be substantiated and should be viewed with suspicion on the validity of their accounts”, which is basically the PR way of saying “People like this stuff so in order to avoid a massive fan backlash we’re just going to hint at it still being canon so they don’t scream at us, but otherwise consider none of it canon”. It’s what they did with the AI Assembly stuff from Reach and so much other established lore from the Bungie era, doing the bare minimum to well “Well…maybe, who knows” and do a wishy-washy hand gesture and try to change the subject.
>
> And to stay on topic with the thread, it’s why NO human civilian or UNSC personnel would have ANYTHING to do with the Elites on a personal level (or why they’d offer up land on Earth for Covenant refugees), and the only interactions that would take place would be, at best, high level diplomacy by top UNSC and UEG officials.

Thank you for the in-depth reply. I think that seeing as Halo3 was pretty much supposed to be the end of Halo, dropping Humanity to 200 million made for a good final fight. 343i, or whoever else would have taken over, wouldn’t have had much to work with without retconning that in some way. Lazy? Sure. Necessary for us to keep being a viable participant moving forward? Probably.

The entire known galaxy was in disarray with the downfall of the Covenant. There were plenty of ways to write the UNSC in such a way that would have given them viability even in such a depleted state, and frankly would have been more interesting rather than just trying to reset the status quo or retcon what had gone before. It is the sign of weak writing that they were unable to do so.

For one, Halo 4 should not have required a major UNSC presence in the first place and instead should have doubled down on the Chief and Cortana being lost deep in unknown space. At best, focus on a singular scout ship (not the over-compensating flagship that was clearly made for marketing reasons) discovering them, let us focus on their crew and characters (which hindsight being 20-20, could have been Team Osiris before or immediately after becoming Spartan-IVs and thus allowing for more build up for having them be in Halo 5). Galaxy-wise, the UNSC is slowly rebuilding, reclamation colonies on Reach and other worlds with just enough ability to defend itself from the various Covenant Remnant factions, the Brute factions (which are all too busy fighting each other for power rather than make any dedicated push to finish off Humanity).

I mean just that premise alone would either make Halo 5 entirely different, or even make it be a little better because Humanity would be even MORE reliant on AI than ever before, thus making far more sense why AI that are clearly Rampant would still be in service, and make the end result of ‘organics vs machines’ a bit more skewed because then it gives depth to the Created, maybe not ALL of them want to fight for Evil Cortana just because she’s got the keys to the Fountain of Youth, maybe some of them want to fight for Humanity because they see how much Humanity needs them, etc and so forth. That would even allow for the Assembly stuff to return in a way that would not seem out of place.

There’s a plethora of interesting ways they could have gone about it, but they took the most low-effort route and simply slapped retcons on things. And also they never should have hired Karen Travissty who is known for running roughshod over franchises and altering them (and assassinating characters) to fit her own personal soapbox agendas. A lot of the reason why Halo is in the state that it is is because they let her redefine so much of the lore, it’s tone and perform lobotomizations of established characters and their personalities.

I would have much preferred to see the ‘broken’ galaxy. A GOOD writer would have been able to do something amazing with it.

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> Due to the martial culture of the Sangheilli, I doubt any Sangheilli would have any interest in any human less combat-capable than a Spartan, and even then I’d say the difference in anatomy would preclude any sort of romantic attraction if not for the one case in Halo 5 where one Sangheilli started writing a love-poem to Palmer. Even under such a rare case, I doubt any feelings would be reciprocated by any human because of the history and the differences in anatomy (Mandibles that size would be disturbing up close, especially when eating or otherwise spending quiet time together)

Sangheilli are like Greek’s Spartans basically. They like to keep their relations within Sparta and only Sparta when it comes to pairing and you are right about Spartans x Elites, they have a high respect for them which would make them probably the only “acceptable” partner for the race of aliens.

I doubt very common due to the way Elites are and how a lot of Humans are, but we’ve seen an Elite have feelings towards Palmer so every other human is a step up from her.
Also, if I remember correctly, there are even Elites that live on Earth in Rio so that could be possible.

“Erase previous recording, begin new recording. I saw you standing at your ship, with armored hand on armored hip. Both my hearts began to pound, so lovely was what I found. I love your brightly shining armor, human named Commander Palmer. I wish that we- What are you doing here, Grunt? What are you laughing at? I will tear off your arms!”
This one data pad inspired me to actually explore the missions of Halo 5 and, though a lot of people don’t like them, it’s really cool and interesting. It’s also a really fun to challenge yourself to get to places you would never go normally, just to see if there is something cool at the top. Even if there isn’t, you’ll probably be treated with a gorgeous view. Say what you want about Halo 5 but you can’t deny that it is a beautiful game.