Okay, I made this thread before, and it was soon locked after descending into a flame war. So this time around, no insulting or belittling on my part, I promise. But please also do your bit and actually read my points before saying something clearly wrong such as “no to bloom, it slows down gameplay”.
Halo 4 should have a weapon which has two firing modes. The first works similarly to the BR, only there is no random spread - one bullet always goes dead centre, the other two at opposite sides of the reticle edge. The second works similarly to the DMR, only the bloom is much larger, though it resets in the same amount of time.
But won’t this increase killtimes?* No - this would work beautifully. Most fights would be the same fast killtimes we loved in Halo 2 and 3, but for those long-range battles in which the BR isn’t effective, you can switch to the DMR and pick them off in 5 shots. Killtimes will be either increased or unaffected from Halo 2/3 - fact.
<em>They should be separate weapons!</em> A utility weapon is needed. This is how good sandbox balancing works - one weapon that works everywhere, and other weapons that can equal it at certain ranges. You can pick up the utility weapon, and there’s no more random rock-paper-scissors gameplay, you’ll be able to put up a fight in every scenario. Having the two guns combined also prevents the DMR from being used mid-close range and having the horrible randomness of bloom creep in.
<em>Surely all we need is a ZB DMR for every range?</em> Having more weapon types is both more interesting and more skilled, given that you have to master two types of gameplay. Also, come on, pretty much everybody wants the BR back, that weapon made Halo multiplayer.
<em>But bloom is still random!</em> Nope again. At close range, nobody will be using the DMR, or if they do they’re an idiot, because the BR wildly outclasses it and they’ll be destroyed. At long range, the smaller size of the enemy relative to the reticle, plus the increased expansion size, means the weapon will not be random. That’s a statistical fact. Trivia: the BR would have the same aim assist as it did in Halo 3, the DMR would have the same aim assist as it did in Reach, there would be no bullet magnetism whatsoever, both weapons would be hitscan.
The reason for bloom in games before Reach wasn’t to hinder your aim-- only to simulate real life firepower.
That’s where Bungie slipped, by cranking the bloom meter up to an absurd level.
You can’t say it’s not random, because that’s a pure lie-- most of the time, players are fighting at medium range, where the randomness between spamming and pacing comes in to play.
So no, bloom should have never been modified to directly influence gameplay, because it will always be inherently flawed; bloom pretty much = randomness.
Bloom only existed to simulate real life, not to become a gameplay factor that involved skill before Reach.
> You can’t say it’s not random, because that’s a pure lie-- most of the time, players are fighting at medium range, where the randomness between spamming and pacing comes in to play.
I’m quite proud of myself for not streaming expletives and insults after reading this.
Look, you have clearly not read the OP at all, you’re just commenting on Reach’s bloom. Had you read my idea, you would know that bloom would only be used at long range - I actually went out of my way to explicitly explain this point. Please go back and actually read what I’ve written, or just don’t comment. Your choice.
Sad no one really reads the OP. Then again, with the amount of negativity surrounding Bloom, many won’t have it and you will trolled as a result OP.
I’ve read your ideas (quickly so i may have missed something) but it sounds like you want a two in one for a utility weapon. Problem is, it’s still a utility weapon and many casuals hate those kinds of weapons (i am gladly not among their ranks). I like how it does add a layer of complexity; using your head to determine which fire mode would benefit you the most depending on your situation.
However while I recognize what you are suggesting, i disagree with the notion that one mode will have bloom and other will not (more akin to BR). This in my head would create an inconsistent gun and you just make a BR that handles just like the DMR except that firing at longer ranges while still viable, will hit less if the player does not compensate (maybe for Recoil or spread). Really, a gun doesn’t need two firing modes so that bloom may be used with the gun. Plus Halo is built on simplcity, while i don’t mind complexity, it wouldn’t feel right. Simplicity is key and if you have figured out already, i am not so big on bloom in Halo.
In fact, your suggestions creates a super utility weapon that can literally be used in all cases and could render the other weapons in the sandbox utterly useless. While i don’t care for ARs, others apparently do and pushing for weapon sandbox seems to be the norm these days.
Hope you enjoyed reading this, hopefully this won’t cause you to rage and spout curses . I mean if the idea could be played around that could yield interesting results (it helped get a clear idea of what you are suggesting to fellow gamers). Feel free to disagree as you will no doubt will.
I’m sorry but I believe that it’s not Halo. You’re over-complicating what we already have perfect. It just isn’t Halo, it isn’t a balance issue. We could add laser guns to Call of Duty and balance them all we want but at the end of the day, they don’t belong there.
I just don’t want bloom in Halo 4. Bloom is the chief reason I’ve grown to hate Reach mp, and I’ve never felt that way about a Halo game before Reach.
I hope I don’t have to feel that way with Halo 4.
> Just out of interest, is there anyone apart from me that likes bloom?
>
> Also, thanks for the (largely) intelligent responses. If the majority don’t like bloom, fair enough.
I definitely like the idea of bloom… It’s not working quite right just yet, but I think if developers really play with it some more they could find a good balance… So I wouldn’t necessarily mind seeing it return in future Halo titles…
I also liked your idea of a gun with two firing modes, one mode for close-mid range and another for long range… I can’t say if it’d work well or not, but it’s different and it’d be interesting to try IMO.
Bloom doesn’t work well in multiplayer, unfortunately. Bloom was annoying because I would be killed real quick in a 5 shot spam duel while I was pacing. I found a way to beat those spammers was to spam then pace on the last shot. It doesn’t feel right so I think it doesn’t belong to multiplayer.
While bloom left some funkiness in the multiplayer, the bloom found it’s place in two places: the campaign and firefight. Spamming bloom doesn’t even eliminate the enemy forces! This is where you have to be disciplined in! Yeah, I know all about the skirmishers and the brutes. I’m impressed with the developers to improve brutes to a big threat. I know this is not related but just pointing out some of the improvements made in the game. Anyway, the bloom has made the game a whole lot harder.
I know that the multiplayer is not the most played game but it still has a high quality campaign and firefight.
> > Just out of interest, is there anyone apart from me that likes bloom?
>
> Oh yes. Edited by a Moderator. Do not attack or flame other forum members.
You know that bit at the start of the OP, where I ask everybody to refrain from insulting and flaming? Please re-read it. Implying those who disagree with your personal opinion are in some way stupider or more ignorant is, rather ironically, in itself ignorant. This thread is for a discussion of the mechanic, not for bashing anybody with an opinion that differs from yours. If you want to do that, go on Bnet’s Reach forum or something.
> > > Just out of interest, is there anyone apart from me that likes bloom?
> >
> > Oh yes. Edited by a Moderator. Do not attack or flame other forum members.
>
> You know that bit at the start of the OP, where I ask everybody to refrain from insulting and flaming? Please re-read it. Implying those who disagree with your personal opinion are in some way stupider or more ignorant is, rather ironically, in itself ignorant. This thread is for a discussion of the mechanic, not for bashing anybody with an opinion that differs from yours. If you want to do that, go on Bnet’s Reach forum or something.
I agree sort of. Bloom never affected me much. It wasn’t that random, if you were aiming perfectly they always hit the person anyway, I never saw a problem with it but don’t mind it being taken out to make others happy.
Bloom has been in Halo for years. It’s just no one really cared/noticed because it wasn’t clearly visible, people spend time killing things, and they never stop to unload a magazine into a wall. All Bungie did in Reach was give the UI/HUD reticle bloom. But the level of bloom that they gave us is too much, and with people who don’t pace their shooting tend to notice more than others because instead of them just unloading into a person, they’re seeing the HUD bloom.
I mean if the idea could be played around that could yield interesting results (it helped get a clear idea of what you are suggesting to fellow gamers). Feel free to disagree as you will no doubt will.
Bloom has been in Halo for years. It’s just no one really cared/noticed because it wasn’t clearly visible, people spend time killing things, and they never stop to unload a magazine into a wall. All Bungie did in Reach was give the UI/HUD reticle bloom. But the level of bloom that they gave us is too much, and with people who don’t pace their shooting tend to notice more than others because instead of them just unloading into a person, they’re seeing the HUD bloom.